The Iraq government has set up an agency to monitor false news coming out of Iraq. After the Associated Press used a government source that doesn't exist, the government wants to make sure the AP and other media outlets cannot get away with similar fraudulent activity. Reports the UK Guardian.
Iraq's interior ministry has formed a press monitoring unit in response to what it described as "fabricated and false news" that misrepresents the country's security situation.
Singling out the Associated Press for criticism, spokesman Brigadier General Abdul-Karim Khalaf said yesterday that dedicated unit would monitor news coverage and even initiate legal action if journalists do not correct stories it believes to be incorrect.
"Fabricated and false news hurts and gives the Iraqis a wrong picture that the security situation is very bad, when the facts are totally different," he said.
He added that the media should consult the ministry's large public relations department staff for "real, true news".
Brig Gen Khalaf referred to an AP story last week describing an attack on a mosque in north-west Baghdad in which six Sunni Muslims were burnt to death.
He said the ministry said it had no records of a Captain Jamil Hussein who had been quoted in the story, and that someone dressed in the ministry's uniform may have given a false name to the reporter in exchange for money.
He also said the ministry had found no evidence of the attack or witnesses.
The ministry' was backed up by the public affairs department of the US military who demanded that the AP's story be retracted.
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
...... and even initiate leg
December 2, 2006 - 15:53 ET by bigtimer...... and even initiate legal action if journalists do not correct stories it believes to be incorrect.
It is about time! Now I hope it is not all talk and no action!
If these people who do this intentionally, (they are called the enemy for those of you on the left), they should be held accountable and dealt with as dictated....they should be shot as far as I am concerned, this is war after-all, they are causing the detriment of others if not their deaths!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
YES, I would love nothing mor
December 2, 2006 - 16:05 ET by FOXFANYES, I would love nothing more than to see the Iraq government put it's foot in the a$$ of the MSM. They have gotten away with their constant lies to date, I hope this works. Also, let's pull out any embedded CNN reporters.
Mass-media can't bear the weight of integral journalist princip
December 2, 2006 - 17:00 ET by PlaceboExcellent, the Iraq government must put a stop to this leftist blight, the media-leftists. AP and others of this repugnant ilk are in utter denial, to the point; manipulation of facts supersedes fact on all counts. We witnessed this same tactic decades ago in Nam. Our present day enemies grasp the leftist mass-media is in their corner… and loving every minute of it.
Hopefully, the Iraq government will take a hard-line stance and make the media accountable for their reporting. Freedom of speech is a privilege, as well as a right, to abuse and misuse this right is none other than criminal.
We have witnessed this misuse and abuse for too long. If the mass-media cannot bear the weight of integral journalist principles, they should get out of the business, now.
This out-and-out fraudulence; the concocting and photo-shop journalism has no place in a free-society. This, however, doesn’t hold any moral measure or weight with the press; only their slovenly leftist agenda, is their concern and ambition.
Traitors at one time would be held in detention or shot; my preference, being the latter.
Prawda isn't far away, is it?
December 2, 2006 - 17:01 ET by kafkakaeferYou don't get it, do you? This is the next step in the abolishment of a very young free press in Iraq. This does not support any accuracy or independence in reporting. Instead every reporter has to be afraid that he get's sued, when he is reporting or critizising the government.
"He added that the media should consult the ministry's large public relations department staff for "real, true news"."
Prawda isn't far away, is it?
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
kafka,How are they going to s
December 2, 2006 - 17:14 ET by bigtimerkafka,
How are they going to sue if they just report the facts...you something like the truth, something our leftist media here in all forms do not have to worry about evidently...and for that I thank the inactive Justice Dept. and Gonzales, who is not a very good Attorney General if you ask me....
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
They don't care and they ar
December 2, 2006 - 17:19 ET by kafkakaeferThey don't care and they are unable to judge what is the truth. And it is pretty interesting how many of you pretend to defend freedoms but at every opportunity call for the execution of some reporter or publisher and demand that the "liberal media" should be sanctioned.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
The liberal media should be e
December 2, 2006 - 17:24 ET by bigtimerThe liberal media should be extinct...just the facts Jack....just the facts.
