Well, this is change you can really see.
Yesterday, verbiage at the "Service" Section of Barack Obama's Change.gov site (specifically the URL "http://change.gov/agenda/service/") served as source material for yesterday's post (at NewsBusters; at BizzyBlog) entitled "Obama’s 'Service in College' Program at Change.gov Promises $40 an Hour."
The page was entitled "Barack Obama and Joe Biden's Plan for Universal Voluntary Public Service." It contained "Barack Obama and Joe Biden's Plan," whose major sections included "Enable All Americans to Serve to Meet the Nation's Challenges," "Integrate Service into Learning," and "Invest in the Nonprofit Sector."
The detail of the second section (saved here at web host yesterday for fair use and discussion purposes) included this requirement (red underlining is mine):
Now the page looks like this (HTs to a couple of NB e-mailers):
The 40-hour requirement can now be found here at a highly stripped-down version of the "America Serves" page. Its entire content is as follows:
The $40 an hour referred to yesterday remains ($4,000 refund divided by 100 hours of service) and generally but not completely less coercive language. It appears that Obama, by "setting a goal" (usually when people set a goal, they intend to achieve it), wants all middle and high school students to get with the program for free.
Apparently, site reconstruction continues. An attempt to get to Change.gov's overall Agenda page just returned this result:
True that.
It's barely worth mentioning, because it's so obvious, that if a GOP president-elect were engaging in this kind of scrubbing, it would be getting saturation Old Media coverage.
Cross-posted at BizzyBlog.com.
—Tom Blumer is president of a training and development company in Mason, Ohio, and is a contributing editor to NewsBusters
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Something liberals never
November 9, 2008 - 13:22 ET by BDSomething liberals never understand is like everything else eduction is a business, and therefore it will make a profit.
Universities today, both public and private charge what the traffic will bear in order to maximize profit.
Let us say that I run the University of South Eastern Arizona and the College age students in my area can afford to pay on average $X to attend my university, I will somehow find a way to cut costs and hire faculty to keep within a budget that keeps my clientele paying $X to attend.
If however, the nanny state shows up and gives each of my students at the University of Southeastern Arizona approximately $4000 each year to attend college, do I still charge my studnets $X?
Hell no, over time I migrate my tuition so that now my students pay $X + $2000 so I can maximize profit.
It is simply a case of supply and demand, something liberals STILL have not learned.
Along with the required
November 9, 2008 - 13:23 ET by BlazerAlong with the required hours of "social programs" and community service from grade school all the way through college and beyond one cannot help to wonder if this is Obama' plan to idoctrinate our young into his own version of the Hitler Youth.
No ones asking what these supposed social and community service programs will entail, but I'm sure it won't be picking up litter from the highways. More like patrolling neighborhoods, spying on neighbors, family and weeding out all dissenters and reporting back to their party contacts at school.
This idiot hasn't even been in office one day and he allready has a taxpayer funded website called Change.gov. More like Change(the Constitution).gov. He obviously hasn't heard of the 13th amendment which he very well should have because it was a very defining moment in American and African American history.
The Thirteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution officially abolished and continues to prohibit slavery, and with limited exceptions, such as those convicted of a crime, prohibits involuntary servitude. It was adopted on December 6, 1865.
Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as
a punishment for crime where of the party shall have been duly
convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject
to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have the power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.
The only way he can make this mandatory is to have the constitution changed.
Paying someone for a job that they are coerced and have no choice in doing is still involuntary servitude.
Start spending time with your children folks and drive the conservative message home like a hammer, don't let the left have them. Every time they go to school or turn on the television their being brainwashed by leftist garbage.
If we lose our children, our nation is lost and this is where Communism always starts.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
"Obama' plan to idoctrinate
November 9, 2008 - 13:41 ET by hirogen73"Obama' plan to idoctrinate our young into his own version of the Hitler Youth"
Oh my God. I don't know whether to laugh my ass off or be just a little afraid that there are people who actually believe this.
Nah, I think I'll lean towards laughing my ass off.
Don't laugh too hard, we've
November 9, 2008 - 13:58 ET by lnthompDon't laugh too hard, we've already seen YouTube videos of kids in uniforms and chanting Obama's praises.
This too shall pass.
