NBC's Martin Savidge began a Friday story, on the rising murder rate in New Orleans, by pointing out how “in the last week more Americans have died in New Orleans than in Iraq.” Savidge explained in his NBC Nightly News piece: “Since December 29th, there have been eight military deaths. In the Big Easy, there have been 14 murders. Among the latest victims, Helen Hill, a 36-year-old mother shot in her home in front of her husband and two-year-old.” Savidge bemoaned how the Crescent City “killers are growing more brazen, striking in broad daylight, using assault rifles, even with police just 30 yards away. And witnesses are refusing to talk.”
Brian Williams introduced Savidge's report by showing the headline on the front page of Friday's New Orleans Times-Picayune: “Killings bring the city to its bloodied knees.” (PDF image of the front page)
The MSNBC.com version of Savidge's January 5 story.
Comments Policy
Lets don't forget that New
January 5, 2007 - 22:04 ET by mlongLets don't forget that New Orleans has been controlled by Dems for decades and despite the attacks on Bush for what happen with Katrina the fact was that the Dems in charge are the ones that caused the most suffering for the people of New Orleans both with the hurricade and the corrupt police dept. that has allowed the high crime rate.
Also if we really want to play games with death rates in Iraq and the US...more Americans die in the US in car accidents each year than die in Iraq because of miltary actions.
I agree with every word you s
January 5, 2007 - 22:17 ET by bigtimerI agree with every word you said mlong...that is why I was furious when President went down there and had his night klieg light speech and took the blame...blah blah blah....
I have posted so much about this in the past I am past tired of the subject and the media and the politco's using it for whatever their purpose is...on both sides of the aisle...the corruption there was and is rampant in numerous ways, and they still vote the likes of Jefferson and Landrieu back in....pathetic that President Bush keeps pandering to the blacks there, it does upset me when you can see right through it.
Blanco and Nagin are pathetic...the people who did not leave when they had plenty of warning are pathetic....we are still paying for this, we will be for years, us the tax payers...as usual.
Screw the media.
"If we ever forget that we are a Nation Under God....then we will be a Nation Gone Under." Ronald Reagan
Damn right.... from The Dem
January 5, 2007 - 22:38 ET by mlongDamn right.... from The Dem.Governor who wouldn't make the request to Bush that would allowed him to send troops in quicker,the Dem.Senator who redirected funds that was earmarked for the levees and the Dem.Mayor who sent his people to the dome even when Bush told him to get them out of there and even though he had dozens of school buses that could do the job...they all played a bigger role in the Hurricades aftermath than Bush and FEMA.
...
January 5, 2007 - 22:41 ET by Jnoble(in robotic voice): But that's not what my master Jon Stewart said! He says it's all Bushs fault. It must be true, because he's smart and tells me what to think about things. And he's got funny sound effects and graphics on his show!
mlong,....and we can't forget
January 5, 2007 - 22:53 ET by bigtimermlong,
....and we can't forget the environmentalists and their lobbying money that bought and paid so many of the politico's....to the people's detriment that vote with them, the dumb saps, they are everywhere in every state, I know for a fact, they are destroying a lot of infrastructure and what once were healthy communities and little cities, that were once basically conservatives...get my drift...it is a well laid plan, and they never ever have to pay for the results In the meantime they move in more liberals after a community is destroyed, whether it is slowly with time or a disaster by nature that they have helped aide and abet with the results, deaths be damned.
"If we ever forget that we are a Nation Under God....then we will be a Nation Gone Under." Ronald Reagan
She was too busy for that. Sh
January 6, 2007 - 11:18 ET by danboShe was too busy for that. She had other important things to deal with in the days after Katrina. Like deciding to go on with redecorating her office in the state capital with walnut paneling, swedish granet marble counters in her coffee room, new wide screen TV and a carpet with the state seal.
There's only so many things a governor can do.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
How is this story an example
January 5, 2007 - 22:34 ET by Archibald CoxHow is this story an example of liberal bias in the media?
Patriotism means to stand by the country. It does not mean to stand by the president or any other public official. - Theodore Roosevelt
I think this particular story
January 5, 2007 - 22:38 ET by Free StinkerI think this particular story demonstrates that the News Coming out of Iraq is biased.
Nice try though.
~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~
"One thing that seperates liberals from conservatives is that liberals are craftier and work without the hinderance of a conscience." --Lynn Wooley
Plus the timing of the story.
January 6, 2007 - 17:40 ET by mattmPlus the timing of the story. Now that the Dems have won, the MSM are in CYA mode, running stories that are either favorable to Republican ideas or that contradict Democrat ideas, to appear non-biased. I predicted this before the election and have been proven correct many times over.
Bias is not merely the content of a story, it also includes context, omissions, timing, placement etc.
"If you do not read the newspapers, you are uninformed. If you do read the newspapers, you are misinformed." - Mark Twain
....
