
Well, sports fans, the conservative hit parade continued last week, for having first accused Fox News's Bill O'Reilly of being a racist, and Rush Limbaugh of being anti-military, the whackos on the left have now branded Ann Coulter an anti-Semite.
Expectedly, Hillary Clinton's Media Matters for America was once again right in the middle of the controversy.
Fortunately, much like Limbaugh and O'Reilly before her, Coulter wasn't taking the attacks lying down, and, instead, explained what was meant by her statements - which was clearly lost on the secular media - to Steve Malzberg of WOR Radio Thursday (audio available here):
I stated the doctrine of Christianity. Apparently, as we're always told in church, but you don't always, you don't always see it, Christianity is a radical and offensive doctrine. But I think, um, we'll see, I don't think most Jews are as stupid as Donny Deutsch.
Neither do I, Ann. Please continue with your lesson for the uneducated about what you meant by Jews being perfected:
That comes from that raging anti-Semite St. Paul. This is a straight statement of Christian doctrine...This is what Christians believe. We believe the Old Testament, and we think the New Testament completes that. I mean, the New Testament is obviously anticipating some Christ coming. Jews say, "Not that Christ. You got the wrong one."...I was just saying that we consider when Jews become Christians, that is becoming a perfected Jew. And that is precisely the theological term.
Steve Gilbert of Sweetness & Light wrote on this very subject Thursday:
As the Oxford University Guide To the New Testament points out, even some Jew once named Saul said the very same thing she did:
Continuity and Superiority: The Epistle to the HebrewsAlthough Hebrews is often called a letter, it does not contain an epistolary prescript, it does not name the author or the addressees, and it does not include an opening prayer or thanksgiving. It is more likely an early Christian homily. The book is anonymous, although it has traditionally been attributed to Paul. The emphases in the book, however, are not Pauline.
The Epistle to the Hebrews asserts the superiority of Christ to the prophets, the angels, Moses, Joshua, and the Jewish priesthood. Christ brings a superior covenant, a superior tabernacle, and makes a superior sacrifice. Like many other authors whose task is Christian self-definition, this author uses the Hebrew Scriptures to illustrate the authenticity of his claims. For example, several Old Testament prophets mention a new covenant that God will make with the Jews. Drawing on Platonic thought, this author argues that the old covenant was a foreshadowing of the new, an imperfect reflection of a perfect reality.
Scholars do not know when or where this book was written. It is clear, though, that the author was concerned to define group boundaries. He argued that Christianity represented the perfection of Judaism. Christianity was the religion foretold by the prophets. Those who did not believe that Jesus was the Messiah, moreover, were not the true people of God.
One would think St. Paul could be considered an authority on Christianity.
But if that isn't enough, how about the Catholic Encyclopedia? From its entry on the New Testament:
Specifically Christian DoctrinesOther doctrines, specifically Christian, are not added on to Judaism to develop, but rather to supersede it. In reality, between the New and Old Testaments there is a direct but not revolutionary succession as a superficial observer might be inclined to believe; just as in living beings, the imperfect state of yesterday must give way before the perfection of today although the one has normally prepared the other. If the mystery of the Trinity and the spiritual character of the Messianic Kingdom are ranked among the peculiarly Christian dogmas, it is because the Old Testament was of itself insufficient to establish the doctrine of the New Testament on this subject; and still more because, at the time of Jesus, the opinions current among the Jews went decidedly in the opposite direction.
As such, Coulter was spot on when she told Malzberg:
People who have no knowledge of religion should not, for one thing, probably talk about it, but should certainly not go around getting their noses out of joint about it.
Yes, Ann, but none of this is about knowledge or religion. The left are hunting for witches, and you are sadly one of their prime targets.
With that in mind, should we expect Sen. Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nevada) to be offering a resolution next week condemning Coulter's words?
Let's all pray.
—Noel Sheppard is the Associate Editor of NewsBusters.













Comments Policy
Excellent post Noel!
October 13, 2007 - 19:29 ET by rx4musicIt just goes to show how smart Ann really is with regards to Christianity. She was absolutely spot on. Also, great excerpts! Now, will anybody read them or listen to them? I can think of a few who won't...
It takes time
October 13, 2007 - 19:37 ET by kgConsidering that the Democratic politicians and journalists are new
to religion this year, it will take them time to figure out exactly
what it means to be Christian.
That is unless they became Christians this year for the votes.
This is why Ann's remarks are racist
December 31, 2007 - 17:45 ET by toaster7First of all, let me state the facts that my argument rests on. If you can disprove them, then my argument has no validity.
1. There are many (100+) religions existing in the world and throughout time. (i.e. various forms of Christianity, Islam, Buddhism, native american religions, Greek+Roman+Norse religions, African tribal religions etc.)
2. From an objective, 3rd person viewpoint, there is no reason to think that any religion is more valid than any other religion. Any follower of any religion believes as much as anybody else. In fact the only historical reason Christianity is a dominant religion is because of Europe's wealth of firepower, and its colonization of the whole world.