Lee T. USN(ret)
Inthomp - this Obamabot is gone - I'll post some videos
November 9, 2008 - 18:01 ET by Dee Bunkfor him but he'll just think they're okay
Obama kids sing for change
We're the kids for Obama
Obama kid brigade
There are tons more unfortunately
Thank god the right wing NEVER involves kids in campaigns
November 9, 2008 - 18:29 ET by Josh SNI remember when Sarah Palin decided to avoid dragging her 7 year old around on the campaign trail, and especially avoided having the depraved press corps interview her. I guess I mean Bizarro Sarah Palin.
The anti-abortion forces never use singing kids to make their point. Never! Another potential difference was whether or not this is some nationwide singing program, forced on you, or just one imbalanced singing teacher. You know, teachers don't get paid much at all, so the profession does not attract America's top talent. I mean, if you are a libertarian you might believe that.
The kids in blue shirts and camouflage pants are in a Troubled Kids program. I used to see them around all the time at Aberdeen Proving Grounds, an Army base, in Maryland. I'm not completely surprised that one troop of them did a salute to Obama. They probably feel a bit better about themselves (undeservedly) because they are very dark skinned and so is Obama.
hi josh
November 9, 2008 - 18:38 ET by TN MomRefresh my memory. When did Sarah Palin's children ever sing and/or promote McCain? Whenever I saw Sarah Palin's children...I saw family supporting their mom!
And the whole thing about the 'obama kids' singing that I found soooo creeepy was that they sang to HIM, not the USA, the US Flag, etc. The song was on the obama/biden website!!
TN Mom, Josh, er, I mean Gomer Pyle just makes it up as he goes.
November 9, 2008 - 23:11 ET by R D Helm-Dave
Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?
rd
November 10, 2008 - 00:09 ET by TN MomI know.... Gomer likes to stir up trouble!
No I've never seen the right wing use kids this way
November 9, 2008 - 18:41 ET by Dee BunkYou seem to be leaving out Obama having his kids on the campaign trail and having them interviewed by ET - So is he bizzaro Obama to you?
More immoral equivalency from an Obamabot. These people truly see no difference between a parent bringing their child to campaign events and indoctrinating them to worship a stranger. Very very sad. They also don't see a difference between teaching children about an issue (like abortion or global warming) and indoctrinating them to worship a human being. It's just nuts.
These kids could be singing about any issue that Obama cares about (like global warming) and that isn't creepy. The human worship is the creepy thing.
They will never get it. This is so scary.
josh
November 9, 2008 - 18:53 ET by TN Momoh,oh,oh....and let's not forget obama's children were publicly promised a puppy! More pandering?
I think it is pretty gross
November 9, 2008 - 19:28 ET by Josh SNBut I was responding to someone comparing it to Hitler Youth, and the hero worship he encouraged as Fuhrer.
People are saying some pretty crazy things. The top tax rate was 50% after Reagan's 1981 tax cut. Obama wants to raise it up to 39%. Was Reagan more socialist than Obama?
I think some people need to settle down a bit. They can't control the results anymore (the campaign is over) and I am happy to have you criticize the results of any action he takes, but until then... I remember when the hard-core right was convinced Clinton's tax hike would destroy the economy, instead we had 8 solid years of growth.
Cut / Raise
November 9, 2008 - 19:31 ET by BlondeHmmmm....what's the starting point in either case?
More immoral equivalency on the part of the leftist talking point boy.
Go figure.
Blonde - looks like Josh just changed the subject
November 9, 2008 - 20:03 ET by Dee BunkWe're talking about fears based on what Obama has already done in this campaign and others and he thinks we need to wait and give him the benefit of the doubt. Please! Even if he does a complete turn around - what he's already done in conjunction with the media is appalling and a threat to our democracy. IF (that's a big if) he morphs into a more reasonable person, the next media choice may not be so kind.
I could care less if his policies do work (or more likely don't hurt). That isn't the point. You don't get there by indoctrinating kids, smearing private citizens, killing free speech, accepting Foreign donations, encouraging voter fraud and funding criminal organizations.
We are nothing without our freedoms. I don't care about prosperity 1/1000th as much as I do our freedoms. I'd rather be poor and free than a slave to wealth.
Because of all their Oil wealth, Saudi Arabia had one of the biggest wealthiest welfare states. Their people don't have to do physical work. Most of their labor is imported. I would never ever want to live there and I don't think our poor people would either.
Of course he did, Dee.
November 9, 2008 - 20:12 ET by BlondeThe talking pointers always change the subject when they have their ears pinned back....when someone kicks their stupid talking points right back down their throats....which you did.
Josh SN is a BIG FAT FAKE!
