ABC's Chris Cuomo Hits Ayers on Bombings; Skips Specific Victims

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In part two of "Good Morning America's" Friday interview with former bomber William Ayers, news anchor Chris Cuomo did challenge the ex-'60s radical on whether or not he was a terrorist. But after Ayers contended, "It's not terrorism because it doesn't target people. It doesn't target people to either kill or injure," the journalist failed to offer specifics that would refute that point. Cuomo could have easily cited the example of John Murtagh. He was a child in 1970 when the Weather Underground, founded by Mr. Ayers, placed multiple bombs, one underneath the gas tank of the family car, at the home of his New York judge father.

In a New York Daily News op-ed on April 30, 2008, Murtagh wrote, "I was only 9 then, the year Ayers' Weathermen tried to murder me." However, while not pressing Ayers on specific victims, he did skeptically wonder, "How can a sophisticated academic like yourself believe that the inherent recklessness of exploding bombs that you know too well killed three of your own- you know the potential for deadliness there."

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Although he didn't press the point that the Weather Underground tried to harm specific people, Cuomo should be credited for grilling Ayers over the bomber's insistence that he's not a terrorist. At one point, Cuomo retorted, "How is what you did there, blowing up, detonating a bomb in the Pentagon, the New York Police Department headquarters, trying to target the Capitol. How is that not terrorism?"

Finally, Cuomo actually addressed the fact that the Weather Underground dedicated its 1974 manifesto "The Prairie Fire" to Sirhan Sirhan, the assassin of Senator Robert F. Kennedy. Cuomo questioned, "I mean, what message does that send? Especially if you don't reject it today and say, 'We praised Sirhan Sirhan. We should not have.'" This prompted Ayers to admit, "I reject that. Absolutely."

An analysis of part one of Cuomo's interview can be found here.

A transcript of part two of the interview, which aired at 7:42am on November 14, follows:

ROBIN ROBERTS: Also this morning, we have more of Chris's exclusive interview with Bill Ayers, the '60s radical who Republicans once called Barack Obama's terrorist pal. We will have more of that interview straight ahead.

SAWYER: That's right. He is speaking out this morning. And in this half hour, talking about some of the statements that were attributed to him that created such polarized and angry reactions.

7:42

CHRIS CUOMO: We are joined again now by William Ayers, a former member of the Weather Underground, a group that during the '70s claimed responsibility for at least a dozen bombings, including the U.S. Capitol and the Pentagon. His relationship with President-elect Barack Obama, of course, became an issue during the campaign. He is the author of "Fugitive Days: Memoirs of an Anti-War Activist" which has just been reissued with a new afterword in paperback. There it is. Mr. Ayers, thanks for joining us again. Why re-release "Fugitive Days" now?

WILLIAM AYERS: You know, that's really a publisher's decision, not my decision. But, I wrote the book eight years ago and I wrote it in part to try to understand what it meant to be a young person set down in that historic period, a person from tremendous privilege and making my way through the world and, kind of, the choices I made.

CUOMO: But the timing becomes relevant. You know, because-

AYERS: I'm sorry?

CUOMO: The timing becomes relevant coming out of the election. You didn't want to come out during the election?

AYERS: Well, no one predicted the attention I would get in the election. I mean, this was not a decision based on that at all.

CUOMO: But you talk about the issues that happen there in the new afterward of the book. Do you regret not coming out during the election and saying, "There's nothing here?"

AYERS: Well, the premise of the whole come-on to this segment, that I've been silent is just not true. I've been teaching. I've been writing. I've been doing all the things I always do. But I did decide not to comment to the media on the presidential campaign, because, again, I felt that I would be feeding a profoundly dishonest narrative and I didn't really want to participate in that. So, I didn't see any way to interrupt it. And since I couldn't interrupt it, I decided to just wait until it passed. And, you know, I think that the dishonesty of it kind of runs to the point of, like, I was somehow in hiding. One of my sons sent me a segment from some 24 hour news outfit and they acted as if they had stalked me down and found me in hiding. Just not true. I was doing the things I always do.

CUOMO: Now, this book, the ideas in it, with perspective on Barack Obama. You ever talk to him about what's in "Fugitive Days."

AYERS: Never.

CUOMO: He ever ask you about it?

AYERS: Never.

CUOMO: Is that unusual for you that being William Ayers and being in the Chicago area that somebody talks to you and doesn't talk to you about your past?

AYERS: I've written seven books. I've edited another 13 and mostly what I talk about is schools and kids and juvenile justice as you know. And those are the things that my work focuses on. And the fact that I have this past is of little interest. And when you say the fact that you're Bill Ayers, that character was created in this election.

CUOMO: Well, he exists because of what happened. I mean, one of the interesting things about this book is that while it provides perspective about that period in history, dismisses the notion that your actions were heroic, expresses your doubts but not an apology or a complete rejection of what happened during those years, the bombings.

AYERS: Well, you know, again, I think you have to read this as a memoir, not as a manifesto, not even as a history. But the reason that I undertook it actually was because- and, remember, I wrote it- it was published in 2001, so I wrote it in the two years leading up to it. But, I had enough distance from it that I felt that I could say something about it. But I wrote it as a memoir, as a way of, kind of, understanding a ten year period in our history. And I thought it was relevant then. I think it's more relevant now and the reason it is, is because we are once again bogged down in two wars. And if you add Israel/Palestine, that's a third major conflict. And, and we don't seem to as a democracy-we don't seem to be able to figure out how to assert the public will and bring these things to an end. I think people want these wars to end. And I think they should.

CUOMO: Isn't that all the more reason for you to take a look back and reject what the Weather Underground is?

AYERS: Well, there's nothing in there that's- there's an attempt to understand the things we did. You know, here we were in a situation where, really, a violent terrorist war was being waged against an entire population. We objected. We tried to end that war. And in trying to end it, we did cross lines of propriety, of legality, maybe even of common sense. But we never committed terror.

CUOMO: Why not? I really- I have a tough time understanding this. How is what you did there, blowing up, detonating a bomb in the Pentagon, the New York Police Department headquarters, trying to target the Capitol. How is that not terrorism?

AYERS: It's not terrorism because it doesn't target people. It doesn't target people to either kill or injure. What it does is- You could call it-

CUOMO: How can a sophisticated academic like yourself believe that the inherent recklessness of exploding bombs that you know too well killed three of your own- you know the potential for deadliness there.