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
And then you are in the mid
December 2, 2006 - 17:26 ET by kafkakaeferAnd then you are in the middle of something called fascism. Good luck.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
So you condon printing lies
December 2, 2006 - 17:31 ET by 1sttofightSo you condon printing lies?
Thanks fight! You beat me to
December 2, 2006 - 17:37 ET by bigtimerThanks fight! You beat me to it....
I guess leftist lies that come out 24/7 of the leftist mouths are okay with kaka...after-all they have the same agenda our little troll does.
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
No I'd like to see a govern
December 2, 2006 - 17:38 ET by kafkakaeferNo I'd like to see a government which is not judging what the "right" facts are or truth respectively.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
kafka, so, you think that t
December 2, 2006 - 17:46 ET by John in CAkafka, so, you think that the Associated (with terrorists) Press has every right to use a person posing as a government official, who isn't one, and cite that person as an authority. And when it's been proven beyond doubt that the person they used as a legitimate government official isn't one, then the Associated (with terrorists) should continue to deny they did anything wrong and not correct the story? All that's OKAY in your book. So long as the press is unfettered to say whatever they like? Truth be damned.
Give a Democrat Party free America a chance!
If the government feels mis
December 2, 2006 - 17:57 ET by kafkakaeferIf the government feels misrepresented they should try to find out who this guy. They certainly have some law prohibiting to pose as an official, when he isn't one. The AP's (by the way your play with words wasn't funny the first time and it doesn't get better repeating it) version sounds still quite different. So before I jump to conclusions (which could be based on false facts), I wait. It would be nice if NB was posting the whole article.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Why does the AP not produce
December 2, 2006 - 18:08 ET by 1sttofightWhy does the AP not produce their witness? Could it be he does not exist.
I've no idea, except protec
December 2, 2006 - 18:14 ET by kafkakaeferI've no idea, except protecting their sources. Ask them not me.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Then why are you defending
December 2, 2006 - 18:54 ET by 1sttofightThen why are you defending them?
Somehow I knew this questio
December 2, 2006 - 19:09 ET by kafkakaeferSomehow I knew this question had to come up. So before I answer prove your claim!
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Somehow I knew this questio
December 2, 2006 - 20:55 ET by 1sttofightSomehow I knew this question had to come up. So before I answer prove your claim!
Isn't that AP's job, Proving their claim?
They did! "Hegel sa
December 3, 2006 - 08:30 ET by kafkakaeferThey did!
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
kafka,There are several blogg
December 2, 2006 - 21:20 ET by aerokafka,
There are several bloggers working on this story, with lots and lots and lots of links and proof-type stuff (including direct correspondence with Centcom). Start with the Jamil Hussein series at Flopping Aces: http://www.floppingaces.net/jamil-hussein-story/ or Michelle Malkin: http://michellemalkin.com/archives/006452.htm . There are also several great posts about the topic in the archives here at NB. Read their reports, follow their links, and get back to us.
aero
December 3, 2006 - 08:12 ET by kafkakaeferLets put together what we definitely know about this story:
AP reports on 24/11 that six men were burned alive by shiite militia raiding a mosque in a suburb of Bagdad. AP claims to have asked the U.S. military about this story on this very friday, receiving no comment (which is nothing unusual, as they probably wanted to find out what was going on there). On saturday AP reports that U.S. military are unable to confirm the story about six men being burned alive. On monday AP receives a letter from the U.S. military claiming there is no police officer of that name. They came to that knowledge by asking the interior ministry and checking their own records about training police in Iraq. Even after that letter AP still claims that the story is true and that this police officer exists. Then AP moves forward and tries to prove that this incident really happened.