Personally, I really don't ever answer whatever it is these trolls are asking, rather I point out the error in their arguments/assumptions/questions. If you answer them, it encourages them. Bat them around, have fun, and as you always do, prove them to be so far beyond wrong they look stupid! LOL.
I knew exactly what your point is (was) Dee...and so does every other NB here who knows you and your style.
Dee, Blonde
November 9, 2008 - 20:35 ET by cocodrieWhat you are discussing here is standard operating procedure for democrats. Everything is "for the children," so they can be used as pawns at any time. They abuse children by dumbing them down through the NEA and the AFT. The dumber the children grow up to be the better democrats they make; the main reason proper history is not taught. Josh is a perfect example of situation ethics - anything is ok if you don't think it is wrong for you. It's ok for him to lie, distort, misrepresent, insult, etc. because he says it's ok - that's why in his little mind he is never wrong.
cocodrie
November 9, 2008 - 20:43 ET by BlondeJosh is a liberal, perhaps even a democrat. With all of the shortcomings and duplicity that that implies.
But make no mistake....he's here on purpose to troll and disrupt the boards....I've seen this happen a hundred times.
Give no quarter.
Glad you're here, mon ami.
You are all wrong
November 9, 2008 - 21:19 ET by Josh SNI was responding to someone who brought up YouTube videos of Obama youth who were compared to Hitler Youth. That person, if anyone, changed the subject, not me.
Sorry Josh
November 9, 2008 - 23:48 ET by BlondeEvidence is there for all to see.
You lose.
Blonde
November 10, 2008 - 00:13 ET by cocodrieI figure Josh 's age to be mentally about 13, and judging by his experiences in life he may be 169 1/2. What do you think?
"I remember when the
November 9, 2008 - 19:43 ET by Blazer"I remember when the hard-core right was convinced Clinton's tax hike would destroy the economy"
It didn't because conservatives took over both houses in '94 and kept Clinton in check and tried to fix the little bit of damage he did in the first two years. This is where we get the line item veto from. Clinton got to take undue credit for Reaganomics.
But when you have the MSM in your pocket, revisionist history becomes the norm.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
Right Blazer and that is our only hope now
November 9, 2008 - 20:13 ET by Dee Bunka huge decisive turn over of Congress before he has time to implement a lot of this. I don't see much in the Republican leadership to make that happen though and a lot of damage can be done in 2yrs.
I'm not blaming the leadership completely. WE THE PEOPLE have to get more involved. Republican leaders literally have to fear for their lives. They can be targets of the dems political persecution like Scooter Libby and many others.
We really need to combine our different advocacy groups like Pro-life, NRA, Pro-military etc... to come together for more general type protests that demand States rights, free speech.
dot.com bubble is what saved Clinton
November 9, 2008 - 20:08 ET by iiiireaderI was part of tech and was part of the ridiculous money that it raised. The money was generated like mad for something that was not real. It all came down like a house of cards just as Clinton was leaving office - that is what the "golden years) were based on - smoke and mirrors. His tax hike was crushing to the middle class.
1994 and 1995?
November 9, 2008 - 21:21 ET by Josh SNI was part of that craziness, too. But you would have to really rewrite history to say that the dot-coms changed the economy in 1994, before the first major website (Ragu) was even made, or about 15 million people worldwide had net access over 56K baud modems (if they were lucky).
Nope, not at all
November 10, 2008 - 11:21 ET by iiiireaderRight from the get-go craziness prevailed. The venture capital money that was being thrown at any idea for dot.com existed in 1994. Again, I was part of it. I remember sitting in meetings to decide which ventures our large company would invest in and thinking how nuts these people were. You would not believe what lame-brain companies were fully funded by people trying to score big. So, yes, investments skyrocketed before the internet was fully brought on-line. That was exactly what was so crazy about it.
are you an Army brat
November 9, 2008 - 18:41 ET by katainkentare you an Army brat Josh?
member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008
My dad was Air Force, but a reservist while I was alive
November 9, 2008 - 19:25 ET by Josh SNI was stationed at Aberdeen Proving Grounds, where I saw the kids, if that is what you were asking. The Marine (my branch) and the Army both had schools there. I was trained to be a 2171 (45 Golf in Armyspeak?) there.
Electro-Optical Ordinance Repair
»→ While I was alive?
November 9, 2008 - 19:31 ET by Cool ArrowWhat was he after you died? LOL
Well he is in perfect
November 9, 2008 - 19:56 ET by Dan The Man 2Well he is in perfect character, became a Troll after he died.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
Before I was born he was active duty
November 9, 2008 - 21:26 ET by Josh SNNot while I was alive.
