Despite her best yet pathetic efforts Wednesday night to win a debate about Critical Race Theory by yelling over her guest, putting words in his mouth, and trying to deny reality, MSNBC ReidOut host Joy Reid didn’t stand a chance against the Manhattan Institute’s Christopher Rufo, who she had a dust-up with on Twitter after she attacked him on her show.
The highly contentious interview began with Reid throwing shade at Rufo for going after her on Twitter and suggested he was the problem. But despite quoting him and inviting him on the program, she failed to do her research and find out his background (Click “expand”):
REID: Now, I will note that Twitter is a hyperbole zone. So, whatever, it's all water under the bridge. But I just want to get to a couple of little factual things. Why would I need courage to have you on? Are you like an expert in race or racial history? Are you a lawyer? Are you a legal scholar? Is that part of your background?
RUFO: Yeah, I'm a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute where I'm running their initiative on Critical Race Theory. And the reason that I reached out on Twitter to you, and I appreciate you having me on, I enjoy this cross partisan dialogue. But the reason is not just because you were attacking me on air, which I think is fine, it’s politics that’s fair game.
REID [Cuts of Rufo]: One second. I'm sorry. I wasn't attacking you. I was reading your quote. So, that’s what I did, I read your quote. But go on.
“You were reading it with the framing calling me a political operative, which I'm not. I'm actually a think tank scholar,” Rufo shot back.
Rufo proceeded to call out and breakdown the four biggest lies Reid has told about Critical Race Theory and its proliferation in public schools:
You've claimed in recent weeks that Critical Race Theory isn't being taught in schools. You've claimed that most American public school students learn what you call confederate race theory and are taught that slavery was, quote, “not so bad.” You’ve claimed that state legislation will prevent schools from teaching about the history of racism. And finally, you've claimed Critical Race Theory isn't rooted in the philosophical tradition of Marxism.
Instead of addressing Rufo on the topic and the merits of his argument, the Reid chose to argue with him about who he’s called out as a supporter of Critical Race Theory. After reading some quotes from one of her friends refuting his suggestion, Rufo quipped about how “it's very interesting to me that so many people are running away from the label of Critical Race Theory.”
Looking to use the words of Critical Race Theorists against them, Rufo quoted Barbara Applebaum who said “all white people are racist” and Robin DiAngelo who said “white identity is inherently racist.”
The use of quotes triggered Reid to launch into a shouting fit where she refused to let Rufo speak, while he was calling her out for playing “word games” (Click “expand”):
REID: She's not a critical race theorist.
RUFO: -- quote, “white identity is inherently racist.”
REID: No.
RUFO: So what you're doing is playing a series of word games.
REID: No, no.
RUFO: You know that critical whiteness studies --
REID: That’s ironic.
RUFO: -- is a subfield of critical race theory.
REID: No, it’s not.
RUFO: These are deeply interrelated.
REID: No, they’re not. They’re not. They’re just not.
RUFO: And I'm not going to let you play word games. This is really, I think, the most essential thing. Hold on.
REID: No, no, no, no. No, not hold on.
RUFO: Let me respond at least once. I haven't gotten a full sentence out.
Reid even had the nerve to snap at Rufo and claim she doesn’t “allow people to just make up and say lies on the show. It's just not really right to do that and let people hear it.” Then again, that’s really her job.
As the interview progressed, Reid played a series of edited together soundbites of Rufo’s appearances and talks, which wasn’t actually damaging but she tried to put words in his mouth and prescribe his motive anyway. “You want to make a campaign and stuff everything in there and you want to stuff it all into Critical Race Theory,” she sneered.
“And here’s the bottom line Joy. What you've done in tonight's segment is exactly what I'm fighting against. I'm fighting against the manipulation of language. I’m fighting against language deconstruction,” Rufo declared. “And I’m trying to basically load off of these euphemistic terms with subversive content, because otherwise you just say whatever you want and then you back away from it and dance around it.”
He also warned Reid that parents knew what was going on and they weren’t going to stand for it:
It's not going to happen. Parents all over this country, they know what's happening in schools. They know what's happening in public institutions and you're seeing people revolt against this divisive identity politics. And you can dance all you want but you're not going to stop people from understanding what's happening in the classrooms.
And you know, for all her shouting about how what he was saying wasn’t actually Critical Race Theory, she never explained why it was from her perspective. That’s because he was right on the money and she didn’t want him to expose the truth.
Joy Reid’s shouting and lies to protect Critical Race Theory were made possible because of lucrative sponsorships from Febreze and Walmart. Their contact information is linked so you can tell them about the biased news they fund.
The transcript is below, click "expand" to read:
MSNBC’s The ReidOut
June 23, 2021
7:19:52 p.m. EasternJOY REID: Raucous school board meetings are one result of a national campaign by political operatives to eradicate curriculums on racial and other forms of equity, which, mind you, are not the same thing as Critical Race Theory. One of those operatives, Critical Race Theory owe Christopher Rufo joins me now. And Christopher, thank you so much for making some time to be with us this evening.