AYERS: Right. It was definitely over lots of lines. Definitely dangerous and had we killed or injured anyone, I'm sure it would have been devastating for everyone. Them and us. But my point is that in a period when 2000 people a week are being murdered, how do you end that? What do you do? And, frankly, in those ten years of that war, I was arrested many times. I took direct, non-violent action again and again. But, the question comes, after 70 percent of America oppose the war, after the war has been virtually lost, how do you end it? What do you do? And there's nothing in the book that says what we did was either brilliant or heroic or wonderful. It tries to understand, as memoirs do, the context in which that actor was acting.

CUOMO: But you would think that looking forward, you would want to set a table for people in addressing the current situations that didn't expose the violence. I mean, even looking back in the 1974 manifesto of "The Prairie Fire," of the Weather Underground, one of the people you dedicate this book to is Sirhan Sirhan. I mean, what message does that send? Especially if you don't reject it today and say, "We praised Sirhan Sirhan. We should not have."

AYERS: I reject that. Absolutely. Absolutely.

CUOMO: "We did these things. We should not have." The 9/11 quote. We should have done more. We should not have. It's wrong. It's bad."

AYERS: No, no. I disagree on the question of we should not have- we should have done more. What I'm saying there and I've said it very clearly is that no one did enough in this country to end the war. We knew it was wrong. We knew it was illegal. We knew it was immoral.

CUOMO: But going that route- but going that route, violence-

AYERS: Again, I don't defend the route we went and I really urge people to participate in resistance, non-violent direct action to these wars. I don't urge violence at all. But, let's admit that we live, often, in a sewer of violence and opposing that violence is key.

CUOMO: Mr. Ayers, thank you very much for taking the opportunity today. The book is "Fugitive Days."

—Scott Whitlock is a news analyst for the Media Research Center.


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No one did enough to end

No one did enough to end the war protesters, you should say.  Damned traitor - should be executed for treason.

BTW - Nixon ended the Vietnam War - was Ayers a Nixon devotee? Ha....  Both the MSM and their America-hating leftist cronies are a bunch of hypocrites, liars and dopes.

Mentioning the victims

Mentioning the victims would have made it too real and less ideological.  Ayers is a coward in the truest sense. 

"Forget change, I want improvement!"

Those "hypocrites, liars and dopes" were right.

Many thousands more U.S. soldiers and Vietnamese died in combat during Nixon's administration than in Johnson's. Nixon only ended the war because he was desperate to win re-election and he knew the war would be an obstacle to that. And it was Nixon, Mitchell and Erhlichman who branded many American war protesters as "terrorists". These being the men who subverted the Constitution in order to preserve their power. A lot of the men who fought bravely in Vietnam joined the protesters when they returned home. Were they "traitors"? 

This was too big of an

This was too big of an interview for Chris Cuomo.  ABC sent out it's 3rd string when the 1st string was required. 

P.T. Barnum was right

There's a journalist born every minute.

Unabashed Liberal Doubletalk

I watched this interview and was astonished.  Does anyone really listen to these people and believe what they say?  I couldn't believe that Ayers actually said that he wasn't a terrorist because they "didn't target people".  He called the police on Fox just because they had a reporter at his house.  I wonder how he would feel about "non-terrorists" placing bombs under his car or house--as long as the intent was not to harm him. 

This segment came on the heels of a story about the Minnesota secretary of state doing an interview in the morning saying that the Republican election challenges were typical political moves to grab the election at any cost, then two hours laters denying he said that. 

They're not even bothering trying to fool anyone anymore, they're just outright lying.  I feel like I'm living Animal Farm. 

Unbelieveable!

Ayers is truly an example of lipstick on a pig.

 Murtagh wrote, "I was

 Murtagh wrote, "I was only 9 then, the year Ayers' Weathermen tried to murder me."

ABC's Chris Coumo couldn't care less that people-AMERICAN people were TERRORIZED (3 men died) by this MONSTER.

My heart goes out to the families who are victimized all over again by ABC, Good Morning America, and all the advertisers who allowed this segment to air.

 

 

I'd love to start a network

I'd love to start a network boycott, but gosh, where do you start?  They're all just as bad as the other.  

cool

I quit cold-turkey...I turned them ALL off.  I get my news online, from places I trust!

But as long as they keep 'reporting' their slanted garbage, I will be here shouting back...it's a matter of principle. 

AMEN Mom

turned of my tv weeks ago dont even watch the "enteriment" stuff any more cuz it would be supporting the BS they call news

where to start is easy turn off your tv and cancel the dish or cable (even paying for the service supports cnn ) then go out and buy some board games and be a family if the kids are older spend time playing the "playstation" with them. My 17 yo son and i do this i use the time to find out what he is being taught in classes in H.S. and what he thought about the election. What i discovered was when he gets to collage profecers will HATE him( he's almost as rabid as his dad about conseveratism(sp)).

Spend time as a family combat the BS in the public schools teach your kids to think for themselves( warning this one will backfire from time to time but it's good to know they can hold their own in a debate). Teach them the values the that made this nation great

I fall back on my grandfathers generation of the greatness of America(WW II). To go from a nation with very little standing milatiry to winning a 2 front war in the time we did it truly speakes to the greatness of the US of A

my .5 cents

 

 

Live Free or Die

Rob B

Your .5 cents is worth a fortune!

 

yea Rob, use that tv for DVD's old movies are very good...

I get urked just listening to the top of the hour news on the radio.

First Mutt's Viet Nam 2

IranianUranium

Give Cuomo a little credit

Chris's job was to bring out the information and Ayers response without being overly judgemental. That's what we would like to see from the MSM and he did pretty much okay as far as showing Ayers for the unrepentent terrorist that he still is.

We would like, I'm sure to have some smoking gun, but it isn't likely to happen. The best we will get is one more link in a lifetime of Baracks association with the marxist oriented far left wing of the democrat party.

   

Has this bonehead EVER

said he was sorry for the people who died? Does the loser media have the smarts to see that they are contributing to the fall of the american way of life? Do they know that by NOT telling (read reporting) the truth, they are just proving how stupid they are? I'd like to hear from someone in the media, but knowing how cowardly they are, I might as well wait for my personal bailout.

There is no sense in being stupid, if you can't prove it! - my dad V

Sorry for what?

Ayers was responsible for no deaths. The charges against him were dropped in 1980. And, for your information, the "American way of life" was built upon dissent and civil disobedience. Attacking dissenters is grossly unAmerican.

»→ JRJ

The charges were dropped because wiretap laws had changed while Ayers was on the lam.

You're painting a rosy picture of a killer you idolize just because you, and he, love Obama.

How was that "Free Eric Rudolph" rally you attended yesterday?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

It's all about hate, isn't it.

