Fill-in anchor Russ Mitchell teased Friday's lead story on the CBS Evening News by citing “a new move to try to stop the war. Senate Democrats want to take back the authorization they gave the President to invade Iraq.” That is new, but a few minutes later Mitchell set up another story by touting how “there is new opposition to the war tonight, and it comes from the very Americans fighting it -- men and women in uniform.” Mitchell explained: “Hundreds of them are very publicly asking Congress to stop it. Lara Logan has this exclusive 60 Minutes report.” The “new opposition,” however, is hardly “new” by daily broadcast journalism standards.
Logan previewed her 60 Minutes story about a relatively minuscule number of servicemen who have signed a petition from an organization called “Appeal for Redress,” a group formed last year and which delivered some petitions to Congress way back on January 16. Logan announced how “over a thousand servicemen and women have done something normally unthinkable for the military: protest the war they're in the middle of fighting....They've all sent a petition called 'Appeal for Redress' to their individual members of Congress letting them know that 'staying in Iraq will not work,' and it's 'time for U.S. troops to come home.'" Logan's piece featured soundbites from three soldiers, but none were identified by her or on screen. The CBSNews.com page previewing the story, however, includes names.
The “Appeal for Redress” Web site reports that “the first Appeal signatures messages will be were [sic] delivered to members of Congress on January 16, to coincide with at the time of [sic] the Martin Luther King, Jr. Day in January 2007.” The page also boasts that 1,312 “Active Duty, Reserve, and Guard personnel have now signed the appeal!” But that's a very small percent of the several hundreds of thousands of servicemen deployed at some point to Iraq.
Logan did squeeze in a note about how “soldiers from the First Cavalry who are currently serving in Baghdad...acknowledge that the service men and women who signed the petition have the right to do so, but that doesn't mean they should." A soldier in Iraq declared: "I know what I'm here fighting for, to give the Iraqi people, you know, some democracy and hope. So I am 100 percent behind this mission. You don't sign up to pick which war you get to go to." But Logan then gave an “Appeal for Redress” soldier the last word and he shot down a red-herring, that people have questioned the patriotism of war opponents in the military:
“By volunteering we've done more than about 99 percent of the population. And anybody who joined after 9/11 when the country was in a state of war, it's my opinion that nobody has the right to question that soldier's patriotism, nobody.”
The plea from Appeal for Redress:
“As a patriotic American proud to serve the nation in uniform, I respectfully urge my political leaders in Congress to support the prompt withdrawal of all American military forces and bases from Iraq . Staying in Iraq will not work and is not worth the price. It is time for U.S. troops to come home.”
The MRC's Brad Wilmouth corrected the closed-captioning against the video for the February 23 CBS Evening News story:
Up top, Russ Mitchell teased: “Tonight, a new move to try to stop the war. Senate Democrats want to take back the authorization they gave the President to invade Iraq. And a CBS News 60 Minutes exclusive: Hundreds of U.S. servicemen and women are protesting the war while they're fighting it.”Mitchell soon arrived at the plug for 60 Minutes: "There is new opposition to the war tonight, and it comes from the very Americans fighting it -- men and women in uniform. Hundreds of them are very publicly asking Congress to stop it. Lara Logan has this exclusive 60 Minutes report."
Lara Logan: "The fight in hostile Anbar province has been more deadly for U.S. forces than anywhere else in Iraq. Over a thousand have been killed in this violent region west of Baghdad. And today, the military announced three more. That's part of the reason over a thousand servicemen and women have done something normally unthinkable for the military: protest the war they're in the middle of fighting. Their interviews will be on 60 Minutes this Sunday."
Unidentified soldier #1: "As a patriotic citizen who served two combat tours in Iraq, I just feel that this war is simply just not working out anymore, and soldiers are dying there every day."
Logan: "It's a sentiment echoed by all of the service members who are part of this protest. We gathered some of them in Washington, but they had to be off base, out of uniform, and off duty to speak to us on camera. They've all sent a petition called 'Appeal for Redress' to their individual members of Congress letting them know that 'staying in Iraq will not work,' and it's 'time for U.S. troops to come home.'"
Unidentified soldier #2: "Just because we volunteered for the military doesn't mean we volunteered to put our lives in unnecessary harm and to carry out missions that are illogical and immoral."
Unidentified soldier #3: "I mean, we volunteered to make a difference, not just be part of an experiment."