3. Thus, the Christian God is no more 'perfect' than Yaweh (Jewish God), or Allah, or Zeus, or Jupiter, or any other mythological all-powerful being.
4. Yes you can believe the Christian God is the best god, but you need to know that your belief really doesn't make something true. Someone else, just like you, once believed in Zeus, too.
Since Ann's said that the Jewish faith is "imperfect," while her religion IS "perfect," it's clearly racist, and just not true.
You prove nothing of the kind, toaster
December 31, 2007 - 18:22 ET by RJEvery religion believes it is the true religion. Because Ann said it out loud doesn't make her any more of a racist than an adherent of any other religion.
Instead, what you are pushing is a kind of liberal "religious equivalency", where you think all religions should admit that they're no better than any other religion.
Further, "Christianity colonized the whole world?" Wow. You have some serious anti-Christian beliefs, there, bucko. I might almost think it makes you racist.
"Huckabee is a compassionate conservative only in the sense that calling him a conservative is being compassionate. -Ann Coulter
Oustanding response by
October 13, 2007 - 19:58 ET by DaMavOustanding response by Coulter and commentary by Newsbuster's Noel Shepherd. Those worried for the safety and security of the Jews (and what sane person would not be, given history) need not worry about the rational dialogue of Ann Coulter. Sadly, many of those going after Coulter on this have ignored the steady rise of vituperative anti-Israeli sentiment on the left and blatant anti-Jewish propanda daily propagated by Islamofascist sympathizers.
Deutsch might better spend his time asking why the Palestinian flag flies unrepudiated over "antiwar" demonstrations, while the new Hitler is wined and dined at Columbia and by the National Press Club. Coulter did not call Jews pigs and monkeys and falsely claim they were engaged in genocide and apartheid and ought to be wiped from the face of the planet. Nor would she in a thousand years. Maybe Deutsch ought to learn to tell the difference between those engaging in rational dialogue over theological differences and those wielding the knife with the sharp blade.
There is a difference
October 13, 2007 - 21:17 ET by Gat New YorkThere is a difference between extolling the virtues of your religion and using your religion to denigrate another religion. The first is freedom of speech. The second is bigotry. Coulter managed to do both in her interview with Deutsch. Coulter is not a threat like the islamo-fascists, but her words support their argument that Jews are a trash religion. Her explanation to Steve Malzberg did nothing to resolve this. She gives a long theological soliloquoy to a world that lives with :15 second sound bites. And her :15 second sound bite was that Jews are imperfect and to become perfect have to become Christians. It is classic anti-semitism that Jews have heard before. Michael Savage was as angry about her interview as I was and so was every other Jewish person I know, no matter what their political affiliation.
Well, there you go again (to quote a great American)
October 13, 2007 - 21:49 ET by RJInstead of taking the thread again into another "I'm offended" trip, how about responding to the fact that Coulter has made an accurate statement. Would you rather she lie?
And, come on. Michael Savage as your example of civil behavior?
I would rather she
October 13, 2007 - 21:57 ET by Gat New YorkI would rather she apologize for making an insensitive and biased remark to Deutsch and every other Jewish person watching. This is a classic anti-Semitic remark that she made and there is no rationalizing it. As I had said, it is one thing to extoll the virtues of your religion. It is another to use your religion to denigrate another religion. The first is freedom of religion and the second is bigotry. She managed to do both.
One thing Michael Savage, Donny Deutsch, and I have are that we are Jews and politics comes second.
GNY, Get over yourself.
October 13, 2007 - 22:18 ET by LilyPearlGNY,
Get over yourself. If I demanded an apology everytime I felt insulted by the media for my Christian beliefs I would be in an agitated state all the time. Breathe!!!
Stop defending Bigots
October 13, 2007 - 22:28 ET by PopularTechHe has every right to challenge bigots and it is you who needs to get over yourself. GNY like myself know Christians who do not hold these bigoted views of Judaism.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Yeah, Komrade Tech and Komrade Gat, you know what to do.
October 13, 2007 - 23:09 ET by RJMuzzle her.
Ignorant
October 14, 2007 - 02:09 ET by PopularTechIs the only way you can try to score points is by being ignorant?
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
It's worked for you, hasn't
October 14, 2007 - 08:30 ET by bretzysdudeIt's worked for you, hasn't it?
i don't think he has -
October 15, 2007 - 13:44 ET by TruthMongeri don't think he has - although I've really been trying to help him - and I will again:
I started a forum on this BTW. But Christians are bigots. Muslims too then, I guess. And if Jews think they are "God's chosen people then - how does that sound, ya think...?
Anyway according to the libs Paul's Bible remarks are bigoted. And the entire Bible is god-breathed - so therefore God is bigoted. As Christians we are part of God's body (the church and believers are the "body of Christ" and Christ and the Father are one) - therefore as part of a bigot we are also bigots - according to the left anyway...
Ultimately this is their definition of bigotry so they can decide who fits it and who doesn't - not much we can do about that...
Of course, according to their own definition of bigotry they are also bigots...
Judging each other is fun as hell sometimes:)!
