In Writing: Under ObamaCare, If You Don't Buy Health Insurance, You Could Go To Jail

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chicago-mls-jailThursday afternoon, at its Live Pulse Blog ("Breaking News on the Health Care Fight"), Politico's Carrie Burdoff Brown reported the following:

Flout the mandate penalty? Face the IRS

Americans who fail to pay the penalty for not buying insurance would face legal action from the Internal Revenue Service, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation.

The remarks Thursday from the committee's chief of staff, Thomas Barthold, seems to further weaken President Barack Obama's contention last week that the individual mandate penalty, which could go as high as $1,900, is not a tax increase.

Under questioning from Sen. John Ensign (R-Nev.), Barthold said the IRS would "take you to court and undertake normal collection proceedings."

Ensign pursued the line of questioning because he said a lot of Americans don't believe the Constitution allows the government to mandate the purchase of insurance.

Friday, Brown reported that Ensign got a clarification on what the result of "normal collection proceedings" might be, and got it in writing (HT Hot Air):

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Sen. John Ensign (R-Nev.) received a handwritten note Thursday from Joint Committee on Taxation Chief of Staff Tom Barthold confirming the penalty for failing to pay the up to $1,900 fee for not buying health insurance.

Violators could be charged with a misdemeanor and could face up to a year in jail or a $25,000 penalty, Barthold wrote on JCT letterhead. He signed it "Sincerely, Thomas A. Barthold."

What follows is a picture of Barthold's actual note. The original at Politico is here. The content is unchanged; I removed some empty space and adjusted the graphic's properties to make the text more readable (and to have something in case Politico takes the original down):

 

NoHealthInsGoTojailCongAide0909

The postscript in Barthold's note is not in the text of Politico's report. Though it's not particularly legible, it says that "Felony tax evasion provides for restitution and a fine of up to $100,000 for an individual and up to five years in jail."

Tax?

B-b-b-but Barack Obama told ABC "This Week" host George Stephanopoulos on Sunday that that these fines aren't taxes, and even ridiculed him for looking up the definition of the word in the dictionary (bolds are mine):

STEPHANOPOULOS: ...during the campaign. Under this mandate, the government is forcing people to spend money, fining you if you don't. How is that not a tax?

.... OBAMA: No. That's not true, George. The -- for us to say that you've got to take a responsibility to get health insurance is absolutely not a tax increase. What it's saying is, is that we're not going to have other people carrying your burdens for you anymore than the fact that right now everybody in America, just about, has to get auto insurance. Nobody considers that a tax increase.

People say to themselves, that is a fair way to make sure that if you hit my car, that I'm not covering all the costs.

STEPHANOPOULOS: But it may be fair, it may be good public policy...

OBAMA: No, but -- but, George, you -- you can't just make up that language and decide that that's called a tax increase. Any...

.... STEPHANOPOULOS: I -- I don't think I'm making it up. Merriam Webster's Dictionary: Tax -- "a charge, usually of money, imposed by authority on persons or property for public purposes."

OBAMA: George, the fact that you looked up Merriam's Dictionary, the definition of tax increase, indicates to me that you're stretching a little bit right now. Otherwise, you wouldn't have gone to the dictionary to check on the definition. I mean what...

.... STEPHANOPOULOS: I wanted to check for myself. But your critics say it is a tax increase.

OBAMA: My critics say everything is a tax increase. My critics say that I'm taking over every sector of the economy. You know that.

Look, we can have a legitimate debate about whether or not we're going to have an individual mandate or not, but...

STEPHANOPOULOS: But you reject that it's a tax increase?

OBAMA: I absolutely reject that notion.

Tom Barthold must not have gotten the memo (or is it diktat?).

If you don't think we have a problem of Orwellian proportions with Barack Obama, I'd suggest you re-read the excerpt. He thinks he's above the dictionary, that words mean only what he says they mean.

In case you're wondering, I have found no evidence that the establishment media has noted the Ensign-Barthold development. The only inkling of interest in Google News searches here and here on "Ensign Barthold jail" (not entered with quotes; one link is to the original result, and the other is to the detail of "all 7 news articles" link at the original) is one Atlanta Journal Constitution item. But it turns out that it's an off-topic blog comment and not any kind of reporting.

Meanwhile, the New York Times Prescriptions blog wonders whether or not the fines for not buying health insurance are set high enough.

(Image found at sodahead.com.) 

Cross-posted at BizzyBlog.com.

—Tom Blumer is president of a training and development company in Mason, Ohio, and is a contributing editor to NewsBusters


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I tell you what

He has definitely mastered the political 'say one thing, do another' con.

 

 

It's called

The Obama shuck and jive. Formerly used only by drug dealers and street hustlers. Everybody knows it's nothing but lies, but they like the rhythm anyway.

You don't see it done very often with teleprompter beat though.