January 5, 2007 - 22:39 ET by Jnoblebecause since the MSM is so preoccupied with death counts over anything else and they want to be consistant, they should be running stories about how New Orleans is in a 'quagmire', a 'civil war', and maybe we should consider getting people out of there because it's a hopeless disaster. How many more innocent people have to die? What's our exit strategy? Oh the humanity!!
Archi, how is the story bias?
January 5, 2007 - 22:54 ET by acaiguanaArchi, how is the story bias?
Well, the preponderance of evidence in the MSM is that they assert and believe their role includes the following (among other great role attributes).
1. Inform and educate the publice by providing background and perspective to the story.
2. Make a difference.
Given the two (of many) idealistic goals above, the reporting object (in this case a human being) talking about a City in the United States that has obviously been denegrated into a stone age civilization by primarily Democrat rule over the ages is sorta important when looking at how the Liberal Bias plays when evaluating the reporting about the Hurricane or Iraq.
One could hope that stories about Pelosi's real Home City, San Francisco would be forthcoming that would talk about the incredible crime, filfth, homeless problems, drug use, tax rate, corruption, lousy school system, terrible public money management and general decline of quality of life there. Don't hold your breath.
Or go across the Bay to Oakland.
Really don't hold your breath.
So, my take on your question is either you deliberately refuse to see any connection between the dots in the MSM or you probably should not be commenting here until you research the entire context of the MSM and the War on Terror, Republican rule of the past 12 years, the orgasmic escasty of the MSM of a rather mediocre woman rising to Speaker of the House... well the list goes on and on.
ACA
...
Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Archie,I believe it was only
January 5, 2007 - 23:43 ET by Roger the ShrubberArchie,
I believe it was only two days ago that a few of your more progressive-leaning comrades were debunking, some rather vigorously, a theory that some US cities are more dangerous than Iraq.
Lo and behold, could they have been wrong?
Could New Orleans be a quagmire?
We should pull all the police
January 5, 2007 - 23:45 ET by JimboWe should pull all the police and emergency services out immediately. It's too dangerous!!
What will happen to the citizens?? WHO CARES!
People are dead damn it.
January 5, 2007 - 23:56 ET by M J BAs a non US subject; I think both the figures from Iraq & the figures from New Orleans are hardly something to compare or to be proud about!
Both situations show incompetence of authority at all levels & from all parties involved.
Comparing "scores" will not change anything.
I agree wholeheartedly. Phill
January 6, 2007 - 00:06 ET by Roger the ShrubberI agree wholeheartedly. Philly had 400 murders in 2006, nothing to be proud of.
The only difference is this: places like Philly and New Orleans or Brazil are (supposedly) safe, peaceful, and not at war.
"Comparing scores" was used, unless I am mistaken, do debunk the garbage the media has been spinning about Iraq. The "scores" were used as a measuring stick, a comparison, to put things in proper perspective.
This may be worse than you re
January 6, 2007 - 11:30 ET by danboThis may be worse than you realize.
There was a fight over the murder rate in New Orleans a number of years ago. Many of the citizens were fed up with it and took to the streets in demonstrations. Anti-crime rallies etc.
Then Mayor Mark Morial, set up his own rally to counter the anti-crime rally. I guess it was an anti-anti-crime rally. (Is that a pro-crime rally.
After all of this. One of the few changes I recall; was a change in the definition for murder. (Took lessons from Clinton.) If you lived too long after being shot. It wasn't murder.
These stats may be using Morial's definition for murder.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
Well, please, "non US su
January 6, 2007 - 00:07 ET by BlondeWell, please, "non US subject"...
(BTW, we are not subjects....we are citizens).
Enlighten us as to how you, specifically, and your country, are so bloody competent to critique the United States of America?
Remember, I asked for specifics. Actions. And solutions.
Blonde, Brits are not citizen
January 6, 2007 - 00:12 ET by MikeBBlonde, Brits are not citizens, they are subjects. I suspect the poster is British.
"A communist is someone who reads Marx. An anti-communist is someone who understands Marx." Ronald Reagan
Knew that.Hence my question.W
January 6, 2007 - 00:17 ET by BlondeKnew that.
Hence my question.
Wonder which wonderful country the poster so cheerfully sends his/her hate mail from....
We may have to wait until hell freezes over, tho,to find out.
Smelled alot like a drive by troll to me.
So now giving an oppinion on
January 6, 2007 - 23:02 ET by M J BSo now giving an oppinion on something I feel could have been handled better by ALL concerned is HATE MAIL! Give me a break. It would seem that your idea of a debate or conversation is very narrow.
MJB....When you poke people i
January 6, 2007 - 23:06 ET by Clear thinkerMJB....
When you poke people in the eye, folks tend to see it as hate mail.
I'm almost as interested as Blonde, what would you do?
M J B
January 6, 2007 - 23:09 ET by BlondeI'm waiting for an opionion from you.
Rather than a whine.
Still waiting.
BTW....Hate Mail????
Maybe you ought to just catch that big jet back over to the other side of the pond. Or grow up. One or the other.