There's nothing "rosy" about the picture I painted. It's just that my picture doesn't look like yours, therefore I "idolize" a killer. A killer who never killed a single person. Nobody on this website is as conservative as I am. I was a lifelong Republican. But when I read remarks like this, I realize that the GOP has deterioriated to the level of a prison-yard riot, where there is no thoughtful discussion, much less an ability to listen. At some point, I fully expect to banned from this site, because a lot of people like you hate any opposing view. This is not what being an American is about. The charges against Ayers were dropped because there was no other evidence against him, and his crimes amounted to little more than extreme vandalism. 

»→ JRJ, all righty then

Was it Adolph Hitler's finger on the trigger of a smoking gun that turns you against him, or the actions of his organization?

Now you're really spinning JRJ.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

»→ Don't be a crybaby

"because a lot of people like you hate any opposing view."

Hate?  Did I say "hate"

Did I say all Liberals are Ayers apologists?  No.

Looks to me that you're grasping for absolute polarity where it doesn't exist.

Keep it up with the "people like you" comments.  I may be more complex than the stereotype of which you accuse me.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

You don't listen very well.

  Ayers never ADMITTED to killing anyone because there is NO statute of limitations on Murder.

  He is a stone cold killer and you are lapping up his propaganda.

Sincerely,

a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.

Son of Privilege/Chicago Machine

The charges were dropped because of "technicalities."  I am sure it is just a coincidence that Ayers, the son of privilege from a well-connected/rich/political Chicago family was the "victim" of some sort of police/prosecutorial misconduct.  BS!!  He benefited from the power of his family and their political connections.  It takes a monumental hypocrit to defend his bombings and decry the political and social hierarchy of the "empire," and then to gladly accept the benefits of those same political and social ties.  He then continued to take advantage to obtain and maintain his cushy university position.  What a complete joke this man is.   

A terrorist with ties to

A terrorist with ties to the president elect and the first news story the msm puts on is12 days after the election .At this point obama should give him a cabinet positon the msm wont care.

he will disappear!

 

Glen Beck said it best.

"I just don't understand a country that can accept this man"

"The man is crazy insane"

"Excuse me, you cannot be allowed to teach this to Kids"

There is no such thing as moral outrage.

Where is America?

CANCON... I just now got

CANCON...

I just now got through listening to him on BOR...I could of hugged him...he sure as heck spoke for me!

"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh

LIE!

, the question comes, after 70 percent of America oppose the war, after the war has been virtually lost,

  LIE! We never lost one single battle in Vietnam. We were ultimately successful in stopping North Vietnam from taking over the South.

  It was only after a peace treaty had been signed and we had all but drawn all of our troops out that the North AGAIN invaded the South and we (read Democrats) turned our back on an ally.

 Ayers is a liar and a terrorist. 

Sincerely,

a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.

Ayers is right...

Ayers was the typical angry college kid during the late 1960's. If you lived through that era, you know exactly what his mentality was because it was prevalent everywhere. Hundreds of thousands of young people, especially draft-age men, protested the Vietnam war in one way or another. Ayers' methods were particularly extreme and destructive, but he was not a "terrorist" bent on killing anybody. In fact, he blew up two restrooms, causing a total of about $200,000 damage. And, as he said in this interview, he never did kill anybody. He's "unrepentant" because repenting would he mean he no longer holds those ideals which made him against the killing of innocent people in the rice paddies and villages of Vietnam. John McCain, who dropped bombs on the Vietnamese and got captured the process, obviously has a lot of anger toward Ayers and he used Ayers' past to get at Obama by implying there was some sort of sinister anti-American collusion going on. It was despicable because McCain has zero proof of what he was suggesting. It was just thrown out there to create suspicion. In this interview, Cuomo seemed not to get that the "concerns" raised by McCain and Palin during the campaign were based upon a distortion of what had been a purely professional working relationship in an organization dedicated to helping lower income families in Chicago. But the innuendo used by McCain/Palin was intended to suggest more. It was a classic "big lie" which the Republican candidates repeated over and over again, hoping voters would just accept it. Again, as Ayers said, voters rejected the tactic, as they should have. 

Ayers was Right? In who's world?

I grew up in the 60's , and I don't anyone who can claim that detonating bombs is a proper means of protest.  I don't care who you are, I don't care what your politics are, I don't care what your protest is about, detonating bombs is a CRIME and anyone commits such a crime should be prosecuted to the full extent of that law.  Claiming that "no one was killed' belittles the fact that Ayers committed CRIMES, and joined an organization that declared WAR against the US of A.  How can you excuse this behavior and claim he was right?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Ayers was Right?

Cobra,

if and only if I am allowed to protest his protest by bombing his house.

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

Ayers is right...

You are misrepresenting what I said. Detonating bombs, even just to blow up bathrooms, is illegal and a crime. But Ayers' intent was not to kill anybody. It was nothing more than extreme vandalism, and the charges against him were dropped in 1980. Calling him a terrorist trivializes that term, which should only be used to describe murderers who intentionally target innocent victims. McCain and Palin referred to Ayers as a terrorist in order to incite fear in the electorate. That is what Ayers was right about, and he was right when he said that voters rejected the tactic. 

I'm not "misrepresenting" anything!

I'm not "misrepresenting" anything, you are!  You just claimed that Ayers was right for setting bombs!  It doesn't matter if "no one" was killed, that possibility still existed.  Ayers was a domestic terrorists, he used terror as a means to force people to accept his views and to change government policy.  That's terrorism by ANYONE'S  standards!  How can you claim that this is right?  Are you so willing to forgive his criminal activities simply because you approve of his politics?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Yes, you are.

Show me the exact quote where I said "Ayers was right for setting bombs!" What I said was that Ayers was not a terrorist. "Terror", as you say, is inflicted on human beings. It is the emotion people feel when their lives are endangered. Unoccupied bathrooms in closed government buildings do not experience terror. Calling Ayers a terrorist trivializes the term. Your alleged "standards" are standards of convenience, driven by a reflexive hatred of the country's first African-American president. So you're willing to believe anything anybody tells you if it helps discredit him. It's pathetic.

Your first scetence said it

Your first sentence said it!  Your Subject lines also said it!  Are you denying what you, yourself, posted?

The rest of your post was nothing more than an attempt to JUSTIFY Ayers' terrorism and an attempt to MINIMIZE his activities by arguing that he was mealy "protesting" the draft and by trying to deflect blame to McCain and the US Government.  Your intent is as transparent as glass, and your arguments are just as fragile. 

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Since you want exact quotes...