Logan: "We spoke with soldiers from the First Cavalry who are currently serving in Baghdad. They acknowledge that the service men and women who signed the petition have the right to do so, but that doesn't mean they should."
Unidentified soldier #4, in Iraq: "I know what I'm here fighting for, to give the Iraqi people, you know, some democracy and hope. So I am 100 percent behind this mission. You don't sign up to pick which war you get to go to."
Logan an “Appeal for Redress” soldier: "There are going to be a lot of people who don't like what you're doing."
Unidentified soldier #3: "By volunteering we've done more than about 99 percent of the population. And anybody who joined after 9/11 when the country was in a state of war, it's my opinion that nobody has the right to question that soldier's patriotism, nobody."
Logan: "Lara Logan, CBS News, Baghdad."
Sunday's 60 Minutes will also feature Mike Wallace's interview with Bill O'Reilly.
—Brent Baker is Vice President for Research and Publications at the Media Research Center
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
I heard about this this morni
February 23, 2007 - 21:09 ET by bigtimerI heard about this this morning....
Timing is everything is it not?
Tell me the leftist msm doesn't work with the left in Congress which are bringing up these issues this coming week in various ways/resolutions/bills/amendments whatever defeatist treasonous BS you want to call it...
Puhleeeeze....give me a break.
The enemy within at it's best.
Abuse the Petition
February 23, 2007 - 23:48 ET by spiritdfFear not. I read about this group of malcontents yesterday (I'll credit Tom Mason), and immediately forwarded the link provided to a close group of folks with muchos amigos who currently serve...many of who are deployed. I'd be interested to see who has signed the petition. I for one, have signed the petition on behalf of Pvt Beetle Bailey, Col Harlan Sanders, and LtCol Yu, Phuk. Each time I signed, their number went up. Many deployed personnel now have this link, and I'm certain they'll take the time to "sign it" themselves. Unfortunately the humorless commies who back these charlatans will probably find no humor in our effort, and we'll probably wind up in court somewhere. Whatever.
...live, from Baghdad,
Your Humble Defender
If you have the chance, could
February 24, 2007 - 09:14 ET by FastEdIf you have the chance, could you add Sgt. I.M. Fury? Thanks for protecting my wheelchair bound daughter.
There is no sense in being stupid, if you can't prove it! - my dad V
Video from 60 Minutes
February 25, 2007 - 20:23 ET by Amanda JusticeHey, everyone... MsUnderestimated has the video posted if you didn't see it.
Backstabbing Military Members
February 23, 2007 - 21:30 ET by emjem24This Appeal For Redress group is nothing new. It's based out of Norfolk, VA and the person who leads it is a known Communist. He's also in the Navy and has never served on the front lines. Some of these soldiers were on the front lines which makes what they say seem more seductive to the clueless and uninformed.
As a military spouse, I have every right to question any of these members' patriotism. Especially when their criticism threatens the mission in Iraq. When it threatens my own spouse.
What is really telling is how "sympathetic" the media is to these people. These people are a mere minority of what is overwhelming support for the current misison in Iraq. The Appeal for "Distress" is really designed to undermine the mission so that these cowards never fight there again. You can't pick and choose. If you think you can, don't join the military.
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
Malcontents Should Have Followed Veep
February 25, 2007 - 17:42 ET by JoePThese guys are whining because they were twice as dumb as VP Cheney. They did NOT have to volunteer, number one; and number two: the Veep was smart enough to get five deferments due to other priorities during Viet Nam. These morons were dumb enough to make the choice of wanting to help in protecting America. Wrong move, bucko's!
They got what they deserve and the Veep will get his!
Balls to the wall! (Air Force motto from the intell side)
Huh?**************Support the
February 25, 2007 - 20:32 ET by Chicago RepublicanHuh?
**************
Support the Spread of Open Society and Capitalism around the World. Do it for the Children.
Cheney vs. These Whiners
February 25, 2007 - 23:06 ET by JoePWell it's obvious, isn't it? These folks and any others who "sign then whine" have no place to bitch and complain. Cheney outsmarted the draft boards, five times in a row, but these folks couldn't outsmart themselves to stay away from protecting American interests.
Too bad none of them are as
February 23, 2007 - 21:54 ET by FowlerK9Too bad none of them are assigned to either Camp Adder or Camp Cedar here in Tallil Iraq. I would like to...... "have a word" with them. Those that are officers should be charged under Article 88 of the UCMJ. Those that are enlisted charged under article 92 of the UCMJ.
Edward Fowler
Security Team Echo 7
Tallil Iraq
Right On!