All great change in America
January 6, 2007 - 00:36 ET by joe conservativeAll great change in American begins at the dinner tableRonald Reagan
Too bad you want ALL great ch
January 6, 2007 - 03:42 ET by UnsaneToo bad you want ALL great change to come from government and that you want to steal from me to accomplish it.
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???." - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
You notice there is no answer
January 6, 2007 - 00:40 ET by BlondeYou notice there is no answer from said "subject".
Oh...if you ignore the one from joe kerry.
I am a "subject of the U
January 6, 2007 - 22:36 ET by M J BI am a "subject of the UK that has lived in Canada for the past 30yrs.
Why should I "not critique" the USA?
Why should the USA not critique Canada or the UK?
No one is beyond critisism.
MJB...You wrote: "No one
January 6, 2007 - 22:46 ET by Clear thinkerMJB...
You wrote: "No one is beyond critisism"
You left out that no one is beyond praise either, and right now the USA deserves a lot of praise for what is trying to accomplish. Sometimes doing the right thing is hard, but we as Americans have always been up to the task.
I may sound arrogant to you, but I really don't care what you think.
M J B
January 6, 2007 - 22:48 ET by BlondeThat's nice....you're a Brit who's lived in Canada for 30 years.
What, specifically (which I asked you last evening), makes you believe you are competent to critique? Credentials?
An answer, please.
Hating, and being envious of the United States doesn't count.
Secondly, since you feel you are entitled to offer up some sort of criticism, what do you offer as a solution? Again, specifics, please.
Critique?
January 6, 2007 - 23:05 ET by UnsaneMaybe you should think twice before critiquing the United States, as the United States provides so much of the defense of Canada.
A Canadian Forces of 60,000 or so will not cut it for a nation the size and population of Canada. The only reason they can afford the Nanny State they have is due to the might of the United States military. Oh, and just before you burst back in here, crying about you being British, let's talk about that. Twenty-five years ago a Third World dictatorship was well on the way to kicking your asses until your long-lost colony decided to bail you out via logistical support (see A Quick and Dirty Guide to War, first edition from 1985).
Therefore, the way I see it, both Canada and Britain are FULL of spoiled, whiny ingrates who have zero appreciation of the nation that provides for their freedom and can be counted on to bail them out whenever they get into any trouble. AND the United States provides both the United Kingdom and Canada the freedom to stagnate and stifle their nations populations into oblivion by giving away the store via a coddling Nanny State.
Why do you wish to critique my country again?
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???." - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
Why in the hell do you care?
January 6, 2007 - 02:31 ET by UnsaneI think the title of "citizen", rather than "subject", sounds so much more enlightened, does it not?
I'm afraid before you come across the pond (or wherever the hell you are from), you may want to study our system of government very carefully. The President did all that he could about Katrina. I apologize in advance if he didn't personally walk down to the end of the Mississippi Delta and wave his magic wand to make the bad storm go away. If that is incompetence, I can live with it, for I failed my courses in magic wand waving, alchemy and mind reading as well.
I hang that on the Governor of LA and their atrocious state government. A month later, Rita was bearing down on the state that is STILL the home of the worst hurricane hit the country (Galveston 1900), and what did this state's governor do? Sit and cry about it? Beg the President for help? No, he merely worked with local authorities and the Texas Department of Transportation to nearly completely empty one of the largest metropolitan areas in the COUNTRY. Drive around this state and you will see signs of hurricane preparedness everywhere. That is much more than I can say for LA, and they should have known better.
As for Iraq, if that is incompetently run, do you care to explain why heads didn't roll on 6/6/44 because of the deaths of roughly 3000 Americans on the shores of Normandy? Or why Generals Walker and MacArthur weren't fired over such events as Task Force Smith?
Finally, as a "subject", why the hell do you care? Last time I checked, you have NO say in how this country is run. I'd tend to the rot in your country before you even begin to bitch about us.
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???" - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
I did not put blame to any in
January 6, 2007 - 22:49 ET by M J BI did not put blame to any individual or party. You incorrectly filled in your own made blanks .
As for I have NO say! Is this not the WORLD wide web?
IF this forum is for the initiated then so be it. If so the site owners should announce that no disagreeable comments to be posted.
Having lived 60 years , in countries, governed by a Parliamentary system I thought it could be interesting to converse with those in a Republic with "only" a two party system. I have judged incorrectly; at least on this site which seems to be full of GW Bush appologists. I thought ,incorrectly, that it was a Conservative site but I see no sign of political or fiscal Conservatives only "moral" ones.
The discussions are too often as narrow minded as they are on the left wing websites.
MJB,You've come here and laid
January 6, 2007 - 22:53 ET by BlondeMJB,
You've come here and laid down some pretty silly stuff.
Now it's up to you to defend it.
You were the one who wanted to "critique"....
Have at it.
But don't even bother if all you are going to do is trot out the same old silly liberal talking points we get here on a daily basis.
If you have a legitimate point to make....by all means, give it a shot.
Waiting.
Blonde...Re: MJBI'm waiting t
January 6, 2007 - 22:58 ET by Clear thinkerBlonde...