A service of the new NB respect police
Get over yourself
October 13, 2007 - 22:54 ET by VinceP1974Michael Savage was an idiot.
Remember the part when she said "You have to obey".. meaning Jews have to adhere to the Torah.
He kept saying (paraphrasing) "What does she mean Jews have to obey... OBEY WHO? OBEY HER? THAT WHORE"
He , and I guess you, don't even know what she was saying yet are INSTANTLY offended and then attack her.
You want someone to coddle your stupid feelings? Maybe you should lead by example, you ignorant woman.
It's bigotry to state Christian doctrine?? Tough. You're bigoted against Christians. Whereas Christians may have an opinion about things they have no control over (such as who God forgives), you are definately trying to control the actions of Christians.
You offend me.
All infidels on the same lib-nuanced bus
October 14, 2007 - 14:46 ET by acumenSorry to arrive late and normally I would just catch up and move along.
But there is one inaccuracy of your post I wish to bring to your attention Gat; "I would rather she apologize for making an insensitive and biased remark to Deutsch and every other Jewish person watching."
I kindly and unbigotedly (is that a word?) refer you to one of my favorite columnist/writer/activist and incidently a "Jewish person", David Horowitz.
Mr. Horowitz offered this opinion of media matters latest contrived controversy; "Why do some Jews think that Christians should not really believe what they believe while it's okay for Jews to really believe they are God's Chosen People? I don't get it. Whatever happened to the pluralism of ideas?"
As a Catholic I couldn't agree more with the above opinion of a Jew who defends a Protestant. It is hard to find fault with someone who does not apply/promote violence in the pursuit of a fellow human being's salvation. If a person was dying from dehydration and I knew that water would bring about an immediate recovery, I would be doing a good thing in offering that person water. That is all Ann was doing based on her beliefs. She is not forcing anyone to drink the theological water, just offering the water.
As much as I have enjoyed other opinions by my fellow NewsBuster commenter Gat, I have to disagree with you on the necessity of Ann offering an apology for her theological beliefs concerning her jewish friends. As Mr. Horowitz prefaces the above quote by saying; "If you don't accompany this belief by burning Jews who refuse to become perfected at the stake why would any Jew have a problem?"
It would serve well to remember that Ann continues to risk her own blood (or she wouldn't require a security detail) to defend among other issues the Jewish State of Irael.
In short - Methinks your stance has to do more with the personality of Ann rather than her theological beliefs. With so much depending on the outcome of the '08 elections right around the corner for ALL of us infidels, I don't see this as a hill to die on Gat.
Mr. Horowitz's entire remarks on this controversy can be found here.
another fantastic post on
October 15, 2007 - 13:46 ET by TruthMongeranother fantastic post on this
didn't make a dent I'm sure but still
A service of the new NB respect police
She is lying
October 13, 2007 - 22:07 ET by PopularTechBecause Christian supersessionism has been rejected by the Catholic Church
and the vast majority of mainstream Christian denominations. Thus she is lying and being a Bigot.
Please tell me what Protestant Religion Ann Coulter belongs too. Then tell us exactly which one you do and I want all the Fundamentalists to do the same thing.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
i belong to the ELCA - good
October 15, 2007 - 13:47 ET by TruthMongeri belong to the ELCA - good luck on the bigotry thing there
A service of the new NB respect police
Michael Savage is Jewish and your not
October 13, 2007 - 22:02 ET by PopularTechSince Michael Savage is Jewish and your not and I have heard the same damn thing from all my Jewish friends I suggest you get a reality check.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Um, it's spelled "you're".
October 13, 2007 - 23:31 ET by bretzysdudeUm, it's spelled "you're". Are you finishing "retarting" now?
Irrelevant
October 14, 2007 - 02:10 ET by PopularTechCorrect I mispelled the word thanks for the irrelevant comment.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Oh, "your" so welcome,
October 14, 2007 - 08:35 ET by bretzysdudeOh, "your" so welcome, dumberass.
What, Michael Savage upset?
October 13, 2007 - 22:08 ET by DaMavWhat, Michael Savage upset? Why that changes everything. When an even tempered guy like that is miffed, you just know something must be seriously amiss.
Maybe you should widen your circle of Jewish friends so you don't fall into the trap of thinking that all Jews think alike. For example:
http://www.americant...
Now here's the deal. You are allowed to say that Christ is not divine and I promise not to have a temper tantrum and call you a bigot. I will simply recognize that we disagree on matters of religion and both of us have a right to speak our own opinions.
Michael Savage is Jewish
October 13, 2007 - 22:40 ET by PopularTechIn case you missed this Michael Savage is Jewish and so is the
The Anti-Defamation League:
ADL Condemns Ann Coulter's Comment That Jews Need 'To Be Perfected'
The National Jewish Democratic Council:
NJDC CALLS ON MEDIA TO STOP INVITING COULTER AFTER ANTI-JEWISH COMMENTS
The American Jewish Committee:
AJC: Coulter's Words Hateful
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
can't believe the ADL et
October 15, 2007 - 13:53 ET by TruthMongercan't believe the ADL et al has actually succumbed to this as well
while the pro-PLO MSM actively undermines Isreal everyday
Ann's verbatem Bible quote is supposed to be their most pressing problem?
