Katherine Kersten, that rare bird – a conservative columnist at the uber-blue Minneapolis Star Tribune – reported that while Minnesota Democrats endorsed that Harvard-smart Senate candidate Al Franken after he expressed regret for all the comic mileage he’s gotten out of rape and his "penchant for the pornographic," he did not apologize for his most offensive material aimed at religious believers, and Christians in particular. The press hasn’t noticed:
Why hasn't this been aired in public? We in the press are too busy searching through Sarah Palin's junior high yearbooks and tracking down the filing dates of Joe the Plumber's tax returns.
Meanwhile, Franken gets a pass for making a joke of the life and death of Jesus Christ.
Franken finds Christ's crucifixion to be a barrel of laughs. For example, in his 1999 book, "Why Not Me?" he wrote about his discovery -- as a fictional former president -- of "the complete skeleton of Jesus Christ still nailed to the cross" during an archeological dig. At the Franken Presidential Library gift shop, visitors can buy "small pieces of Jesus' skeleton."
"We would like to display Jesus' skeleton at some future point," Franken went on. "It's merely a matter of designing and building an exhibition space ... . Until then he's very comfortable in a box down in our basement near the geothermal power station."
Very funny. Anybody want to try a joke like that about Mohammed?
Franken also wrote a Saturday Night Live monologue for Jesus Christ that appeared in a magazine. After poking fun at Christians' belief that Jesus was both God and man, he had Christ speculate on having the hots for Mary Magdalene:
"If Mary Magdalene looked like Barbara Hershey, I might have thought twice about this celibacy thing. I mean, the real Mary Magdalene was about four foot two, 135 pounds. And with bad teeth yet."
In Franken's world, God has a mouth as foul as Franken's. In one book, he has God refer to books about liberal media bias as "total bullshit." Later, he describes God as having his head "up his ass."
But Franken saves his sharpest barbs for those weirdos, Catholics.
In 2006, he and a guest on his Air America radio show joked about Eucharistic communion wafers -- sacred to Catholics as the body of Christ -- and compared them to chips and guacamole. In "Dog Confessional," a proposed sketch for Saturday Night Live, Franken depicted "a series of dogs, played by cast members, confessing to a priest," according to the Washington Post. NBC refused to air it.
In another book, Franken described greeting a New York audience with the words, "Isn't Cardinal O'Connor an asshole?"
Franken's campaign did not return a phone call seeking comment.
If a 12-year-old kid spouted this stuff in a schoolyard, he'd be hauled to the principal's office and told to grow up. But in today's surreal political climate, a guy who lobs insults like these has a shot at one the highest political offices in the land.
We're used to slanderers of Christianity getting government arts grants. But Franken wants more. He's asking us to send him to what's been called "the most exclusive club in the world" -- and to serve us there until 2014.
Since Kersten only has so much space, she left a few examples lying around. MRC's Brent Bozell noticed some other ones in Franken's Lying Liars book in 2003:
The most visible example of tastelessness is the comic strip that runs from pages 313 to 323: “The Gospel of Supply-Side Jesus.” Franken’s fictional preacher explains to the masses in Israel that “the only way gain entrance to God’s kingdom” is to “become a Supply Side Jesus Pioneer and have access to me at our annual Yom Kippur ‘Break the Fast’ Dinner.” So there’s shades of Bush in this ersatz savior, and he’s about to be betrayed by an apostle “with a gambling debt,” which brings us to a caricature of “William Bennett Iscariot.”
If you didn’t like that example, there’s always Franken’s trip to Bob Jones University with a fake son (his real one wouldn’t play the gag) to try and trip up the wacky Christians and suggest that maybe they could bend their wacky rules for some major donations. Their college guide wouldn’t bend from his “path to Christ.” Franken summed up: “A good honest day’s work done, lying to God-fearing people. We’d sleep well tonight.”
This Franken clearly isn't just playing the prankster. He's displaying a real loathing. But that hardly puts him far from the liberal "mainstream."
It's amazing that journalists badly disguised as Democratic operatives (like Time's Amy Sullivan), who so energetically promote the preposterous idea that the the Party of Abortion and 'Gay Marriage' goes together with devout Christians like chips and salsa, aren't forced to stare material like this in the face.
—Tim Graham is Director of Media Analysis at the Media Research Center.