Re: MJB
I'm waiting too....cricket...cricket.
Sad, but true.Another drive b
January 6, 2007 - 23:05 ET by BlondeSad, but true.
Another drive by.
I love all of the blather about wanting a fair debate...blah, blah, blah.
All the while throwing out the lib talking points....then disappearing.
Archie Cox was a hoot last night....."what do you propose"?
I know what I would do if I were in charge of our effort in Iraq....but why on earth should any of us put any sort of a plan into words for the libs? All they ever do is naysay....without an original thought between all hundred million of them.
Notice how quiet they are when one asks a pointed question?
Sheesh.
No one said you could not hav
January 6, 2007 - 23:14 ET by UnsaneNo one said you could not have a say, but I suggest that you study my country's governing documents and its history very carefully before opening your mouth to spew your vitriol on this board. Otherwise you will be treated with posts such as the one you responded to.
It seems that you are a little quick to call me a "Bush apologist". This shows that not only have you failed to factor in the history and Constitution of the United States, but you have never carefully considered the posts where I have been quite critical of him. The Republican party does not provide my political compass; I run off of my own political principles that may or may not align with a particular political party. On more than one occasion, Bush's policies have run counter to them.
Again you have failed to consider the posts where I (among others) routinely blast policies that run counter to fiscal/economic conservatism, and for those failings I lay that blame at the feet of a lot of people, to include the current President.
It seems that you are the one that is narrow minded, at best, or illiterate, at worst, as our most vitriolic Leftist residents (that for some reason NB permits to post here in spite of our narrow-mindedness; try seeing Right-wing commentary on Leftist boards).
"HAV3 TH3 BRIDG3S OF INSANITY B33N CROSS3D AND FOR3V3R R3TRACT3D???" - Meshuggah, "3ntrapm3nt", from Catch Thirty Thr33 (2005)
This morning I was listening
January 6, 2007 - 23:16 ET by danboThis morning I was listening to a copy of a news report from 1938. Just after Germany Annexed Austria. Many in your country and in this country said it wasn't our business. And it would eventually go away. The world. Including this country, England and Canada sat by as how many were murdered in Nanking. http://www.users.bigpond.com/battleforaustralia/JapWarCrimes/TenWarCrimes/Rape_Nanking.html
How many even remember Sandakan. http://www.users.bigpond.com/battleforaustralia/JapWarCrimes/TenWarCrimes/Sandakan_Death_March.html
I for one appreciate the Brits. they've stood beside us. Though there are appeasers in England as there are here. Deluding themselves it'll go away.
Yes this is a moral site for a lot of us. (Though I for one am an athiest.) But there is real evil in the world as there was at Nanking and Sandakan. We saw it with the twin towers. We saw it at a train station in Spain. And in the streets of Paris and in the subways of London. Unfortunately in the streets of Iraq. And the beheading of little girls because they're christians.
I for one am not interested in appeasing this enemy. No matter the cost. Pretending they'll go away, or that we can negotiate with them and appease them is as ill advised as pretending Hitler will take Austria and stop.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
danbo...As crude as it sounds
January 6, 2007 - 23:20 ET by Clear thinkerdanbo...
As crude as it sounds I have taken to using an old saying and updating it a bit....
"the only good terrorist is a dead one"
This is not very PC but I don't care. We are at war and the only way I see us winning is by killing as many of the evil bad guys as possible.
Political correctness is a fa
January 6, 2007 - 23:32 ET by danboPolitical correctness is a farce. If this war has gone on longer than it should. And if I have a bitch with "W". We're fighting it too politically correct.
You have too crush the enemy.
The appeasers and self haters only give the enemy courage and assistance.
We used to understand that. And we won that war against stronger and every bit as determined enemies.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
danbo,P.C. is merely a tactic
January 6, 2007 - 23:43 ET by Blondedanbo,
P.C. is merely a tactic of the left to subjugate all that is right and good in this country.
A great "dumbing down" tactic, if you will.
And as an insidious lie as albore's Global Warming.
And just as likely to cause us all no end of grief.
I for one. Think political Co
January 6, 2007 - 23:55 ET by danboI for one. Think political Correctness is more insidious than global warming.
But the tactics are the same. Pretend there's no disagreement. And the few who do are Cro Magnon.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
Guess that makes you a cave m
January 6, 2007 - 23:59 ET by BlondeGuess that makes you a cave man, danbo
Consensus? What consensus?
Oh right, shout 'em down.
Hey. I identify with the cave
January 7, 2007 - 00:09 ET by danboHey. I identify with the cave man in the commercials. Guess I woke up on the wrong side of the rock.
But I'd rather be a cave man than an Eoanthropus dawsoni. (And he was British. LOL. Wink. Grin.)
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
That caveman in the commercia
January 7, 2007 - 00:14 ET by BlondeThat caveman in the commercial is pretty cool. (and I like the music, too).
Much better looking than most of the business travelers I see in the airport. LOL.
