Anti-Gun Chicago Priest Calls for Death of Gun Shop Owner - Media Silent

Photo of Warner Todd Huston.

On May 29th a Catholic Priest from Chicago's St. Sabina Church joined a rally in front of a gun shop and called for the owner of the shop and all pro-gun legislators to be "snuffed out", yet, the media is strangely silent on the "Father's" extreme comments -- words one would think would be explosive enough to get media coverage. Father Michael Pfleger, known the city over for his overt political activism, made the obscene comments while demonstrating with Jesse Jackson and his Organization Operation Push in front of Chuck's Gun Shop in Riverdale, a Chicago suburb.

This from the Capitol Fax Blog (one of Illinois' best political sites):

Rev. Michael Pfleger, pastor of St. Sabina’s Church, went way over the top this week. During a protest against Chuck’s Gun Shop, Father Pfleger twice threatened to “snuff out” the shop’s owner and threatened the same fate for legislators who oppose his position on gun control.

“We’re gonna find you and snuff you out,” Fleger said about the gun shop owner, likening the man to a “rat.” He later repeated his threat to “snuff out” the owner.

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“We’re gonna snuff out legislators who are voting [garbled] against our gun laws and we’re coming for you because we are not going to sit idly.”

That is some of the most vicious rhetoric one could imagine coming out of the mouth of a so-called Priest, but, the MSM had nothing to say about the comments. In fact, while several Chicago MSM sources mentioned the Jackson sponsored protest, none of them mention Pfleger's outrageous and inflammatory rhetoric.

NBC5 News (TV), with a story copyrighted by the Chicago Sun-Times, doesn't mention that Pflager was even at the rally.

ABC7 News (TV) similarly doesn't mention that Pfleger was at the rally. They do, however, recount Jackson's unfounded claim that "weapons sold at Chuck's Gun have ended up in the hands of criminals." There is no proof that Jackson's claim is true and ABC notes at the end of the piece that, "From time to time, protestors target Chuck's Gun Shop, but there have been any charges that the gun stores breaks the law." Still, and once again, Jackson gets away with making unfounded claims without any proof whatsoever to back it up with no one calling him to account.

The Chicago Tribune at least mentioned that Pfleger was at the rally, but does not report his comments at all. All the Trib said was that, "Michael Pfleger encouraged the crowd to push for stricter gun laws." And that he, "vowed that the rally was just the beginning and that civil disobedience was possible."

So, why the blackout of the "Father's" outrageous comments?

Could it be because they agree with the efforts at gun control and they don't want Pflager's idiotic rhetoric to tarnish that effort?

Or, perhaps, Pfleger has been a loose cannon for so long that his foolishness doesn't even rate comment anymore?

That last point is a shame if true, too. After all, don't we always hear that Bush is an evil, evil "extremist Christian" for wanting to have faith based charities being able to receive Federal funding? Don't we hear that this is some sort of violation of the so-called "separation of church and state"? Don't detractors always say that the Church should stay out of political fights? Additionally, don't leftists claim that Churches that get involved with right leaning political causes should have their tax exempt status threatened or removed?

Yet, here we have in Father Michael Pflager, a Catholic Church and it's Pastor getting directly involved in political fights and causes all the time. You can go right to the St. Sabina website and immediately see a graphic and a link to an overtly political message against Illinois gunrights legislation. The link takes you to a Church sponsored page featuring a listing of current Illinois gun bills that they are targeting for activism.

If THIS isn't a violation of Church and State... what is?

But, do we hear the left railing about this political activism by a church? Do we hear calls for St. Sabina's tax exempt status to be threatened?

Um, no. After all, it is an MSM approved brand of political activism, one that leans squarely against the Constitution and in a heavily leftward direction.

And, can we remind one and all of what kind of coverage Reverend Jerry Falwell got upon his passing? How often did the MSM rail against his political activism? It shouldn't have to be noted that Falwell's activism was scorned because it emanated from a distinctly right leaning direction.