At this point we stand. In the article linked above they claim to have found three independent eyewitnesses of the incident, apart from Jamil Hussein. As far as I know these reports were not refuted by anyone yet. The identity of this person seems to be a mystery. If it is true that this person was a "reliable" source for two years, I wonder if they published the name before and if yes, why the U.S. military or the MOI didn't object to the use of a "bogus" source. There is of course the possibility that this man is posing as a police officer. But does that necessarily mean that his reports are inaccurate? Does that furthermore prove that AP is the "propaganda arm of terrorism"? I think the official point of view is quite weak on that matter. As it is suspected, and often complained about, that the Iraqi interior ministry has links to shiite militias, it wouldn't be surprising that they refute the claims. I don't know what role the U.S. military is playing here. Probably they trust the information given to them by the MOI. As AP was able to back their story by more reports, I'm going to give them the benefit of the doubt. Although it is possible that they were exploited by sunni propaganda. But again they backed their story. And I would like to read something official refuting that.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Thanks for spending some time
December 3, 2006 - 11:44 ET by aeroThanks for spending some time learning about this and not just lobbing grenades and running away. I figured you'd reach a different conclusion than we did on this due to the bias you have revealed in your previous comments.
I trust Centcom. Centcom's statements are the proof that the "witness" is not a police officer and that the events in question never happened. Terrorist propagandists have a long track record of manufacturing "events" such as this one and feeding it to the western media. We would be stupid to think that this isn't happening all the time.
If you need more reason to trust Centcom over the AP, here's my reasoning: AP has a vested interest in protecting its bottom line, so they're unlikely to retract this story--if they do, they'll surely lose credibility and revenue. Centcom, on the other hand, has readily confirmed stories that cast the U.S. military in a negative light. It would be in Centcom's interest to deny such stories, but they don't. This story makes Iraqis look bad, not Americans directly--Centcom would have even less interest in lying about it. If AP loses credibility, they lose money. If Centcom loses credibility, they lose wars. I think Centcom would not risk it over this story.
"They don't care and the
December 2, 2006 - 20:15 ET by whitetop"They don't care and they are unable to judge what is the truth". This is a typical liberal cliche. People are too stupid to know the truth, they are too stupid to know what is good for them, they are too stupid too know how to spend their money. The list goes on and on. Only liberals are smart enough to know what is right and the truth. The war in Iraq may have been over by now if it hadn't been for the liberal media and their censorship of the news that comes out of that country. The terrorists have certainly benefited from the liberally biased news.
The liberals find it okay for some poor American to have his head cut off by terrorist but damn if it isn't a crime for terrorists to be subjected to a little frat type hazing. According to all you liberals the terrorists have civil rights in our court system; even though they were captured as ununiformed combatants.
"Journalists", and I use the term loosely, have a responsiblity to be accountable for their work products. We have seen in the case of Dan Blather that is no longer acceptable journalism. Maybe the standards need to be set in another venue since the journalist are unable to live up to any standards in this country.
Amen to all of that whitetop
December 2, 2006 - 20:24 ET by bigtimerAmen to all of that whitetop!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
at every opportunity call f
December 2, 2006 - 20:22 ET by Jack Bauerat every opportunity call for the execution of some reporter or publisher
Are you frackin' nuts or what? What in God's name are you talking about?
When have I, to name but one, called for the execution of a reporter? Don't come here and lecture me on fascism, okay?
Proud member of the all-powerful and vast
militarist/industrialist/capitalist/zionist-bagelist complex
BT, kaakaa just doesn't get
December 2, 2006 - 17:23 ET by DontFeedTheTrollsBT, kaakaa just doesn't get it. He wants all the lies he likes that hurt Bush to be printed.
DSG
I don't care about Bush. I wa
December 2, 2006 - 17:25 ET by kafkakaeferI don't care about Bush. I want the iraqi people to know what nonsense their government is doing.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
And just what does the Asso
December 2, 2006 - 17:30 ET by John in CAAnd just what does the Associated (with terrorists) Press using a source claiming to be an Iraqi government official, who really isn't, have to do with the Iraqi people knowing what nonsense thier government is doing?