He did three years right after Korea, and another three years during Vietnam.
I was born in 1971, after he was out of Vietnam.
Not while I was alive - So
November 9, 2008 - 21:42 ET by Dan The Man 2Not while I was alive - So you were never born alive?
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
"I was born in 1971, after
November 10, 2008 - 01:13 ET by Blazer"I was born in 1971, after he was out of Vietnam."
Your 37? Really? Cause I'm 37 too and I really had you pegged as some bratty, punk teenager. Really don't feel much better now that we know we're dealing with an intellectually challenged adult totally divorced from reality.
Here's a little advice friend. Maybe you can go back to Kos and ask Markos to help you polish up on your subversionary tactics, 'cause we at least like a challenge here and we're tired of chewing up leftist troll's like potato chips. Plus it's getting a bit embarrassing watching the cerebral whooping your suffering here.
No need to dissapoint Markos and make Kos feel like their missing their village idiot, ya' know? Plus in a few months that may cost you a finger or too, if you embarrass and dissapoint your Communist masters.
Fat, drunk, leftist and stupid is no way to go through life son.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
you mean ordnance yes?
November 9, 2008 - 19:40 ET by katainkentah well. Was just curious. Navy Family ourselves. We spent several years in VA.
member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008
Just so, kata
November 9, 2008 - 19:45 ET by BlondeSomeone who repaired optical ordnance might (maybe ought to) be able to spell the word correctly.
My ex was in the Army....I've been to Aberdeen, and to the best of my recollection, there were no Marine "schools" there.
Methinks we've found a new brand of talking point disseminator. One who's done a little bit of research to sound authentic, but who actually hasn't a clue.
<edit> IIRC, it's Aberdeen Proving Ground, no (s).....a point which one who'd actually been there might remember. Just sayin'.
There is no I in ordnance?
November 9, 2008 - 21:28 ET by Josh SNWell, I am mistaken.
There is a large school at APG. Lots the armorers and other similar jobs for the Army and Marines get trained there. That's how I learned about shaving the seer and I made friends with the *only* guy in Tomahawk Missile Fixing school. A funny Navy redhead.
Well, one would think if one went to school for say
November 9, 2008 - 22:00 ET by Blondeaccounting.....one would be able to properly spell accountant.
But hey....that's just me!
There's an "I" in ordinal.....as in an ordinal number, but not in ordnance, i.e. weapons, as in things that go BOOM!
I notice you didn't address the balance of my post though.
accounting.....one would be
November 9, 2008 - 22:19 ET by Dan The Man 2accounting.....one would be able to properly spell accountant - Well librals dunt have ta spell rite, I mean the VP caint even understand how many ladders are in JOBS. That said Blonde, this is a blog and spallin should be secondary to the message, of course in Josh's case ....
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
say what?
November 9, 2008 - 22:56 ET by katainkentYes there is no I in ordnance. Unless you're speaking of repairing city laws. As for shaving a seer, I am a bit puzzled unless you are speaking of giving a mystic a trim. You might be referring to shaving the SEAR, but as a Marine you'd already have a fully automatic weapon, why would you need to? Shaving the sear pin is a way to illegally convert a semi automatic to an automatic, but you risk having it blow up in your face if you don't do it right. Not to mention serious jailtime when the BATF catches up with you.
I am concerned Josh, that you are not who you profess to be.
member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008
wow Josh
November 10, 2008 - 01:15 ET by candanceYou never cease to amaze us here, I'll give you that.
I'm usually reluctant to call someone a liar, but come on....you were in Marines and yet you did not know that ordnance had a special spelling? And that's where you learned about shaving the seer? Is this a joke?
My bro served in Marines. They tend to take a lot of pride in their jobs and would not make such mistakes. They also tend to sound like encyclopedias once you get them started instead of just tossing out lingo.
This is two nights in a row that you have flapped your gums here without any backup. I think it's high time for you to bounce back to DKos and stop annoying our military members.
Evenin' J, So it appears Josh's Marine story is unraveling.
November 9, 2008 - 23:08 ET by R D HelmLOL-If this gomer was actually a Marine, he would have been this Marine.
You know, that gives me an idea....
-Dave
Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?
Nah, I think I'll lean
November 9, 2008 - 17:44 ET by Dan The Man 2Nah, I think I'll lean towards laughing my ass off - We should be prepared for anything. Were you laughing your ass off 9/11/2001? I believe you were.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
»→ Tough crowd here
November 9, 2008 - 17:50 ET by Cool ArrowNow he's going to tell you about the first time in history fire melted steel.
