On this past weekend's The Saturday Show, MSNBC host Jonathan Capehart teamed up with anti-gun activist Dr. Jonathan Metzl to spread misinformation about the effects of gun laws as the two discussed his book on the 25th anniversary of the Columbine school shootings.
As the discussion turned to the 2018 attack on a Nashville Waffle House by 29-year-old Travis Reinking, Dr. Metzl reflexively blamed Tennessee's "pathologically loose gun laws" without divulging that the gunman had only somewhat recently moved into Tennessee from the blue state of Illinois. He soon complained about Tennessee expanding gun rights since the shooting:
And so, instead, what we've seen is a dramatic expansion in every kind of law that led to the shooting. People can carry guns without permits now. We're arming teachers, long guns to people with 18 and older, so we have this total disconnect between what people know we need as a society to keep our country safe and what the political process in its gerrymandered state right now is delivering which is, unfortunately, more of these horrific mass shootings.
It was not mentioned that Illinois police had confiscated several guns from Reinking after he showed signs of schizophrenia, but then gave them to his father who then returned them to his son later. One of those firearms was used in the Nashville attack after the gunman moved to the state. Reinking's father was also convicted in connection with giving his son's firearms back to him.
Capehart played the race card by hinting at the far-left liberal trope that the cops allowed Reinking to live because of he was white. "Dr. Metzl, a question occurs to me when we showed the Waffle House shooter. Was he taken alive after that -- that manhunt?" he played coy. Metzl obliged.
Then, without offering any evidence that other racial groups are treated differently, Metzl claimed that the Waffle House gunman was allowed to keep his guns because he is white:
Not only was he taken alive, what I show is there were five or six incidents before the shooting. He tried to jump the fence at the White House -- he came to the attention of the FBI -- he jumped naked into a pool and jumped out and shook his gun at people -- and so part of the story I ask in the book is, "What does it take to disarm a white man in America?" That's really the story of the book. And it turns out it's very hard because the laws -- the system -- people see a white man as a patriot. And, yes, he was taken alive after the shooting. He was not killed.
Back in February, Metzl made another appearance on the same show to promote his book, and, on that occasion, spread misinformation blaming the loosening of gun laws in Missouri around 2008 for an increase in homicides in that state:
Missouri had these pretty reasonable gun laws. I mean, there's a long history of gun ownership ... but until about 2008, believe it or not, you know, people would go to get a permit at the sheriff's office. ... And then they started overturning all the gun laws, overturning everything -- guns in parks, guns in bars, persons -- in 2021, made it almost a crime to even have cities mandate their own gun laws or enact federal -- any federal laws -- and what I saw was not just a rise in all kinds of gun injury and death gun, suicide gun, homicide -- all these things went up.
But, in fact, homicides in Missouri did not see a sustained increase until after 2014 when the Ferguson effect led to a surge in crime after the Mike Brown shooting in Ferguson, Missouri -- coinciding with a crime surge that was also seen across the country.
The transcript is below. Click "expand" to read:
MSNBC's The Saturday Show
April 20, 2024
6:52 p.m. Eastern
JONATHAN CAPEHART: Dr. Metzl, your book takes a deep dive into the 2018 Waffle House shooting and how these mass shooters reveal a lot about the issues on race and mental health we continue to face in our country. Can you expand on that?
Dr. JONATHAN METZL, AUTHOR OF WHAT WE'VE BECOME: Yeah, my book, What We've Become, really takes a deep dive into that 2018 Waffle House shooting. It was a shooting where a naked white shooter went into a Waffle House in a part of Nashville where it was 2:30 in the morning full of young adults of color celebrating after the clubs closed. And it was many things -- it was a mental ill mass shooting -- it was a race shooting -- it was a sign of what happens in a state like Tennessee with our pathologically loose gun laws. In many ways, it's the same thing (similar to the Columbine school shootings from 25 years ago). Our town came together and said, "Enough is enough -- we're going to -- we're going to turn course -- this has shown us the worst of humanity, and now let's turn course."
I want to say there are a lot of people who are building from the horror of that moment -- people running for office. The mother of one of the victims of that shooting, Shaundelle Brooks, is running for state office in Tennessee. So there are many things that come out of the aftermath of the horror, but, again and again, it was a similar story, which was the people demanded some kind of action, but because Tennessee is a supermajority state, there was no pressure. Nobody was going to get pushed out of office or voted out of office.
And so, instead, what we've seen is a dramatic expansion in every kind of law that led to the shooting. People can carry guns without permits now. We're arming teachers, long guns to people with 18 and older, so we have this total disconnect between what people know we need as a society to keep our country safe and what the political process in its gerrymandered state right now is delivering which is, unfortunately, more of these horrific mass shootings.
CAPEHART: Dr. Metzl, question occurs to me when we showed the Waffle House shooter. Was he taken alive after that -- that manhunt?
Dr. METZL: Yeah, that's kind of the story I tell in the book. Not only was he taken alive, what I show is there were five or six incidents before the shooting. He tried to jump the fence at the White House -- he came to the attention of the FBI -- he jumped naked into a pool and jumped out and shook his gun at people -- and so part of the story I ask in the book is, "What does it take to disarm a white man in America?" That's really the story of the book. And it turns out it's very hard because the laws -- the system -- people see a white man as a patriot. And, yes, he was taken alive after the shooting. He was not killed.
CAPEHART: Dr. Jonathan Metzl, as always, thank you very much for coming -- for coming to the show.
(...)
MSNBC's The Saturday Show
February 17, 2024
6:46 p.m. EasternJONATHAN CAPEHART: You wrote -- you focus on three states. One was Missouri Missouri's lax gun laws and what those lax gun laws did to Missouri. Real quickly, talk about that.
Dr. JONATHAN METZL, AUTHOR OF WHAT WE'VE BECOME: Well, I'm from Missouri -- I grew up in Kansas City -- my brothers and my dad were at the Super Bowl, you know. And so Kansas City is kind of home, and I know from this and from my own research that Missouri had these pretty reasonable gun laws. I mean, there's a long history of gun ownership -- of hunting -- of people caring about the 2nd Amendment -- but until about 2008, believe it or not, you know, people would go to get a permit at the sheriff's office. I interview people in my research -- it took about three seconds to get that. Nobody cared. And then they started overturning all the gun laws, overturning everything -- guns in parks, guns in bars, persons -- in 2021, made it almost a crime to even have cities mandate their own gun laws or enact federal -- any federal laws -- and what I saw was not just a rise in all kinds of gun injury and death gun, suicide gun, homicide -- all these things went up.
But the bigger issue for me was that it was the end of a kind of particular public space that people stopped congregating in places like Swope Park -- this park in the middle of the town -- and the public pools -- because everybody was so worried that they were going to get shot. And so there was injury and death, but there was also the end -- I mean, for me in Missouri, there was a Super Bowl parade pretty much every day -- it just never got on the news. But people -- it wasn't weird to go in a public space with people who were different than you. And that's what these gun -- these loose gun laws killed, was the sense of camaraderie and civic engagement.
CAPEHART: The name of the book is What We've Become: Living and Dying in a Country of Arms