Give a Democrat Party free America a chance!
Liberals like you only beli
December 2, 2006 - 17:30 ET by 1sttofightLiberals like you only believe in Free Speech if you are the only ones talking.
The next platitude, please
December 2, 2006 - 17:34 ET by kafkakaeferThe next platitude, please
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Platitude?
December 2, 2006 - 18:10 ET by 1sttofightPlatitude?
no? "Hegel says somew
December 2, 2006 - 18:15 ET by kafkakaeferno?
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
1st, platitude...it's like
December 2, 2006 - 18:26 ET by John in CA1st, platitude...it's like attitude, only from Pluto.
Give a Democrat Party free America a chance!
Kaakaa is merely visiting r
December 2, 2006 - 17:36 ET by DontFeedTheTrollsKaakaa is merely visiting reality today, he normally resides elsewhere.
DSG
DFTT.....You have me laughing
December 2, 2006 - 17:39 ET by bigtimerDFTT.....You have me laughing so hard it really is hard to type and send this! Good One....Thanks...I needed that!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
You have a very awkward typ
December 2, 2006 - 17:43 ET by kafkakaeferYou have a very awkward type of humor.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
At least I have one kaka!BWAH
December 2, 2006 - 17:50 ET by bigtimerAt least I have one kaka!
BWAHAHAHAHAHHAAAAHAHAA!!!!........Bah humbug!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
Humbug indeed! "Heg
December 2, 2006 - 17:59 ET by kafkakaeferHumbug indeed!
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
"or critizising the gove
December 2, 2006 - 17:30 ET by FOXFAN"or critizising the government."
Don't see that line anywhere. Just stick with the FACTS and report them. No more green helmet man reports, just reporting facts, something Al-AP knows little about.
You truly are naive! foxfic
December 2, 2006 - 17:32 ET by kafkakaeferYou truly are naive! foxfiction can seriously distort your perception of reality.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
I would be naive if I believe
December 2, 2006 - 17:47 ET by FOXFANI would be naive if I believed the slanted garbage put out by the MSM, but I don't. And by the way, FOXFAN=fan of women.
But you believe the "G
December 2, 2006 - 17:50 ET by kafkakaeferBut you believe the "Guardian". Explain yourself. I really hope you don't watch Fox.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Where did I say I believe the
December 2, 2006 - 18:01 ET by FOXFANWhere did I say I believe the Guardian? You cannot just watch the news, it take interpitation on your part. Early morning hour election 2004, FOX, ABC, NBC declares Bush the winner. CNN was declaring Lurch the winner, no bias there. Yes I do watch FOX, can't stomach CNN anymore.
You believe the story posted
December 2, 2006 - 18:09 ET by kafkakaeferYou believe the story posted above and printed by the guardian or don't you?
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
I HOPE it is true but will c
December 2, 2006 - 18:14 ET by FOXFANI HOPE it is true but will check with various sources. As I said in my first post, I hope.
And I hope american authori
December 2, 2006 - 18:17 ET by kafkakaeferAnd I hope american authorities realize soon that their backing this plan is contraproductive to their goal (if it still is) of establishing democracy.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
And I hope we start getting r
December 2, 2006 - 18:26 ET by FOXFANAnd I hope we start getting real news out of Iraq, not the slanted al-ap version.
Gotta go kaf, dinnertime here on the east coast.
kafka, Iraq is not a state of
December 2, 2006 - 19:29 ET by Unsanekafka, Iraq is not a state of the United States, thus the 1st Amendment does not apply there. In my passport is a little sentence that states "While you are in a foreign country, your are subject to its laws."
The Constitution of the United States applies to the United States and citizens of the United States.
Curious: The U.K. has NO enshrined freedom of the press the way the United States does. Are they instantaneously less a democracy because of that?
"Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy." -Sir Winston Churchill, British statesman (1874-1965)
Unsane, was just going to a
December 2, 2006 - 19:37 ET by John in CAUnsane, was just going to ask kafka what he knows about the Iraqi Constitution. Does he know if the have the equivalent of our First Amendment? Whatever his belief is about government monitored and controlled press, I don know that since the Iraqi interim government was seated there has been an explosion of media in Iraq. Hundreds of newspapers, dozens of TV broadcasts and many radio stations. I'd dare say the have much more press freedom now than they ever had before Saddam was toppled.
Give a Democrat Party free America a chance!
Unsane and John:I wondered ab
December 2, 2006 - 19:40 ET by aeroUnsane and John:
I wondered about the Iraqi constitution myself. Here's a link to the full text:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/12/AR2005101201450.html
See Article 36 for freedom of the press.
Iraq Constitution, Article
December 2, 2006 - 19:51 ET by John in CAIraq Constitution, Article 36
The state guarantees in a way that does not violate public order and morality:
A. Freedom of expression, through all means.
B. Freedom of press, printing, advertisement, media and publication.
C. Freedom of assembly and peaceful demonstration. This shall be regulated by law.
(D.
Every Iraqi has the right to engage in sports, and the State should
encourage its activities and promotion and will provide its necessities)
Bet this phrase that does not violate public order and morality: will eventually get a hearing in some court. You know it would here.
Give a Democrat Party free America a chance!
Absolutely. And I'm sure if t
December 2, 2006 - 19:55 ET by aeroAbsolutely. And I'm sure if this AP burned-alive story kerfuffle ever makes it to court, that's what the Iraqi government will rely on to justify its lawsuit. Lying is immoral; and the story caused even more unrest amongst those who believed revenge was necessary for the supposed burnings, so it would be easy for them to say that it violated public order as well.
Point made John, there is no
December 2, 2006 - 20:09 ET by bigtimerPoint made John, there is no getting around that! Job well done. Thanks for the info., especially since I am in and out of here today.
Time will tell if anything is going to be done about all of this propaganda...people held accountable.
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
Freedom of the press isn't
December 2, 2006 - 19:12 ET by n2soonersFreedom of the press isn't absolute. There are limits on what you can and cannot print and call it news. When an agency goes from being an objective news agency to a propaganda arm of terrorists, then something has to be done.
Please prove that your prem
December 2, 2006 - 19:16 ET by kafkakaeferPlease prove that your premise concerning AP is true. I'm tired of this sort of propaganda.
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
I am tired of the AP propagan
December 2, 2006 - 21:53 ET by UnsaneI am tired of the AP propagandizing as well!
"Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy." -Sir Winston Churchill, British statesman (1874-1965)
Exactly that is to be proven!
December 3, 2006 - 07:17 ET by kafkakaeferExactly that is to be proven!
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
Are you awake?
December 3, 2006 - 16:14 ET by UnsaneWere you paying attention to the war that broke out in the Middle East over the summer when both the AP and Reuters were slavishly reporting everything Hezbollah wanted them to, chapter and verse, while they treated EVERYTHING Israel told them with extreme skepticism?
If that wasn't cheerleading for a particular side of the war, I don't know what was.
"Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy." -Sir Winston Churchill, British statesman (1874-1965)
You said it all n2!"Once
December 2, 2006 - 19:21 ET by bigtimerYou said it all n2!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
kafka,I get your point about
December 2, 2006 - 18:27 ET by aerokafka,
I get your point about freedom of the press, and I respect it. Freedom of the press is critical to democracy and must be protected, which is why our founders added it to the Constitution. However, all the others who have commented have an excellent point as well. The press needs to be held accountable for telling the truth. Their freedom cannot extend to spreading outright lies, particularly lies that can cost people's lives.
A huge component of the War on Terror is the propaganda war. Terrorists are fighting the propaganda war openly and effectively, and we're too PC to fight back. The Iraqi government is apparently willing to fight back, and they have every right to do so. They won't survive long if they just roll over and let the enemy propagandists say and print whatever they want with impunity.