CHRISTOPHER RUFO: Thank you.
REID: Thank you. Let’s started off – do the elephant in the room. You and I started off on a little bit of a Twitter beef. I talked about you, I quoted you in an article that one of our great journalists here at NBC had quoted you in a piece. And I quoted that on TV. And then you tweeted that you wanted to come on the show and said I didn't have the courage to put you on.
Now, I will note that Twitter is a hyperbole zone. So, whatever, it's all water under the bridge. But I just want to get to a couple of little factual things. Why would I need courage to have you on? Are you like an expert in race or racial history? Are you a lawyer? Are you a legal scholar? Is that part of your background?
RUFO: Yeah, I'm a senior fellow at the Manhattan Institute where I'm running their initiative on Critical Race Theory. And the reason that I reached out on Twitter to you, and I appreciate you having me on, I enjoy this cross partisan dialogue. But the reason is not just because you were attacking me on air, which I think is fine, it’s politics that’s fair game.
REID [Cuts of Rufo]: One second. I'm sorry. I wasn't attacking you. I was reading your quote. So, that’s what I did, I read your quote. But go on.
RUFO: You were reading it with the framing calling me a political operative, which I'm not. I'm actually a think tank scholar. But put all that aside. The problem that I have is you've really spread four key false pieces of information about Critical Race Theory.
You've claimed in recent weeks that Critical Race Theory isn't being taught in schools. You've claimed that most American public school students learn what you call confederate race theory and are taught that slavery was, quote, “not so bad.” You’ve claimed that state legislation will prevent schools from teaching about the history of racism. And finally, you've claimed Critical Race Theory isn't rooted in the philosophical tradition of Marxism.
And I think that all four of those claims are wrong. And I’d love to discuss them tonight.
(…)
7:25:48 p.m. Eastern
RUFO: Well, I’ll say two things. First of all, it's very interesting to me that so many people are running away from the label of Critical Race Theory.
REID: He's not a critical race theorist!
RUFO: Hold on. I'm going to quote two Critical Race Theorist, Barbara Applebaum with the book “Being Good, Being White.” She says, quote, “all white people are racist.” Robin DiAngelo, who’s another critical whiteness scholar and says that--
REID: She's not a critical race theorist.
RUFO: -- quote, “white identity is inherently racist.”
REID: No.
RUFO: So what you're doing is playing a series of word games.
REID: No, no.
RUFO: You know that critical whiteness studies --
REID: That’s ironic.
RUFO: -- is a subfield of critical race theory.
REID: No, it’s not.
RUFO: These are deeply interrelated.
REID: No, they’re not. They’re not. They’re just not.
RUFO: And I'm not going to let you play word games. This is really, I think, the most essential thing. Hold on.
REID: No, no, no, no. No, not hold on.
RUFO: Let me respond at least once. I haven't gotten a full sentence out.
REID: No, no. Because I’m not going to let you-- You probably never watch me on TV. We didn't know who each other were not too long ago, but I don't allow people to just make up and say lies on the show. It's just not really right to do that and let people hear it. But hold on. Robin DiAngelo is not a critical race theorist and I want everyone to know that. I don’t who the other woman is, but she’s not.
(…)
7:29:47 p.m. Eastern
REID: So you don't give an S about this stuff. You're really just having a campaign to take everything that everything that annoys white Americans and white conservatives--
RUFO: No, that’s not right. No.
REID: -- hold on. You want to make a campaign and stuff everything in there --
RUFO: You played my highlight reel, give me a chance to respond.
REID: And you want to stuff it all into Critical Race Theory. Right?
RUFO: What I don't think is right is forcing 8-year-olds in Cupertino, California to deconstruct their racial identities and rank themselves according to
REID: That’s not Critical Race Theory.
RUFO: -- is power and privilege. It's intersectionality theory which was invented –
REID: That’s intersectionality.
RUFO: by Kimberle Crenshaw, which is part of Critical Race Theory.
REID: No, it’s not dear.
RUFO: You had her on your show. You know this.
REID: Yeah, she invented both things. She invented both things.
RUFO: And here’s the bottom line Joy. What you've done in tonight's segment is exactly what I'm fighting against. I'm fighting against the manipulation of language. I’m fighting against language deconstruction.
REID: Right, you're fighting against wokeness and you don't like corporate wokeness, I get it. I get it.
RUFO: And I’m trying to basically load off of these euphemistic terms with subversive content, because otherwise you just say whatever you want and then you back away from it and dance around it.
It's not going to happen. Parents all over this country, they know what's happening in schools. They know what's happening in public institutions and you're seeing people revolt against this divisive identity politics. And you can dance all you want but you're not going to stop people from understanding what's happening in the classrooms.
(…)
