President Obama delivered the commencement address at Notre Dame on Sunday, amid protests that the nation's preeminent Catholic college shouldn't be honoring a pro-choice president who even supports the gruesome procedure of partial-birth abortion.
Monday's front-page New York Times story, "At Notre Dame, Obama Calls for Civil Tone in Abortion Debate," by Peter Baker and Susan Saulny, began by giving Obama credit for good intentions that resulted in a favorable response from his audience:
President Obama directly confronted America's deep divide over abortion on Sunday as he appealed to partisans on each side to find ways to respect one another's basic decency and even work together to reduce the number of unwanted pregnancies.
As anti-abortion demonstrators protested outside and a few hecklers shouted inside, Mr. Obama used a commencement address at the University of Notre Dame to call for more "open hearts, open minds, fair-minded words" in a debate that has polarized the country for decades. The audience at this Roman Catholic institution cheered his message and drowned out protesters, some of whom called him a "baby killer."
Monday's print version is toned down from the original filing Sunday afternoon at nytimes.com. That story, credited to Peter Baker alone, had a headline with a more defensive thrust -- "At Notre Dame, Obama Defends His Abortion Stance." That filing (no longer available at nytimes.com, but you can read it here for now) also included this paragraph:
About 100 anti-abortion demonstrators shouted angry slogans at the edge of campus, angrily heckling back and forth with a smaller number of abortion rights demonstrators. They shouted through megaphones, waved banners at motorists, and handed out leaflets to pedestrians. At least five anti-abortion activists were led away in handcuffs, according to the Associated Press, which also reported that police had arrested 23 protestors on Saturday.
Boy, those anti-abortion protestors sure are angry! The "angry" descriptors are missing from Monday's print version, replaced with a more sedate image of abortion opponents "shouting back and forth with a smaller number of abortion rights demonstrators."
The original online story by Baker put forward a religious requirement before one has the moral authority to protest against abortion or President Obama. (Did the Times ever engage in such close questioning of anti-war protestors who claimed to have served in the military?)
Many demonstrators had no affiliation with Notre Dame and were not even Catholic. "You're not a Christian university," shouted Mona Wenger, 54, who said she was not a Catholic. "You have invited the worst baby killer in the nation."
That sneering response by Baker became more presentable in the print version:
Many demonstrators had no affiliation with Notre Dame. "You're not a Christian university," shouted Mona Wenger, 54, who said she was not Catholic. "You have invited the worst baby killer in the nation."
The Times took pains to note that most in the crowd sided with Obama against the "hecklers."
The crowd inside the Joyce Center enthusiastically supported Mr. Obama, erupting into sustained cheers when he arrived. Some graduating students adorned their mortarboards with a yellow cross and baby feet, a symbol of the anti-abortion movement. But just as many had the president's red-white-and-blue campaign logo on theirs, and the crowd sided with him against hecklers.
When a man sitting in the rafters of the stadium began shouting, the crowd drowned him out, and he was taken away by security officers. Three other men stood up one at a time within the next few minutes shouting "abortion is murder" and "stop killing our children." The crowd responded by shouting, "Yes, we can," Mr. Obama's campaign slogan, and "We are N.D.," a Notre Dame chant.
—Clay Waters is the director of Times Watch, an MRC project tracking the New York Times.
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Why?
May 18, 2009 - 12:16 ET by Willis_Leon_JohnsonMr. Obama, if you truly believe in abortion, why is it that your children made it?
If you truly believed what you preach (and yes, to a liberal, abortion is a religion) why do you insist that others do that, which you refused to do?
http://gjresult.com
→ That's easy Willis
May 18, 2009 - 12:20 ET by Cool ArrowHe decided Michelle should be "punished"
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
Perfect!
May 18, 2009 - 14:07 ET by boomerconOh yeah, CA, perfect!
too bad he had the TOTUS with him. Would've loved to see him squirm, stumble and mumble in South Bend.
But then, since I couldn't stomach watching it, I would've missed that also. (bet I could've seen it here though).