I don't think criticizing and punishing the AP for propagating a proven lie is a danger to freedom of the press. Holding them accountable is not the same as taking away their freedom. No armed thugs have shown up at the AP's offices to shut them down at gunpoint. But they should not expect happy cooperation from the Iraqi government whose back they willfully stabbed with this story and probably others. Between faked photographs and faked stories, the AP and Reuters are losing credibility by the day in my book. They're totally free to report these bogus stories, just like I'm totally free to reject them.
aero,"A huge component
December 2, 2006 - 19:04 ET by kafkakaeferaero,
"A huge component of the War on Terror is the propaganda war."
And propaganda has nothing to do with facts, truth or similar qualities. It is about extinction of dissenting voices and putting your version of "truthiness" in place.
"Terrorists are fighting the propaganda war openly and effectively, and we're too PC to fight back."
I don't think that the U.S. government is to PC to fight back. They produced plenty of propaganda over the last years. It is a question of how to "fight" back the terrorists effort. By just propagating your own view and abandoning rational discourse you will lose, even if you win. The point is: dissent and plurality of opinion as well as rationality is strength not weakness in this conflict, whatever they might say.
"The Iraqi government is apparently willing to fight back, and they have every right to do so."
They don't have every right to do so. They have those rights which do not interfer with the freedom of press. Furthermore they have the duty to protect that freedom. And a government panel which decides what are the facts is not protecting the press, it is endangering it. And when I'm hearing such words as
"He added that the media should consult the ministry's large public relations department staff for "real, true news"."
then I really get afraid, because I know what happens when a government claims to hold the truth. In fact, I don't think that the Iraqi government is very interested in free press, as it would discover plenty of scandals (if it was really free). Mixing up, again, WOT and what is in discussion here is not very helpful anyway.
Of course AP is to be held accountable. The government is entitled to go after the person posing as an official, when he was none. They are entitled to put out press releases as much as they want to. But it is not AP endangering the freedom of press.
"No armed thugs have shown up at the AP's offices to shut them down at gunpoint."
Perhaps not. But if the freedom of press situation is moving furthermore in the direction I think it is, than it will happen some day.
That news agencies depend upon local sources, which have own interests is nothing new. That sometimes they produce false stories is nothing new either. It depends on AP how they deal with that situation. I think they can't afford it to have negative coverage of that kind for very long. On the other hand the Iraqi government has similar interests in hiding or promoting certain stories. So the proposed plan doesn't help either. The only thing it is doing is intimidating journalists (who are already intimidated by the overwhole situation in Iraq).
"Hegel says somewhere all great events and personalities in world history reappear in one fashion or another. He forgot to add: the first time as tragedy, the second as farce."
The Eighteeenth Brumaire of Louis Bonaparte (1852) sect. 1, Cf.
kafka:Great, thoughtful repl
December 2, 2006 - 19:39 ET by aerokafka:
Great, thoughtful reply. Thank you!
You said:
"Propaganda has nothing to do with facts, truth, or similar qualities..."
Exactly. Which is why the AP story, having been proven false, is propaganda. The Iraqi government should and did correct the record. I say again, they have a right to protect and present the truth. They have a right to hold AP and other organizations accountable--in court, if necessary.
If the BBC were to report that George Bush's skin had turned red and that he had grown horns out of his head, and then indignantly defended the story despite being presented with the truth of his unchanged appearance, they should be sued, yes?
When I said the Iraqi government has every right to fight back against propaganda and a lying press, you said:
"They don't have every right to do so. They have those rights which do not interfere with freedom of the press."
I contend that they are not interfering with freedom of the press by offering the press an office that can give them the government's official statements and versions of stories the press is running. They can fact-check the Iraqi government and report any lies they find in the world press. But if they report lies from fictional sources as truth and it's proven that they knew they were lies, they can and should be sued. I repeat, keeping the press accountable for checking their facts and telling the truth is not denying their freedom. As far as I know, the Iraqi government has not threatened to kick out or shut down news agencies--those news agencies are still free to print whatever they like. However, they might get sued if they lie--in a court of law, where they will be able to defend themselves according to due process and the rule of law.