A service of the new NB respect police
Steven is a secular
October 13, 2007 - 22:50 ET by Gat New YorkSteven is a secular non-practicing Jew and could not argue with the fact that Coulter sat face-to-face with someone she knew was Jewish and intentionally decided to answer a rather stupid question about a perfect world with a classic anti-Semitic remark. It was done with malice and intent. But she ended up angering many more Jews than Donny Deutsch.
The art of talking about religion
October 13, 2007 - 20:12 ET by KC MulvilleThe media is just exploiting a minor conflict between the intellectual and the emotional.
Intellectually, it’s simply a question of whether Christians believe that Jesus is the messiah that the Jews were looking for. Modern Christians believe Jesus was the messiah, Jews don’t. We think we’re right, and that Jews are missing out on all the fun. The Jews naturally think we’re wrong, and that’s fine.
Emotionally, though, it pushes buttons. Historically, Christians forced many Jews to convert, against their will, and Jews are on the alert for signs of that intolerance ever happening again. Since this is a discussion that touches the notion of converting Jews, fellow Christians need to be sensitive to how that sounds to Jewish ears. It doesn’t matter that Coulter was just making an obvious intellectual point; we all need to know what words sound like to others.
It’s frustrating, however, to realize that the media is so absurdly juvenile that they can’t appreciate (and certainly can’t respect) differences of opinion. To hold fast to your own opinion, in the media’s eyes, is to insult everyone else. The media takes the position that no one is right, or everyone is equally right, and that any expression of confidence that your belief is better than someone else’s is reported as an insult.
Unless, of course, you express one of the media’s “accepted truths.” The media never finds those ideas controversial.
exploiting is correct
October 13, 2007 - 20:52 ET by botgmove ahead ten spaces
also KC they don't take their philosophy to it's conclusion. If The media takes the position that no one is right, or everyone is equally right, then they have no need to report anything.
"Television is where you watch people in your living room that you would not want near your house." Groucho
Or...
October 13, 2007 - 21:16 ET by KC MulvilleGood point, botg.
But I think they take it the opposite way: they think it allows them to report anything. It's a convenient feature of relativism that it allows every reporter to get paid, no matter what they report.
don't they
October 13, 2007 - 21:35 ET by botgdon't they always?
"Television is where you watch people in your living room that you would not want near your house." Groucho
the MSM knows better and
October 15, 2007 - 13:54 ET by TruthMongerthe MSM knows better and exploits anyway - that's the completely sinister aspect
A service of the new NB respect police
KC, Noel, I agree this is a
October 14, 2007 - 00:07 ET by RDWKC, Noel, I agree this is a cynical campaign of exploitation on the part of the media. People who may be struggling with religion, myself for example, would like to simply dismiss or ignore hostile religious debates altogether. However, I could use some help with reconciling the hostility between what I see as two sides of the same coin, namely Judaism and Christianity.
I have a difficult time understanding how a Christian could even be an anti-Semite and still be considered a Christian? I will leave aside my horror regarding the absurdity of racism as a belief system. But Martin Luther apparently wrote a virulently anti-Semitic screed, founded and (allegedly) reformed the Catholic Church, so I guess anything is possible.
I have done my best to study (non-scholastically) the history of Christianity, Judaism and oriental religions with the hope of discovering a unifying truth. It strikes me that the vocabularies in these language paradigms support each other respectfully rather than are opposed to each other and are united in their natural tendency towards belief in an intelligent creator. I find it invaluable to use different resource to grapple with the question of what it means to be human.
Jewish World Review, provides various audio lectures of the Torah, one of the lectures by Rabbi David Fohrman is his interpretation of Book of Genesis. He provides a fascinating perspective I would not have other wise discovered. For me these new ideas enrich rather than compete with my understanding of Christianity.
I am sorry if all these questions are naive, I’m a little afraid to ask them because of how difficult it is to reconcile the hatred of a people (Jews, Christians) with people who dismiss the very premise of their faith, namely love. I.e. by those, (the media) who would toss a dragons tooth between brothers.
Sincerely Rich
edited.
The explanation is more in history than theology
October 14, 2007 - 01:01 ET by KC MulvilleRDW: Just another simple question, eh? (LOL!) Let me give my two cents worth, with the provision that we both understand that this is a site about liberal media bias. However, I don’t like to leave religious questions hanging. Also, I’m answering as a Catholic. Take whatever I say with a huge grain of salt.
In my opinion, the answer is more in history than in theology.
I offer this to help explain, but not to excuse Christianity. Speaking as a Catholic, our theology never taught us to resent Jews, but our history did. We’re not proud of that. In Vatican II, we hope that theology caught up to history. John Paul II apologized to Judaism for this history, not to absolve the Catholic Church and be done with it, but to start a new relationship.
When stories like this come up in the media, they exploit it for sensationalism. We’re trying to take one step forward, and the media threatens to push us two steps back. We can’t let that happen.