February 23, 2007 - 22:44 ET by pickerseniorArticle 88—Contempt toward officials, Article 92-- Failure to obey order or regulation, for those unfamiliar with UCMJ. There are sedition and treason laws also, that newsbabes, newshounds and politicians should be subject to. There was a time when these things were enforced with some dire consequences.
Do these people have any clue what it means to protect the country, who is doing it, and the consequences of giving up on the spot? When their city crashes on their heads, I guess they may understand if they are still around.
Like you, served my country years ago. Why can't they?
Unidentified soldier #2: "Jus
February 24, 2007 - 00:14 ET by gfrrmanUnidentified soldier #2: "Just because we volunteered for the military doesn't mean we volunteered to put our lives in unnecessary harm and to carry out missions that are illogical and immoral." With this line of thought, the U. S. would never again defend itself. This guy should be brought up on charges and put in the brig. Something here really smells to high heaven.
Unidentified soldier #4, in I
February 23, 2007 - 22:22 ET by NeoConfirmedUnidentified soldier #4, in Iraq: "I know what I'm here fighting for, to give the Iraqi people, you know, some democracy and hope. So I am 100 percent behind this mission. You don't sign up to pick which war you get to go to."
Well said.
It's the simple, logical quotes that mean the most in this ridiculous world that we live in today.
The war was not originally ab
February 23, 2007 - 23:02 ET byThe war was not originally about bringing Iraq into a Democracy. And it should not be about that now. Our nation is not even a Democracy. Our nation is a Republic. Nonetheless, the war was not about changing their type of government.
Saddam had agreed to let the UN see all places where military weapons were being built. This was an agreement made in ending the Gulf War.
Saddam would not let the UN see all places. So we went in. We could not risk that he was building weapons of mass destruction, considering his track record.
People debate over the issue that no weapons of mass destruction were found. But, they do not understand that that is not the issue. The issue is that he went back on the agreement.
It would have been foolish to only go in, if we knew for sure that he was building them. The entire reason for the agreement after the Gulf War was so that we could learn if he was building them. So those who say we should have known for sure first, are being foolish.
It was also important to call Saddam's bluff, if in fact he was testing us. He may have very well been nudging the "Sleeping Giant," to see if we noticed him. And if we did not wake up and go after him, such would have given him the go-ahead to build the weapons, knowing that we were not awake and not going to do a thing to push the issue.
We can look at this like raising children. If we do not back up that which we say, with action, children catch on real quickly that mom and dad are bluffing--then the kids do whatever they want to do.
Should we be helping them rebuild their nation? I am not sure about that, but I don't believe that rebuilding their nation is the only reason that we are still there. I think that there are others who would pick up where Saddam left off, and that we are making sure that does not happen, before we leave. I believe in the mean time that we are using the time over there to help rebuild their nation. And if this war was about oil; where is the oil?
As for the whiney-babies who are talking on camera about wanting to come home; they are a disgrace to their uniforms. I say bring them home and completely remove them from their duties. They are shameful and are doing more harm than good.
Debra...
www.InformingChristians.com
"As for the whiney-babie
February 23, 2007 - 23:30 ET by NeoConfirmed"As for the whiney-babies who are talking on camera about wanting to come home; they are a disgrace to their uniforms. I say bring them home and completely remove them from their duties. They are shameful and are doing more harm than good."
Debra,
While I agree with most of your post, this final portion angers me. Anyone brave enough to serve our country deserves respect and just because you don't agree with their opinion of their current mission, you have no right to devalue their service by attacking them in this way. No, Debra, they are not shameful and should not be removed from their duties. That is nonsense. They have sacrificed much to speak their minds, whether you and I agree or not. If the people who are members of the armed forces have not earned the right to speak their minds cannot, then who can? You? Me?
Free speech and thought works both ways, Debra. Don't bring yourself down to the level of liberals. We can handle opposing views without attacking the messenger.
I agree. I don't think there'
February 23, 2007 - 23:34 ET by balboaI agree. I don't think there's anything wrong with someone in the military saying they want to go home. I imagine that's the goal of all soldiers.
Balboa,You are truly the only
February 23, 2007 - 23:46 ET by NeoConfirmedBalboa,
You are truly the only Democrat on this site who gets it. Good for you.
I'm tired of my fellow conservatives raking anyone over the coals who has the nerve to disagree.
That said, you're only half right. The goal of all soldiers is to be successful in their mission (whether you personally agree with it or not). Going home should always be the reward of that success.