"driven by a reflexive hatred of the country's first African-American president"

Since you want exact quotes, show me where I even MENTIONED Obama, even in passing.  That is called deflection and it is an extremely POOR debating tactic.  Talk about pathetic!

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

»→ Great defense

I'm thinking Sirhan-Sirhan was just trying to vandalize the kitchen after some bad Crab Louie.

So, he missed, and killed Bobby Kennedy?  JRJ could be Sirhan's lawyer.  His buddy Ayers has already agreed to JRJ's defense for Sirhan.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Do a little research.

You REALLY need to do a little research about the Weather Underground, the organization of which Ayers was a member.

This is from the FBI itself:  "In 1976, the FBI's Chicago Field Office prepared a summary which described the activities of the Weather Underground Organization, also known as Weathermen. This organization described itself as a revolutionary organization of communist men and women."

Here's the link.

These people were not merely unhappy men and women who did nothing more that use "extreme vandalism" as a means of protest.  These people were revolutionaries who's sole purpose was to overthrow the US government using terror and violence!  How can you dismiss this so easily?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Oh Great. Another professional Obamatroll.

And a flagrant liar at that.

The fact that Ayers would associate himself with such people says much about him, and the fact that you come in here and defend him for having done so says even more about you.

To me, you are nothing but a terrorist sympathizer, which makes you just as bad as the terrorists themselves, and about twelve feet lower than the lowest whale excrement.

Liberalism is a mental disorder, and your post here defending a member of a terrorist organization proves it.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

»→ Associate himself?

It's not that he associated himself with such people, it is that he organized this group of people.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Ayers and JRJ are both wrong

From the Compact Oxford English Dictionary:

 http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/terrorist?view=uk

terrorist

  • noun a person who uses violence and intimidation in the pursuit of political aims

 Terrorism isn't about killing, it's about terror.  It's using force and violence, or the threat thereof, to scare people and create a "mandate for change" to borrow a phrase.  Terrorism doesn't even require an overt act--you can send an email that says if the government doesn't meet your demands you'll put poison in milk.  If it's broadcast far enough you can frighten people into not buying milk, which impacts parents who are concerned about their children, stores that sell milk, farmers that produce milk, etc.  If you do this once, it's a little bit scary, if you continue to make threats, it becomes a situation where people don't trust store-bought products and the economy is rocked.  If you actually carry out the threat, it raises the level of terror even higher, and the impact is greater.  So, logically (which is a concept that often escapes liberals, especially those in the university)  threatening to set bombs is terrorism, and actually setting off bombs is terrorism, and hurting or killing people (which the Weather Underground did do, despite the weasely protestions of their founders) while also terrorism, is not a necessary element.   

Thank you...

Your own post proves my point, buddy. You don't intimidate an unoccupied restroom in an unoccupied government building's restroom. Terror is about frightening people. Nobody was in the buildings that Ayers set off his bombs in because they were intentionally timed to go off after hours. A terrorist blows up cars in crowded market places, flies planes into buildings in broad daylight, and commits suicide in a busy pizzaria. People who deface and damage empty buildings are vandals. Nobody in this god-forsaken blog has any proof that William Ayers ever intended to hurt a living soul. He was angry at the government, not citizens. Again, this is not to justify his acts. It's just to get some people here to stop trivializing real terrorism. The people who do most of the posting in this blog are just out of control ideologues who are angry about what happened in this election. Angry to the point of believing all the lies and distortions that came out of the most despicable presidential campaign since Andrew Jackson ran against John Quincy Adams. This may come as a shock to some of you, but not every word that came out of Sarah Palin's mouth was true. In fact, they were meant to incite suspicion and hatred among people like you. And you bought it, which says more about you than anything else.

Well said!!!  If Sarah

Well said!!!

 If Sarah Palin represents the future of the GOP, then the GOP is doomed.

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

No, you are a dumbass Obamatic idiot who hasn't had an original thought since birth.

What is more, you have allied yourself with a freedom-loathing, America-hating troll.

Have a nice life, Texas Wolf.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

texaswolf7777

Actually, texaswolf7777, if we conservatives DON'T turn to Sarah Palin (or someone in that vein), we are doomed.  We already turned to the Left to get more voters and that failed miserably.  Why should we stay on that course? 

Actually, you are a Leftist who is deeply embarrassed and ashamed to admit it.  It's funny how the Left is full of people who absolutely will not depart from Leftist orthodoxy no matter what the cost, while those evil conservatives - you know, those guys and gals who never think for themselves - actually engage in the most intriguing, intellectual policy debates.   

"THIS IS YOUR FINAL WARNING!!!  A WAR ON FREEWILL IS COMING!!!" - Nevermore, "Bittersweet Feast", from This Godless Endeavor (2005)

There are plenty of old

There are plenty of old articles detailing the terror inflicted by William Ayers.  Unfortunately you have to pay a fee to read them so I cannot personally quote them.  What I can find, are articles that came out around the terror attack of 9-11.  The Weathermen "hadn't done enough" Ayers said.  And that is correct.  Example follows:

 "CURIOUSLY, YOU WON’T FIND IN AYERS’S PAGES an account of the "War Council" held by the Weather Underground in Flint, Michigan, in December 1969, at which he and Dohrn were key players. It was at the Flint War Council that Dohrn admonished the four hundred delegates to stop being "wimpy" and "scared of fighting," and to "get into armed struggle." Invoking the example of Charles Manson, who had killed Sharon Tate and all her houseguests in the Los Angeles hills, Dohrn declared, "Dig it. First they killed those pigs, then they ate dinner in the same room with them, they even shoved a fork into a victim’s stomach! Wild!" She closed her speech by holding up three fingers in what she called the "Manson fork salute." Dohrn was followed by one of Ayers’s friends, John Jacobs, who told the crowd, "We’re against everything that’s ‘good and decent’ in honky America. We will loot and burn and destroy." The delegates then discussed how to get weapons, make bombs, and rent "safe houses"—after which they broke into a nearby Catholic Church to engage in group sex."

 - Don't Need a Weatherman
The clouded mind of Bill Ayers.
by Ronald Radosh
10/08/2001

 

They wanted to escalate and either couldn't come up with the resources or the organization/motivation.  That is one thing Al-Qaeda has had on the WU.  Their motivation is unflinching.  They were willing to die for their cause.

But, I think to somehow try to grade and measure the fear-factor of the people who were targets of Ayer's bombing against those who were in NY that day is offensive to all parties involved.  Comparing Ayers to vandals trivialises what he did! Vandals choose targets indiscrimately.  Ayers' repeatedly targeted government installations and institutions that represented authrority.  They were buildings in which people worked, not abandoned warehouses.