I hope this unpresedented war
January 7, 2007 - 00:25 ET by danboI hope this unpresedented warm weather we seem to get every January and February lasts another week and a half.
Heading over to the N central Fla area for a change of scenery. Camping for much of it. Cave man like.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
Danbo,I'll keep my fingers cr
January 7, 2007 - 00:30 ET by BlondeDanbo,
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you on that one.
Anywhere around G'ville? Or the Ichnetucknee River? (sp?)
It is so beautiful up there....I love that part of the state.
It has been unseasonably warm here in sofla this year....but that just means rain in May....which is a good thing, hurricane wise.
Al Bore can stick it where (well, you know)....
Have a great trip!
Close. The Ocala area. Silver
January 7, 2007 - 07:17 ET by danboClose. The Ocala area. Silver River to be more exact. Then up in St Augustine. Haven't spent much time in that area since I was a kid. And decided to spend more time there when I did my cavern training nearby.
Looking forward to it. Though I'm not bringing the tanks with me. So no diving this time.
Just checked the weather. Looks like the warm weather is over. It's heading into the 30's again.
Oh. Good luck to your gators. I hope they do as well as my tigers did against ND.
"Whoever undertakes to set himself up as a judge of truth and knowledge is shipwrecked by the laughter of the gods." Albert Einstein
Comparing "scores"
January 6, 2007 - 11:00 ET by Jack BauerComparing "scores" will not change anything.
Neither will you writing posts on a conservative leaning website dedicated to exposing the mendacity and bias of the Institutionally Leftist media.
Proud member of the all-powerful and vast militarist/industrialist/capitalist/zionist-bagelist complex
MJB...You wrote: "Compar
January 6, 2007 - 22:42 ET by Clear thinkerMJB...
You wrote: "Comparing "scores" will not change anything."
It let's you know who's winning!
More to the point is that t
January 6, 2007 - 11:19 ET by HyunchbackMore to the point is that the MSM has had access to these same numbers since they began beating the drum for the Pelosi Posse. NOLA and other high crime cities have been more dangerous than Iraq since before the war began.
Why do they wait until AFTER the Democrats gain control of Congress to point this out?
They also fail to point out that in Iraq when the bad guys shoot at Americans the Americans can shoot back while in this country most law abiding citizens are hampered or forbidden firearms (Washington, D.C. citizens, for example). Also, in the U.S. shooting back can open a law-abiding citizen to prosecution or civil liabilities that are unfair and unethical even if technically legal.
"Also in the U.S. shooti
January 6, 2007 - 14:07 ET by MikeB"Also in the U.S. shooting back can open a law-abiding citizen to prosecution of civil liabilities..." Not in Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, and the other states that have passed Castle Doctrine laws. In those states, you may defend yourself, your family, your property, or someone else in any place you have a legal right to be. If the perceived threat is great enough, and you use lethal force, you may not be prosecuted by the state, or have civil suit brought against you by the survivors of the person you had to kill.
Several of the states have also passed legislation prohibiting the type of gun confiscation that went on in New Orleans, as the people, legislators and governors realized that in such a disaster, the civil defense system breaks down (the police forces are overwhelmed at the scale of what must be done), so the people must be allowed to protect themselves from those who would take advantage of the chaos to commit crimes.
The anti-gunners have had a bad time of it lately, yes?
"A communist is someone who reads Marx. An anti-communist is someone who understands Marx." Ronald Reagan
Yes, and they are only begi
January 6, 2007 - 21:59 ET by HyunchbackYes, and they are only beginning to wake up to what kind of bad time they are in for.
They felt a surge of pride when Democrats took seats from Republicans, not noticing (perhaps wishful thinking?) to notice that a lot of the victories were against RINOs. Mike Dewine, for instance.
Often the victories for Democrats were for solidly pro-gun Democrats.
I think that realization by the Brady Bunch was part of the inspiration for their cheif's comments in Maine (as hypocritical and untruthful as they were).
I want to see the shall-issue CCW and Castle Doctrine spreading. I'm hoping that the case going to the Supreme Court will put a final nail in the coffin of the argument that the Second Amendment only applies to formal military, such as the National Guard. If that occurs then firerarms bans all across the nation are in danger of failing the Constitutional muster.
MikeB...You wrote: "...F
January 6, 2007 - 22:16 ET by Clear thinkerMikeB...
You wrote: "...Florida, Texas, Oklahoma, and the other states that have passed Castle Doctrine laws. In those states, you may defend yourself, your family, your property, or someone else in any place you have a legal right to be. If the perceived threat is great enough, and you use lethal force, you may not be prosecuted by the state, or have civil suit brought against you by the survivors of the person you had to kill."
This is what I call common sense law. How could anyone see it any other way? Oooops, I forgot, this country is full of liberals...sigh.
I would venture to say th
January 6, 2007 - 00:35 ET by HyunchbackI would venture to say that the story didn't mention the major gun confiscation that Ray Nagin instituted right after Katrina.