They Have An Agenda Bal
February 24, 2007 - 01:16 ET by emjem24Bal, it seems we have another issue we will not agree on. When an obviously biased news show puts on a group of disenfranchised malcontents and then openly promotes this segment as the new feel good, update of the week, I have a problem. The members who appeared on 60 Minutes do not do our country, our military, or the mission a service. It's all part of the bigger picture, the PR War that we are currently losing between us and the terrorists. These Appeal For Redress folks are feeding into that.
As a military spouse, deep down I know this affects what my husband and other military members do. What these people say sows dissension in the military. I feel these men and women are picking and choosing where to go to fight and the military just doesn't work like that. When you enlist or sign a commisioning form you're agreeing to serve and follow orders, no matter under who and for what.
I feel a lot of these Appeal For Redress folks are speaking out against the war because of politics and their hatred for both Pres. Bush and the military at large. There will always be a slight percentage of the overall military who do not like their jobs and want out. I think some of these people are malcontents, disenfranchised, have an axe to grind, or never truly served on the front lines. Take, for example, the founder of Appeal For Redress. He's in the Navy, but has known Communist sympathies (is an activist actually) and has never served. He's stirring up trouble and many in the military know it. There are only 1,000 members in this group and the only real support they're getting is from a PR firm that's affiliated with Moveon.org.
There is a big picture to all this that everyone, including the public, is missing. There is a movement in America that not only wants an end to the Iraq War but an end to the military and it's been like this since the '60's. There are towns that willingly accept the military's presence in their communities because of the money they bring with them, but will not accept their spouses working in the same community thereby bringing forth disrespect and discrimination. Can you explain that to me, Bal?
I don't have a problem with disagreement within the military. Just like in other fields, there are a lot of patsies and phonies in the military. It's okay to use the military to fund your college education or get out of a ghetto but when you have to fight a war that they conveniently "object" to, these individuals draw the line.
How do you think spouses and families feel? I've lost friends over in Iraq and I've comforted someone who lost her husband in a previous tour. I feel that this Appeal For Redress group is getting a lot of press at the expense of military members and their families. They're being faithless, fickle, unpatriotic, and disloyal. More importantly, they're compromising our mission in Iraq. I hope the military does something about them and discharges all of them. You don't want to be in a military that's fighting an "unjust war?" Fine. Here's your dishonorable discharge.
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
Emjem24,Don't fall for the MS
February 24, 2007 - 01:21 ET by NeoConfirmedEmjem24,
Don't fall for the MSM game. Refer to my post above at 00:49.
What Game Would That Be?
February 24, 2007 - 01:32 ET by emjem24What game would that be? To get me frantic and foaming at the mouth like most liberals about the Iraq War? Believe me, I've acted in a more dignified way than many anti-war protesters. The Iraq War is just a bone to be played about by the MSM, the Dems (really, all politicians), the terrorists, and anti-war folks. I don't fall for much the MSM does anymore. I understand where you're coming from. However, that doesn't mean I'm not angered that I'm am just one more chess piece to be moved about on the greater chessboard of life..
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
"What game would that be
February 24, 2007 - 02:11 ET by NeoConfirmed"What game would that be? To get me frantic and foaming at the mouth like most liberals about the Iraq War?"
Exactly. And the more you foam, the more frantic you become...
The line between us and them narrows. That's what they want you to do. They're counting on it.
The inner strength that we posess is what will eventually defeat them. In more ways than we can imagine.
So let them whine. Let them cry. Let them undermine. It's been going on since the beginning of the war. You'll never convince them that this effort is noble.
All you have to do is look at history. Unfortunately, this war will be won on behalf of the people that make you so angry. You're husband is fighting over there. You are fighting over here. The tactics and circumstances are different but the pain is the same.
I'm guessing that you're rather young. I've seen this all before. It will work itself out. War is hell. In more ways than one.
Hi, Neo... Nice to see you ag
February 23, 2007 - 23:43 ET byHi, Neo... Nice to see you again... :o)
This is where we disagree. I have family in the military and I care about others as well. I would not want the life of a loved one in the hands of one of these soldiers. They have no faith in their Commander and Chief and no good reason to do what they are doing, which I see as treasonous. If Bush was wrong enough for his own men and women to ditch his decision publicly, then he would be impeached or the funds would be being pulled. Hence, he still has the majority of Congress behind him--whether they wish to admit it or not. So, this tells me that those people have no cause to publicly be insubordinate to him.