After the election our neighborhood was... vandalised or terrorized?  Only homes that had McCain and other Republican signs and bumper stickers woke up to find swastikas and other symbols of hate painted on their homes and cars.  It was like a punch in the stomach resulting in feelings of both fear and anger.  Is it a one time political statement, or next time does something get burned down? Now, whether I want to or not. I find myself unconsciously checking the locks more often and looking out into our yard at night when I hear odd noises. 

 THAT SAID and moving to a completely separate argument;  The utilization of Bill Ayers for this campaign should have been as a precision instrument but the McCain camp used it as a blunt instrument.  Instead of bringing up the idealism and motivation held by both Ayers and Obama over the course of years and illustrated by the programs they created, supported and funded he utilized the word terror like a ball peen hammer.  Going for the simplest common denominator rather than speaking directly to the people and having an honest conversation about the economic impact of these social projects and letting people draw their own conclusions.

I think that anyone who wanted to research, did so.  Those who tend to be sheep, continued with their sheep-ness regardless of campaign tactics.  And I mean that for both sides of the aisle. 

People who are independantly conservative, like myself were the ones that suffered most.  In that there was really no good choice and to keep us from falling still further down the rabbit hole, we had to vote for someone who was less than palatable.

 

member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008

You're moving the target

Nice try, but my post was in response to your initial post which was that it wasn't terrorism because he didn't kill people.  (Which, of course, the WU did do--killing at least two policemen in a shootout when they tried to rob a Brinks truck, and another officer in a bombing in San Francisco that is generally attibuted to them, in addition to three of their own members.  Death or great bodily harm is also a foreseeable outcome of shrapnel bombs, and bombs at occupied homes and under vehicles).  My only point was that killing is not a necessary element of terrorism.  Attacking civil institutions is a common form of terrorism, it sends a message that no place is safe.  However, you can't limit my argument to the few examples you cite--there were many more bombs placed by the WU, and not all of them were in empty restrooms and at least a few of them did harm or threated harm to people. 

OJ didn't kill anyone, RIGHT! .

And after you demorats took over the congress and cut off the funding this is what happened to   Viet Nam

And you FILTHY bast**ds want to do the same to Iraq.

No one I knew BLEW UP ANYTHING, BACK IN THE 60'S..

TYPICAL! righhhtteee

Now your guy is going to talk with this guy

IranianUranium

The "FILTHY bast**ds" are right, too.

This kind of irrational rant has nothing to do with reality. It's just an angry counterattack, which is what a lot of Republicans are doing now. Until you become a little more introspective and are willing to accept that you don't know as much as you think you know, the Republican Party will never win another national election. It's as simple as that. Whether you know it or not, the vast majority of Americans don't want one more U.S. soldier slaughtered in Iraq. It's not worth it. We've been there more than five years. It's time for the Iraqis to take responsibility for their own futures now. By the way, "my guy" is also your guy. Unless you're not a citizen of this country. 

»→ Your Guy?

That's just creepy JRJ.  I'll assume you're a woman. (not that there's anything wrong with, you know . . .)

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

What is this place?

It's not nearly as creepy as some of the hateful, anti-logic I've read in this blog over the last 30 minutes. It is truly scary that people in this country actually feel the way some of you do. The eagerness to accept lies out of political expediency and apply such venom to people who don't agree with you is a real sickness in this country. I'm sure none of you watched the broadcast of what went on in Grant Park on November 4th. It probably would have just made you more angry, and I think that's sad. You missed out on one of the greatest moments in the country's history because you prefer to hold onto your prejudices and anger. Self-destructive. 

Who's accepting lies here?

Who's accepting lies here?  It's sure not us as we REJECT your lies about the Weather Underground and Ayers.

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Who is "us"?

I have not mentioned the Weather Underground once. I'm talking about William Ayers and what he did. That was a large group with more violent factions in it. But, again, these people were driven by their anger about the war in Vietnam, which killed +55,000 U.S. soldiers and more than 1,000,000 Vietnamese. On top of that, it created an entire generation of homeless veterans. Who is to say which side of that argument was more immoral? Again, blowing things up is definitely a crime, but I don't think it rises to the level of terrorism. 

Are you really that stupid?

"I'm talking about William Ayers and what he did."

Are you really that stupid?  Ayers did what he did as part of the Weather Underground!

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

He couldn't be Cobra

Even JRJ couldn't defend Ayers' wrapping explosives with roofing nails and fencing staples.

Simply put, Ayers was building and passing out anti-personnel explosives.

You don't need shrapnel to bring down a wall.  You need it to kill people, though.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Justified terrorisM

"But, again, these people were driven by their anger about the war in Vietnam"

I can't believe that you're STILL trying to justify terrorism!  By your logic, I should be able to set bombs and join an organization who's stated purpose is to overthrow the Obama administration simply because I don''t like his policies!  That's outrageous!

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

JRJ08

"Again, blowing things up is definitely a crime, but I don't think it rises to the level of terrorism."

It doesn't?

(cue loopy circus music...)

Btw, isn't it a wonderful thing that Iraq is in no way, shape or form, anything resembling Vietnam? 

 

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The irony

I note that you utter NOT ONE LITTLE PEEP about the people the Vietnamese government killed in the oppression of their people, or of the famine of the 1980s, or of the "boat people" trying to get away from all of that. 

But then, you are a State-worshipping Socialist.  For you, the State is God and the Holy Shahinshah is Christ. 

THIS IS YOUR FINAL WARNING!!!  A WAR ON FREEWILL IS COMING!!!" - Nevermore, "Bittersweet Feast", from This Godless Endeavor (2005)

JRJ08

Are you done? You're projecting.

I think it's perfectly fine that we let off a little steam. Have you paid any attention to the treatment (that would be, um, complete unhinged anger, vitriol, claims of murderer, hopes for his assassination, and so on...) our current president has had to tolerate since he "stole" the 2000 election?

EDIT: Thank you, CobraMan. It never ceases to make me completely numb, how anyone can totally drink up on the lying and deceiving the mainstream media has been doling out by the truckloads. We were lied to -- and/or the truth withheld -- up and down about this utterly unqualified, no-track-record president elect, and his ugly CLOSE associations.

 

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I will never be "done"...

Unlike some people here, I don't apply extreme emotions to political disagreements. I voted for Bush in 2000, then watched a steady stream of incompetent decisions over the next 7 years. He has the lowest approval rating in history for good reason. That speaks for itself. 

