Expect the Barack Obama-fascinated media to play up the Illinois liberal's trip to talk AIDS at the Saddleback evangelical mega-church in California run by Rick Warren, author of the monster best-seller The Purpose-Driven Life. It will probably draw more buzz at how Obama can reach out to conservative Christians, although that's not how conservative Christians are reacting. Warren was largely ignored by the media while he was burning up the best-seller list -- although he's getting more attractive as he moves closer to the media "mainstream." See last year's World AIDS Day coverage.
But that's not the whole story. Laura Ingraham offered a different story of AIDS advocacy and Obama: the Chicago Sun-Times reported Obama and the gangsta rapper Ludacris met with area youth to talk AIDS, and “the senator applauded Ludacris for using his stature and his celebrity to bring attention to the issue.” It’s possible that Ludacris could have a few hours in which he sounded socially responsible, but his recorded repertoire trends more to the kind about “letting the condom pop” as you ahem, do “all those able bitches with riches.” The Sun-Times finds no occasion for either the reporter or the presidential aspirant to suggest that perhaps Ludacris could help with the AIDS problem by recording less culturally toxic lyrics for the young people he seeks to empower.
Place your bets on the national political correspondents focusing on (A) and either ignoring (B) or counting that as another plus.
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Yes, and there is the problem
December 1, 2006 - 10:21 ET by msh1973Yes, and there is the problem. Rick Warren has now moved from the pulpit to the political arena. He has now opened himself up to criticism from the Church. For more information on Warren from a Bibical perspective, go to:
http://www.worldviewweekend.com/secure/cwnetwork/article.php?ArticleID=1313
Warren is now, and always ha
December 1, 2006 - 11:26 ET by tracheostomyWarren is now, and always has been, a cancer on the church. He's simply showing his true colors now after dragging the sacred Word through 40 days of Purpose that felt like 40 years. . .
-PJ
http://www.draftcondi.us/
Rick Warren is an individual
December 1, 2006 - 12:22 ET by Dan The Man 2Rick Warren is an individual and what church are you refering to. He has his purpose in life and understands taht everyone has a purpose in life. I personally dont know much about him or his books, but a cancer on the church?
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
Oops, my bad. Cross out "
December 1, 2006 - 12:56 ET by tracheostomyOops, my bad. Cross out "church" and replace that with "Christianity". His purpose in life was to lead a movement to turn the church into a business model.
Oh, and he twists scripture to his own ends. He is an eisegetical, rather than exegetical teacher. Those are his two lofty contributions to Christianity. Thanks, Rick. Just what we needed in a doctrinally; directionally starved ecclesia.
http://www.draftcondi.us/
Church in capital letters ref
December 1, 2006 - 22:48 ET by msh1973Church in capital letters refers to the Body of Christ, you know the Church. Did you even go to the website I highlighted? No probably not.
I did and it was crap. Nuke
December 3, 2006 - 02:00 ET by Dan The Man 2I did and it was crap.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
I don't know exactly what it
December 1, 2006 - 11:47 ET by Dave RI don't know exactly what it is, as I cannot quite put my finger on it, but there is something about Barack Hussein Osama Obama that isn't quite right.
Over at Hot Air yesterday, Al
December 1, 2006 - 13:17 ET by aeroOver at Hot Air yesterday, Allah posted a quote from Fox News in which a top Iowa DNC guy said that he thought Hillary wouldn't run if Obama got in the race (yeah, right). The quote ended with the guy saying that he hadn't seen this level of excitement for a candidate since Bill Clinton. He said that people "just wanted to touch him (Obama)." That statement kinda creeped me out--another commenter helped me realize that it's because these people (Obama worshippers) are acting like cultists around the man. They can't possibly know very much about what he actually stands for--since he doesn't have a record to speak of yet--so they're apparently just responding to the media hype like mindless sheep. I think that's what's bothering me most about Obama--the creepy factor of his "followers."
Not sure the context of you
December 1, 2006 - 12:11 ET by balboaNot sure the context of your Luda quotes is correct.
Rick Warren is a class A ph
December 1, 2006 - 12:19 ET by Squalls BladeRick Warren is a class A phony who has done tons of damage to Christianity. He never lets the Bible get in the way of pushing his agenda.