Thanks KC My imperfect
October 14, 2007 - 01:38 ET by RDWThanks KC
My imperfect memory does recall some of those examples, which you highlight. As an outsider (religiously speaking) the history part is not my strong suit. Oh hell I don't have a strong suit. But anyway, it is certainly understandable that a Jew would find it hard to simply pretend that history did not happen. Creating trust may be something for future generations, those who are religious and non-religious alike. But I hope that more forums like this will allow a thrashing of ideas rather than a trashing of faiths.
Thanks, I should really send you money in exchange for the education I'm getting.
Ps: Should read (Founded a Protestant religion and (allegedly) reformed the Catholic Church, so I guess anything is possible.
also RDW
October 14, 2007 - 01:43 ET by botgthe doctrine is followed and represented by imperfect persons who make mistakes and (perhaps more often) outright do what they know they should not. Both religions teach that the heart is wicked and not to be trusted. This kinda bears that out huh?
"Television is where you watch people in your living room that you would not want near your house." Groucho
"imperfect persons who make
October 14, 2007 - 01:50 ET by RDW"imperfect persons who make mistakes" Certainly in my case.
The more I learn about the Bible the more it seems to illuminate a deep understanding of human nature and point in a direction towards some unknown purpose. I find this hard to explain away.
the fundie crowd I run with
October 15, 2007 - 13:57 ET by TruthMongerthe fundie crowd I run with is vehemently pro-Isreal. My circle of fellow believers considers ourselves to hopefully be honorary Jews in God's eyes...
Ann comes accross that way to me...
But there are secular Jews who are not necessarily religious Jews...
They absolutely love to stir up this kind of trouble regarding comments like Ann's
A service of the new NB respect police
I have been following this
October 13, 2007 - 20:44 ET by LilyPearlI have been following this story for a couple of days and this verse keeps coming to mind:
1Co 1:18 - For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
It is really not Ann Coulter that is offending these people, although they think she is.
Actually, read the whole passage that verse comes from:
17 For Christ did not send me (Paul) to baptize, but to preach the gospel--not with words of human wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power. 18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written: "I will destroy the wisdom of the wise; the intelligence of the intelligent I will frustrate." 20 Where is the wise man? Where is the scholar? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world? 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not know him, God was pleased through the foolishness of what was preached to save those who believe. 22 Jews demand miraculous signs and Greeks look for wisdom, 23 but we preach Christ crucified: a stumbling block to Jews and foolishness to Gentiles, 24 but to those whom God has called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than man's wisdom, and the weakness of God is stronger than man's strength. 26 Brothers, think of what you were when you were called. Not many of you were wise by human standards; not many were influential; not many were of noble birth. 27 But God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise; God chose the weak things of the world to shame the strong. 28 He chose the lowly things of this world and the despised things--and the things that are not--to nullify the things that are, 29 so that no one may boast before him. 30 It is because of him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God--that is, our righteousness, holiness and redemption. 31 Therefore, as it is written: "Let him who boasts boast in the Lord."
The people who criticize her are described below:
Rom 1: 20 - 32
20 For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse. 21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles. 24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator--who is forever praised. Amen. 26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion. 28 Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30 slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31 they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32 Although they know God's righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them.
Some "words of wisdom" from the bible
October 13, 2007 - 21:46 ET by PopularTech2 Chronicles 15:13 "Whosoever would not seek the LORD God of Israel should be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman"
Acts 3:23 "And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people."
John 2:22 "Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son."
Please don't start quoting the bible because you don't want me to start.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
PopularTech
October 13, 2007 - 21:58 ET by LilyPearlPopulartech,
You can quote all you want, but do you understand what you are quoting? Do you understand what it means? That is, do you understand the context in which it is stated and the concepts of law and grace? Note when I quoted scripture I did not stop with giving a single verse like you did. I gave the passage from which it came.
You missed the entire point of Noel's article. The media has taken one statement Ann Coulter made without examining the Bible and scripture from which she arrived at her statement. If you read the passage from which I took 1 Co 1:18 you will see that none of us are perfect (Jews nor non-Jews) unless we accept Jesus as Lord and Savior of our lives.
PT's quotes are ironic
October 15, 2007 - 14:00 ET by TruthMongerPT's quotes are ironic aren't they? He thinks he's exposing flaws in our beliefs? He's just confirming our message...
This is the fundie warning - repent or die!
PT believes it is foolish yes - and this is also referenced in scripture as you point out...
A service of the new NB respect police
You have no concept of
October 13, 2007 - 22:00 ET by dvdaughtryYou have no concept of context.
Proverbs 26:4-5
4 Do not answer a fool according to his folly,
or you will be like him yourself.
5 Answer a fool according to his folly,
or he will be wise in his own eyes.
Well, for once, the rich white man is in control. --Montgomery Burns
Oh ok sure...
October 13, 2007 - 22:24 ET by PopularTechGenesis 17:14 "And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant"
Why are you not out killing the gays?
Leviticus 20:13 "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."
Jesus came for war?
Matthew 10:34 "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword."
