It was a shocking, but welcome, development when CNN Primetime host Abby Phillip welcomed Chicago Teachers Union President Stacy Davis Gates to the Tuesday show and repeatedly called her out for her hypocrisy of sending her son to a private school for its sports program.
Phillip immediately began by confronting Gates with her double standard, “You've likened in the past private schools of today to quote "segregation academies” of the Jim Crow South. Why then send your child to a private school after speaking out so publicly against them?”
Gates replied with one of the greatest lines ever uttered in the history of television, “I didn't speak out against private schools. I spoke out against school choice. School choice and private schools are two different entities.”
Not buying it, Phillip tried a second time, “In your tweet, you describe basically private, I mean, you've described private schools of the North. That was literally your language. But you've also said this, that school choice was the choice of racists. I think at the end of the day, people are asking here about whether the rhetoric matches your actions. What do you say to them?”
After Gates went on a bender about the response Brown v. Board of Education, Phillip wouldn’t let Gates play the race card. She explained “Look, I understand the history” before reading a letter that Gates wrote defending herself claiming nuance, “You wrote that to explain why you chose to take your child out of public school for a sports program at a private school. The question I think your critics are asking is, why not afford that nuance to the families who might live in the South Side of Chicago and in other major cities and they want the same choice that you were able to afford to give to your child?”
Gates then went on a long rant about how her other two children are still in public school and arguing that Chicago schools are unfunded, which is odd considering all her attacks on “the right-wing” because it is not as if Chicago and Illinois are run by right-wingers.
Up until now, Phillip had questioned Gates pretty well, but had let her say her piece. Now, she was starting to lose her patience as the two talked over each other:
PHILLIP: I totally understand the point that you're making, but I do wonder, do you regret your own rhetoric here?
GATES: Regret rhetoric? What I've said are facts again I'm a history teacher –
PHILLIP: Well, I think that the rhetoric that I'm -- let me explain my question, let me just explain.
GATES: Hold on for a second, Abby, I understand quite clearly what you're saying –
PHILLIP: What I'm asking is that you're describing a very nuanced issue here. I understand that, I understand the history of, you know, segregation in the school system. But at the same time, what I'm trying to ask you is, do you think that your rhetoric at some point went too far when you are making a choice, because perhaps I assume you can afford to do that, that a lot of Chicago parents don't, because they can't afford it. And proponents of school choice say the state should have a role in helping those families who can't afford it make the same choice that you did for your family.
Flip-flopping back and forth to whatever position was most convenient, Gates claimed “It is nuanced in Chicago… What we are faced with in Chicago is an absence of a choice, is an absence of resources. And furthermore, school choice in this country has been anchored to a very racist and angry right-wing. I can show you a whole host of emails that have come to me and my family detailing that level of violence and racism.”
Phillip concluded the segment by again pointing out, “I also think that what you just described for your son is choice that you made for your family, and I think that's what your critics are pointing out here.”
Ultimately, this segment proves that it is possible for CNN to hold the left accountable, they should try doing it more often.
This segment was sponsored by LeafFilter.
Here is a transcript for the September 12 show:
CNN Primetime
9/12/2023
10:37 PM ET
ABBY PHILLIP: We wanted to have you on so you could help explain what happened here. You've likened in the past private schools of today to quote "segregation academies” of the Jim Crow South. Why then send your child to a private school after speaking out so publicly against them?
STACY DAVIS GATES: I didn't speak out against private schools. I spoke out against school choice. School choice and private schools are two different entities.
PHILLIP: In your tweet, you describe basically private, I mean, you've described private schools of the North. That was literally your language. But you've also said this, that school choice was the choice of racists. I think at the end of the day, people are asking here about whether the rhetoric matches your actions. What do you say to them?
DAVIS GATES: Well, I would say that if we understand the desegregation of schools post Brown v. The Board of Education, we also understand that school districts in the South in particular closed down entire school districts, offered money to families, white families, so they could get accepted into private schools. That is, in fact, the origin of school choice in America.
And I know that the right-wing wants to obscure that in the same way that they want to tell us that slavery was a job training program.