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Off Topic...Important Please read and pass on
October 22, 2008 - 07:01 ET by sjanus11Dear Friends:
My name is Joe Porter. I live in Champaign, Illinois. I’m 46 years old, a born-again Christian, a husband, a father, a small business owner, a veteran, and a homeowner. I don’t consider myself to be either conservative or liberal, and I vote for the person, not Republican or Democrat. I don’t believe there are ‘two Americas’ but that every person in this country can be whomever and whatever they want to be if they’ll just work to get there and nowhere else on earth can they find such opportunities. I believe our government should help those who are legitimately downtrodden, and should always put the interests of America first.
The purpose of this message is that I’m concerned about the future of this great nation. I’m worried that the silent majority of honest, hard-working, tax-paying people in this country have been passive for too long. Most folks I know choose not to involve themselves in politics. They go about their daily lives, paying their bills, raising their kids, and doing what they can to maintain the good life. They vote and consider doing so to be a sacred trust. They shake their heads at the political pundits and so-called ‘news’, thinking that what they hear is always spun by whomever is reporting it. They can’t understand how elected officials can regularly violate the public trust with pork barrel spending. They don’t want government handouts. They want the government to protect them, not raise their taxes for more government programs.
We are in the unique position in this country of electing our leaders. It’s a privilege to do so. I’ve never found a candidate in any election with whom I agreed on everything. I’ll wager that most of us don’t even agree with our families or spouses 100% of the time. So when I step into that voting booth, I always try to look at the big picture and cast my vote for the man or woman who is best qualified for the job. I’ve hired a lot of people in my lifetime, and essentially that’s what an election is - a hiring process. Who has the credentials? Whom do I want working for me? Whom can I trust to do the job right?
I’m concerned that a growing number of voters in this country simply don’t get it. They are caught up in a fervor they can’t explain, and calling it ‘change’.
‘Change what?’, I ask.
‘Well, we’re going to change America’, they say.
‘In what way?’, I query.
‘We want someone new and fresh in the White House’, they exclaim.
‘So, someone who’s not a politician?’, I say.
‘Uh, well, no, we just want a lot of stuff changed, so we’re voting for Obama’, they state.
‘So the current system, the system of freedom and democracy that has enabled a man to grow up in this great country, get a fine education, raise incredible amounts of money and dominate the news, and win his party’s nomination for the White House that system’s all wrong?’
‘No, no, that part of the system’s okay we just need a lot of change.’
And so it goes. ‘Change we can believe in.’
Quite frankly, I don’t believe that vague proclamations of change hold any promise for me. In recent months, I’ve been asking virtually everyone I encounter how they’re voting. I live in Illinois, so most folks tell me they’re voting for Barack Obama. But no one can really tell me why only that he’s going to change a lot of stuff ‘Change, change, change.’ I have yet to find one single person who can tell me distinctly and convincingly why this man is qualified to be President and Commander-in-Chief of the most powerful nation on earth other than the fact that he claims he’s going to implement a lot of change.
We’ve all seen the emails about Obama’s genealogy, his upbringing, his Muslim background, and his church affiliations. Let’s ignore this for a moment. Put it all aside. Then ask yourself, ‘What qualifies this man to be my president? That he’s a brilliant orator and talks about change?’
CHANGE WHAT?
Friends, I’ll be forthright with you I believe the American voters who are supporting Barack Obama don’t have a clue what they’re doing, as evidenced by the fact that not one of them - NOT ONE of them I’ve spoken to can spell out his qualifications. Not even the most liberal media can explain why he should be elected.
Political experience? Negligible. Foreign relations? Non-existent. Achievements? Name one. Someone who wants to unite the country? If you haven’t read his wife’s thesis from Princeton, look it up on the web. This is who’s lining up to be our next First Lady? The only thing I can glean from Obama’s constant harping about change is that we’re in for a lot of new taxes.
For me, the choice is clear. I’ve looked carefully at the two leading applicants for the job, and I’ve made my choice.
Here’s a question - ‘Where were you five and a half years ago? Around Christmas, 2002. You’ve had five or six birthdays in that time. My son has grown from a sixth grade child to a high school graduate. Five and a half years is a good chunk of time. About 2,000 days. 2,000 nights of sleep. 6, 000 meals, give or take.’
John McCain spent that amount of time, from 1967 to 1973, in a North Vietnamese prisoner-of-war camp. When offered early release, he refused it. He considered this offer to be a public relations stunt by his captors, and insisted that those held longer than he should be released first. Did you get that part? He was offered his freedom, and he turned it down. A regimen of beatings and torture began.
Do you possess such strength of character? Locked in a filthy cell in a foreign country, would you turn down your own freedom in favor of your fellow man? I submit that’s a quality of character that is rarely found, and for me, this singular act defines John McCain.