So if you do not interpret the bible literally then who decides the context? You? Only your religion decides the context? How convenient.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
But it sounds like you're
October 13, 2007 - 23:33 ET by bretzysdudeBut it sounds like you're (that's right, spelled "you are") trying to decide the context. Is it just at your convenience too?
context? what about where
October 15, 2007 - 20:19 ET by TruthMongercontext? what about where does that passage say we're supposed to kill gays? Where in the NT does it say gentiles like us are supposed to kill anyone? This guy is clueless...
A service of the new NB respect police
For what it is
October 13, 2007 - 23:36 ET by dvdaughtryFor what it is worth.
http://home.earthlink.net/~ronrhodes/Interpretation.html
Well, for once, the rich white man is in control. --Montgomery Burns
Some Basic Bible Interpretation Questions
October 14, 2007 - 09:40 ET by Dirigodad1. Who said it?
2. To whom was it said?
3. What were the circumstances?
That defines the context...which apparently you're not aware of. You seem only capable of ripping verses out context and building various proof-texts. Your handling of the Bible is vicious and dangerous. Why not quote John 14:6? "Jesus said, 'I am the way, the truth, and the life. No man cometh unto the Father, but by me.'" By your definition, Jesus was a bigot. In that light, why would you even want to identify yourself as a Christian?
PT, in previous threads, you've mentioned that you can't tolerate fundamentalist Christians because of our supposed "bigotry."
By definition, especially considering the venom with which you've shared your opinion, are you not a bigot yourself?
i asked that questions
October 15, 2007 - 14:04 ET by TruthMongeri asked that questions several times
the response is "you are an idiot! stop defending Ann's bigotry!"
score
A service of the new NB respect police
more democrat elitism
October 13, 2007 - 20:55 ET by LighthouseJThe left have always talked about things they have no idea about.
Take the Assault Weapons Ban under Bill Clinton for example.
It basically said if a weapon contained two or more of the following attributes, it is classified as an assault weapon and thus prohibited for sale:
Take the magazine, how are you more dangerous with 14 rounds than 12 or 13? How about a pistol grip, are you more dangerous if your wrist is rotated a few more degrees. How can a bayonet mount surely make someone more dangerous especially without a bayonet affixed? It goes on an on.
The ridiculous realization gun owners saw led to manufacturers producing legal alternatives that sidestepped the law.
Democrats arrogantly demonstrated a massive willingness to think they know what's better for everybody by governing from across the asile, akin to the British trying to rule the colonies from across the pond. It's leftist imperialism waged on the American people.
Laws only affect the lawful. You think Bill "kibitizer" Clinton's will stop those determined to commit violent crimes? No, it just hindered lawful citizens from properly arming themselves against violent criminals. I'm tired of democrats conceitedness manifest itself into imperialistic rule from within our society.
"Boats are safe in the harbor, but that's not what they're made for." -- Maritime quote
Ann Coulter is a Bigot
October 13, 2007 - 21:08 ET by PopularTechNo her views do not represent all Christians, Christian supersessionism has been rejected by the Catholic Church and the vast majority of mainstream Christian denominations.
Jewish Groups Condemn, Boycott Ann Coulter
ADL Condemns Ann Coulter's Comment That Jews Need 'To Be Perfected'
"The Anti-Defamation League strongly condemns Ann Coulter for her anti-Semitic comment that Christians "want Jews to be perfected" in an interview with Donny Deutsch on CNBC's "The Big Idea." During her October 8 appearance, Coulter suggested that Jews should convert, adding that, "we just want Jews to be perfected, as they say. … That's what Christianity is."
Ann Coulter may be a political pundit but she clearly knows very little about religious theology and interfaith issues. Coulter's remarks are outrageous, offensive and a throwback to the centuries-old teaching of contempt for Jews and Judaism. The notion that Jews are religiously inferior or
imperfect because they do not accept Christian beliefs was the basis for 2,000 years of church-based anti-Semitism. While she is entitled to her beliefs, using mainstream media to espouse the idea that Judaism needs to be replaced with Christianity and that each individual Jew is somehow deficient and needs to be "perfected," is rank Christian supersessionism and has been rejected by the Catholic Church and the vast majority of mainstream Christian denominations.
Clearly, Ann Coulter needs a wake-up call about the power of words to injure others and fuel
hatred. She needs an education, too, about the roots of anti-Semitism and the shared values of Judaism and Christianity. Christians and Jews have worked tirelessly for more than 40 years to overcome the past and to promote a more tolerant and pluralistic vision for the future and
especially for America.
Donny Deutsch is to be commended for his immediate and forceful denunciation of Coulter's
statements, for calling her remarks personally offensive, and for rightly characterizing her suggestion that Jews are inferior to Christians as anti-Semitism."
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
This is why the Republican
October 13, 2007 - 21:24 ET by Gat New YorkThis is why the Republican Party should find a way of muzzling her for the next 12 months. She is intemperate and impulsive with words that cross the line of reasonable behavior. Democrats may get a pass from MSM - Republicans do not.