I can't garauntee that any of the murdered people were formerly armed but I can say that the murderers probably felt a lot safer after the NOLA police went around stripping law-abiding citizens of their firearms.
It would go against MSM's anti-firearms ownership bias to point out that the police took away guns and murder went up.
Huh?There were law-abiding ci
January 6, 2007 - 00:42 ET by BlondeHuh?
There were law-abiding citizens in NO after the hurricane?
They didn't tell me about that on the MsM......
Yeah - reports I heard were t
January 6, 2007 - 00:45 ET by JimboYeah - reports I heard were that there were bodies stacked to the rafters in the Superdome and people were eating babies to survive.
/Sarcasm OnBeing an Anti-Hurr
January 6, 2007 - 03:01 ET by jcrapes4/Sarcasm On
Being an Anti-Hurricane advict its time to cut our losses. We have lost too many lives to Hurricanes. I am advicating we redeploy our citizens in New Orleans to our parts of the country. Oh yeah we should also impeach President Bush for allowing the Hurricane to hit the coast. He could have used all his Presidential might to redirect the path of Katrina but he did nothing!!!!!! I am outraged I tell you.
/Sarcasm off
Sorry had to purge all liberal thought from my mind. I am dark side free now:):)
Sarcasm aside...
January 6, 2007 - 03:18 ET by ShadesofgrayI see this as bashing the New Orleans and Louisiana local governments with no mention of the Feds. Everyone knows that Nagin and Blanco are democrats, and nowhere in the article is Bush or the Fed Govt mentioned. In fact, it says "This alarming homicide rate is a function of the failure of these different municipal entities to coordinate in a really productive way," says Peter Scharf, a criminologist at New Orleans University.
So, my point is, if anything, this is one example that goes against liberal bias. It also seems to say that not so many Americans are dying in Iraq. A perfect conservative news piece, I would have thought. The media cannot win with newsbusters folks. How should it have been written differently?
Your point, Shades, assumes we never point out good MSM stuff.
January 6, 2007 - 10:08 ET by acaiguanaYour point, Shades, assumes we never point out good MSM stuff.
That is what this thread is about.
Good MSM, good boys. Good...
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Apparently you have not read
January 6, 2007 - 10:53 ET by Roger the ShrubberApparently you have not read down this thread or the thread from a couple of days ago when your socialist/progressive brethren were blowing a collective gasket over the fact that some US cities are almost as dangerous as Iraq.
Perhaps it should have been pointed out in the main article, and might have alleviated some of your distress that we here at Newsbusters are a boatload of drooling twits. I guess, in your enlightened state of "Progressiveness", you had to sacrifice subtley, sarcasm, and reading comprehension.
"...boatload of drooling twits."
January 6, 2007 - 11:24 ET by acaiguana"...boatload of drooling twits."
Now you've done it Roger. Giving them ideas again, I see.
he he
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Shrubber
January 6, 2007 - 11:46 ET by ShadesofgrayI did read down this thread, but not the one from a few days ago that you mentioned.
When Archie asked why this is an example of liberal bias, nowhere did I see any of you say that this showed the MSM doing good. Thus my question.
I am so glad that Baghdad is such a nice place now...as safe as Philly, New Orleans, or Chicago. I think I will take my wife and daughters there for Spring Break. I hear Ramadi is beautiful that time of year. Maybe I can meet you and your family at the hotel? That would be so cool!
Take them to San Francisco, let the kids play on the streets.
January 6, 2007 - 11:50 ET by acaiguanaTake them to San Francisco, let the kids play on the streets.
Any of their streets.
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Aca
January 6, 2007 - 13:37 ET by ShadesofgrayAca, you seem to be saying that the streets of San Francisco are just as unsafe as those in Baghdad. If that is not what you are saying, please clarify. If that IS what you are saying, then that is a ridiculous assertion. I cannot believe that such a discussion STILL takes place on these blogs. You are clearly oblivious to what is happening over there. Ever read Paul Bremer's book "My Year In Iraq"? I highly recommend it.
Again, I live in Atlanta, (another city that you guys would probably skew to be as "safe" as Baghdad), but I have been to San Francisco, and I would love to go back. In fact, it is the number one place my wife wants to go right now, just to see the sites. I would let my kids play in the SF parks, at the museums, etc. Tell me a place within the Sunni Triangle that you would take a vacation. This comparison is ludicrous.
Good luck in SF on your vacation.
January 6, 2007 - 13:43 ET by acaiguanaGood luck in SF on your vacation.
If the kids (and I said streets) play in the Parks, they'll be lucky not to be bit by a discarded needle and get AIDS. One in three Gay men in SF have AIDS and the ratio is higher for IV Drug Users (who live in the Parks). If you can't see the comparison to the filth in SF and Calcutta, then you need to drop by Calcutta first.
But, I'm sure you have a shade of grey when it comes to Typhoid, West Nile, Gang wars, filth and SF's Gay community's disease problems.
If you get bored in SF watching your kids play, take them to West Oakland.