I am very much a supporter of our troops, but I will not support bad people just cause they are in the service. Just recently a service man was convicted of raping a girl and killing her family. Just because someone is in the military, does not mean they are a good person.
So we disagree on this issue. But, that is okay. We are not going to agree on everything.
Debra...
Debra,I'd like to think that
February 23, 2007 - 23:55 ET by NeoConfirmedDebra,
I'd like to think that you're above insane comparisions. With all due respect, comparing soldiers who publicly disagree with their Commander-in-Chief with a rapist and murderer is beyond ridiculous. Think about it, are soldiers Bush robots or human beings capable of thought?
I'm not wild about their remarks either but when more than half the country wants to cut and run, it can't surprise you some troops feel the same.
Neo, Your comment had the fol
February 24, 2007 - 00:17 ET byNeo,
Your comment had the following in it, "Anyone who is brave enough to serve our country deserves respect..." --My comment about the service man convicted of raping a girl and killing her family in Iraq, is to show that your statement is too broad of a statement.
Your comment in your second post to me, shows that you would draw the line with seeing the rapist/murderer as deserving of respect.
We all have lines that we draw. It simply appears, in this incident that my line is drawn a little sooner than yours.
With regards to "are soldiers Bush robots or human beings capable of thought?" --President Bush is their Commander and Chief, if they cannot respect him as such, then they should not be serving under him. Even in the business world, if someone trashes the boss publicly, they get fired.
Debra...
Debra,Never confuse desention
February 24, 2007 - 00:49 ET by NeoConfirmedDebra,
Never confuse desention with a lack of respect. For example, my kids attempt mutiny on a daily basis but I know that they respect their parents.
My point is that when we fall for the CBS parlor trick of gathering a handful of anti-Iraq war soldiers to underline their agenda, we feed into the illusion that Americans can be defeated if divided. The reason that they do this is to induce a negative reaction from conservatives who see the big picture. By doing this, we show all the signs of the NeoCon stereotypes that Liberals love to nail us on. I choose to take the path of least resistance. That is, I'm fine with voices that do not agree with my take on the war. I'm secure that they are wrong and I am right. Remember the old saying, doing the right thing is never the same as doing the easy thing.
Neo, Nonetheless, you do not
February 24, 2007 - 00:57 ET byNeo,
Nonetheless, you do not respect the service man who raped the girl and had her family killed. That was my point about that part of your comment.
And I stand firm on how I feel about the over-all issue. Those who are fighting this war, need to be united.
I respect that you have a different opinion on this issue; I just don't respect what that opinion is, as you do not respect mine. And that is okay. We do not have to agree on everything.
Debra...
Fair enough Debra. We'll agre
February 24, 2007 - 01:07 ET by NeoConfirmedFair enough Debra. We'll agree to disagree.
Please keep an open mind though. Either one of us could be wrong.
And that's okay as well...
Very good point. Yes, I will
February 24, 2007 - 01:15 ET byPoint taken. Yes, I will keep an open mind, Neo. :o)
Zealotry
February 24, 2007 - 12:21 ET by UnsaneHow is that even remotely possible?
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???." - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
Quick to judge, quick to anger, slow to understand
February 25, 2007 - 21:53 ET by UnsaneWhat, Debra, ashamed of yourself?
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???." - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
Neo Then Others Can Speak Out Against Them
February 24, 2007 - 01:27 ET by emjem24Neo, I don't agree with you. They served their country...that doesn't mean you backstab those you serve with. As a military spouse, I hear this a lot. "It's all right to speak out, it's doing no harm." I think it is. Since these backstabbers get the limelight of 60 Minutes I think it's time for people like me, military members serving in Iraq who support their mission, along with their families to speak out against Appeal For Redress. There are already many in the military who are aware of what these folks are all about. They're based out of Norfolk, VA, close to where I live. They want to pull out of Iraq and bail like most of the American people because of a "civil war," "illegal war," "scewed mission," whatever excuse is handy. I really wish people wouldn't put this group on a pedestal. They can be court-martialed and drummed out...believe me, the cold shoulder they will get in their units will be testimony enough of what they've done.
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
Whoa, Emjem,I am far from put
February 24, 2007 - 01:47 ET by NeoConfirmedWhoa, Emjem,
I am far from putting these people on a pedastal. And you, I and everyone else on this site who believe that winning this war is crucial to our future security have every right to disagree with their desention. Please don't misunderstand my premise. My point is that once you join the military, although you are bound to faithfully follow military orders, you are able to still have an opinion. Would you agree that if that is not the case that we are no different than countries run by dictators who allow no freedom of thought or difference of opinion? This point seperates us from Liberals. Can't you see that?
