On Thursday's New Day, during a discussion of whether the NFL should require players to stand during the National Anthem, conservative CNN commentator Ben Ferguson and liberal Republican CNN commentator Ana Navarro got into a heated debate after Ferguson called Colin Kaepernick a "fraud" because he used the Flag to protest provocatively without even taking the time to vote.
Navarro inserted race into the discussion as she complained that it was "white" of Ferguson to make his complaint, and exclaimed: "Who died and made you the judge of blackness -- to tell Colin what's'-his-name that the fact he voted or not allows him to have a political opinion?" After Navarro complained that Ivanka Trump should be called a "fraud" for not voting previously, Ferguson suggested the same could be said of Navarro because she claims to be a Republican after voting for Hillary Clinton.
After Ferguson asserted that some of the NFL players who protest are "frauds" because they did not vote, Navarro responded: "Voting is not a requirement to protest. Voting is not a requirement to voice a political opinion. Donald Trump's children didn't vote, and they are advisors in the White House!"
Ferguson recalled that he had criticized Trump's children for not voting, and then continued pushing his point, leading Navarro to introduce race:
ANA NAVARRO: Can I tell you something, Ben? Ben, how white of you to think that going to a Black Lives Matter rally --
BEN FERGUSON: It's not white -- don't even go there. Don't even -- I'm sorry -- that's absurd.
NAVARRO: No, no, who are you to tell a black person what makes them black -- what makes them have black credible?
She soon added: "Who died and made you the judge of blackness -- to tell Colin what's'-his-name that the fact he voted or not allows him to have a political opinion?"
After Navarro kept trying to insert Ivanka Trump and Donald Trump Jr. into the conversation, Ferguson reiterated that he had already criticized them, and then argued that Navarro is a "fraud" because she voted for Hillary Clinton while claiming to be a Republican:
NAVARRO: Ivanka Trump and Donald Trump Jr. are frauds because they didn't vote in the Republican primaries!
FERGUSON: They should have voted in elections. I said that. You also voted for Hillary Clinton, and you say you're a Republican, so that's a little bit of a fraud, isn't it?
NAVARRO: No, no, no, there's a lot of Republicans who did.
FERGUSON: By using your standard. You come on here and say you're a Republican. You say you're a Republican, and you voted for Hillary Clinton. So you're not a Republican, by your standard.
Below is a transcript of the relevant portion of the Thursday, October 12, New Day on CNN:
7:38 a.m. ET
BEN FERGUSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You have a right to do a lot of things in this country, and there are consequences, and the NFL got it wrong. The NFL got out and tried to play both sides of this issue. And then they tried to say, "Oh, we're America's team, we're America's game, we're America's sport," while allowing their employees to disrespect this country. You have the right to do it -- there's consequences. The NFL boycott is real --
ALISYN CAMEROTA: Listen, I just want to be very clear. They say they're not disrespecting the country. They say that their protest is about the treatment --
FERGUSON: Well, that's what they say.
CAMEROTA: They're the sources. They're doing the protesting. They're the protesters.
FERGUSON: I have the right to disagree with them. I'll say this. I think many of the NFL players are frauds. Most of them did not go and vote in the last election, including Colin Kaepernick who's never voted in an election -- while coming out and claiming --
ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Voting is not a requirement to protest. Voting is not a requirement to voice a political opinion.
FERGUSON: If you're going to be the leader of a political statement, as Colin Kaepernick was --
NAVARRO: Donald Trump's children didn't vote, and they are advisors in the White House!
FERGUSON: And I criticized -- and I criticized them for that. I'm consistent.
NAVARRO: Well, fine, you criticize them for everything, but don't tell me, then, that they don't have a right to protest when the senior advisors in the White House didn't vote.
FERGUSON: Colin Kaepernick comes out and says, "I'm going to lead this group." When was the last time he went to a Black Lives Matter -- the guy saw a bunch of TVs and a bunch of cameras and said, "I'm going to kneel right now, but I'm not going to back it up."
CAMEROTA: That's his right.
FERGUSON: He has a right, but it also means you're a fraud.
NAVARRO: Can I tell you something, Ben? Ben, how white of you to think that going to a Black Lives Matter rally --
FERGUSON: It's not white -- don't even go there. Don't even -- I'm sorry -- that's absurd.
NAVARRO: No, no, who are you to tell a black person what makes them black -- what makes them have black credible?
FERGUSON: Again, it has nothing to do with race.
NAVARRO: Look at yourself in the mirror. What he is saying might be more significant than what -- than going to one of the rallies.
FERGUSON: If I go out there every day and I champion a cause and I never do it in real life, I'm a fraud.
NAVARRO: Who died and made you the judge of blackness -- to tell Colin what's'-his-name that the fact he voted or not allows him to have a political opinion?
FERGUSON: If you go out there every day and you fight for something that you say is so near and dear to your heart, and then I find out in reality you're never involved in the issue other than being on national TV, you're a fraud. You're a fraud and a fake.
NAVARRO: Well, then talk to Ivanka Trump! Talk to Ivanka Trump who didn't vote!
FERGUSON: Again, we're talking about Colin Kaepernick.
NAVARRO: No, no, because you want to hold this one standard for this one set of people and another one for another set of people.
FERGUSON: I did. I said this. I said this. You should have voted in an election.
NAVARRO: Ivanka Trump and Donald Trump Jr. are frauds because they didn't vote in the Republican primaries!
FERGUSON: They should have voted in elections. I said that. You also voted for Hillary Clinton, and you say you're a Republican, so that's a little bit of a fraud, isn't it?
NAVARRO: No, no, no, there's a lot of Republicans who did.
FERGUSON: By using your standard. You come on here and say you're a Republican. You say you're a Republican, and you voted for Hillary Clinton. So you're not a Republican, by your standard.
NAVARRO: You voted for a man who was a Democrat and then an independent, and then when he was an opportunist, he became a Republican. So, really, don't go there for me because I have been supporting Republican candidates for President probably when you were still in diapers!
FERGUSON: Again, you voted for Hillary Clinton, and you say you're a Republican.
NAVARRO: I voted for Hillary Clinton because I refuse to vote for a racist, misogynist, even though he was a Republican nominee.
FERGUSON: And you have every right to do that.
NAVARRO: And it was the first time in my life that I did not support the Republican nominee because I found him absolutely disgusting, and I was going to put country over party! And you are nobody to question Colin Kaepernick what's-his-name's blackness or my Republican credentials, okay? You are not judge and or jury! You can do whatever you want for yourself -- you cannot judge me -- you cannot judge whether he is black enough!
FERGUSON: I can judge Colin Kaepernick. It doesn't have anything to do with his blackness. This the weakest argument -- let me finish, though --
NAVARRO: Oh, you're saying -- you're saying he's not black enough because he didn't go to Black Lives Matter.
FERGUSON: Again, I'm going to finish my point here because it's really important.
NAVARRO: And you are black because you went to a Black Lives Matter rally!
FERGUSON: Let me finish - let me finish -- again, let me finish. Colin Kaepernick coming out and saying this is a big issue to him, but he never goes out into the community and is involved in it -- doesn't even care enough about the issue which he says everyone else should care about to go register to vote and vote. That is hypocrisy -- it has nothing to do with being black or white. It's called being a hypocrite.