In any case, the MSM's failure to report this incident is telling, indeed.

(For those interested, an MP3 audio file of Father Pfleger's comments can be downloaded from the Illinois State Rifle Association website)


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I imagine if he were callin

I imagine if he were calling for the death of an abortionist, it would get some coverage.....

That was my first thought whi

That was my first thought while reading the article. The MSM wouldn't be able to get the story out fast enough if Planned Parenthood was being threatened that way.

So, Father Pfleger is going t

So, Father Pfleger is going to purchase a gun from the gun shop to "snuff out" the gun shop owner?

I think guns should be banned from felons, the mentally disturbed, and Priests.

He can just borrow from the Rainbow Push Coalition

He can just borrow a weapon from the Rainbow Push Coalition, making use of Jesse Jackson's armed guards at this protest.

I guess it's all ok because they're wimpy libs and noone believes a word they say, from a decade plus of experience.

I'm about as far as a perso

I'm about as far as a person can get from being an expert on anything about the Catholic Church, but I'm wondering how the gungrabbing Father would explain this particular saint away?
JMR

Here's another article that h

Here's another article that has something to do with a religious figure and his (religious) views. No one is sure about his faith. I'm pretty sure will generate hundreds of opinions. I will start...I am sure this priest is against abortion, against death penalty (church teaching), but for some reason, he calls for the death of a human being? Go figure. Sin is sin, and crime is crime anyway you look at it...

Three things I was told before not to discuss: politics, religion and sex. Folks this is the perfect forum, as long as we all avoid name-calling. And be clear and concise so we can respond accordingly...

This is the first I’ve hear

This is the first I’ve heard of this priest, so I reserve the right to revise everything that follows. I hope against hope that this priest just got carried away with his rhetoric, and that he simply misspoke the difference between sniff and snuff. I heard the clip, and he was talking about how the shop owner was hiding. Therefore, they were going to snuff him out. Of course, you don’t “snuff” people out of hiding, you sniff them out. That carries a much different meaning. I can’t imagine that he meant snuff, as in murder. Maybe it was a Freudian slip, I don’t know.

The deeper issue is church and state. When political and moral issues overlap, church leaders have every right to speak out. Religious leaders have no political authority, and their religious authority extends only to their own flock, and we hope that’s understood … by both the audience, and in this case, the speaker. I don’t agree with this priest in this case, but if he wants to speak out, he has as much right as any citizen. But if he did, in fact, call for someone’s murder, then he faces the same prosecution as anyone else who abuses his free speech.

You have to be careful as a priest. People treat what you say as official church teaching, because you are a church official. However, merely owning a weapon or making them for a living is not, in itself, a moral sin. That isn’t church teaching. I don’t own guns, but I don’t think it’s immoral to own them, or even make and sell them. If you knowingly sell guns to the wrong people, or you’re careless about who you sell them to (children, drug runners, etc.) then it becomes a moral issue. If the gun owner isn’t guilty of that, the priest shouldn’t exploit his collar. (But jeez, I hope there’s more to the story than that.)

Regardless of the issue, this

Regardless of the issue, this is another clear example of left wing bias. Since gun control is a pet position of the lefties, of course they're not going to publicize anything negative about this "rally". If Dubya, the great evil one himself, were to make a public statement vowing his support of anytime, anywhere abortion, he would become the darling of the media (at least for that particular day). In case anyone hasn't noticed, this has become the MSM modus operandi over recent years. If you say something they like and agree with, and something that promotes their position, you will make the headlines. If you say something blatantly against their views, you will also make headlines, though you may have wished you hadn't. If you say something that promotes their views, along with something totally off the wall, at least half of what you said will be the headline. Anything else will be ignored. Cherry-picking has become the journalistic standard of the MSM.

The Closed Mind Erects Strong Barriers

BTW, this preist should be de

BTW, this preist should be defrocked by the church, his church should be taxed for political activism, and the gun store owner should sue him for threatening his life and defamation of charactor, as well as lost revenue. The police should arrest him for making threats against individuals and elected officials. The men in the white coats should be vying with the cops to see who gets to him first to lock him up - as a criminal or a whack-job.