Unlike several presidential candidates in recent years whose military service is questionable or non-existent, you will not find anyone to denigrate the integrity and moral courage of this man. A graduate of Annapolis, during his Naval service he received the Silver Star, Bronze Star, Purple Heart and Distinguished Flying Cross. His own son is now serving in the Marine Corps in Iraq. Barack Obama is fond of saying ‘We honor John McCain’s service…BUT…’, which to me is condescending and offensive - because what I hear is, ‘Let’s forget this man’s sacrifice for his country, and his proven leadership abilities, and talk some more about change.’
I don’t agree with John McCain on everything - but I am utterly convinced that he is qualified to be our next President, and I trust him to do what’s right. I know in my heart that he has the best interests of our country in mind. He doesn’t simply want to be President - he wants to lead America, and there’s a huge difference. Factually, there is simply no comparison between the two candidates. A man of questionable background and motives who prattles on about change, can’t hold a candle to a man who has devoted his life in public service to this nation, retiring from the Navy in 1981 and elected to the Senate in 1982.
Perhaps Obama’s supporters are taking a stance between old and new. Maybe they don’t care about McCain’s service or his strength of character, or his unblemished qualifications to be President. Maybe ‘likeability’ is a higher priority for them than ‘trust’. Being a prisoner of war is not what qualifies John McCain to be President of the United States of America - but his demonstrated leadership certainly DOES.
Dear friends, it is time for us to stand. It is time for thinking Americans to say, ‘Enough.’ It is time for people of all parties to stop following the party line. It is time for anyone who wants to keep America first, who wants the right man leading their nation, to start a dialogue with all their friends and neighbors and ask who they’re voting for, and why.
There’s a lot of evil in this world. That should be readily apparent to all of us by now. And when faced with that evil as we are now, I want a man who knows the cost of war on his troops and on his citizens. I want a man who puts my family’s interests before any foreign country.
I want a President who’s qualified to lead.
I want my country back, and I’m voting for John McCain.
Phone: 760.434.1395
E-mail:ronald.hess@alumni.purdue.edu
I AM JUST SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SICK AND TIRED..............THIS COUNTRY IS HEADING DOWN CRAPPER...........AND JUST REMEMBER WHEN IT"S TIME FOR BLAME.....YOU REMEMBER WHO!!!
»→ That's better
October 22, 2008 - 07:08 ET by Cool ArrowYes, many of us have those conversations with our peers.
LYDSEXICS UNTIE!
Colman's ad should be just this
October 22, 2008 - 07:32 ET by theduck6My fellow Minnesotans, Go to Google images and type in "Frankenbunny"
I'm Norm Coleman and I approved this message.
I live in the Peoples Socialist State of Maryland so I am rarely short of bleeding hearts to debate. Well, I misspoke. They can NOT debate because they refuse to support their arguments. They will invariably say, " I don't care about that or anything else. I'm voting for Obama. I want a change." Now considering Marxism might be a change it sure isn't anything new. Are people just that frigging lazy, apathetic or are they really that stupid? I cut them a little slack as one must put in some effort to get any opposing viewpoint save those of the Messiah but I think it's kinda important. McCain wasn't in my top 3 choices during the primary but far better a RINO than a Marxist.
Hey Cool
October 22, 2008 - 07:33 ET by sjanus11Please forgive my ignorance, but what is LYDSEXICS?
I AM JUST SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SICK AND TIRED..............THIS COUNTRY IS HEADING DOWN CRAPPER...........AND JUST REMEMBER WHEN IT"S TIME FOR BLAME.....YOU REMEMBER WHO!!!
It is the motto of
October 22, 2008 - 08:16 ET by Scuba DudeIt is the motto of "Dyslexics Unite"!!!!! : )
»→ Thank you Scuba
October 22, 2008 - 08:20 ET by Cool ArrowI wouldn't have thought that one would go over anybody's head.
LYDSEXICS UNTIE!
Funny. I guess I must be
October 22, 2008 - 11:02 ET by sherylsimsFunny. I guess I must be dyslexic because I just read that (every time) as dyslexics unite, and didn't realize it didn't say that until it was pointed out just now.
God Bless you
October 22, 2008 - 07:39 ET by Gabrielle EI wish that more voters or even elected officials had your thoughtfulness and intelligence. You're a patriot.
Gabrielle, no credit for me
October 22, 2008 - 11:32 ET by sjanus11I wish I could take credit for it, but the Auther's name and e-mail and phone are on bottom...........Someone got a copy to me, sorry, but It is Beautiful, is it not? Steve
I AM JUST SICK AND TIRED OF BEING SICK AND TIRED..............THIS COUNTRY IS HEADING DOWN CRAPPER...........AND JUST REMEMBER WHEN IT"S TIME FOR BLAME.....YOU REMEMBER WHO!!!