Did you have to start that up all over again?
BWAHAHA
hirogen
November 9, 2008 - 18:01 ET by TN MomYou know what they say: 'He who laughs first, laughs last'.
Gird your Loins!
Laughing? While Obama ran a
November 9, 2008 - 18:49 ET by BlazerLaughing? While Obama ran a criminal and thuggish campaign and had his minions use the DOJ and I.R.S. to investigate anyone who dared question his past and policies with his buddy ACORN perhaps committing the largest act of voter fraud in history?
Laughing? When one of the first things he plans on doing is enacting massive gun legislation taking the teeth out of the 2nd amendment and assualting the first amendment by shutting up conservative talk radio?
Laughing? When he's talking about indoctrinating our youth into involuntary social programs and enacting involuntary conscription into the military?
Laughing? When he promised to reach out across the aisle and lead from the middle, when he's now saying he'll rescind up to 200 executive orders?
Oh, that's right civil liberties and free speech as far as liberals are concerned, however if there is legislation enacted to silence and hurt conservatives, thats fine. Partisan politics as usual, eh?
What happened to "Change"?
That's right, when he said "Change", he actually meant "Change"The Constitution of The United States to enact a Hyde park, Berkley utopia.
Obama will be legislating from San-Fran and Chicago. Using thuggish tactics to alienate the opposition and quash all dissent.
You folks fell for this garbage, hook, line and sinker. This man is a liar and a thug. He's promised too many things to too many people and he won't be able to deliver on Jack.
You guy's cried for the last eight yrs. that Chimpy-McHaliburton was taking all of your freedoms away, when he didn't take away one, and kept this country and it's people safe for eight yrs., and you want us all to rollover for and bow down to recieve "The One"?
The irony and hypocrisy of you people never ceases to both amaze and disgust me all at once.
Liberal's are a group of people who will not truly recognise what hell on earth truly is, untill they finally get everything they've ever wanted.
By then it'll be too late my friend. When we conservatives are gone, they'll be noone to pull you out of the very deep well you'll find yourself in.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
Don't do me any favors
November 9, 2008 - 19:31 ET by Josh SNBut more than anyone here, I think you need to see this.
Josh, you really should
November 9, 2008 - 19:48 ET by BlazerDon't worry Josh I won't.
However, you really should take a look at this.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
You Won't, But You Expect Me To?
November 9, 2008 - 21:29 ET by Josh SNThat's not particularly logical.
Logic? Coming from
November 10, 2008 - 01:18 ET by BlazerLogic? Coming from you?
Since when did you ever let a little thing like logic get in the way of you making an argument?
Logic?
Thank's, I just spit my drink all over my keyboard. You should do stand up..................and then sit the hell down.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
If I'd thought about it ahead of time...
November 9, 2008 - 13:23 ET by JohnMI would love to have kept each successive re-write, as the campaign unfolded.
Imagine an analysis that showed how the content was revised in response to what was said about Obama's pitches...
What a book that would make!
»→ I'm mad at NB
November 9, 2008 - 14:34 ET by Cool ArrowMy wife and I already had plans to do our 100 hours and cash in on that $8,000 tax break.
We were torn between ACORN and a soup kitchen.
But NOOOOOOO! NB had to go and put the kibosh on that.
I'm really bummed!
I kind of has a nice ring to it...
November 9, 2008 - 14:50 ET by Nortonalec"Barack Obama and Joe Biden's Plan for Universal Voluntary Public Service." I mean it is voluntary, right?
God that sounds like the name for an old Soviet program.
"It's such a fine line between stupid and clever."~David St. Hubbins
Universal Voluntary Public
November 9, 2008 - 15:02 ET by motherbeltUniversal Voluntary Public Service."
As I said yesterday, someone needs to inform His Highness and His Sidekick that the words "universal" and "voluntary" are mutually exclusive.
Subject Change
November 9, 2008 - 15:21 ET by spiffI don't want to change the subject but one other thing that bothers me about change.gov is that it is copyrighted. I believe that by law United States Government publishings can not copyrighted, with a few exceptions (Post office, Smithsonian etc.).
a mom's POV
November 9, 2008 - 15:25 ET by katainkentThis is neccessary because ....we need the government telling us what we should be doing? Tired of the government trying to step in to do my job. Really tired.
member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008
well its sunday and I better
November 9, 2008 - 15:49 ET by smoto66well its sunday and I better get my kids and show them how to goose step in formation if they want to attend college!