Basically, I think he should feel something he should understand - the wrath of God coming down upon him for his actions.

The Closed Mind Erects Strong Barriers

Defrock him

No, I've got a better idea.

Make him spend a month with Tumbler.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

As I am a firm beleiver in th

As I am a firm beleiver in the Bill of Rights, I have to disagree with you, Riled, as your suggestion would clearly violate the protection against cruel and unusual punishment...

The Closed Mind Erects Strong Barriers

Tumbleboarding

OK, so we tape up Tumbler's mouth and dress him up as an altar boy.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!Save a Se

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

I respect Catholicism, exce

I respect Catholicism, except for when they go into their Berrigan brothers or "liberation theology" modes. Then....they can go pound sand.

Rochester, Minnesota: A Fem_Leftist City!

I do belive that this type of

I do belive that this type of behaviour flys in the face of the teachings of Jesus and what was written by Peter and James. Dident they teach to obey those appointed  as kings and the laws of the land? Dident they teach that this was Gods will? Seems to me, this guy needs to meet with God on a personal basis. I do think his attitude needs a little adjustment. To advocate the overthrow of the Bill of Rights and the Constitution of the United States is treason to say the least. And is contrary to the teachings of Christ. This is no priest. This is a proponent of Satan.

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

Satanic priest?

People seem to forget Jesus didn't tell the penitent thief he could get down off his cross and walk away from his punishment.

The C Church is trying to have it more than both ways as it attempts to flood the US with a lawbreaking, predominantly Catholic demographic.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

But Jesus continued with, &qu

But Jesus continued with, "Today thou shalt be with me in paradise". You're absolutely right, the penitent malifactor recognized his misdeeds and Jesus forgave him according to his faith in Jesus and "rewarded" him a place in paradise.

But I am with you Riled, the "church" want to have it both ways. And with your analysis, are you also suggesting that people of this "church demographic" are predominantly liberal- not just in politics but also in their beliefs? Mostly, these are the group of people- liberal thinking- being wooed by leftoids and therefore will kill the two-party system by adding more left-leaning welfare recipients to our country. No, no, no, this is my analysis, not Riled.

And I said predominantly, therefore not all Catholics are liberal.

Right Senior Chief

Forever tied to the Party that enslaved them with the comfort of poverty in the US.  The party that will tell them how Mexicans are supposed to think, the party that shows them what happens to rogue Mexicans.

Same game they've played with Blacks in America.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

Spoken as a true hater of the

Spoken as a true hater of the Catholic Church.

Thanks, chad

But you'd be wrong.  I just vehemently disagree with the Catholic Church on so many issues.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

Hate or vehemently disagree -

Hate or vehemently disagree - seem pretty cose to the same thing to me.

 Although what I read from you before about the Catholic Church seemed more like hatred than disagreement. Oh well - that is your right. Don't hide from your true feelings.

Whatever, chad

I hate the lies of the Libs, but I don't hate Libs.

I hate the lies of the Catholic Church, but I don't hate Catholics.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

Florida chad...this is not ab

Florida chad...this is not about the church. This is about the a lowly priest within the church advocating a violation of Church doctrine. This is no priest. This is a menion of Satan posing as a priest. He is advocating disobedience to the teachings of Christ. How would this be hate towards the church?

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

Bass - I was commenting on Ri

Bass - I was commenting on Riled Ones comments about the Catholic Church. This priest is not fullfilling his duty to the church, and to me his actions are not a reflection of the Catholic Church.

Priest

So he wasn't dressed up with his Roman Collar?  I stand corrected.

But if he was, you would expect swift discipline from his superiors, wouldn't you?

But he was wearing his collar, and the Church will keep its mouth shut because the Church backs him.  Hide and watch.