Yes, I can Neo
February 24, 2007 - 02:01 ET by emjem24Disagreement is all well and good when you're with your buddies in a barracks. When you go public with it to the media, it becomes a monster. Dissent can be used against the mission by the terrorists, politicians like Kucinich, and the anti-war, anti-America crowd. I'm not likening you to putting this group on a pedestal. I'm worried others will consider Appeal For Redress a legitimate group. All I've seen so far is them offering words of dissent but no real reasons why or how to improve the situation. All they want is out of Iraq at "our" expense and they don't seem to think about that. Also, the freedom to voice one's difference of opinion in the military is what makes us better than the freak shows that pose as democratically-run countries in South America and the Middle East right now. I'm not insinuating that military members should march in lock step conformity but I do think when you act in a manner deleterious to the objectives of one's mission, you are a risk and need to be adjudicated (like Watada). Believe me, there are a lot of of different philosophies, religions, and belief systems in the military and they're not being squashed. However, if these folks refuse to deploy to Iraq that makes them vulnerable to adjudication. I can see your point. However, what the Appeal For Redress folks do is add fuel to the power trip the liberals are on right now and fuels their obsession to cut the military completely. That should scare all Americans but like in most things, Americans haven't though through the consequences of a precipitous pull-out from Iraq.
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
Emjem,Like you, I pray that w
February 24, 2007 - 02:41 ET by NeoConfirmedEmjem,
Like you, I pray that we stick it out. I hope that one day you and your husband toast America's victory in Iraq. I sincerley do. I can read the angst in your posts and feel your frustration with groups like Appeal for Redress. I don't get it, either! But I'll tell you one thing, I refuse to let these people get to me. I will not allow them to mess with my convictions. I see them (as you do) for what they are. We are doing what is necessary. Your husband is doing what is necessary. The next time that you write to him, please remind him that they're are millions of us who support him in every way. That we believe in him and his mission despite what the MSM says. That he is in our thoughts and prayers although we wouldn't recognize him on the street. He is us and we are him.
As a small gift, I ask you to go to the forum section of this site and look for my post entitled 'Dave High Declares That Conservatives Aren't Funny' under the Latest News forums. I have posted some jokes there from the conservative angle. Please forward those to him. If he gets a smile from just one, it will be well worth my effort.
Take Care and God Bless
Neo
However, if free speech is to
February 24, 2007 - 09:18 ET by FastEdHowever, if free speech is to be held sacred, then why not become identified? The reason for being unidentified means that the speaker knows there are consequences that they don't want to face.
There is no sense in being stupid, if you can't prove it! - my dad V
FastEd, ----Excellent point..
February 24, 2007 - 17:31 ET byFastEd, ----Excellent point....
Iraq
February 24, 2007 - 11:14 ET by pbanks71. How many times is it acceptable for a country to fire missiles at our airplanes before we retaliate in force?
2. We rebuilt Germany and Japan.
3. We're still in Germany and Japan.
Ignorance is bliss. It's easier to repeat a mindless slogan than to do some actual research.
Contrary to what some th
February 24, 2007 - 00:50 ET by MidAmericaContrary to what some think a military person does not have constitutional rights. They have rights granted them by the Military Code of Justice. A soldier is someone who pledges their life to the military command. Insubordination in any form cannot be tolerated.
The American People
February 24, 2007 - 01:03 ET by john ryanThe American People no longer support the war in Iraq.
John R,By 'American' I'm sure
February 24, 2007 - 01:09 ET by NeoConfirmedJohn R,
By 'American' I'm sure you mean Liberal. Who never supported it in the first place.
Not Quite Correct JR
February 24, 2007 - 01:46 ET by emjem24Only about 60-70% of the American public "don't like" the direction of the war. That doesn't mean they all don't support the war. BTW, a 1/3 of the public still support the war, including this military spouse. A recent Opinion Dynamics Poll found that about 50-60% want the new strategy to succeed in Iraq. I don't trust all polls because people can manipulate them to scew toward one political spectrum (mainly liberal democrats). The MSM and the polling they use to project and characterize how a certain situation appears is so much smoke and mirrors. Any poll done by the MSM is one I don't trust. The MSM is rooting for us to lose this war, are you? I've seen some of your past posts and you tend to put out statements without any foundation of support. Trolls tend to do that when they have no argument. If the proof you have of your statement is MSM polling, think more outside the box. There are other polls that suggest otherwise.