Exactly
October 13, 2007 - 21:53 ET by PopularTechI could not have said it better myself.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
"Muzzle her?" ARE YOU SERIOUS?
October 13, 2007 - 22:59 ET by RJWelcome to Amerika, Komrades.
RJ, Congratulations.
October 13, 2007 - 23:07 ET by Dave RI think that your above comment is far and away the most intelligent one I have yet seen on any of the three threads that this holy war is currently raging on.
The idea that anyone should not be allowed to speak their mind is positively Hitlerian.
When I'm president, privatization is off the table because it's not the answer to anything.-Hillary Rodham, September 3, 2007 AARP Legislative Conference.
If PT had his way, he would
October 13, 2007 - 23:34 ET by bretzysdudeIf PT had his way, he would claim Fairness Doctrine and attempt to shut us down.
That's true, bretzysdude
October 13, 2007 - 23:39 ET by RJIn fact, I have no doubt that this is just another (O'Reilly, Limbaugh) step in the liberal's plan to reintroduce that misnamed piece of socialist totalitarianism.
You guys need help
October 14, 2007 - 00:44 ET by PopularTechLimbaugh was quoted out of context, O'Reilly should have realized what he said was going to be taken the wrong way and Ann Coulter is simply a bigot. I am sure as hell not a liberal aka neo-liberal or socialist. I would consider myself fairly libertarian which is what classic liberalism is. Then on many issues I consider myself a conservative.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Nah, Sport Politics, you're a liberal.
October 14, 2007 - 10:26 ET by RJYour paternalism and your desire to "muzzle" those who disagree with you prove it.
Comprehension Problem
October 20, 2007 - 23:52 ET by PopularTechYou don't even know what the word liberal means. No I am not NEO-liberal like Socialist Democrats but I am in many ways CLASSICAL-liberal like Libertarians. They are two vastly different ideologies.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Moron
October 14, 2007 - 00:41 ET by PopularTechThat is because you are a moron. I am against the Fairness Doctrine dumbass. I am sick of you are your buddies idiotic comments.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
OOOOHH! "Moron"! He's
October 14, 2007 - 08:32 ET by bretzysdudeOOOOHH! "Moron"! He's winning the Internet, folks!
Oh, and one more
October 14, 2007 - 08:33 ET by bretzysdudeOh, and one more thing:
"I am sick of you are your buddies idiotic comments"
You don't know how to type, and I'M the dumbass??? What does that make you?
Yes of course from the Fundamentalists
October 14, 2007 - 00:40 ET by PopularTechI thought you do not take things literally or do you not understand when they are not?
Muzzling her as not inviting her to speak and not using her to represent the Republican party. Not literally, grow up.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
ADL
October 13, 2007 - 21:34 ET by allanfI wish the ADL would be as strong in condemning Jimmy Carter - a man who works tirelessly to harm Israel.
They have and
October 13, 2007 - 21:46 ET by Gat New YorkThey have and did:
http://www.adl.org/PresRele/IslME_62/4947_62.html
The ADL would never bite
October 13, 2007 - 21:58 ET by ConservativeRexThe ADL would never bite the hand that feeds them: vis a vis, any Democrat. Look to the Hasidics in New York and the "help" they gave the Clinton's.
Ann spoke the truth as any Christian would/should do. The Jews are not believers (in Christ) and now they have their panties in an up roar. Tough. It's all spelled out in the NT. The NT is what WE try and live by. We are all sinners, but Ann did no wrong here.
"The Jews are not
October 13, 2007 - 22:06 ET by Gat New York"The Jews are not believers (in Christ) and now they have their panties in an up roar."
Jews are God's Chosen People. Christians defected from the Jewish faith to follow a false Messiah. You like that? That is what we are taught.
What Ann did was announce to Jewish Republicans to vote for Democrats. Coulter is what Savage I think called a loud mouth "hag."
funny
October 13, 2007 - 22:57 ET by VinceP1974What Christian DOESN'T know that Jews think the Christians are nuts (theologically).
You dont see Christians turn into women when Jews reject the central premise of the Christian faith, do you?
Yet for a Christian to state theirs is bigotry.
You know how stupid you sound?
Example
October 14, 2007 - 02:13 ET by PopularTechPlease provide an example where a Jew has stated like Ann did that Christians are a watered down Jew and can only find God by renouncing Christianity? Or are they intelligent enough to either not believe this literally or at the very least not state this, understanding it would offend Christians?
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
PT
October 14, 2007 - 03:34 ET by VinceP1974Show me the Christian who takes personal offense when a Jew states that Jesus is not the Messiah.
Why would I provide an example for something that doesn't make any sense. No Jew would ever call a gentile a watered-down Jew, so what you're asking for doesn't exist. Are you that unhinged to not know that...the more i consider the things you say the more i have the opinion you have some maturing to do.
Are you sure the "ADL
October 14, 2007 - 00:23 ET by Jerwould never bite the hand that feeds them: vis a vis, any Democrat...."?
Never? Any Democrat?
How about Jimmy Carter, Fritz Hollings, Andrew Young, Cynthia McKinney--all Democrats. All sharply criticised by the ADL.