Democracy is not enough. If the culture dies, the country dies. - Pat Buchanan
I'll be expecting comments fr
December 1, 2006 - 12:46 ET by Eric TurnerI'll be expecting comments from Guy Arthur Thomas any moment now. But let me just say that I have not supported, nor approved of the Saddleback church. I'm not that knowledgeable of the church but it seems to be very much a part of this whole new "emergent conversation" (AKA: "seeker sensitive movement"). I have not read Warren's book either. I don't intend to. I mean, come on...the guy went to Syria and called it "moderate" if I'm not mistaken. I guess him and the Pope have something in common uh? Go to a muslim country and kow-tow to the muslims.
I'm not a fan of Rick Warren - never was and never will be. His Saddleback Church, along with the Willow Creek Church (& association) and many other "mega-churches" are built on the charisma of their founder. Churches should be built on the "charisma" (if you will) of Jesus Christ and upon the foundation of his death, burial and resurrection - the salvation we have through Him, not on the abilities of a fallen man.
That's my two cents and my story and I'm stickin' to it!
________________________________
Ah! NOW we see the violence inherent in the system. Come and see the violence inherent in the system. Help! Help! I'm being repressed!
I looked at the faith and pur
December 1, 2006 - 12:57 ET by Dan The Man 2I looked at the faith and purpose statement of the church and a brief bio of Rick. He and the message seem to be Biblical, so I see no problem in what he is doing. People go to churches for many reasons, one of them is because they like or trust a particular person prophesizing the Word other wise they wouldn't go there. It doesn't matter if it is small or large just that the people in that church are getting fed with the proper food.
Looking at his bio it seems he is an evagelist in the sense he believes in spreading the message far and wide. He also believes in the Biblical principle of being all things to all proplr and however we have to carry that mission out as long as it does not conflict with the Bible. I say more power to him and if he gets a bit of money in the process then its ok by me.
In short conclusion I dont think he is trying to lead people by his Charisma but by the Word of God.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
Look more closely.-PJhttp://w
December 1, 2006 - 13:01 ET by tracheostomyLook more closely (James 3:1).
-PJ
http://www.draftcondi.us/
I read the treatsie and must
December 1, 2006 - 13:24 ET by Dan The Man 2I read the treatsie and must read the book to verify the conclusions. One thing we must look at is the book is primarily aimed at Bible believers and the probably dont need much in the way of what it means to be born again. Another is that God actually wants us to spread the gospel by exponential growth. I look to teh early church and when they became somewhat complacent God split them up and scattered them.
Sometimes we must look at spreading the gospel as a business model, becuase we are supposed to be in the business of ... expanding the messaghe taht it reaches all people. So it is very reasonable when he took a survey of what people wanted in a church is a rock band and contemporay music. He wants to attract the unsaved and it showed taht is what they would feel more confortable with.
Jesus went into where the people were and listened to them. Im sure he spoke to them in a way they would understand the message. We are not perfect like Jesus and do not have his intimate understanding of humans and human nature, os we rely on shotgun methods to get the word out.
Remember be all things to all people, but dont compromise the Word. I dont think Rick compromised anything he just thought outside the box most want to place God in.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
Another is that God actually
December 1, 2006 - 15:54 ET by tracheostomyThe church of Jesus Christ is not fueled by pragmatism (probably the only exclusively American-born philosophy), nor by a worldly business model.
-PJ
http://www.draftcondi.us/
I disagree wholeheartedly as
December 1, 2006 - 18:08 ET by Dan The Man 2I disagree wholeheartedly as Jesus admonished us to be in the world but of the world of heaven. Since we are in the world we must know how it works and work it. I imagine when Jesus choose a mountain to conduct some of his most famous speeches and then whne the people were hungry he fed them taht you think that was a bad model. Man did not make that model but God did.
You are blinded by some hatred, which might be because Rick makes a bit of money preaching, and can't see the big picture. God does not want his people to be poor and this includes the men he calls to prophesi the word. Is this the big problem? It seems that it may be.
God wants us to prosper and thrive and if we can spread the Word at the same time then halleluyea. Do you know the reason for so many Bible translations? Sometimes people have to be told the truth in a way taht is palatable to them. Some say the one they understand is the KJ and others say the NAS and still others read the Bible in spanish and the list goes on. We must reach the peopel where they are not where we think they should be and if you read the bio that is what Rick wanted to do.
So in his quest for reaching out to people he gained knowlege on purpose and growing people and churches and wanted to share the knowlege. He spent time and effort and profits a small bit on his materials and hard work. People dont have to buy it, but they do.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
I disagree wholeheartedly as
December 2, 2006 - 12:08 ET by tracheostomyI disagree wholeheartedly as Jesus admonished us to be in the world but of the world of heaven.
Where is that written? See 1John 2:15; John 15:19! You're not backing anything up.