California is already making

California is already making room for non-complying Americans since mandatory Obamacare charges won't apply to illegals.

Hmm...

Go to jail and get the best medical care taxpayer money can buy?

Fine/Jail Time. Ensign

Fine/Jail Time.

Ensign got that Signed, Sealed, Delivered.

Baby it's Ours.

This had better be put to the use it can be all over the place...and I mean all over the place....this will make even the leftist have to discuss amoung themselves in the bar rooms, coffee shops etc across this land...

Of course we all know what the SRM will do...but the internet, radio and other outlets aren't going to suppress this, the only ones that really could put a slow halt on this are the Big-Wigs on the 'R' side of the aisle...

I truly hope they see what a perfect opportunity this is.

'Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea'~Breitbart

Tyranny

We live in very dangerous times. The marxists (aka democrats) are playing fast and loose with the constitution. If either Obamacare passes and/or Cap and Tax passes I refuse to particapate. I will not not submit insurance info to the IRS. I will not pay their penalties. I believe these government actions to be unconstitutional. I will fight. I believe there are enough like minded people that still believe in liberty and freedom. This country is on the verge of civil war.

King George

I think King George has been re-incarnated.

 

He has already failed... his country.

You are likely right that

You are likely right that this would be unconstitutional. The reason is - pay close attention - that the federal government has no jurisdiction over intrastate commerce. If they allow insurance companies to operate across state lines, then they might have an argument that they can be involved. In effect, if you pay a doctor to provide services within your state, it is considered intrastate. If you go to a neighboring state, it could be interpreted to be interstate, and the feds have some control over this. Wyoming is going through something now where they are challenging the feds ability to get gun registration information from owners from Wyoming who purchased guns produced in Wyoming.

The only sticking point I see is that bad little 16th Amendment. But if that is brought up, the feds will have to admit that this is a tax.

Only two forms of government? Find out why... http://www.flixxy.co...

Go to Jail....

Get free medical care.  Just ask Susan Atkins (Manson fame) She just died of brain cancer after a 4 year fight and 3.1 MILLION DOLLARS of tax money being spent to try to save her WORTHLESS A$$!!!

Gecks

"Your right to Life, Liberty, and the Persuit of Happiness ends at my front door, and my wallet!"-Me!

Hell...

 I've been there before and I'm willing to do it again for a good cause...

I wonder what that Harsh Penalty will be

"To force people to get health insurance, you've got to have a very harsh penalty."
Barack Obama
2008 Presidential Debate

"Individuals will be required to carry basic health insurance -- just as most states require you to carry auto insurance."
Barack Obama
Health Care Speech
September 9, 2009

Barry has no idea what auto

Barry has no idea what auto insurance is all about. First, if you don't own a car, you don't have to purchase insurance. Second, you never have to buy collision -- if you own your car outright. The mandatory part of auto insurance is liability -- for others! So that your insurance pays the hospital bills of someone else you might injure.

I see no relationship between health insurance and auto insurance. I wonder why Barry is so stupid? 

___________________________________ 

"Tax the rich" is a basically unstable way of governing - The NYT

Because he's

never lived in the real world, TnT.  He has no concept of what auto insurance is.  And he has no concept of what health insurance is, other than a vehicle to insure his second term, after the immigation amnesty they need to sneak through congress. 

 

Liberal 'Cognitive Dissonance' is a Serious Mental Disorder

'Cognitive Dissonance' is a 'Serious Mental Disorder' that holds two or more diametrically opposed views of 'Reality' as the 'Singularity of Reality'.

ObamaCare proposes that life lengthening care for seniors, the seriously handicapped or those suffering from Cancer or other serious illnesses, is simply to expensive for someone who MAY no longer make a 'Positive Contribution' to society - which is unproven.

Then the Liberal 'Cognitive Dissonance'.

Liberals stand steadfast on their opposition to the 'Death Penalty' of those who have 'Proven' that they have NOT made a 'Positive Contribution' to society.

Liberals INSIST that that we house, feed, clothe, provide cable TV, internet access and provide medical care for serial killers, murderers, rapists and the very 'Dregs' of Society residing on 'Death Row'.

Why??

Liberals 'Insist' that those who have been judged 'Guilty' by law and a jury of their peers, may someday make a 'Positive Contribution' to society and may NOT be guilty - therefore ANY COST is reasonable.

Liberals then 'Insist' that those who are NOT guilty of anything but being Elderly, Handicapped or Seriously Ill, have proven beyond a 'Shadow of a Doubt' that they WILL NOT make a 'Positive Contribution' to society and ANY COST is unreasonable.

Under the definition that

Under the definition that one must provide a "positive contribution" -- I think Jimmy Carter might be ready for the 'ol liberal dustbin.

___________________________________ 

"Tax the rich" is a basically unstable way of governing - The NYT

 god like

 What a brilliant point....President Jesus is beyond  narcissistic...he's godlike... 