Off Topic II
October 22, 2008 - 07:41 ET by BuffNBoneRather then wait for the open thread to become available, I thought I'd hitchhike on this off topic line of thought.
Hawaiian Jersey Girl
Given the importance Obama's grandmother played in others' lives, I truly wish her Godspeed and
His peace to Obama as she goes to meet her maker. That said, the
situation provides numerous opportunities for him to get an
advantage, not lose ground, avoid a misstep, or provide cover for a
misstep. Here's why I see parallels with the Jersey Girls.
that's why she loved Tampa's team. Now you understand why I said I
want both teams to win.” While the previous was fiction, be warned
these words may soon appear in a press release.
because there isn't any defense against them.
for anything misspoken, his defenders can offer this time of sadness
as a reason for what is said. If his words resonate with undecided
voters, they will be underscored by that's what grandma said/would
say. If they don't resonate then they already have protective teflon
coating in place.
for the last portion of the game lest he make yet another gaff, Obama
has a reason to be out of the limelight. This way he can let his
momentum carry him for the final push.
wouldn't appreciate a couple of days in Hawaii. (If only a token
coverage crew makes the trip, I'll gladly retract this comment).
by the McCain team now can be negated by saying Obama is not
available to defend himself and BTW, how could you be so cold as to
raise them at this time.
Some questions
Do I think grandma's situation was deliberately planned? Probably not
Do I think his campaign will milk it for all it is worth? Probably
If she is so gravely ill, why delay the trip until Thursday and Friday?
How has their relationship been in the recent past?
"Fighters are fun but bombers make policy"
Tim, I've about given up.
October 22, 2008 - 07:40 ET by motherbeltTim, I've about given up. Christians in general, and Catholics in particular, are the only groups in this country that can be insulted with impunity. I don't mean made fun of....I mean insulted and denigrated.
William Donohue and others do yeoman's work of calling attention to this, but even then, they only hit the most outrageous. And when brought to light feeble excuses, or in rare cases, feeble apologies, are made, and that's that. No one ever suffers serious consequences or becomes persona non grata because of them.
Most of the time, the comedians who do it are considered "edgy," pundits or actors who do it are "controversial" but no one is ever called a hate-monger, which is exactly what they are.
I don't want fawning over my religion (I'm a Catholic), or the complete avoidance of religious jokes (I do believe God has a sense of humor). I would just like us Christians and Catholics and our God not to be villified and made into dirty jokes.
Is that too much to ask?
From MB to MB
October 22, 2008 - 09:39 ET by Mike BrattonDo not give up.
It is tempting, I'll admit, but we do not give up.
"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not. As we have therefore opportunity, let us do good unto all men, especially unto them who are of the household of faith."
As the song says, we are strangers here, we are aliens, we're not of this world. Those who are of this world will only get more bold in their attacks.
But we must not give up.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
crucify me - with a smile
October 22, 2008 - 11:24 ET by TruthMongercrucify me - with a smile on my face:)
just proves Christians are right - and they are "dead" wrong
Government is the "greedy capitalism" of marxists
John 15:16-23; 16:33
October 22, 2008 - 13:38 ET by gajim"You did not choose Me, but I chose you, and appointed you, that you should go and bear fruit, and that your fruit should remain, that whatever you ask of the Father in My name, He may give it to you. This I command you, that you love one another. If the world hates you, you know that it has hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you. Remember the word that I said to you, 'A slave is not greater than his master.' If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you; if they kept My word, they will keep yours also. But all these things they will do to you for My name's sake, because they do not know the One who sent Me. If I had not come and spoken to them, they would not have sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin. He who hates Me hates My Father also."
"These things I have spoken to you, that in Me you may have peace. In the world you have tribulation, but take courage, I have overcome the world."
Jesus
My friends, don't be surprised or dismayed by the venom spouted toward those who follow Christ. Jesus predicted it would happen and it will only increase as we approach His second coming. Our peace is in Him. He may not calm the storm, but He will bring peace in the midst of it. This is a supernatural battle. The world hates Christians because the world hates Christ and all He stands for. But one day truth and righteousness will prevail and Jesus will take His rightful place. At that time, Al Franken and all like him will bow their knee and their tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. As Christians, we do so willingly today, looking foward to eternity in His presence. To those who wait until "that day" to bow and confess, their future will be eternal separation from God and all this is good. This is the blessed hope we have as we navigate the world around us. We're called to be light and salt; to illumine the darkness and flavor the distasteful. Our acceptance or reward does not come from this world, but from the hand of the One who was sacrificed to purchase us out of this world. Al Franken and those like him can say all they want and spout off in their ignorance, but they cannot touch who I am or my faith. They are lost and their minds are darkened. Their ONLY hope is to one day find the hand of the One who died for THEM. Then they will know true forgiveness and experience unconditional love from a God who sent His only Son to die in their place.