I'll expect you to show me when the Church denounces his actions. I won't hold my breath.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

Riled - Priest are not robots

Riled - Priest are not robots, but humans and as such able to speak freely and make mistakes. IMO he shouldn't have had the collar on during his political stunt. I have not seen any official communication from the church indicating an official position on this issue. I have seen some priest come down on both sides of this issue. The church should discipline him for his actions. If they do it will probably be behind closed doors. At my catholic church the priest has spoken on the issue and comes down on the side of the law. This is his personal opinion just like the opinion of the priest in the article.

Show me the official statement from the church, not a rogue priest or cardinal, backing amnesty for all and I will reconsider my viewpoint. You moved quickly from condemning the priest to the whole church, because of your  vehement disagreement with the church.

Robots

It took a severe money drain for the Church to recall Cardinal Law, didn't it?

And where is this pedophile sympathizer now?  Yeah, they have a real good record of discipline.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

Good point - do you have any

Good point - do you have any offical statement form the church on immigration?

Yes chad

Google "Vatican decries fence"

Gore lied. Nobody fried

One top cardinal - not the en

One top cardinal - not the entire church nor the Pope.

BTW - In response to the Card

BTW - In response to the Cardinal Law scandal, over 50 priests signed a letter declaring no confidence in Cardinal Law and asking him to resign - something that had never before happened in the history of the Church in America. It took the loss of money and support of the priests to cause a change.

They do try - they don't just stick their head in the sand and hide.

Does the church get any credit from you for all the good they do in the world ? Or do you just focus on the mistakes?

And the Pope

The Pope knew of the scandal for years before reacting to declining tithes.  Guess the free market works universally.

A mistake?  Why don't you just call it a faux pas?

Gore lied. Nobody fried

It was a terrible thing, erro

It was a terrible thing, error, mistake, crime, abuse, faux pas. Call it what you like. They did wrong then. They should have never listened to shrinks, should have just called the cops. But I see that you will never let them repent or recover from these horrible crimes.

And they won't repent

As long as there are Dioceses who suddenly decide State protection isn't all that bad.  File bankruptcy, hide settlements, trash the victims.  Guess none of this stuff is still going on.  Yeah, they've repented.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

florida...I have a problem wi

florida...I have a problem with priests, ministers, preachers or any so called man of God, that has a personal opinion on matters spoken about by Jesus, and written down in the Bible. In my view, there is no room for personal opinions by these people on such subjects. Just IMO.

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

I agree bassndude. It gives t

I agree bassndude. It gives the church a black eye. They need to tighten the reins on priest like this one. When they don't it just gives ammunition to the bashers.

florida, I dont think that an

florida, I dont think that anyone here is saying that the Church as a whole is wrong. But I dont think Peter would recognize it today. I do think that Peter would clean house, so to speak. What we have today is a but a shadow of the Church that was. There have been to many excuses and to many compromises in these latter years. My cousin, RIP, was a devout Catholic. One of the last conversations we had were on the problems  faced by the Catholic Church today, and he belived Peter would be most upset by what was going on, and that God would, in time, rectify the situation.

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

Bass - mostly I agree. The ch

Bass - mostly I agree. The church does have lots of problems it needs to correct. The world is a better place with a healthy catholic church.

Except Riled One was casting blame on the whole church. That is why I defended the church - not this priest.

Riled, I think, gets a little

Riled, I think, gets a little over zelous. I belive his view is that the Church dosent recognize the problems. But nobody is perfect, not even I, ( by a long shot). The Church is made up of people, and by defination, cannot be perfect. But they should strive for this ultimate goal. 

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

over zelous

Spot on Bassndude.

Riled knows this

Any Catholic who thinks they don't know people who were abused is kidding themself.

And Certainly the silence of ALL priests for many years is damning.  Maybe they needed guidance in forming principles, huh?

Who'da thunk ALL these grown men needed to be instructed in something so simple?

That's all.

Don't lie

Do some math RO - Most catholics were not abused. I know lots that weren't. I'm now tired of going in circles with you. Maybe you are too. Have a good afternoon.