As far as Obama is concerned, he's a highly intelligent, pragmatic student of history who will surround himself with the best and the brightest, rather than his college fraternity brothers. It is arguable whether or not he has had "ugly CLOSE associations", but what president hasn't? Nobody in public office lives in an insulted bubble that isolates them from all sorts of people. If we made that the litmus test for any president, only unborn children could be elected. We've had a checkers player in the Oval Office for the last 8 years and, in case you hadn't noticed, things haven't gone too well. It's time to bring a chess player and see if brains can make a difference.  

»→ Say what?

I don't apply extreme emotions to political disagreements.

If we made that the litmus test for any president, only unborn children could be elected.

Contradict yourself? Much? In the same post?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

JRJ08

"He has the lowest approval rating in history for good reason."

Oooooh yeah. For good reason, alright. And I'll let you figure that one out.

 

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»→ Good Point Shy

Seems like Abe Lincoln's populariuty rating was so bad a war was fought over it.

Good company.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

yea CA, Lincoln, the FIRST REPUBLICAN PRESIDENT..

Had a 100%  American kill rate.

he was hated so much he was assassinated.

And President Bush gets a lower rating... 

Freedom is bad.

Ignorance is strength.

We have left the paved road for, a rutty dirt road.

First Mutt's Viet Nam 2

IranianUranium

The first what?

The first what?  I guess you never heard of Thomas Jefferson (you know the founder of the Jeffersonian Republicans?) and James Madison.

On Edit: Opps, forgot the < sarc > tag  

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

I think in 20 years history

I think in 20 years history will reveal that Bush was right on the war and that the seed of democracy we planted there is now flourshing thus terrorism is now fading.  That he led our country through a challenging and unpopular war but stood steadfast in his beliefs, and that those beliefs were right for our country and the world.

Seashell

Bravo! Great post. Time will tell, but if I had any money I'd put it down that this will indeed be the case in 20 years time.

 

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You're Welcome

 
You're welcome, Mr. Shy.  It's obvious that anyone who tries to justify Ayers criminal activities, and the activities of the Weather Underground,  wasn't actually alive during that period and has no idea what was happening.  Ether that, or they agree with Ayers tactics and politics and are willing to forgive and forget terrorism simply because they sympathize with those who would use terrorism as a means of change, as long as the terrorists are on the "right"side of course.

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Age doesn't always equal intelligence...

I was alive during that time and was actually paying attention. Then I enlisted. I don't agree with criminal tactics. I also don't agree with calling Ayers' tactics "terrorism". That term was used in the recent election to instill unjustified fears in the electorate about a candidate. That's McCarthyism and I'm opposed to that because I lived through it, too. You may recall from your extensive reading of American History, that many of colonists used tactics that made Ayers' activities look tame by comparison. Sometimes-- not always-- there is a "right side" to be on. That was true in 1968. Or do you actually think that the Vietnam war was worth millions of lives?

What would you call it?

"I don't agree with criminal tactics. I also don't agree with calling Ayers' tactics "terrorism""

Setting bombs in order to terrorize the population and force political change IS terrorism!  How else can you define it?  

You seem willing to dismiss the ramifications of Ayers actions, and the actions of the revolutionary group of which he was a member, simply because you agree with his political ideals.  You seem to be willing to attempt to JUSTIFY his actions as merely a protest of government policy when, in fact, it was TERRORISM.  That's rather extreme, wouldn't you agree?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Age doesn't always equal intelligence...

and JRJ seems to be the posterboy for said assertion

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

»→ No fair botg

Witness for your perusal:

Robert Byrd

But he's a Democrat too.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Who do you keep deflecting the arguments?

Why do you keep trying to deflect the argument by continually using Vietnam as a means of justifying Ayers' terrorist activities?  Do you REALLY believe that Ayers was right?  If so, you really don't understand anything, even history.

You may not be aware of this, but the Founding Fathers did NOTHING on the order of Ayers and his terrorist organization..  They never ATTACKED the British forces prior to the Revolutionary War, even as "extreme vandalism," you know.  Several of them even traveled to England in order to conduct PEACEFUL negotiations, not to promote and practice terrorism.  

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Boys and girls, please pay close attention to JRJ08...

...as this is what happens when you smoke a great deal of hash (among other things) in your formative years:

You grow up to be a freedom-loathing, brain-damaged America-hater.

Please, please don't let this happen to your children.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

The cleaners just called.

The cleaners just called. Your pillow cases and sheets are ready to be picked up. 

»→ JRJ

You're a secretary?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

You sound like John F'ing

It is totally disgusting for you to give Ayers a pass for his criminal and terrorist activities because you were/are against the VietNam war.

That doesn't excuse Ayers in the least little bit, and BTW, when were you put in charge of U.S. foreign policy anyway?

The war was what it was, and those who fought and died there dont' deserve the condescension dripping from your post.

 

»→ Blonde

JRJ just watched Obama's address over at change.gov.

I don't think that's condescension dripping from his post.

BWAHAHAHAAaaaaaaa.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

JRJ08, either you are mentally ill, or a liar in the extreme.

McCarthy was right in many cases, btw, and if you knew anything at all about history, you would know that.

Shortly after the Berlin Wall fell and the USSR collapsed, the KGB and GRU files were accessed, and many of those that McCarthy had fingered as being communist subversives name's were in those files.

You may recall from your extensive reading of American History, that many of colonists used tactics that made Ayers' activities look tame by comparison.

This is a demonstrably false statement on your part.

As for the Vietnam war costing "millions of lives," that did not happen until Ted Kennedy and his cronies forced us to leave Vietnam in disgrace. Shortly thereafter, several million people in the region were slaughtered.

Something I have also noticed about your blatant hypocrisy when it comes to people being killed:

In the 20th Century, between 150 and 200 million people were directly or indirectly murdered by the very form of government that you espouse, which is Marxism.

I have yet to see even one comment on your part that comes close to lamenting this historical fact. Is it possible that you have no problem whatsoever with what happened to those unfortunate people?

Personally, I believe you probably secretly applaud what happened to them, and may even wish it had happened to millions more, as my readings of your posts to date suggest to me that you are, in fact, mentally ill.

Your credibility here is fast approaching zilch.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

Boy, you fit right into the

Boy, you fit right into the Republican Party, calling me a Marxist. 

Generalizing again

You're generalizing again, equating anyone who argues with you as an Republican (as if there's something wrong with being a Republican) .  Do you always assume that you know someone's political affiliations?

Tell, me, Sir, what political affiliations do I hold?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

JR Dudelette, you are a Democrat, Founders of the KKK

I'm a CONSERVATIVE..