Since we are in the world we must know how it works and work it.
Does this include a carrot-and-stick approach to the gospel? Lure them in with anything they want after taking an opinion poll? That's not obedience. It's conformity to the world.
I imagine when Jesus choose a mountain to conduct some of his most famous speeches and then whne the people were hungry he fed them taht you think that was a bad model.
If anything, it's purely an imaginary one if such a statement begins with "I imagine. . ."
Why don't you try some quotes, man? Why is opening the Bible such a chore for you?
You are blinded by some hatred, which might be because Rick makes a bit of money preaching, and can't see the big picture.
Wow, assumption abounds with that statement. I think I made it clear that my passionate opposition is purely theological and appeals to reason. Pragmatism and business models oppose the Bible. If you'd like examples, I have tons.
God does not want his people to be poor and this includes the men he calls to prophesi the word. Is this the big problem?
Yes. The apostle Paul says otherwise. James had a particular problem with the rich. Are you a member of the Word of Faith movement?
-PJ
http://www.draftcondi.us/
I dont want to have a thread
December 3, 2006 - 02:11 ET by Dan The Man 2I dont want to have a thread devolve intop a theological discussion. But, Job was rich, the richest in the world, so I guess God smote him for this. No it seems God put him up as an example and let Satan beat him up. If I have time I might give u some lessons but probably not. I am Southern Baptist, traditional. God does not want us to be poor an he does want us to reach people.
The message should be undiluted but it can take other forms. Think of The Lord of The Rings and the message, it is not diluted but is in a different package.
Nuke em til they glow then shoot em in the dark. -- save my gun, shoot a liberal.
and Job ended up richer for i
December 3, 2006 - 02:15 ET by Conservative Voiceand Job ended up richer for it
dear armyvet
December 1, 2006 - 12:59 ET by tumblerYou hit a nice spare, not really the strike you were expecting. I agree with almost all you've said.
But our Holy Father has gone into the whirlwind of Islam, not to kowtow, but to counsel every good soul. Not only Christians in Turky, but Muslims of good will; should any even dare speak to him. One who was apealing for a private audince with Benedict was the Turk assassin who just failed to assassinate John Paul II. (Don't ask me why; but I'm sure it wasn't to request any kowtow.)
My parish priest expressed fears for the Pope's safety in Turkey. It seemed to him that the Church should have appealed to HIM, don't GO. I disagreed with my pastor. I see what Benedict is doing as positively heroic. He isn't afraid to be martyred if God wills it. He's anything BUT a kowtow-er.
The Swiss Guards
December 1, 2006 - 13:07 ET by Carl KolchakMy sister just returned from Italy and said the Swiss guards that take care of the Pope are extremly fascinating. I guess these guards have to come from a specific part of Switzerland, and it goes back to a long time ago when Swiss mercanaries were in charge of protecting the Pope, and the opposing force was closing in and trying to capture the Pope. These Swiss guards had to smuggle the Pope out to a safe haven in another church, and as a result from that time these specific Swiss guards are in charge of protecting the Pope. I may not have all of the facts straight, as she was relating the story to me while suffering jet lag. Also what was the story with the guy who tried to assasinate the Pope back in the early 80's? Was it ever confirmed the Soviets were involved with all of that, because of what was happening in Poland?
"I've always been crazy, but it's kept me from going insane" Waylon Jennings
yeah, Carl
December 1, 2006 - 13:19 ET by tumblerI believe the Soviets were exposed just lately, in documents that have come to light after the party was lopped off. Operatives in Bulgaria were involved. I'd have to do a search to be sure.
Something interesting was said by Fr John Corapi on EWTN the other day. When JP II visited the assassin in prison (and forgave the man for shooting him) he asked the Pope how he could still be living. He said, "I'm a professional assassin. I do not miss my targets. Something saved you; but WHAT?"
Red Rabbit (ugh)
December 1, 2006 - 21:06 ET by UnsaneThe Swiss Guards are NOT to be f%#!?d with either. There is a bit more to them beyond the dress uniforms and halbeards.
By the way...ever read Red Rabbit by Tom Clancy? A poor novel by his standards, but it is supposed to be a fictionalized account of this. How much of this is based on reality, I am not sure (beyond a Turkish would be assassin trying to kill the Pope).
"Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy." -Sir Winston Churchill, British statesman (1874-1965)
Red Rabbit (Yay!)
December 1, 2006 - 21:23 ET by Free StinkerI kinda liked it . . . would you at least agree it was far better than Teeth of the Tiger ?
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