Florida, you are indeed corre

Florida, you are indeed correct.  I too don't know any Catholics that were abused.

The funniest think about RO is that he'll sit here and generalize about Catholics, yet I'd be willing to bet if you were to do the same thing to his denomination he'd call you a bigot.

The Newsbusters show their true colors subtly but clearly.  

RO is an ex-catholic. That is

RO is an ex-catholic. That is the reason for all his anger.

I'm not Catholic, but I have

I'm not Catholic, but I have no problem with Catholicism. 

I just find it funny that on the NB it's nobody complains when a poster attacks Catholicism, but attack conservative christianity in any form and the wolves come out in force.

I just don't get it.

I just don't get it.You said

I just don't get it.

You said a mouthful there about yourself Leon.

LOL!

"I just don't get it.&

"I just don't get it."

The story of your life Leon.

"There are two types of people in this country; those who provide freedom and those who enjoy it." MM says...

Another ignorant statement, Leon

Another ignorant statement, Leon.  Your liberal assumptions continue to make you look foolish.   ALL forms of religion have been heavily debated here, and Consevative Christianity has been a long, long way from getting a pass.  

General of Generalizations

I just find it funny that on the NB it's nobody complains when a poster attacks Catholicism...

See my response to riled Leon.  Now what were you saying about generaliztions?

Leon, I am not Catholic, but

Leon, I am not Catholic, but have often come to their defense.

Just be aware of Leon's new Trolling Tactic

Just be aware that Leon's new Trolling tactic, is to attempt to get NB posters arguing...."let's you and him fight."  

He's tried that with several posters today....it's pretty transparent.

Seems to be working too....Go

Seems to be working too....

Good ol' Leon.

Busy little bee.

OK, chad

Are you saying you know none who were?

YES and I live in the Northea

YES and I live in the Northeast, in fact, most of my coworkers and friends are Catholic.

Not A ONE.

OK

OK you're right, Leon.  But chad's still thinking how he'll answer.

Gore lied. Nobody fried

In my experience, I'm correct

In my experience, I'm correct, which makes your ignorant, blanket generalization completely false.

Leon

And thank you for stepping in for chad who couldn't answer in the negative.

I used to love tag team wrestling on TVwhen I was a kid.  It was so real.

None that I am aware of. Were

None that I am aware of.

Were you abused by a Priest? One of your family members or friends?

Yeah, one of those

I do know someone who still has problems 40 years later.  He says he doesn't blame himself, but I can remember the personality change he went through.

It wasn't an ignorant stateme

It wasn't an ignorant statement. It was a caring, heartfelt question. Why do you assume otherwise? I am sorry for the suffering that you friend went through and continues to go through. It helps to explain your hostility toward the church.

BTW - I am not sitting here trying to respond to you negatively, as you suggested to Leon. I am honest with you and assume you are with me and other posters. You don't like the church that I am a member of. Now I have some more understanding why. It doesn't make you correct about the church, or me. When you examine the numbers, the % of people abused by priest is no where as large as you assume. Because you know someone who is hurting, it is affecting your judgment, IMHO.

Thanks, chad

It is one of the issues that have formed my opinion.

But you haven't addressed the issue that an overwhelming majority of priests kept their mouths shut while their parishoners were being molested.  This had to come from the top.

Think about it, if you were a priest, could you have kept quiet even if you were ordered to do so?  I hope not.

Shoots holes in the theory that the priest in the article is a rogue, doesn't it?

I don't know that it does. Lo

I don't know that it does. Look - it was wrong and not handled well then or now by the church. But priests can say and do things that the church may not like, but it isn't enough to get them fired. That is what I think about this priest in the article.

The abuse scandle was different, I believe there were oders from above to keep quiet. But I also do not think it is as widespread as you believe. The numbers bears this out. When you look at the number of priest vs those that were molisters, then % is very low. Cpmarable to the % in society. But let me say again, clearly, they were wrong then and now. They should all be in jail. It was more a case of CYA than protecting the church.