No wonder you have plenty of sheets available.

The First republican president Freed the slaves, and was Killed, by you guessed it a democrat .

 

First Mutt's Viet Nam 2

IranianUranium

Actually JRJ08, you have identified yourself as a Marxist...

...by your incessant and irrational support for those that are, in fact, Marxists.
How any intelligent, rational person could support either in whole, or in part, the most dignity-robbing, oppressive and murderous form of government yet devised by man is beyond me.

BTW-I am a Libertarian, not a Republican, which means my love and understanding of true freedom is beyond your intellectual ability to comprehend.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

btw

If you knew what a Marxist was, I might be offended. But, if your reading comprehension is any indication, you've never picked up a book in your life and probably think his first name was Groucho. 

JRJ08,

The fact that you cannot refute any of my previous replies to your Obama programed posts says it all.

Go back to shagging golf balls at your local driving range, as it is rather clear that you are not sufficiently equipped intellectually to continue your pursuits here.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

mc carthy was right in a lot

mc carthy was right in a lot of cases...his problem was in the cases he persued against people who were not communist,had never been but just happened to be someone who got in his way.. what started out as a just and noble cause ended with him dying a disgraced drunk,but he only had himself to blame

I don't believe you or Ayers

You sir never served a day in the military.

Yes. The Vietnam war was worth everything.

I would put your age at no more than 15.

Sincerely,

a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.

Sincerely...

You, sir, are incorrect. 

»→ JRJ, you're wrong

Several years ago I bought a gold plated railroad watch at an estate sale.  It is beautiful, it still works, and it wasn't cheap.  As of Nov 4 2008, it was 110 years old.

For two years now I've been discussing and arguing politics with a black friend at work.  It gets lively, heated and edgy.

Last week I presented him with that watch to commemorate an event I didn't vote in favor of, but understood somewhat the extent of personal fulfillment this election brought to African Americans.

Don't tell me about my sickness, JRJ.  You're making some silly assumptions.

LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

No one here didn't

No one here didn't understand the historic nature of what happened with the election of Obama.  Most people here have also stated that they would love to see an African-American ascend to the Presidency but the right person.  We are in the middle of 2 wars and the largest economic meltdown in our lives and we have elected a guy with NO experience at all.  That is scary and really downright dangerous.  And as far as feeling anger, it is because the media did not report on anything that might have given people pause at electing Obama.  They gave him a pass on everything and presented all information regarding him in the BEST possible light while devouring McCain and Palin.  That is where any anger is coming from.

Seashell

"We are in the middle of 2 wars and the largest economic meltdown in our lives and we have elected a guy with NO experience at all."

THAAAAAAANK

YOUUUUUUUUU !!!!!!

Seashell :)

 

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The right person got elected.

So here were the choices in this election:

A man who had nearly been expelled from the Senate during a banking scandal, who graduated 894th in his Naval Academy class of 899 midshipmen. (By the way, he only got into the Academy because his father and grandfather were Admirals in the U.S. Navy). A injured man who appears to be suffering from Post Traumatic Stress Disorder, who has a reputation in the Senate for being short-tempered and "too tightly coiled". A man who supported the most disastrous president in U.S. history 92% of the time...

Or...

A younger man who graduated from Columbia, then at the top of his Harvard Law class, then became the first African-American to be president of the Harvard Law Review. A man who taught Constitutional law at the University of Illinois, and worked to help low-income families as the head of the Annenberg Trust in Chicago. A man who was a State Senator and then U.S. Senator, who has shown a genuine ability to inspire people, give them hope, and provide intelligent, pragmatic leadership rather than intransigent ideology-driven thinking. And, finally, a man who ran one of the most difficult and brilliant presidential campaigns in our history. 

 No contest.  

JRJ08

You are incurable.

You win. Now go back to your lib la-la land and leave us clear-eyed people with brains alone.

 

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And thank God for that...

If your point of view represents the cure, I'll take the disease. 

You people hurl invectives at someone you know nothing about, and ignore facts that don't affirm your misconceptions. It's almost a mob mentality in this blog.

 In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is king. 

"It's almost a mob mentality

"It's almost a mob mentality in this blog."

Almost? No, it's without question a full-on mob of smart people taking precious time out from their lives to talk some sense into deluded, BDS/PDS/McDS drinkers such as yourself.

"ignore facts that don't affirm your misconceptions."

Please list these facts, which we won't ignore -- we almost never do -- but WILL refute with evidence to the contrary... as we've been doing again.... and again.... and again... here.

We are patient to a fault with you, actually.

 

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Project much?

Project much?  The only one I see trying to "hurl invective[s]" here is you when you make baseless claims that people like myself oppose Obama simply because he's black

That's a completely inaccurate assumption on your part.  I oppose Obama because he's a liberal, his skin color has no bearing on his politics.

"In the Land of the Blind, the one-eyed man is king."

I hope that you grow an eye soon, as you seem blind to history, even recent history. You also seem to be selectively blind as to what constitutes terrorism and what justifies  terrorist activities.

 

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

»→ You people?

Actually JRJ, we're not really here to educate you.

We're here because we're conservatives. 

Other than reaffirming our suspicions about Liberals, and their abiding love and deification of elderly terrorists like Ayers, Castro, and Arafat, I'm wondering what you're doing in a conservative blog?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

cool --->

Hahaha... thanks! That was wonderful.

I will now stop banging my aching head against this wall.

Liberal enters conservative blog. Liberal receives "mob mentality" treatment when hurling liberal talking points. Go figure.

 

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Educate yourself first...

<b>I'm in a conservative blog because hearing an opposing view is a healthy thing. Of course, the problem here is that all I've heard is a lot of anger about the election, and nothing at all about conservative values. This blog is a terrific microcosm of the Republican Party, since it's built on a deep-seated hatred of anybody who doesn't believe exactly as you do. Every response I've read in this blog has been a venomous counterattack, as if the regulars here are the only people who know the truth about anything. You show the same "excessive decisiveness" that rank amateur Sarah Palin showed. Instead of trying to insult me, which is just plain stupid, you should all be asking yourselves why people like David Brookes, George Will, Susan Eisenhower, Peggy Noonan, Kathleen Parker, Colin Powell, Scott McClellan, and Ken Dubenstein all rejected the Republican ticket and voted for Barack Obama. Or do you all think you're more conservative or intelligent than any of them? </b>

You are right on the money.

You are right on the money. As long as the conservative movement allows itself to be hijacked by the reactionary, hate-filled, anti-intellectual chorus, it is doomed to failure.