The difficult we do immediately; the impossible takes a little longer. Air Force Motto
emjem says: When your brain's stuck on liberalism it self-destructs.
The American People don't?Wel
February 24, 2007 - 14:40 ET by BDThe American People don't?
Well then, how about the American people standing watch on the wire in Ramadi, Tal Afar etc....
Everything I have seen indicates that the vast majority of THAT demographic groups DOES support it. (Personal experience included.)
The American people no longer
February 24, 2007 - 14:44 ET by Clear thinkerThe American people no longer support Jack Ryan.
The liberal MSM has become an enemy of the USA.
john ryan is not the American
February 25, 2007 - 21:54 ET by Unsanejohn ryan is not the American people.
Perhaps john ryan would like to provide proof of his statement?
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???." - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
Hey Blonde
February 24, 2007 - 02:43 ET by NeoConfirmedHey Blonde
Neo,Hey back at you!I've been
February 24, 2007 - 03:35 ET by BlondeNeo,
Hey back at you!
I've been away for a while.
And trying to catch up on the threads.
Must say....NB is much more interesting than the news.
The whole time I was in Vegas...all the news was Anna Nicole.....sheesh!
emjem24 has it exactly right
February 24, 2007 - 03:25 ET by Right Wing Attack Dogemjem24 has it exactly right and crystal clear. Please thank your spouse for their heroic service. Thank you for your sacrifice while they are fighting for the freedom of all Americans. My prayers and best wishes go out for both of you. Air Force brings the pain from above!
Ah yes, another Dark Helmet m
February 24, 2007 - 08:52 ET by Chicago RepublicanAh yes, another Dark Helmet moment. Find seemingly anecdotal evidence (1000 out of a total deployment of many many thousands more) of the troops wanting to shitcan the war and you have a majority. Journalism at its best.
According to their website, t
February 24, 2007 - 18:25 ET by Del DolemonteAccording to their website, they've only got 1335 or so signatures so far. And not all of those are active duty people. Considering that there are over 100,000 US troops in Iraq, and a grand total of over 2.8 MILLION people serving in the military, 1335 is miniscule. But it's enough for CBS and their "reporter", former swimsuit model Lara Logan, to try and spread more hate.
As a retired Navy Chief Petty
February 24, 2007 - 09:11 ET by NeoCon JediAs a retired Navy Chief Petty Officer, I am disgusted by the actions of these individuals. To me, it equates to "giving aid to the enemy," because they, like some members of Congress, are showing weakness within America and it will give our enemies the ammunition to fight on.
These men and women are the "John Kerry" of the Iraq War... Their statements will be used against us and it will hurt our efforts in the end.
"At an end your rule is, and not short enough it was!" -- Yoda
Another Thought: Would the
February 24, 2007 - 09:20 ET by Chicago RepublicanAnother Thought: Would the Useful Idiots do a puff piece like this if 1000 economists protested a Democrat tax hike? Try to make you think its a majority?
Well, if you remember back to
February 24, 2007 - 18:29 ET by Del DolemonteWell, if you remember back to 1999, the pro-Bubba media people trotted out a large assortment of "law professors" to assure us that the impeachment of Billy Jeff was not grounded in reality or the law. Of course, they failed to trot out *some* law professors, like Richard Posner, who convincingly proved in one of his books that Mr. Clinton in fact perjured himself repeatedly.
It's not really all that su
February 24, 2007 - 09:32 ET by American InfidelIt's not really all that surprising since 17% of the military are democrats.
We've finally given liberals a war against fundamentalism, and they don't want to fight it. They would, except it would put them on the same side as the United States.
Ann Coulter
I would take that poll you ci
February 24, 2007 - 18:33 ET by Del DolemonteI would take that poll you cite with caution, as it's from the Military Times, which is owned by the liberal Gannett group. Some of their "polls" in the past have used questionable methodology (one of their favorite "polling methods" is by MAIL!).
To all of you who are serving
February 24, 2007 - 10:14 ET by msh1973To all of you who are serving or have in the past...I thank you from the depths of my soul. My nephew just got back from Iraq, he like many have a different story to tell, but the drive-by media doesn't want to hear the truth. I am very sad today.
Who is "Appeal for Redress?"