The Catholic Issue
May 18, 2009 - 12:21 ET by KC MulvilleNo, it isn't. Abortion isn't a religious issue. It's a moral issue. You don't have to be Catholic to consider the issue. You just have to have morals. Either way you decide, it's a moral decision, not a sectarian decision.
And those angry protesters. What were they doing to get arrested? Was it the shouting? Was it the leaflets they handed out? Surely they were so obnoxious and aggressive that the police had to restrain them!
____________
And can anyone answer this question for me?
What exactly did Obama say about abortion? Did he outline the reasons for his opposition? Did he explain his theoretical or moral principles that allow abortion? Did he explain why he thought it was better for a infant, born alive during a botched abortion, to be neglected to death inside a sterile delivery room?
As far as I can tell, he got away with another dodge. He appealed to civility. He appealed to decorum. He did not appeal to reason. Didn't even try.
→ His answer
May 18, 2009 - 12:25 ET by Cool ArrowObama's opinion was that we should respectfully engage in dialogue concerning abortion.
I hear he's launching a Listening Tour of Klan groups shortly.
Makes just as much sense.
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
Load of crap
May 18, 2009 - 12:52 ET by KC Mulville"we should respectfully engage in dialogue"
Yeah, we should always do that. So what are you telling me that I don't already know? How is that adding anything? That's another plea for "why can't we all get along?"
What this whole "dialogue" ignores is that we are prevented from having a dialogue by the Supreme Court's liberal wing, which refuses to allow the decision to be released to the people. So long as Roe v. Wade and Casey uphold abortion to be a civil right, without allowing the public to discuss the issue, there is no point to having a dialogue.
Obama is about to appoint another justice to the Court, and without question, he will appoint a nominee who will vote to withhold the debate from the American people. It strikes me as the height of gall to appeal for civil debate when he knows there is no debate to be had.
If you put the issue before the public, and the pro-life side loses, fine. That's democracy. We'll make better arguments, and we'll try again, but if we lose, we lose. But at least we'll have lost a debate. It won't be, as it is now, that we weren't allowed to debate in the first place.
→ Thanks KC
May 18, 2009 - 13:09 ET by Cool ArrowIf America chooses to curse itself, that's one thing. But if the SCOTUS continues to call down damnation upon us, that's another.
When it comes to abortion, I'm reminded of "Give us Barabbas! crucify Him! Let their blood be upon us, and the children we choose!"
Apologies to the writer of the Gospel.
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
When liberals say we shoud
May 18, 2009 - 14:56 ET by motherbeltWhen liberals say we shoud "respectfully engage in dialogue" that means "you say what you want, then we do what we want."
There is no "dialogue" to be had. He wants his way and no other.
On what possible situation might he give ground.... parental notifictation? No RU486 for minors? Born alive act?
Nope...nope....nope....so how dare he says "Let's talk"?
I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson
Yep...it's their way or the
May 18, 2009 - 15:17 ET by bigtimerYep...it's their way or the highway with the left as far as dialouge goes...
...and lord knows when they protest with all their violence, when half the nit-wits there protesting are bused in, plus don't even know what the heck they are protesting about to being with, why that's all right...they are speaking 'for the people' according to the majority of the talking heads in the msm of all venues.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
these are some sick f*cks, folks
May 18, 2009 - 12:41 ET by SickofLibsThe protestors chant "stop killing our children" and the crowd responds by shouting, "Yes, we can!"
Only at the NYT would this be considered something to be proud of.
Until the 1920s ALL Faiths taught that
May 18, 2009 - 12:44 ET by Ole_Sargeabortion was WRONG! The worse thing you could have ever said to a physician at the time was that the physician was an "abortionist." Instead of helping to bring LIFE, the task was to kill it at the very beginning.
During the "Christian Era" many of those tried for "witchcraft" were in fact, providers of abortion aids, such as herbal mixes to induce a miscarriage "intentionally," aka an abortion.
Rowe vs Wade violated the Consitution, and our Declaration of Independance by denigning infants in the womb "Life." Without Life, there is no Liberty (or anything else that we value). We cease to be reflections of the Creator, and become "resources" like timber, oil, or paper. To be used, and when no longer useful, discarded in the trash.