  "He thinks he's above the dictionary, that words mean only what he says they mean."

We gotta find a new planet...

If the IRS enforces it...it's a $&#$@ TAX!

This has got to be the thing that finally sinks Obama AND Obamacare.

Folks are starting to realize that it'll affect THEM...with a $1,000-$3,000 TAX increase enforced by the IRS with PRISON TIME.

And what's it going to get them? Rationing, waiting lists, treatments denied merely to save money and substandard, bureaucratic 'service'.

These are the same folks Obama told 'Your taxes are not going up one dime. Not your income tax, etc. etc. Not one dime.'

SUCKERS.

Nationalized Healthcare is a DEATH SENTENCE.

Democratic Senator Robert K Byrd is a recruiter and leader in the KU KLUX KLAN-a white supremacist group. Where in the HELL do Dems get off lecturing ANYONE on racism?

$1900 is not one dime. It

$1900 is not one dime. It is 19000 dimes.

"Damn, someone needs to go back and get a sh1tload of dimes." Mr Taggert, Blazing Saddles

Only two forms of government? Find out why... http://www.flixxy.co...

Sat. Morn. Smile

 

Barack Obama wanted to experience life as the Native Americans once did and asked Tonto to take him camping.  Tonto agreed and the two me men went camping in the desert.  After they got a camp site selected and their tent all set up, both men fell sound asleep.

Some hours later, Tonto woke the president and said,

"Kemo bro, look towards sky, what you see?"

Obama replied, "I see millions of stars."

 "What that tell you?" asked Tonto.

Obama pondered for a minute t hen said,

"Astronomically speaking, it tells me there are millions of galaxies and potentially billions of planets.

Astrologically, it tells me that Saturn is in Leo.

Chronologically, it appears to be approximately a quarter past three in the morning.

Theologically, there is a Higer Power and we are small and insignificant.

Meteorologically it seems we will have a beautiful day tomorrow. “

What's' it tell you, Tonto?"

Tonto says, "Obama, you dumber than buffalo shit. It means somebody stole our tent."

If an unborn child cannot trust you, why should I,?? 

Yeah. this policy makes a

Yeah. this policy makes a lot of sense.  They can't even get murderers behind bars but they want to arrest someone for failure to buy into Obama's BS. 

OK, I'll bite.  Hey Obama...I suggest you do the enforcing.  Better yet, I want your volunteer brown shirts to do it.  I will guarantee you that this will get interesting if that happens.  Or frankly, if anyone tries to enforce it.  Please, try. 

I made this postcard

I made this postcard yesterday. I guess we should somehow be surprised that the Dems would want to take it to this level, but when you heard that it would be the IRS that would monitor this whole thing, didn't it seem obvious then, that enforcement would be a necessary part of the equation? After all, how can the government exert total control without the threat of total control?

Bkeyser, That is neat,

Bkeyser,

That is neat, but awhile ago I saw a health logo with the  german  swatchsticker (cant spell that) in it,  Put that one in instead of the one you have.  :)

This is gotcha moment for

This is gotcha moment for alot of unisured because, like my other half, cannot get insurance because of a pre existing condition. Thats what has to change here. 

Better start building some more jails then, and I will just get free food, tv, internet and health care while I'm in there. 

 Put that in your pipe and smoke it BOZO

This won't sit well with Obama's freeloaders.

They expected Obama to provide government-run healthcare for FREE.

Of course, the poorest among us will receive subsidies, yada, yada...

But there will be millions who voted for this lying POS who wake up and say, 'Wait a minute...I have to PAY for it'?

But the worst is yet to come.

Right now Obamacare would be able to keep premiums low and services high by underpaying providers (exactly like Medicare) and forcing them to pad private insurance to make up the shortfalls.

With Obama's new nationwide Medicare, plus prohibitions on writing new policies, plus added taxes and regulations on insurers and employers, private insurers will run out of policyholders and money and very rapidly go bankrupt.

 "...which is the way he wants it".

Then watch taxes (yes, Obama, they're taxes) go through the roof and service go down the toilet.

Nationalized Healthcare is a DEATH SENTENCE.

Democratic Senator Robert K Byrd is a recruiter and leader in the KU KLUX KLAN-a white supremacist group. Where in the HELL do Dems get off lecturing ANYONE on racism?

calculus of failure, or maybe revolution?

OK, so let's say that people resist this tax. Let's say 50,000 people just say NO.

And let's say they get fined and don't pay.

And let's say they get convicted and imprisoned.

I think it costs somewhere around $50,000 per year per prisioner. (That's my recollection; I welcome anyone correcting that number.)

Total cost for imprisionment of this population: 2,500,000,000.00

Less the wages they would have been earning and putting into the consumer economy.

Less the taxes they would have been paying.