Lets not keep going over this point again and again. I think you and I have made progress today.

Church-warfare

I did - see above.....

I'm not picking on you riled.... I haven't seen you post anything negative about the Catholic Church prior to today.

This comment is meant for those of all faiths who seek to divide, evidently totally impervious to Christ's teaching "that they may be one Father, as You and I are One" just hours before the "world" took him out beat Him mercilessly, humiliated Him and nailed Him to a cross.  I think all Christians owe Christ at least their silent obedience if they can't muster up enough courage for brotherly love.  This church-warfare crap is just sooooo irrelevant to this site and if Christians are divided they make such a nice target for the real enemy.

Riled knows this

Any Catholic who thinks they don't know people who were abused is kidding themself.

And Certainly the silence of ALL priests for many years is damning.  Maybe they needed guidance in forming principles, huh?

Who'da thunk ALL these grown men needed to be instructed in something so simple?

That's all.

That's enough

Any Catholic who thinks they don't know people who were abused is kidding themself.

I enjoy a good kidding of myself as much as the next Catholic but I must "confess"...I seriously don't personally know anyone that was abused.  Does that make me a bad Catholic?  If not, as a good Catholic, I'm down for some MORE guilt if that will make others feel better but this situation at NB is getting out of control.

And Certainly the silence of ALL priests for many years is damning.

Indeed.  I'm sure that was the hot topic at dinner time by ALL priests.  So how is your perverted affair with young Tommy going Fr. Perv?   Just Dandy Fr. Bill, still not interested in a trinitysome?.  No thanks Fr. Perv, I'm much too busy trying to figure out how to encourage ALL parishoners to break their silence because one or two Catholic laypeople have been accused of pedophilia and surely ALL parishoners MUST know.

Who'da thunk ALL these grown men needed to be instructed in something so simple?

Yes, I'm confident that if the Church had only instructed the pedophiles looking for easy prey had received just a bit more education on the evils of boy sex....

Similar to the model offered by the Protestant Church instructing ALL of their ministers on the evils of drug use, extra-marital affairs, same-sex sex, yes even pedophilia, etc., etc.  Yeah, that seems to have worked out equally well.  And don't even start with the it's-more-prevalent-in-the-Catholic-Church argument.  As the largest Christian Church on the planet that lame arguement can only deserve a 'duh' response.  Oh yeah, and don't get me started on those #$*&%^ Jews and Jehovah's Witnesses and Moonies and ......

That's all.

That's enough.

When we going to stop this ridiculous my-Church-is-better-than-your-Church nonsense on NB?  I've been observing this crap for the last month or so and it's starting to get a bit old.  How in the hell do you expect the demedia to take this site seriously and maybe make some positive changes when they read this kind of childish tripe?  Save the Catholic bashing for the demedia....not to worry - they have that topic more than adequately covered for you.

Acumen is right - we probably

Acumen is right - we probably all have more in common that differences. We should concentrate on the common areas.

Exactly...we need to see each

Exactly...we need to see each other as fellow Americans. We absolutely have more things in common.

Acumen, you hit the nail on the head...the My Church is Better than Yours crap is getting us no where but division.

End of Story?

Wouldn't that be a refreshing change F_C.  I'm thinking there just might currently be a war with some REAL supposedly religious freaks going on who must truly be getting off with this my-Christ-is-better-than-your-Christ bickering between the "infidels".

Man I hope this is the end of this story on NB.....

I am thinking I am going to t

I am thinking I am going to try real hard to avoid these discusions in the future. Rarely does any good come from them. You have inspired me - thanks

It would be a lot nicer to ju

It would be a lot nicer to just discuss politics. A real religious war could be on the horizon.

I Second that.

acumen...

I Second that.

I tried to post that right after your first post about this subject....

My site disappeared for a few minutes....just wanted you to know.

Thanks....you said it all along with CV and others.

consider this biblical application ?

The Catholic Church is rightly compared to Peter's Bark, and the apostles became "fishers of men." Just to put it in perspective for you.