What is with that "Office
November 9, 2008 - 16:17 ET by ThisnThatWhat is with that "Office of the President-Elect"???!! Has NB commented on that yet? This is outrageous. Obama is trying to create a counter-government cult to undermine President Bush over the next two months. That man is as dangerous as a rattlesnake.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
What is with that "Office
November 9, 2008 - 16:22 ET by motherbeltWhat is with that "Office of the President-Elect"???!! Has NB commented on that yet?
Not officially, I don't think, but several of us have brought it up in comments. It really is hilarious.
I repeat: when someone repeatedly says "It's not about me" you can be damn sure that it is.
"What is with that "Office
November 9, 2008 - 19:18 ET by Blazer"What is with that "Office of the President-Elect"???!!"
This man suffers from malignant narcissism and has a god-complex amplified by the media and his cult like following.This man has some serious personality disorders.
Mix all of that together and be at the helm of the most powerful nation on earth all at once, makes me believe we are in for some very dark days my friends.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
Malignant Narcissism?
November 9, 2008 - 23:21 ET by Lord ElicaniMalignant Narcissism? That's a Rush tune, and awesome when heard live...
Oh wait, we weren't talking about music, were we?
If I have to do this crap for him to go back to college, screw it. I'll just work without a degree and be poorer. Is that not the point, for those that don't agree with him? Sounds like a logical conclusion to me.
"The trouble with our liberal friends is not that they're ignorant; it's just that they know so much that isn't so."
- Ronald Reagan
First $4000?
November 9, 2008 - 16:36 ET by Lamb-chopLet me see if I understand: 100 hours of "community service" will provide the FIRST $4,000 of college?? Excuse me, but $4,000 might get me half-way through one semester, assuming I attend a public college. Here's a much better plan, and it's the one I used to obtain my bachelor's degree absolutely free: Join the military branch of your choice (I chose the USAF), help protect and defend America, then attend the college/university of your choice.
Huh?
November 9, 2008 - 18:22 ET by Josh SNA $4,000 tax credit is the same as $4,000?
»→ Don't think so, Josh
November 9, 2008 - 18:29 ET by Cool ArrowI think it decreases your taxable income by $4,000.
I'd still like to take advantage of it as I indicated above. Me and the Missus getting an $8000 credit could lead to a pretty tidy return.
double post
November 9, 2008 - 18:59 ET by Prester Johndouble post
No
November 9, 2008 - 18:58 ET by Prester JohnA tax credit reduces DOLLAR FOR DOLLAR your tax liability, so what you would do is figure your taxes as normal, then subtract $4,000 from the taxes that are owed i.e. if your tax liability is $5,000, the tax credit reduces it to $1,000.
that's about $10 per hour, is it not?
November 9, 2008 - 20:20 ET by iiiireaderAs Obama wants to raise minimum pay to $9.50 and tie it to inflation, it looks like you would be working for about the minimum you could earn as counter help at McDonalds. Doesn't sound so great after all.
look Josh
November 9, 2008 - 18:47 ET by candanceIt's very simple:
The government will use $4,000 as leverage to compell young people into doing service.
Yes or no.
PS - I'd like to know precisely what kind of service Obama has in mind. Picking up litter in the park or taking sensitivity classes to interact with gay people better?
I'm a typical white person.
candance - probably the latter along with ACORN work
November 9, 2008 - 19:03 ET by Dee Bunkthis country is so screwed.
Dudette
November 9, 2008 - 21:33 ET by Josh SNDo you have any idea what the military is giving to people to "compel" them (YOUR WORDS!) to join the military? It was simply $30K for college to be a 2171 when I joined the Marines. Now it is much, much more.
Are you accidentally damning the George Walker Bush administration for "compelling" people to do military service by offering large enlistment and re-enlistment bonusses?
Are you serious Josh - My God - what is wrong with you!
November 9, 2008 - 21:45 ET by Dee BunkOur soldiers are the only government employees that are underpaid. You compare a signing bonus for active duty into a dangerous war zone to some liberal fraud work?
How outrageous. What type of volunteer work are those people going to do that warrants more pay than most military members get? Where is this money going to come from? You people don't think anything through.
None of us are sure what is
November 9, 2008 - 21:54 ET by Free StinkerNone of us are sure what is wrong with Josh.
But I'll bet that whatever it is, it's very hard to pronounce.