By the way, both George H. W. Bush and his son, the current President, have been singled out for praise by the ADL as well as Condi Rice and Charles Krauthammer.
Might want to reconsider your allegation.
Jer
Meyer Kahane would have made
October 14, 2007 - 11:15 ET by ConservativeRexMeyer Kahane would have made an excellent Grand Wizard, so to speak.
If a well-known Jew, on a TV
October 13, 2007 - 21:55 ET by motherbeltIf a well-known Jew, on a TV talk show, said out loud what their actual belief is: that Christians are wrong; that Jesus was not the Messiah, that the Messiah has not come yet, does anyone here think the media would be labelling him as anti-Christian? Or do you think they would chalk it up to different religions, different beliefs?
Definately that person would
October 13, 2007 - 21:59 ET by Gat New YorkDefinately that person would be hammered if it were meant as a serious remark.
GNY, What universe
October 13, 2007 - 22:04 ET by LilyPearlGNY,
What universe are you living in?
Good point, motherbelt.
October 13, 2007 - 22:03 ET by LilyPearlGood point, motherbelt.
Really?
October 14, 2007 - 02:15 ET by PopularTechPlease provide the example.
The Anti "Man-Made" Global Warming Resource
Ann Coulter and other comments
October 13, 2007 - 21:59 ET by Lame CherryMs. Coulter is quite correct in her base conclusion, but is ignorant of the meaning of Hebrews as much as Popular Tech is in complete ignorance of Ann Coulter and Christian belief and attitude toward what he terms "Jews" as much as Ms. Coulter.
Firstly, the book of Hebrews has one Author and this is the Holy Spirit of God Who inspired Paul to write this. One has to understand exactly the Hebrews, because it is the greatest theological doctrine ever written in human history explaining in Phd. understanding the minute detail of the Jewish scholars of the Saducees and Pharisees explaining Who Jesus Christ is.
THIS IS VITAL to understand that the Hebrews was not written for the simple folk, but for the most educated, brilliant and religious scholars in history. The Jewish leadership in all communities were the greatest of debaters equalling the gifted Greeks who influenced all cultures in the known world of the day.
Hebrews exposes the absolute flaws of Jewish doctrines which were basing all their adoption by God to only obeying the Law and neglecting completely that the adoption is a Gift from God not earned. Good works alone do not get a person into heaven.
Paul in the Hebrews composed a timeless doctrinal explanation which reads to the informed and uninformed across time. There is nothing anti semitic in Paul the Jew nor in Ann Coulter the Israelite, because what people do not equate is Hebrews was written to law scholar Jews, but the Hebrews are 12 other tribes who still exist as God said He would never loose one of the 13 tribes of Israel. They are as Jewish scholars have written of like Yair Davidy found among the northwest peoples of Europe, England and the Americans. Denmark for example means Mark of Dan.
Ignorance of the depth of this subject then jumped on by leftist groups or condeming bloggers like PT only cloud the issue with their blanket intellectual ascertions without any fact of reality.
One has to remember the early Christians ended up quite dead by the leading Jews. Paul, himself was part the hunt and execute teams the Jewish leadership sent out. Paul even records these people stoned him when he became a Christian.
The early Universal or Catholic religion took parts of both pagan and Christian doctrines and in struggle did indeed struggle violently with Jews who were prosperous and well established in power. Many German Christians can relate to the persecution as Martin Luther was persecuted as much by the Catholic religion as were the Huegonauts.
So stating "Christians" is as much a misnomer of ignorance as "Jews". Modern Jews are Judeans who are the children of Judah, son of Jacob of the Hebrews. Modern Jews are in part Levites and Benjamin, also sons of Jacob. Modern Jews are also in an almost 70% majority as can be seen by Olmert's European Cabal in Judea or the Israeli state of Ashkenaz, an Asian people who converted to a form of Judaism.
"Jews" are different peoples and not united by one faith. There are sects of Orthodox who follow the Tanahk and Torah (Old Testament Prophets and Law) to what is an imported doctrines from Babylonian captivity of the Mystery Religion called the Talmud to even the mysticism of Shabbatai Zvi, the false messiah, who most of the ruling "Jewish" elite of Europe follow.
Olmert right now is making war on American Jewish settlements using Russian Jews to beat and molest settlers. They cleaned out Gush Katif last year and many other areas. They want Judeans out of Judea to take control of the area. In American terms they are the socialist Hillary Clinton sect practicing a form of blue state religion against the redlands.
So to call Jews as Jews and Christians as Christians with this diverse bag is as ignorant as people chattering on about Muslims as all Muslims when they are as diverse as bin Laden's Islamofascists, Zawahiri and Ahmadinejad's Islamocommunists to the Muslim Brotherhood of Keith Ellison in Congress striving for the overthrow though politics the American government.
It is always red flag whenever someone starts hammering anti semite and name calling then adding half facts of blanket statements which have been leveled at Ms. Coulter. All need to be perfected or "Be ye therefore perfect as I the Lord your God am perfect". The term is Holy which means set apart. All people are