→ Thanks Sarge
May 18, 2009 - 12:52 ET by Cool ArrowYo've encapsulated the debate nicely.
I belong to a Protestant Denomination that stands strongly against abortion. It seems some religions have a misunderstanding of "Divide the child in twain", thinking there is common ground on abortion.
Absolutely, NO WAY, would a college carrying affiliation with my faith, bestow a Doctorate onsomeone who publicly defends abortion. If they do, I'm outta' there!
Notre Dame sold out.
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
Notre Dame, like every
May 18, 2009 - 13:59 ET by MrSnugglesNotre Dame, like every Catholic University, is run by the marxist priests known as "Jesuits". They should all be excommunicated, removed from the schools, and banished to hell.
Snuggs
May 18, 2009 - 14:17 ET by Nortoit is the board of ND that is packed with libs and OB supporters. Read coverage of it somewhere and wish I could remember where, search it I guess, I feel the answer lies there.
I know about the board, but
May 18, 2009 - 14:54 ET by MrSnugglesI know about the board, but it is the Reverend that runs the school that put those people on the board.
My brother goes to Seattle University, another jesuit run "Catholic" school. For a long time he was a militant vegan (he actually looked and acted like he was a heavy drug user, thats what veganism does to you), dabbled in buddhism, supports socialist policies, etc.
This is not what Catholic Universities should be doing.
Well, wait a minute
May 18, 2009 - 14:57 ET by KC MulvilleNotre Dame is run by the Holy Cross Fathers. They have nothing to do with the Jesuits.
However, you're absolutely right about those Jesuits. What a lying pack of ... oh, uh, er, ah ... waaaaiiiittt aaa minute!
nah
May 18, 2009 - 13:09 ET by RowaneYa don't need an herbal mixture, from reading in herbalism I learned that 2 ounces of dried, pulverised blackthorne root or 3 of cotton root will do it in a trice...only problem is they lost around half thier patients from serious bleeding, so DON'T try this at home.
Obama as Solomon
May 18, 2009 - 12:48 ET by ekslibObama pretends he is a wise man, like King Solomon.
Solomon "ordered" the bisecting of a baby in order to determine which woman was its real mother, but he did not really intend to cut the baby apart.
Obama, on the other hand, figures that he will solve the abortion debate by telling pro-lifers they should continue to tolerate the cutting apart of thousands of babies.
Obama is no Solomon.
→ That's just spooky
May 18, 2009 - 12:54 ET by Cool ArrowI just made a comment in another thread referencing Solomon's command to "divide the child in twain".
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
→ Correction
May 18, 2009 - 12:55 ET by Cool ArrowSame thread (above)
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
I heard Mark Steyn say a
May 18, 2009 - 12:51 ET by R D HelmI heard Mark Steyn say a while back that he is expecting a complete societal breakdown shortly after Obama gets re-elected in 2012.
I believe he is right, and I believe we are seeing the early stages of it now.
-Dave
Why spend a dime for these types of universites if they are not
May 18, 2009 - 12:54 ET by pahubergoing to be unique or stand for something other than name recognition?
World magazine had a story a year or so ago on why would parents send their kids to Fuller or some other extremely expensive private (psuedo Christian values) college that only tries to mimic a public university and hide its origins of existence. Wheaton, Notre Dame, Bethel University, etc....
Might as well send your child to a good church and a good public university where they will be aware it's secular and you will save thousands of dollars.
Let's see. 51% of Americans
May 18, 2009 - 13:21 ET by QueenMumLet's see. 51% of Americans identify themselves as pro-life. And Catholics make up about 25% of the American population. I'm just sayin'.
Besides, if Notre Dame wants to invite the most prominent proponent of abortion (who is also not a Catholic) to its commencement, why point out that some of the protestors weren't Catholic? Sort of stupid if you ask me.
GO CAVS!!!!!