"Gov. Palin has been subjected to one of the most massive and dishonest pile-on smear attacks in the history of liberal media." -- Lowell Ponte
lol Free
November 9, 2008 - 22:00 ET by Dee BunkI noticed after I posted that on the side comment thing someone else was using almost the same words "what is wrong with you?" and they were replying to him also.
Josh was a Marine?
November 9, 2008 - 22:00 ET by R D HelmLMAO-God help us all!
-Dave
Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?
Good evening RD
November 9, 2008 - 22:14 ET by cocodrieAnybody know how old Josh is? I figure mentally about 13. But to have been everywhere and done everything he claims, I figure him to be about 169 1/2.
A $4,000 tax credit is the
November 9, 2008 - 18:53 ET by Dan The Man 2A $4,000 tax credit is the same as $4,000 - And when you dont have any taxes it is a 4K benefit. The government gives you money. Of course I don't expect you to understand or think about the consequences.
The most interesting and disturbing thing is how the programs seem to waffle and change daily. Obama has said so many things he can point to something and say see I said that. Oh wait he has.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
Dude
November 9, 2008 - 21:31 ET by Josh SNA Tax Credit when you don't owe taxes is like an umbrella without rain.
A Tax Credit when you don't
November 9, 2008 - 21:46 ET by Dan The Man 2A Tax Credit when you don't owe taxes is like an umbrella without rain. - Apparently you have not heard of unearned income tax credit? It all boils down to government giveaways to those who dont pay.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark.
It is to the Democrats
November 9, 2008 - 20:48 ET by CobraManIt is to the Democrats. At least it was when Bush offered increased tax credits back in 2001 and 2003. Don't you remember? They were complaining that Bush was giving money to the "super-rich."
Obama: My job is above my pay grade
Another Government "Program"
November 9, 2008 - 18:45 ET by iveseenitallSooner or later there will be a "needs test" for this government giveaway. Then guess who'll get the money. "...To each according to his needs"--sound familiar?
NEVER,NEVER trust a "liberal"
Why change it?
November 9, 2008 - 18:59 ET by El__KabongA question for fellow NBers ( and you trolls... um, visitors as well)- if this is "change he believes in," why change this part of the website? Why the big scrub? Do they not have the courage to stand behind their beliefs... even if they are waaaay far reaching? Was it deemed to be unpalatable to the public? And the obamaton webheads had to know that the original words of the that page would be cached, despite their attempts to change it and make it "acceptable." Even if the words are changed, the outcome will be the same- involuntary servitude!
I would still like to hear someone...
November 9, 2008 - 19:12 ET by Prester John...in the MSM publicly ask BHO about this Civilian National Security Force of his. If Bush had proposed something like this the Left would've gone insane with the usual comparions to the Nazis, the SS, the Gestapo etc, but here we have BHO proposing this "force" that is to be as well equipped and funded as the regular military and no one in the press is interested to find out what he has in mind?
Incredible.
Exactly PJ, my sentiments
November 9, 2008 - 19:37 ET by BlazerExactly PJ, my sentiments exactly. I find it beyond comprehension that people are not alarmed by this. We do not need his CDF, we have the right to defend ourselves!
With a budget comparable to the U.S. military? How is this not a para-military force? Defending whom from what, since these folks claim we are in no damger of terrorists here anymore.
We allready have the federal agencies, state and local police, why would we need this?
One cannot help to wonder if this would not be some sort of a secret police force, like the Gestapo.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
The conspiracy monger in me....
November 9, 2008 - 21:01 ET by Prester John....tells me that this is a not so subtle attempt to confiscate privately owned firearms or at least control their ownership. If BHO can get a federal court (say that group of nutcases out in San Francisco) to say that this new "force" is the well regulated militia mentioned in the Constitution, then anyone who is not a member of this "militia" no longer has a right to own a firearm. Thus the "authorities" can confiscate these illegally owned weapons. Meanwhile, back in the militia, the leadership of said militia can expel any member who is not politically reliable and can thus confiscate those weapons also. All very nice and legal.
But I'm just being paranoid, aren't I?
Good evening Prester
November 9, 2008 - 21:20 ET by cocodrieUnfortunately this is not far fetched nor paranoid. There have been many attempts to pass rediculous laws to get our guns or render them useless. One that comes to mind was the one to serial number all bullets. Look for attempts to impose exorbitant taxes on guns and ammo.
Prester
November 9, 2008 - 19:37 ET by iveseenitall"Incredible", right on. Unfortunately,we are going to be shaking our heads in disbelief for some time to come. Barry, the mutt, will be nipping at our heels every waking moment.