They aren't the only ones...
October 22, 2008 - 15:17 ET by UberconMB,
You forgot FAT people..."I found there was only one way to look thin, hang out with fat people."
-Rodney Dangerfield
As for Born-Agains...PJ O'Rourke once said,"Making fun of born-again Christians is like hunting dairy cows with a high powered rifle and scope."
"I would just like us Christians and Catholics and our God not to be vilified and made into dirty jokes." What's the difference between Christians & Catholics? Also, the "God" of Christians & Catholics is the same for Muslims & Jews...
Hate-mongers of your religion? How many people have used "Obama is a Muslim." as a form of disparagement towards Obama? He's a Christian.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
heartbreaking
October 22, 2008 - 07:51 ET by EurikaPeople who mock God, are sad people and they break my heart. I feel more sorry for THEM though, than anything else.
Imagine what they are going to say when they have to bow before God's glory one day. I think they need our pity.
it really is all about them
October 22, 2008 - 11:26 ET by TruthMongerit really is all about them actually
these are cries for help - add some prayer to your pity
Government is the "greedy capitalism" of marxists
Everyone will have their day...
October 22, 2008 - 15:20 ET by UberconTM,
...or not. Depends on how you think, for thinking is the anathema of religion.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Thanks for the insight.
October 22, 2008 - 16:20 ET by Mike BrattonAny more of your bigotry you'd like to share with the group, Uber?
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Mikie, mikie...
October 22, 2008 - 16:27 ET by UberconMikie,
No bigotry, whatsoever...
I'm probably more tolerant of your views than you are of mine.
Do you believe in imaginary places, things and beings? Please share what you see. Are they different from everyone else?
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Yes, you show a great deal of bigotry.
October 22, 2008 - 17:55 ET by Mike BrattonPlus, you exhibit signs of being double-jointed, what with patting yourself on the back like that.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
No answer to the questions, I see.
October 22, 2008 - 18:22 ET by UberconMike,
I asked some very simple questions. A simple yes or no...that's all.
I didn't ask How, Why, When, Where or What...just straight forward questions.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
You haven't asked anything substantive.
October 23, 2008 - 11:21 ET by Mike BrattonLet me know when you get past the "Have you stopped beating your wife?" brand of "simple yes or no" questions.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Profess your faith...
October 23, 2008 - 11:39 ET by UberconMike,
Don't shy away...
It's a simple question...
Do you believe in imaginary places, things and beings?
It's a yes or no answer.
Come on, Mike, there's nothing to lose.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Ubercon, Heaven, Hell, Angels, and Satan are real...
October 23, 2008 - 11:55 ET by vrwc13...is that what you meant by "imaginary places, things and beings? "
U, you might not believe that Satan is real, but he knows you are.
v
Oh really?
October 23, 2008 - 12:26 ET by Uberconvrwc,
How's the personal relationship with Satan going? Wow, what an imagination!
Proof?
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Do you honestly perceive me as being "shy"?
October 23, 2008 - 11:56 ET by Mike BrattonFor a heartbeat?
You don't even have the fortitude to sign your name to your missives, yet you insinuate that others are "shy"?
Please take your trolling someplace else, before you're shown the door.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Still not answerin'...
October 23, 2008 - 12:14 ET by UberconMike,
Having a tough time with the imagination is reality scenario?
Richard Beutel aka
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Poor Richard.
October 23, 2008 - 13:28 ET by Mike BrattonNo, you really aren't that challenging a writer. The reality is that you're lacking in imagination.
What I am having trouble with, though, is believing you're anything but a troll.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
There it is...
October 23, 2008 - 14:19 ET by UberconMike,
Originality! A troll you say...
Squirmin' and slinkin' off with no answer...Nice job, Mike.
yes or no. Choose one to the question...
Do you believe in imaginary places, things, and/or beings?
Gosh, what's so hard about this question?
Or will you succumb to the name calling as so many others have in the past...
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
What part of "I'm not playing your child's game" don't you get?