Recall Jesus has gone into Peter's boat: "And they put out to sea. But as they were sailing He fell asleep. And a squall swept down upon the lake and they were filling and they were in peril. So they came and woke Him saying, Master ! We are perishing !

Then He arose and rebuked the wind and the raging of the water; and they ceased, and there came a calm. And He said to them, "Where is your faith ?" But they were afraid, and marvelled, saying to one another, "Who, then, is this, that He commands even the winds and the sea, and they obey Him ?" (Luke 8 :22-25.)

The bark of Peter is the Catholic Church. The sea is SIN (Jesus walks on it) and the storm at sea is all those trials and tribulations His Church will pass through --over 2,000 years and counting-- and He is always with her. He sleeps quietly. But no one's in danger who keeps the faith.

-- FAITH is what overcomes, faith in Jesus. Not faith in men. Yet only one boat is crossing over the this world's sins and arriving one day. Peter's Bark. Every storm will bring doom on the world. But not on the Church he protects and saves.

Tumbler, what is "peter'

Tumbler, what is "peter's bark"? Didn't sound like a Bible word. Is this Peter's arguing with Jesus or Peter's skin. And since you quoted some Bible verses, here's one about debunking celibacy (not the verse explained by the cathechism teacher)...

1 Tim 3:1-5.  This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.  A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach; Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous; One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity; For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?

Well, i do think that in lots

Well, i do think that in lots of cases concerning priests in the Catholic Church, they are doing a disservice to their parish and their church. This is where alot of the Catholic Church incurs much of its reputation. With the little boys, priests keeping nuns and this priest preaching treason and telling these people its ok because he is a priest and God said it was ok. There are problems with this and untill it is dealt with, the Church will continue limp along with a tarnished image. I am not saying that all priests are this way. But you know, "one bad apple"...Jesus did not tolerate this type of behaviour in His Fathers house. And neither should the Catholics.

Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!

I must agree with RO.  I th

I must agree with RO.  I think the Catholic Church has done a ton of covering up.  I do not think all Catholics are bad, nor do I think RO thinks that.  I also do not think all priests are bad, nor do I think RO thinks that.  However,the catholic church has a very long history of abuse.  The Nuns, Orphans, not allowing people to read the Bible, lying to people in the church about what the Bible says.  It is amazing, my father in law did not know that there is no spot in the Bible that corroborates the Catholic view that Mary never died or that she never had sex.  It is a shame that the church elevates Mary to godhood, if she was here, they would see how sad that made her.  It is aweful that the church, instead of deal with pedophile priests, moved them from place to place.  In no place does the Bible say you must confess your sins to a priest or elder, it says confess your sins one to another.  The guilt that is layed upon people of the Catholic church is horrendous.  You may not think that you do not know anyone who was abused by the curch, but set aside sexual abuse, what about physical abuse by insane nuns in the private schools.  Their abuse of students goes on even today.  I respect that they are one of the only churches who have held strong against abortion and homosexuality, but I really can not say they have produced much good in the church.  Many Catholics do not know God, many Catholics are not Christian.  To be a Christian you must love Christ, and in John it says Jesus is the word, how many Catholics love Christ so much that they spend time reading His word?  I know many babtists, lutherans, protestants....they do not either, it is very sad.  I hear so many self-proclaimed-Christians say reading the Bible is boring, sorry, but the Bible is Christ, it is the word of God, if you love someone you want to be around them, you want to do what they say you should do, you want to know what they say....

Full disclosure: I was raised Episcopal, change to a non-denominational church, and now I go to a pentacostal type church.  I refuse to go to a Catholic Church because they add to the word, to a Lutheran church because they had to have a conferance on weather or not homosexuality is ok, an episcopal church because they only want people to be comfortable, and a baptist church (not southern, I don't know anything about southern baptist) because it is so immersed in guilt.