PHILLIP: Look, I understand the history that you're talking about and I myself attended public school my entire life, but I think one of the issues here is actually something that you yourself raised. You wrote a letter to your colleagues and you said that our critics want you to believe that, quote, "school choice is a black and white issue that lacks nuance and hard choices for people like us, black families, especially when you are parenting a black boy in America." You wrote that to explain why you chose to take your child out of public school for a sports program at a private school.
The question I think your critics are asking is, why not afford that nuance to the families who might live in the South Side of Chicago and in other major cities and they want the same choice that you were able to afford to give to your child?
DAVIS GATES: So a couple of things. Number one, I have three children. And all three children have attended public school. And my youngest two are still public school students.
The second thing is that over 90 percent of my neighbors and my zip codes send their children into schools outside of our zip code, outside of our neighborhood. And this is an issue that black Chicagoans, black families in Chicagoans deal with on a very regular basis, and in fact, for generations. This is not an issue of just Stacy Davis Gates and her family.
Quite frankly, this is an issue, especially for middle-class black families all across this country, where the public accommodation is obsolete, just like the grocery store in our communities is obsolete, just like the health care provisions in our community are obsolete.
What I am saying and what we have said very clearly as a union for a very long time now is that the public accommodation has to be invested and resource in black communities because we have been defunded and destabilized in those same communities. So when we talk about choice, Abby, what we're talking about is a decision between Frosted Flakes and Cheerios.
But in Chicago and especially in black neighborhoods, it's a decision with zero and zero. And that's not a choice. That is, quite frankly, an ultimatum. Black children in the city of Chicago travel outside of their neighborhoods on an average two hours more than any other comparative demographic.
PHILLIP: I totally understand the point that you're making, but I do wonder, do you regret your own rhetoric here?
DAVIS GATES: Regret rhetoric? What I've said are facts again I'm a history teacher --
PHILLIP: Well, I think that the rhetoric that I'm -- let me explain my question, let me just explain.
DAVIS GATES: Hold on for a second, Abby, I understand quite clearly what you're saying –PHILLIP: What I'm asking is that you're describing a very nuanced issue here. I understand that, I understand the history of, you know, segregation in the school system. But at the same time, what I'm trying to ask you is, do you think that your rhetoric at some point went too far when you are making a choice, because perhaps I assume you can afford to do that, that a lot of Chicago parents don't, because they can't afford it.
And proponents of school choice say the state should have a role in helping those families who can't afford it make the same choice that you did for your family.
DAVIS GATES: So a couple of things, Abby. It is nuanced in Chicago. Like I've said, we have been destabilized and defunded in our black communities. When people speak of choice, they are speaking of two different things that are of comparative nature.
What we are faced with in Chicago is an absence of a choice, is an absence of resources. And furthermore, school choice in this country has been anchored to a very racist and angry right-wing. I can show you a whole host of emails that have come to me and my family detailing that level of violence and racism.
So if the Choice Movement does want to move away from their angry and violent rhetoric, I might add, then they would do themselves a favor and reject the rhetoric of the right that tells us that history is not important.
I understand the impact of segregation in Chicago, the impact of destabilization in Chicago. And I faced that along with over 90 percent of my neighbors and that the school that is supposed to be down the street for the cop that lives across the street from me or the retired teacher and her family that lives next door to me, that's not afforded to us. So when we talk about rhetoric, we also have to talk about the historical record. And the historical record is very clear.
The school choice movement was a cudgel for integration in this country. That is a fact. Number two, the destabilization of black spaces throughout this country has been reprehensible and is most acutely felt with families who want to send their children to public schools.
As I've said before, my children do attend public schools. As I’ve said before, my children do attend public schools. My son, he has the opportunity to play sports at a school, sports by the way that are not offered at our neighborhood school or any school close to our address. Again, students in Chicago, especially black students on average, travel almost two hours back and forth to school.
So the real scandal, Abby, is why in 2023, black families in Chicago and across this country have to deal with such severe inequities and such high stakes.
PHILLIP: I totally agree that is a scandal, but I also think that what you just described for your son is choice that you made for your family, and I think that's what your critics are pointing out here.