A side note: I wasn't even sure if freedom of the press was in the Iraqi Constitution, but it is:
Article 36:
The state guarantees in a way that does not violate public order and morality:
I agree with most of the rest of what you said. If freedom of press is infringed upon, it can be infringed upon slightly more and slightly more until the thugs are at the door to shut it down. I believe that happened under Saddam. It certainly happens in other authoritarian regimes with frightening regularity.
I also don't dispute the lack of newness in various parties trying to influence the press and the version of the story that is presented to the public. I know that both sides have an interest in having the news come out a certain way, and it is the reporters' responsibility to fact-check and present the unbiased truth as best they can. This is where the AP failed.
I also agree with your statement that the AP can't take this kind of negative publicity for long. At least I hope that market forces will prevail and keep them accountable. Market forces are probably more powerful than the Iraqi government could ever hope to be when it comes to the world press.
I do disagree with the idea that reporters in Iraq are intimidated by the Iraqi government. They just got away with telling a huge bald-faced lie that hurt the Iraqi government, and nothing happened to them except that the Iraqis held a press conference and opened an office. The AP did not apologize or retract the story at the Iraqi government's behest. If reporters are intimidated by anyone, it's the "insurgents," who kidnap them and behead them with disturbing regularity.
You clearly have ZERO idea
December 2, 2006 - 20:30 ET by Jack BauerYou clearly have ZERO idea of how and why the Associated Press was established, what its role should be; and how that previously useful function has been hijacked, bastardized and CORRUPTED.
Please refrain from ignorant assertions until you have at least a modicum of facts about the sad and almost criminal decline of the Associated Press into a hack organization pimping and pumping out nothing less than partisan propaganda.
Proud member of the all-powerful and vast
militarist/industrialist/capitalist/zionist-bagelist complex
Frozen hell first Jack
December 2, 2006 - 22:23 ET by acumen"Please refrain from ignorant assertions...."
That would require an unconditional vow of silence by Kaka. My money is on hell freezin' over first Jack.
1638hrs - "No I'd like t
December 2, 2006 - 20:57 ET by bulletproof1638hrs - "No I'd like to see a government which is not judging what the "right" facts are or truth respectively"
-kafkakaefer
I just received a mysterious phone call from a man calling himself Frankenberry. The relevence here is that he told me that back in the early 80's a specter going by the name of "kafkakaefer" (alias "kkk") set ablaze in maniacal unrestraint the nests of harmless gypsy moths all across the northern Virginia/Maryland border. After dodging intelligence officials in the highlands of West Virginia he was eventually forced deep into hiding when in a tragic turn of events, a group of local miners nearly died in a gas explosion caused when kkk attempted to set the company's canary (Freida) free using a remote-controlled incidiary device. As a cruel twist, the miners' were under an emergency ascent due to their faithful Freida's watchful senses detecting the natural gas leak; watchful senses that would watch no more, for Freida tragically lost her life in the consuming fury caused from the exploding column of gas. Kafkakaefer dissappeared...
So! You've resurfaced then! Canary killer!!!! Canary K-I-L-L-E-R!!!!!!!
Everyone must be able to judge the truth, Bro, otherwise "the truth" it can never be.
Never use your gun to pistol-wip a Liberal. That could mar the finish.
Oh man bp...you have exposed
December 2, 2006 - 21:11 ET by bigtimerOh man bp...you have exposed this guy for who he really is....Kard-Karrying Kanary Killer!
Thank YOU!
"Once the coffers of the federal government are opened to the public, there will be no shutting them again." - Grover Cleveland
The credit really goes to m
December 2, 2006 - 21:47 ET by bulletproofThe credit really goes to my source! ; )
Never use your gun to pistol-wip a Liberal. That could mar the finish.
Take a gander
December 2, 2006 - 22:55 ET by acumenMedia Monitor? I thought that used to be called a baby monitor? At any rate, our leftist checks and balances advocates should find this a positive development. If it's good enough for the goose.....