I am sorry if this is offensive to anyone, I hope you understand that I do not think the people of these churches are bad, it is the institution of the church that needs work.  I have been to examples of each church that are great, but I can not commit myself to them because they are still ruled by the institution.

Amber, maybe you haven't been

Amber, maybe you haven't been to an Independent/Autonomus, Fundamental church where institution doesn't rule the church. It's the Word of God that rules and govern the people of God and its Pastor is the overseer, and the Bishop. Try to locate it in the yellow pages under independent- fundamental and you'll find the church that was and is still being built by Christ.

Yea, even the music is Christ-centered, old fashioned Biblical hymns where music was written to honor and to glorify Him, and not the feelings of the song-writer.  

are you sure you do not have another---

are you sure you do not have another---login on this blog? You sound quite a bit like another lady. I am the last person I thought would defend the Catholic faith---

but:

The Nuns, Orphans, not allowing people to read the Bible--No one ever stopped me and we had a bible in our home. Pls explain how Orphans can stop me from reading the bible?

It is a shame that the church elevates Mary to godhood, -- Mary was honored in my church and school as the Mother of God--not as God

It is aweful that the church, instead of deal with pedophile priests, moved them from place to place.---  Absolutely, 100 % agree. So the church did it? How about --it is absolutely awful that some Bishops of the church covered up the sins of SOME priests? Or would you like to voice that the Pope wascomplicit?

what about physical abuse by insane nuns in the private schools.  We tore out their fingernails and made them go naked into the world--you must be kidding me , right. Of course I caught tha ruler when I acted up. Why not?

I really can not say they have produced much good in the church.  Well , that's what makes a horserace. They produced me--want to go into that one?

 Many Catholics do not know God, --  Right, we never brought him up in any of our conversations--He was locked behind the altar with the Bible I was not allowed to read. BTW It's the Douay version--OMG!!!

how many Catholics love Christ so much that they spend time reading His word?   -- I don't know, but I bet you think that none of us do!

Full disclosure--I was baptized and raised a Catholic. My children were also baptized in the Catholic church. I joined a Methodist church for 4 years. There were no Catholic churches close by. I will attend services in any Christian church. I am always comforted in the house of Christ. I respect all Christian religions and others that are not Christian. So I guess I am a bad guy and you are a good girl. How about I sit here and say some nasty things about Pentecostal. I can't, I do not suffer the illness of intolerance that you do. Also, my barber is a Pentecostal minister and has asked me to write a poem for him to read and use. I dare say Rev.Marty would not be happy with your rant.

PS - I cannot believe I am sitting here and arguing religion--I hate that--I guess I hate reading someone's post that denigrates my religion, even more, even when there are some valid points. I wish I lived in your perfect world.

Misterbill,I am shocked, shoc

Misterbill,

I am shocked, shocked i tell you to find that you would be posting on religion.  (You forgot to mention Luke 9: 54-56)

Gotta love Bogart movies

Supreme Court,  National Security,  Borders,  Fiscal Restraint, my litmus test for President.   

botg--yeah--you know--

botg--yeah--you know--even a guy like me who is at peace with all religions except extremism gets a little pissed off when his religion keeps getting put down by people who do not know what they are saying.

The only Luke I usually talk about is "Cool Hand Luke" and I have never forgiven Hollywood for not giving the Academy award to Paul Newman.

misterbill,I am truly discour

misterbill,

I am truly discouraged by all of the bashing going on over religion.

First it was bash the Mormons, now bash the Catholics.

Of course, each of us will defend our faiths.  As I've said before, these beliefs are not "moveable".  So to continue to bash and bash is just a waste of bandwidth....and is hurtful, as well.

I refuse to take part in this, other than to point out that it is pointless. 

Blonde-- please trust me--I did not want to do it.

Blonde-- please trust me--I did not want to do it. I felt to sit idly by reading all the putdowns, on the one hand and overzealous defenses on the other was too much.

Please folks, all pay honor to Jesus in your own way. I will respect it. Please reciprocate and let's talk about current events.

misterbill,I didn't mean to i