October 23, 2008 - 17:12 ET by Mike BrattonObserving that you're trolling a discussion board isn't name-calling, in all fairness.
Calling you, for example, deluded (as you refer to others) would be name-calling. Have I done any of that?
And there's nothing difficult about your schoolyard question. Which is entirely the point. What you do not understand, you seek to mock. That is the antithesis of discussion, and if you continue to badger me, I'll do what I can to see that your attempts to disrupt the discussion are concluded here.
You've struck out. Move on.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Tsk, tsk, tsk...
October 23, 2008 - 17:32 ET by UberconMike,
I'm badgering you?!? You stroll into a conversation, call me out and then accuse me of trolling?!? I've answered your questions...you haven't answered mine. No wonder you chose your current profession...parroting talking points of unoriginality and making it your own. Please respect the way I'll ignore your comments from this point forward.
Richard Beutel aka
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
If you've concluded sharing your bigotry, that's wonderful.
October 23, 2008 - 17:43 ET by Mike BrattonMarvelous.
But keep trolling, regardless of the target, and I'll see if we can't have you shown the door.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Mike... I haven't said
October 23, 2008 - 17:54 ET by bigtimerMike...
I haven't said anything here, been following this though...I just will say one thing about it all..you aren't alone at all about showing him the door...I had my fill long ago.
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
I appreciate your observation, BT.
October 23, 2008 - 18:05 ET by Mike BrattonMuch obliged.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
Uber--
October 22, 2008 - 18:04 ET by misterbill"I'm probably more tolerant of your views than you are of mine."
You are so noble.
Peace...
October 22, 2008 - 18:19 ET by Uberconmisterbill,
...be with you.
Thank you for the compliment.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Al Franken Comedy
October 22, 2008 - 10:35 ET by Chattychitoso he doesn't like the death and burial of Jesus Christ. the BIble says the cross of Jesus is foolishness to those who are perishing. but to those that beleive it is the power of life.
in that day all will give account for their remarks to God himself. and it is all about how they treated the death of Christ.
Christian faith is not as bad as everyone thinks. if we all lived by faith and the word of God the world woud be a better place.
Shameless plug alert ...
October 22, 2008 - 10:42 ET by Dave PierreFrankenlies.com: The truth about the lies of Al Franken ...
Thank you.
I think we are forgetting
October 22, 2008 - 12:08 ET by UtherpendI think we are forgetting that Al Franken is Jewish, so to him the symbol of Christ is not as sacred as it would be to a Christian. Secondly he is liberal so unless it is something he likes then it isn't worth honoring the beliefs of others.
Thank You
October 22, 2008 - 14:11 ET by AtTheWaterCoolerI've added this post as a referance to http://www.jeremiahf... thank you for posting this information.
For a conservative website
October 22, 2008 - 15:25 ET by UberconFor a conservative website that battles the liberal mainstream news media, there sure is a lot of articles on Christ and those being offended by non-believers. What gives? Supposedly, Matthew Sheffield has said no religious discussions, yet, there's a constant stream of religious issues being discussed. So why not have religious discussions?
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Serpents v. Servants
October 22, 2008 - 19:21 ET by MinutemenFranken is a Pharisee.
You Can't All Possibly Take Religion That Seriously...
October 23, 2008 - 00:24 ET by The7SticksI have a cousin who is married to a pastor who found that job path because he needed help. He was a heroin addict and he needed something good in his life to fix him up. He found God and Jesus, and then he became a pastor. He did it because he needed salvation to save him from his self-destructive life, not because he had a calling to evangelize everyone. He has a wonderful family with two beautiful children that I have met. For that I congratulate him.
That said, the point was it wasn't because he had no other choice to become a Christian. It was because he chose to be a Christian, or at least chose to preach the word of God. And for that, his life is better, That doesn't necessarily mean that salvation in Christ is the only way to get yourself out of a rut. I have been leading a very good life even though I live an agnostic Jewish lifestyle. And I don't believe I have to go to Christ for salvation because we Jews know we are going to heaven because we don't believe in Hell.
If Al Franken wants to make fun of Christians and Catholics, let him. It doesn't bother me and I certainly believe my cousin's husband, a pastor, wouldn't even bother because he is not the target of that humor. The target is people who use bigotry towards other people's faiths, disguised in the form of salvation. People like Al Franken, Seth McFarlane, Trey Parker and Matt Stone are trying to balance out the playing field to use their kinds of humor to take on a wholly corrupt empire called organized religion, specifically the Evangelical and Catholic communities. and turn it on its back and tell them, we will attack you the way you attacked us who don't follow your faith. That is as simple as I can put it, and if you don't like it, then deal with it. I deal with it all the time.