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Aca
January 6, 2007 - 14:08 ET by ShadesofgrayAca, you have a laser-like focus on homosexuals. I live in Atlanta which has a very large gay community similar to SF. I'm sure that some have AIDS. I am straight, and married with kids. I don't know any gays, nor do I run across gay people very often. Maybe an occasional waiter at a restaurant. Centennial Park in downtown ATL is not littered with AIDS covered needles. Stone Mountain Park does not have "gay community disease problems." Also, gay people live in parks? Are they all homeless or something? I'm not getting that.
I get it. You hate gay people and you would not vacation in San Francisco. Great. That is fine. But to compare the "dangers" of Lombard Street, Golden Gate Park, or Chinatown to Ramadi and Fallujah is incomprehensible to me.
Wrong, as usual.
January 6, 2007 - 14:29 ET by acaiguanaWrong, as usual.
I'm merely stating facts.
I don't have any anxiety about Gay people. I am citing a fact. I am also citing facts about IV Drug users and their propensity to drop needles around and about, like in the Parks and streets.
You seem to have the laser like focus. I'm just pointing out that your kids will be exposed to diseases you would not necessarily expect them to be exposed to in the Parks. I am also pointing out that SF is no longer the City of 'flowers in the hair', but is quite 'kid unfriendly.'
This isn't my imagination, it is a well know and discussed concern at the SF Visitors Bureau, e.g. "How to make SF more attractive to families?"
You want to ignore what I am saying and infer that I am a Gay Basher, go ahead. I'll sleep at night because 1) I am not and 2) I didn't bash anyone.
I, since you must be psychotic (er.. sorry psychic) and since you obviously don't know and since you obviously have no other avenue to turn down in your inane attempt to argue with me, am a SF area denizen and know quite a lot about about our little City.
SF has been labled quite nicely as "49 square miles surrounded by reality." I think it was Paul Sobrine who said that.
You know Shades, I've dealt with a lot of jump to conclusions, deluded people in my lifetime who decide the only way to argue is to lable a person something other than what they could possibly know; but you take the cake.
I appreciate your feeble attempt at discourse on this site, but I would thank you to keep your personal opinion of what I hate, like, love or admire...
the hell out of the conversation with me.
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Aca
January 6, 2007 - 14:41 ET by ShadesofgrayAca,
You seem to throw "facts" out quite a bit without providing any links to support them. (33% of SF gays have AIDS, needles are commonly found in SF parks, SF is kid unfriendly, etc. Surely there are easy to find articles from your local paper that support these "facts"?)
I apologize for saying you don't like gay people. That seems to have ticked you off. I thought I was making an inference based on your previous statements that seemed to portray gay people as a bunch of disease infested, homeless criminals who infect children in parks. That is apparently not what you were saying at all. I can admit that it was a mistake for me to infer that. My bad.
Here's one link regarding crime. The rest you can look up.
January 6, 2007 - 14:48 ET by acaiguanaHere's one link regarding crime. The rest you can look up.
Try "AIDS rates in San Francisco". That will probably yield an article talking about the resurgence of AIDS infections. Try "Homeless in San Francisco". That will probably yield at least a day's worth of reading. Try "Clean up San Francisco". That might yield a number of discussions on how dirty that City has become.
Before you throw your children out on the streets or Parks to play there do some research.
A trip to New Orleans might be better.
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Aca
January 6, 2007 - 15:01 ET by ShadesofgrayAca, I looked up some info on the SF AIDS issue, and the rate has recently decreased significantly, but is still fairly high. Couldn't find the percentage of SF gays with it, but this is a can of worms that shouldn't be opened on this string. I'll let it go. Again, my bad for drifting off topic. : )
Crime
January 6, 2007 - 15:53 ET by ShadesofgrayAca, I like the crime link you sent. Very helpful. It shows that SF had 96 murders in all of 2004.
Newsbusters,
California had 2,503 murders (violent deaths) in 2005, and the highest was 4,096 in 1993 for the state. According to this report (it is about the best report I can find out there...I know it is the Brookings Institute,but, it is the best I could do. If one of you have a better source, I'd be interested to see it). Page 10 shows that an estimated 17,100 Iraqi civilians died violently from non natural causes from January to July 2006. That is seven months, or a rate of 29,314 violent deaths per 12 months. Correct me if I am wrong, but 29,314 is approximately 7 times more than 4,096 and almost 12 times more than 2,503. Sooo, therefore I conclude that the violent crime rate in Iraq is 7 to 12 times worse than the state of California. Where am I wrong? Please provide a link to a report that shows my imprecision. Name calling does not help your argument. Let's please discuss this like civil folks. : )
I haven't called you any names. I have addressed your behavior.
January 6, 2007 - 16:07 ET by acaiguanaI haven't called you any names. I have addressed your behavior.
SF murder rate is nearly exactly twice the national average. Not bad for 49 square miles and 798,000 people.
You can use the Iraqi government's own numbers, better than a Liberal NGO in my opinion. They are higher than the AP's count. Lower than the Brooking's count.