NEVER,NEVER trust a "liberal"
Community Service
November 9, 2008 - 19:26 ET by Nortocomes naturally to those of us who care..seems some folks need to use their powers to make others do it. They cannot comprehend that many of us are already doing what they deem necessary to make mandatory. Sort of takes the joy out of it, you know.?
"comes naturally to those
November 9, 2008 - 19:39 ET by Blazer"comes naturally to those of us who care"
Spot on. However coerced community service in name of Dear Leader does not.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
Norto
November 9, 2008 - 19:46 ET by iveseenitallI've always said the same thing about most "charities". If I want to give my money to the needy, I'll go to a poor neghborhood and hand out $20 bills. Otherwise, my money goes into the pockets of the "administrators", not the intended. Witness the Katrina debacle. Millions lost. Furthermore, most government or quasi-government "programs" are corrupt. Witness Fannie and Freddie. Socialism doesn't work. Yet now we are knee-deep in it. Sad.
NEVER,NEVER trust a "liberal"
Ironically it's a proven
November 9, 2008 - 19:51 ET by BlazerIronically it's a proven fact that conservatives give more to charity and volunteer for coummunity service significantly more than our "compassionate" liberal friends.
"You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious. "
- Ben Kenobi on Liberals, and the MSM.
" The Cake is a lie."
Educare/Ayers/Klonsky/CAC
November 9, 2008 - 19:38 ET by NortoI think that educare, Buffet and Gates conception to K school for the less fortunate in our midst, has the stamp of Ayers, Klonsky and CAC all over it. This Communism at its best or worst, take your pick. Waterville, Maine where I live has won the chance for one of the first satellites of this scenario and I cannot but wonder if it is a sprout of Klonsky's Small Schools Workshops?!
The Waterville gig has gone under the radar by way of Governor Baldacci's wife in concert with Susan Buffet. No local control and all kinds of disengeuous talk of no local tax $$ being used, as if all tax revenue was not local.
This is indoctrination, with midwives, prenatal and the works. Go to Educare Chicago and check out the white paper on it and wonder to yourself if the buildings look at all like the calf sheds on your local dairy farm. Herd mentality at its finest! Very Creepy.
Norto
November 9, 2008 - 20:04 ET by iveseenitall"Creepy"--- another excellent word for the times in which we live. Barry H.Obama is indeed a "creepy" guy. He slithers when he walks and hesitates when he talks. You never know what he is thinking or if he is thinking at all. When he gives a speech he looks at the sky or the ceiling. Ask him a question requiring a "yes or no"and he's liable to ramble for an hour. He'll tell you something one minute, then change his mind the next. Honesty isn't his strong suit, to say the least. As for "education"-- keep your kids away from this "creepy" fellow and his "creepy" friends if you can.
NEVER,NEVER trust a "liberal"
Creepy as in makes my flesh crawl
November 9, 2008 - 20:30 ET by iiiireaderI don't understand how so many think this guy is anything but creepy. Everytime I hear him speak, it makes me feel slightly sick to my stomach. I remember his big speech years ago and even then I had the same down-trodden feeling afterward.
Obama will encourage
November 9, 2008 - 21:23 ET by TN MomObama will encourage retiring Americans to serve by...
Withholding their Social Security?
Exactly what I told my daughter
November 9, 2008 - 23:06 ET by NortoJust this evening when she asked how the "he" could force us to serve? Withhold all or part of my SS. "he" will have to give me credit for the hours I am already doing.
Seems those not doing, should be kicking in to us that are??
My college sophomore
November 10, 2008 - 00:15 ET by TN MomMy college sophomore daughter does tons of volunteer work through her sorority and for her University. TONS. Betcha she won't get credit unless it helps ACORN??
Last to comment, as usual...
November 10, 2008 - 00:15 ET by m4ster chiefI'm surprised someone more brilliant than this dim bulb hasn't brought up something said a few weeks ago by Whoopie Goldberg, who was supposedly worried about being enslaved again (as if she has ever been.) I can't remember the exact context of her comments, nor whom she feared would restore slavery...although it was probably McCain.
I do find it ironic, however, that her messiah is going to be the slave master, assuming his voluntary / compulsive community service corps comes about, cracking the whip over millions of Americans. She will probably view this as a combination of righteous retribution for sins against blacks and brilliant progressive thinking.
I like the money
November 10, 2008 - 11:45 ET by NorthCoasterWhere do I sign up?