February 24, 2007 - 10:22 ET by coffee260This post originally appeared at MilBlogs in October, 2006. While some of the information uncovered herein has since made it's way into smaller media outlets, most major mainstream media sources are still reporting this effort as a "grass roots" campaign. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Astroturfing (via wikipedia):
And that's what's occurring with the "Appeal for Redress" web site.
The missing piece of the puzzle was actually available from the start:
That's from the October 26 New York Sun - kudos to the only reporters in the crowd who had the guts to tell the truth about this. As of this writing, over 200 newspapers have carried the story; The Boston Globe, al-Jazeera, The Washington Post, ABC News, Reuters, The (UK) Guardian... but none of the stories acknowledge the orchestration of the event by Fenton Communications. Instead, virtually all of them detail the "grass roots" effort of the troops. Even without the Sun story, the mere fact that this appeared simultaneously in multiple "big media" outlets is evidence enough of such a campaign. In the pre-internet days this wouldn't be so obvious, but in these days of instant global communication the life cycle of such a story should hardly exceed 24 hours (and wouldn't have in the past without active media participation). But if you're among the few tech savvy and information hungry people interested in not taking such slickly-packaged information at face value, here are the facts about "Appeal for Redress" in order of discovery here.
The site is registered to J.E. Glick, of 803 North Main Street, Goshen, Indiana. A quick check of online white pages reveals that's the address of The Fourth Freedom Forum. (You can also read about the group here). This would seem to confirm the point in the Sun story quoted above:
And Jennifer Glick (J.E. Glick), actual "owner" of the Appeal for Redress web site, is listed in the Fourth Freedom Forum contact page as Director, Information Services.
The Fourth Freedom Forum's opposition to war pre-dates Iraq and Afghanistan. They are a well funded, very professional organization. But the group is not listed among the sponsoring organizations on the Appeal for Redress web page. (Those groups are Iraq Veterans Against the War, Military Families Speak Out, and Veterans For Peace.)
It would seem the Fourth Freedom Forum wants to hide it's activities behind some groups and individuals seen as more credible to this particular cause. (I think "front groups" is the usual term.) But it was easy to find the real owners of the "Redress" web page (I originally noted the failure to do so on the part of one of the reporters who carried this propaganda to "the next level" - but have since come to believe that among journalists this was actually common knowledge that they saw fit not to include in their stories), so the "staff member at Fenton Communications who requested anonymity" (ironically, given the breathless press accounts, the only actual whistleblower in this story) may or may not have needed to be so concerned about being revealed.
(Update: registration of the site has been changed. Fourth Freedom is working quickly to camoflage their involvement in this project.)
*****
Read the whole thing...
Fenton Communications...Fenton Communications...um...
February 24, 2007 - 10:33 ET by acaiguanaFenton Communications...Fenton Communications...um...
I've heard them mentioned before. In connection with some political campaign.
Moveon.org is a Soros group, is it not?
Doesn't that make a convicted felon in charge of an anti-war movement in the US and isn't this felon also a 'naturalized' citizen or resident?
Or am I nuts?
ACA
...
Quoted from: 'Acaiguana Notes from the Bomb Shelter' (soon to be a movie at theaters near you)
Who is Fenton Communications?
February 24, 2007 - 11:24 ET by coffee260This from DiscoverTheNetworks:
Wow, coffee.Talk about an inf
February 24, 2007 - 12:19 ET by BlondeWow, coffee.
Talk about an information filled post!
Thank you. You've provided enough reading material for a week....and cut to the heart of the matter....not that this connection would ever be mentioned by the MsM.
Mr. Baker: Great work. Ho
February 24, 2007 - 18:17 ET by TEMr. Baker:
Great work. However, you are too diplomatic toward CBS. This is NOT a "relatively minuscule number of servicemen." This tiny group is an absolutely, positively minuscule number of servicemen.
Even smaller than that! Someo
February 24, 2007 - 18:38 ET by Del DolemonteEven smaller than that! Someone else can do the exact math, but according to Wiki the total number of people serving in the military, both active-duty and reserve, is over 2.8 million people. As of today, the "appeal for redress" has gotten just over 1300 signatures. That's less than .05% of the total military force.
Well, if what I hear today is true, a lot of these signatures ..
February 24, 2007 - 18:50 ET by acaiguanaWell, if what I hear today is true, a lot of these signatures are a joke. Many active duty guys have signed with really funny names.
ACA
...
Quoted from: 'Acaiguana Notes from the Bomb Shelter' (soon to be a movie at theaters near you)