Not to mention the fact
May 18, 2009 - 14:01 ET by MrSnugglesNot to mention the fact that the non-Catholic media leftists that are always lecturing the church about being too conservative.
And remember when Pope John Paul died? How did the non-Catholics react to the failure of the church to elect a leftist Pope?
"I'm going to teach them
May 18, 2009 - 13:05 ET by mattm"I'm going to teach them values and morals, but if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby." - BHO
Obviously, taking responsibility for one's actions is not one of BO's morals, and life is not one of his values.
If all the pro-aborts had been aborted, there would be no pro-aborts. Irony is so ironic.
THATS
May 18, 2009 - 13:14 ET by RowaneThat's why he can lie so easily with a straight face.
I think ya have to have a serious lack of morals to even consider politics as a career. I didn't have this view a few years ago but the hearings on Slick Willy made them coalescue.
→ Ironic irony
May 18, 2009 - 13:15 ET by Cool ArrowIronic is that person-for person, those aborted American babies have been replaced with mostly illegal aliens, who now demand our childrens' place at the table.
Now, that's ironic!
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
more like
May 18, 2009 - 13:32 ET by RowaneMore like sardonic, if ya ask me.
Ronald Reagan said it best...
May 18, 2009 - 13:14 ET by sam12663..." I've noticed that everybody that is for abortion has already been born."
President Obama is nothing more than a lying empty suit; a Hollywood style special effects smoke and mirrors show that has shown itself to be a total fraud.
WAKE UP AMERICA! SAVE OUR CONSTITUTION!
Trust Ronaldus Maximus
May 18, 2009 - 13:33 ET by RowaneTrust Ronaldus Maximus to put it plainly.
Things will improve in the
May 18, 2009 - 15:01 ET by motherbeltThings will improve in the next generation because of the Roe effect.
In a nutshell: liberal women who favor abortion abort their children. Conservative women give birth, and their children are more likely to be conservative.
Also crudely known as being hoist on one's own petard.
I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson
→ Great observation mb
May 18, 2009 - 15:15 ET by Cool ArrowAnd let's face it. That battlefield will be littered with the mangled bodies of an extremely high percentage of black babies - about 37%.
One of every two, or 50% of all black pregnancies, ends with abortion.
The Klan's got nothing on the Liberal Democrat plan.
"I was fighting a war in Iraq!" - Nancy Lugosi
Thanks, mb. That's an
May 18, 2009 - 15:59 ET by QueenMumThanks, mb. That's an encouraging perspective.
GO CAVS!!!!!
Civil conversation
May 18, 2009 - 13:50 ET by FranksamI'm struggling, as I often am, with a concept. What rhetoric would be appropriate for a civil discussion about cutting up live humans inside the womb and removing the parts with forceps?
As referenced obliquely above, can we also have a civil conversation about mass murder, sexual assault, etc.? I have some pretty extreme opposition to those activities as well, and it's going to be hard to get me into the Ted Bundy fan club, no matter how polite the conversation might be.
Woe is me?
May 18, 2009 - 13:51 ET by CobraManI'm not Catholic and I also oppose Obama's support for the murder of innocent children in the name of "progress." I guess that I, too, should just keep my mouth shut and let 30 million more innocent children lose their lives in the name of "hope" and "change." Isn't that right, NYT?
The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.
The US Constitution
Unless you're a fetus.
The US Supreme Court
Hey NYT! Obama's not Catholic either.
May 18, 2009 - 14:38 ET by kg"DumbAssity of Dope"
This goes both ways
May 18, 2009 - 15:16 ET by slickwillie2001BTW, Roe (Norma McCorvey) was at the protest at Notre Dame yesterday. She is now pro-life.
The media is going to have it both ways on this, whichever makes the pro-life crowd look bad. If the protest was only Catholics, they would have said 'Catholics, isolated and standing alone, what's wrong with them, etc, etc. Since they found it was far from only Catholic, they deride that fact as somehow derogatory.
They would never use their favorite word -'diversity', in the case of a pro-life crowd, would they?
She is also Catholic
May 18, 2009 - 16:31 ET by ThermistoclesShe is also Catholic now.