When did organized religion attack these guys?
October 23, 2008 - 00:38 ET by Captain KirockYou said "People like Al Franken, Seth McFarlane, Trey Parker and Matt Stone are
trying to balance out the playing field to use their kinds of humor to
take on a wholly corrupt empire called organized religion, specifically
the Evangelical and Catholic communities. and turn it on its back and
tell them, we will attack you the way you attacked us who don't follow
your faith."
When did organized religion attack these guys? Did I miss something? Who fired the first shot in this comics v. organized religion war?
Good Evening Sticks
October 23, 2008 - 00:50 ET by cocodrieBeing an agnostic is OK. When I die I know where I'm going, but you will be laying there all dressed up with nowhere to go.
Prove it...
October 23, 2008 - 11:36 ET by UberconCoco,
For all intents and purposes, you'll be rotting in your suit like the rest of us.
Seen on London buses..."There is probably no God. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life." Great words to live by...until the cold hands of death take you away to the great big hole in the ground...
"Some come to this graveyard
To sit and think,
But I've come here to
Rot and stink." -from a tombstone
Now go out and enjoy yourself...
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Good morning Uber
October 23, 2008 - 11:56 ET by cocodrieYou prove that God does not exist. Also prove that Henry Ford said "The voice of dissent must be heard".
Proving the existence...
October 23, 2008 - 12:49 ET by UberconCoco,
...of an imaginary being is impossible. The burden of proof lies upon your shoulders not mine.
As for Henry Ford, it's a quote from his will.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
frank, you are sidestepping.
October 23, 2008 - 12:59 ET by cocodriefrank, you are sidestepping. Prove that God is an imaginary being and prove that Henry Ford made that quote.
coco... He's now over at
October 23, 2008 - 13:04 ET by Clear thinkercoco...
He's now over at Daily KOS asking for help!
Peek Into Liberal Minds - If You Dare
Making Fun of AGW http://giovanniworld.wordpress.com/
CT
October 23, 2008 - 13:14 ET by cocodrieHe needs proffesional help.
Who's "frank"?
October 23, 2008 - 13:23 ET by UberconCoco,
"Prove that God is an imaginary being."? I see the delusion is strong in you. Once again, God exists in your mind by way of indoctrination or choice. I cannot prove the existence of an imaginary being or fictional character you believe exists. Fictional characters like Peter Pan, Harry Potter, the Tooth Fairy, etc exist in children's minds. Try to prove the Tooth Fairy doesn't exist to a young child who lost a tooth and is waiting for the arrival of the Tooth Fairy.
As for Henry Ford's quote...you're going to need a library with books and magazines from the 1950's to find the quote. Try some books with quotes. It's amazing what libraries have on their shelves. Are you a slave to the internets and all of its tubes of information...?
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Uber
October 23, 2008 - 14:18 ET by cocodrieDoes the wind exist? Does gravity exist? Does electricity exist?
Coco...
October 23, 2008 - 17:00 ET by UberconCoco,
These questions are answered through science or there's a better answer...
Does the wind exist? The flow of gases in an atmosphere or It's God blowing gently or forcefully upon my face.
Does gravity exist? Actually, Gravitation as explained by Newton's law of universal gravitation-
F=G(m1m2/r2)
where:
or It's God holding us from going up into the sky like birds and angels.
Does electricity exist? There's electric charge, electric current, electric fields, electric potential, and electromagnetism or it's God's way of keeping you in fear of being shocked and fried by his awesome power.
Answered.
Do you believe in fairies and fairy tales?
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Ubercon, God said...
October 23, 2008 - 11:53 ET by vrwc13...that both He and Satan exist. Man (some) say God and/or Satan does not exist.
Who you choose to believe may haunt you or bless you for eternity.
v
I must disagree...
October 23, 2008 - 12:58 ET by Uberconvrwc,
...as you base your knowledge and understanding of imaginary beings on the writings by men. Ghost stories can haunt you, scare you, & entice you into believing ghosts exist if you believe in the storyteller. Once again, believe what you want...the human imagination can take us anywhere we want to go. Through reason and thinking we can stop a delusion. Just stop worrying & enjoy your life.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
Ubercon, I will pray to...
October 23, 2008 - 17:10 ET by vrwc13...my "imaginary" God on your behalf. I will ask Him to reveal Himself to you, so that you too may believe.
Just do me a favor and let me know when you hear from Him.
v
Jesus said to him, "Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed." John 20:29
I'm not delusional...