PLUS, if they need medical care while imprisoned, add those costs to the system costs.

PLUS all the pissed-off families who would be expressing their anger in various ways...

I don't see how the Dems can honestly think this is a win.

 

@Kangaroo: Ha! Your post came in while I was composing - I think a lot of people are going to see this flaw!

Re Revolution

Some think that if the Bamster is successful in changing our country to the extent that he hopes, we are headed for a tax revolt. If twenty million people refuse to pay outrageous taxes, what will the gummint do?

Re this fine, what about people that don't submit a tax return? At present there is a threshold of income below which you don't have to send in the forms. If you are mostly living on savings with a bit of income or cap gains, will you now have to do the forms? Will young folks in college with little income now have to do their taxes? What if they don't? How will they be detected? What will this do to IRS workload? More growth for government unions? Who'da think that could happen?

The Situtation in Massachusetts

Massachusetts began its mandatory health insurance coverage in 2006. Here's what's happened last year.

Penalties for Massachusetts residents who can afford health insurance but do not purchase it in 2008 could quadruple compared with the maximum penalty in 2007, according to draft regulations released by the Department of Revenue yesterday. The maximum penalty for those who flout the law and do not buy health insurance would be $912 a year, compared to $219 in 2007.

In a statement explaining the penalties, the revenue department said, "These penalties apply only to adults who are deemed able to afford health insurance." Residents who cannot afford insurance, based on state standards, won't be penalized.

From each according to his ability .... To each according to his needs. That's the definition of socialism. That's the reality of Massachussetts. This is what Barry wants to bring to everyone. "Spreading the Wealth" is what I think he said to Joe the Plumber.

___________________________________ 

"mmm, mmm, mm. Barrack-Hussain-Obama." - The liberals cool-aid drinking song

Massachusetts had a big problem with people....

 ...waiting until they needed health care before signing up.

Enforcement of this 'penalty' is going to be about as popular as Prohibition.

Nationalized Healthcare is a DEATH SENTENCE.

Democratic Senator Robert K Byrd is a recruiter and leader in the KU KLUX KLAN-a white supremacist group. Where in the HELL do Dems get off lecturing ANYONE on racism?

Mess with the PTB and

Mess with the PTB and you're going to jail.  Deal some drugs, rape and/or kill somebody and they'll feel sorry for you.

Read Solzhenitsyn's Gulag Archipelago.  The real criminals and the ones who were treated the worst and did the longest time were political offenders...not common thieves.

One of the 34% who thinks George W. Bush was a great President. One of the 86% who wants to bring back the stock and pillory.

The vehicle insurance

The vehicle insurance argument fails entirely given that no one is forced to own a vehicle.

I am independantly employed and I chose not to carry health insurance for myself. I have been to the doctor office once in four years and I simply paid out of pocket. So my health care cost in four years is about $55. Dems tell me I am not paying enough and under thier plan I must pay more regardless of my needs and certainly desires. That sounds an awful lot like a tax.

sounds a lot more like tyranny

I also am not involved in health care. Modern medicine conflicts with my religious beliefs.  

I think in the past 20 years, I've bought 2 bottles of asprin. My father-in-law was once concerned about a cough I had, and to soothe his agitation, I went to the doctor. I dumped the prescription down the toilet and continued with my vitamins and meditation. Three days later my father-in-law was happy that I was better. I never told him his quack-pot doctor had nothing to do with it.

I say, leave me and my health care to me and my Creator, and all the natural remedies He provided on this planet.

How I live and how I die are between me and God, not the government and their doctors.

Pass the FairTax and the IRS is toast

-Dave

I agree with Rush. It's time for Obama to resign.

I hope the dims are just this stupid, actually

Because it's going to mean the next D.C. Tea Party will include pitchforks and torches.

-Dave

I agree with Rush. It's time for Obama to resign.

So much for Seperation of power

One of the commentators at Politico.com brings up a valid point, that the IRS will fine you for not paying a fee.  Excuse me, but isn't that the responsibility of the Judicial system?  To punish someone for failing to pay a legally required or imposed fee is what the Courts do, not the IRS!  So the Democrats want to give the IRS the authority of the Judicial branch of government?   When did THAT become Constitutional?

The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.
The US Constitution

Unless you're a fetus.
The US Supreme Court

The IRS already does this. 

The IRS already does this.  Try not paying your taxes on time.  You will be fined and charged interest by the IRS.  A "Tax" court has jurisdiction over this, not a court of common pleas.    I think this is the reason the Congress wants to place administration of the Heltchcare "tax" under the IRS.  The IRS is already familiar with the arrt of extortion and shakedown.

A new game...Obamanopoly

You only go to jail if you are a conservative or working...probably the same thing.

http://www.framingthedialogue.com/archives/update-obamagear/

How about it George?

 Are you wishing you had some of Joe Wilson's courage?