Where is the in depth interview with her? She was used and discarded by the pro-abortion camp when she was no longer useful. The abortion folks lied to her and about her. Bring her name up now and she is villified by those same people.
God help Obama. I truely believe the man has sold his soul to the devil. Pray for Notre Dame, the once great University.
Therm... I also noticed
May 18, 2009 - 16:40 ET by bigtimerTherm... I also noticed they didn't have any interviews with her, it mad me mad somewhat, it's just I am so used to the msm and their tactics, I wasn't expecting it but I was in hopes.
We know for them, the more silence about Roe vs Wade the better in their eyes...soulless bunch of vipers.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
The NYTs and all their ilk
May 18, 2009 - 15:34 ET by bigtimerThe NYTs and all their ilk can sneer away...
Since when do you have to be Catholic to be totally against abortion or infanticide as Obama is?
HUH!?
This makes me furious....what audacity these leftists have.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
It's the audacity of hope,
May 18, 2009 - 16:01 ET by QueenMumIt's the audacity of hope, bt. ;)
GO CAVS!!!!!
Yeah Queen...as those poor
May 18, 2009 - 16:18 ET by bigtimerYeah Queen...as those poor babes have no one to save them or hear their cries.
It makes my heart hurt.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
Mine too BT
May 18, 2009 - 19:47 ET by general companyIf not us, then who would speak for them?
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
They're a bunch of damn fools
May 18, 2009 - 17:55 ET by Kat Outta the BagAbortion is the MURDER of unborn HUMANS. One doesn't have to be of any particular belief system to open their eyes and see it for what it is.
You don't have to be Catholic to be pro-life.
May 18, 2009 - 19:32 ET by jawebster1I have never been arrested in my life, but if I lived within 200 miles of South Bend, instead of here in smoke filled Santa Barbara, I would have gone to Notre Dame with my protest sign to join Alan Keyes and many others for the great honor of being arrested. Jim Webster
One way to improve the tone
May 18, 2009 - 22:21 ET by snaggletoothieOne way to improve the tone would be to stop the killing for a year.
And if the MSM wants more reason to ignore me, I'm not Catholic. Am I still allowed to vote?
The crowd responded by
May 19, 2009 - 00:12 ET by RR GOPThe crowd responded by shouting, "Yes, we can," Mr. Obama's campaign slogan, and "We are N.D.," a Notre Dame chant.
Please, change the name of your damn school to Karl Marx University, Our Lady Helen Thomas or something more appropriate and not insulting to Mary the mother of Jesus and Christians.
One of the 34% who thinks George W. Bush was a great President. One of the 61% who wants to bring back the stock and pillory (yep...approval for Congress now at 39%...do you believe that!?).
Yes, yes, yes!
May 19, 2009 - 02:49 ET by danebramageThank you. I'm so sick of hearing the lying media frame this as an anti-abortion protest. It was not. It was a protest against a university calling itself Catholic while simultaneously thumbing its nose at the Church's teachings.While there were no doubt non-Catholics present, and even some who didn't "get" what the real issue is, the opposition to Obama's presence there had everything to do with a "Catholic" institution of higher learning according him an honor. It did not have to do with Obama speaking there per se.
Proof? If, as Jenkins claims, Obama's presence at ND represented ND's desire to "dialogue" with the enemy, and the Catholic protesters represented neanderthals who wanted to shut down debate, one would expect them to be opposed to ND hosting an actual debate with Obama. Yet what knowledgeable observer could believe that, for example, Alan Keyes, would not have given his right arm to debate Obama on that stage, even as an impromptu event? No, the simple fact is that Obama wasn't there for any kind of "dialogue." He was there to receive an award--an honorary doctorate of laws, no less--for being a great and sympathetic thinker on the issue of abortion from an institution publicly claiming (into its sleeve) to be at moral odds with his position.
What Keyes and other Catholics were there for was to demonstrate to the world that this "Catholic" institution is anything but. That's what the story here is, and NB contributors should be careful, as should everyone else, not to be taken in by the media's lie about it.