You can also use the numbers generated that show several hundred thousand in Iraq being murdered annually.
I really don't care. I'm not defending any violence in Iraq or NO, I am simply saying that the perspective brought to bear on Iraq is skewed to reinforce the idea that the USA is 'bogged down', in a 'quagmire' and there is nothing but chaos there. That is an incorrect assumption and presentation. It is a model about which facts are thrown out to discourage any idea of optimism regarding this war.
I'm done with you anyway. I don't deal with people who are not able to integrate reality with fantasy and fact with fictional delusion.
My point about Iraq is not that it is safe; my point is ...
so what?
ACA
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Acaiguana says: "Which city is next?"
Aca
January 6, 2007 - 18:56 ET by ShadesofgrayAca,
I was not accusing you personally of calling me names. The discussion you and I are having has been fine. Sorry if it sounded like I said you were name calling. There are many on this site who argue with me by calling names. I was just preempting that.
I guess I just don't understand the conservative take on the level of violence in Iraq. One minute I am seeing you all saying that the reporting of violence is overblown and exaggerated and then later you agree that the violence there is high...but so what? I think it the violence is a big deal, and reporters have to report on it, not because they hate GW, but because that IS the story in Iraq. The schools in the Sunni Triangle have closed, and their hospitals are chaotic and short of power and supplies. A million Iraqis have left town or the country. You guys think that the violence reporting should be minimized or not reported. I don't see how that is possible right now. That is the main difference in our takes on the topic.
Anyway, thanks for the mostly civil discussion, Aca. Nice chatting with you.
Allow me to butt in...
January 6, 2007 - 19:13 ET by Guy Arthur ThomasDear Shady,
Allow me to butt in without apology.
You state..."I just don't understand the conservative take..." So let me help you why you are so confused.
Two posts above you state to acaiguana "Name calling does not help your argument. Let's please discuss this like civil folks" (I will skip the arrogance of the statement itself)
Then acaiguana states to you in response, "I haven't called you any names".
Then you respond back, "I was not accusing you of personally calling me names...Sorry if it sounded like I said you were name calling".
So what in he!! is ANYONE suppose to conclude from your accusation, "Name calling does not help your argument"? What,? That you were accusing acaiguana of stealing a bike, cheating on taxes...what? I'll tell you what, and that is exactly what you accused acaiguana of, calling names. But amazingly you state, "sorry if it sounded like I said you were name calling". Once again, what the he!! should it sound like when someone says "name calling does not help your argument"? Gooooood Lord you super-libs can't even bring yourselves to admit what you said when it is right in front of you.
And now back to your confusion...you state you "don't understand the conservative take"...well Shady, when you cannot even bring yourself to admit clearly what you have accused someone of in plain English, of name calling, then how the squirrel's he!! do you ever expect to understand what anyone else says or the positions they take. Good grief, you tell someone they are name calling and then aplogize for it appearing that you said that when...that is exactly what you said. No damned wonder you super-libs remain stupified and dumbfounded when dealing with even the most elementary of facts.
If you claim to be a conservative, please don't disgrace yourself and conservatism by thinking and arguing like a liberal.
Mr. Thomas
January 6, 2007 - 20:27 ET by ShadesofgrayMr. Thomas,
Please let me clarify. In the message you are referring to, in my first line I told Aca that I liked his link showing SF had 96 murders in 2004. Note that I was being courteous and thankful. Then my next line I addressed to the entirety of the Newsbusters board by doing this:
Newsbusters,
...and then I typed my question. I was no longer trying to just talk to Aca. I was asking the entirety of whoever looks at this site. Again, Aca was not the intended recipient of my "please don't call me names" statement. I think this tactic caused confusion, and I learned not to do that next time. I guess I will post two separate comments from now on.
I have been posting on here off and on for about a year, and I get treated hot or cold as far as name calling. Sometimes the debate goes downhill quickly and I am called names without having substance discussed. This is because I am open about being a left leaner and this gets me in quick trouble with the posters here. I sometimes mess up and insult a righty here or there (I did that to Mister Bill yesterday, I admit, and that was probably my fault). Anyway, your post makes sense if I was telling Aca not to call me names, but that was not what I was doing in the earlier post. He was being polite to me, and that is great.
To use your phrasing, I believe an elementary fact is that there is more violence in Iraq than anywhere in the United States and that any reporter who goes there has it in his or her face on an hourly basis, therefore that is what gets reported. 30,000 murders a year in a place the size of California is a lot. But, I am told by NBs that because I believe this, that I "live in a fantasy world." Alrighty then.
Yeah, I and I bet you venture
January 7, 2007 - 02:51 ET by gfrrmanYeah, I and I bet you venture out all the time in DOWNTOWN Atlanta all the time. FWI, the crime rate recently has skyrocketed in good ole' ATL in case you haven't read. I live here too and I would say that ATL is "safe as Baghdad"...keep going for it pal(ette)!!!..but that's just one of your "shadesofgray"(lib-talk).btw you must live in Midtown!!