October 23, 2008 - 17:54 ET by Uberconvrwc,
Since he's a figment of your imagination, ask him why he can't create peace throughout the world, why he created evil, why he can't defeat what he created, why he can't cure cancer, gosh...I'm just getting started...Tell you what, keep those delusions from happening and go out enjoy your life without worrying about any type of eternal damnation from a God that acts like a homicidal maniac.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
"why he can't create peace
October 23, 2008 - 18:30 ET by vrwc13"why he can't create peace throughout the world, why he created evil, why he can't defeat what he created, why he can't cure cancer"
In His own time He will:
4and He will wipe away every tear from their eyes; and there will no longer be any death; there will no longer be any mourning, or crying, or pain; the first things have passed away. Rev 21
In the meantime He allows man's free-will to to choose Him or not. In otherwords, God offers but man must accept.
25Jesus answered, "I did tell you, but you do not believe. The miracles I do in my Father's name speak for me, 26but you do not believe because you are not my sheep. 27My sheep listen to my voice; I know them, and they follow me. 28I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one can snatch them out of my hand. 29My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all[d]; no one can snatch them out of my Father's hand. 30I and the Father are one." John 10
v
Touching...& written by men.
October 23, 2008 - 19:23 ET by Uberconvrwc,
Free will, you say...
Theological doctrine stated that God allows human beings to be tempted into evil, so by a personal decision each individual may "freely" elect to resist temptation or not. According to the Second Book of Esdras, "It had been better not to have given the earth unto Adam; or else, when it was given to him, to have restrained him from sinning. For what profit is it for men now in this present time to live in heaviness, and after death to look for punishment?"
If God was all-knowing then he must have known in advance what man would choose, which would take the element of surprise out of human sins. On the other hand, if God couldn't foresee what man would choose, and could be surprised by human actions, he wasn't all knowing.
The 9th century Irish theologian, J. Scotus Erigena tried to establish the dogma of "divine ignorance". Unfortunately, he succeeded in demonstrating that God fails to understand what he created. Scotus Erigena said,"There is another kind of ignorance in God, inasmuch as he may be said not to know what things he foreknows and predestines until they have appeared experientially in the course of created events. There is a third kind of divine ignorance, in that God may be said to be ignorant of things not yet made manifest in their effects through experience of their action and operation; of which, nevertheless he holds the invisible cause in himself, by himself created, and to himself known."
These subtleties start to add up to a statement God doesn't know what he knows, with a hidden conclusion man is smarter than God, because man (Scotus Erigena) knows all about what God knows and what God doesn't know. The concept of "free will" became so troublesome to some sects of Protestants, they abandoned it all together and embraced predestination, stating that every person was already saved or damned at birth by God's unalterable decree. This helped in restoring God's omniscience but led to the erosion of the incentive to lead a godly life.
I have a charming folk tale that goes along with what I have written, but for now...I'll let you digest this and look forward to your response.
Übercon
"The voice of dissent must be heard."-Henry Ford
That's a nasty bit of navel-gazing, Uber.
October 23, 2008 - 23:21 ET by Mike BrattonAnd hardly written by a "theologian."
He didn't know the "Theos," he didn't know the "Logos," so presuming Erigena to be a "theologian" has always been a stretch.
But we recognize you, Uber. You're not interested in dialogue or inquiry, but just in bashing Christians and Christianity. We make easy targets, in your mind, because if we bash back in kind we're presumed to have invalidated our faith. (And how frustrating it must be when we don't.)
How very Saul Alinsky of you.
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
can uber see his navel?!
October 23, 2008 - 23:31 ET by porpoiseboyi love it when the heathens conspire against God and prove his word. uber, quite a case of the clay yelling at the potter about what he made. yhwh said "my ways are not your ways". i know you don't like it, but that negates every argument you throw out there because you can only argue from your lowly claylike position. you lose.
Ecclesiastes 10:2 The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left.
That's an open mind, all right.
October 23, 2008 - 11:24 ET by Mike Bratton"If you don't like it, then deal with it"?
Spectacular.
Again, where are the "attacks" you speak of from Christians, or from "organized" Christianity of any stripe?
--Mike
www.thebrattonreport...
those who do believe, and those who do not
October 23, 2008 - 13:06 ET by JIMMY1660allow me to love America -elected officials represent ALL of those in their bailiwick. church and state??? keep me safe and pick up my garbage. my religion is off limits, no matter what i might or might not believe in. patch the streets and put out the fires. stay out of my life.and as someone who wants to be elected should not cross those boundaries.