I live in red-state Texas, and I saw MANY yard signs that said "Republicans for Obama." McCain and the GOP remain empowered in this area, but their extent of their dominance is shrinking at an extremely fast rate. More and more people are fed up with the constant drumbeat of stupidity and intolerance that they hear from the hardcore right. They realize that the right-wing hatreds of government, of minorities, of women, of LGBTs, of the planet Earth, of intellect, these are all largely to blame for the shit we are in as a society. Many Republican coworkers of mine were scared shitless when McCain nominated Palin. They can plainly see that she is a dunce, an intellectual floozie, an embarrassment. If she represents the future of the GOP, then that future is strikingly bleak.

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

You'll notice that you're

You'll notice that you're the only one here who responded to that question. 

He's a smart guy, no doubt

He's a smart guy, no doubt about it, but he still has no experience in running this country especially in  a time of war.  The only thing he knows about foreign policy is what has been spoon fed to him by advisors.  We know nothing on how he will deal with the likes of Ahmadinejad, Chavas, etc. except that he wants to meet with them unconditionally. 

Also in your profile of Obama you fail to mention anything about his ties to these unsavorary people (at least they are unsavorary to me) who have influenced his life and his political thinking.  "Spreading the wealth around"   "Civilian security force"    We just don't know how he is going to govern (thanks to the MSM).  Our concerns over Obama are real and have merit.  McCain at least knows what is going on in the world and has a proven track record especially on the 2 main problems we face today, the wars and the economy.  He was for the serge (Obama against it) and legislation he put forth on Freddie and Fanny (Obama against that to)  As far as the Keating 5, he admitted that it was the worst mistake of his life (and he only met with him 2 times if memory serves me correctly.)

Point being, Bill Clinton was right, he said that with Obama "your getting a role of the dice".  To me it was not the right time to take such a gamble.

Brains trumps experience...

In fact, Obama has more experience than Abraham Lincoln did. George W. Bush had a lot of executive experience, yet he'll go down in history as the worst President ever, second only to Richard M. Nixon, who had even more experience. You have to look at both tickets to make a fair comment about the experience issue. John McCain has zero executive experience, and he represented a relatively small state. As a pilot, he never commanded anybody and, on top of that, he had a terrible flying record. Your "concerns" about Obama are largely driven by the misinformation generated by the campaign. If you look at any of those issues objectively, none of them is as worrisome as what McCain did with Charles Keating. If he hadn't been a war "hero", he would have been indicted and expelled from the Senate. Obama was against the "surge" because nobody told him that the U.S. was in the process of bribing Sunni warlords to get them to go after Al Qaeda. Also, NOBODY had any idea that the "Awakening" in Anbar Province would end up being as powerful as it was. Without those two factors, the surge would have been a terrible failure and a lot more U.S. soldiers would have come home in a body bag. So, let's try to look at the issue of Obama's worries about the surge with a little objectivity. (Like there's a chance of that happening here).

JRJ08

"George W. Bush had a lot of executive experience, yet he'll go down in history as the worst President ever, second only to Richard M. Nixon, who had even more experience."

Good grief. Your #1 and #2 is Nixon and Bush. Let me guess, #3 is Reagan?

Yeah, JRJ08, you're a liberal alright.

And who's this new coat-tail ridin', toilet paper carrying sidekick of yours, TexasSomething, who farcically labels himself a Republican?

 

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I think Reagan will probably

I think Reagan will probably be viewed as one of the great presidents. And is popularity was always very high. So your suggestion that I would make him #3 is just another example of your brain being out of order. 

I think Reagan will probably

I think Reagan will probably be viewed as one of the great presidents. And his popularity was always very high. So your suggestion that I would make him #3 is just another example of your brain being out of order. 

B i n g o ! ! ! I am a

B i n g o ! ! !

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

JRJ08

"It's not worth it."

Many (but not all) here think it was completely worth it.

Look at how much safer from terrorism the world has been since early 2004. Look how there's one less madman dictator. Look how there's a flourishing and free democracy sprouting in the heart of the Middle East. Really, don't be afraid. Look. I know it could cause your whole comfy view on the war to collapse, but you're going to have to look eventually. 

Btw, Americans don't want one more police officer slaughtered on duty, and don't want one more fireman killed, either. So what's your point?

 

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Already looked

It's true. There is one less dictator in the world and there's no question that Saddam & Sons were among the most brutal we've seen. But he has been out of power now for five years and most of the U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq died AFTER he was deposed. So the question is, how long do you continue to occupy a country where most of the people there hate you and want to kill you? If that's not true, why is that the only safe place for our soldiers and administrators is in the Green Zone? I don't have a "comfy view on the war"? I know what war can do to people. It's time we started to pull our people out of Iraq. By the way, your policeman/fireman analogy makes no sense.  And that "flourishing and free democracy" in the heart of Middle East is a seething cauldron of religious intolerance and mutual hatred. It's been that way there for the last 600 years. 

Wake up!

Wake up!  Those troop died PROTECTING the Iraqi people from those who tried to use murder and torture in order to control the population, died protecting the citizens of Iraq from terrorists who were trying to OVERTHROW a democratically elected government, chosen by the Iraqi people themselves.  I guess that democracy isn't worth protecting if it involves the loss of a single American, right?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Wide awake, thanks.

Those people who tried to "use murder and torture in order to control the population" didn't show up until after we got there. Democracy is our form of government. The last time I looked, it was not the form of government of every other nation on Earth. We imposed democracy on a country that has deep, religious-motivated divisions that have existed for centuries. It is incredibly naive to think that a country with the social structure that has survived since the Middle Ages is going to flourish with our form of government. It is being held together today with the blood of U.S. soldiers, bullets and billions of U.S. dollars. 

You ARE that stupid!

You ARE that stupid!  Saddam and his government not only promoted, and practiced,  terrorism against his own citizens, he trained said terrorists in order for him and his government to retake the country after his "fall."

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

If the people of Iraq didn't

If the people of Iraq didn't want democracy why were they so thrilled to be able to vote?  Remember all the purple fingers? 

The Iraqis chose democracy too, you know

The Iraqis chose democracy too, you know.  They VOTED for their Constitution and their form of government, it wasn't imposed upon them.  Do you denigrate them for CHOOSING democracy and do you feel they their democracy isn't worth protecting?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

History lesson

Paul Bremmer established the Iraqi form of government, not the Iraqis. Of course Iraqis voted. Why wouldn't they after living under Saddam for 20 years. Democracy is a labor-intensive form of government that doesn't work properly in a violent atmosphere with deep religious divisions and a non-existent educational system. There is a reason why there are no other genuine democracies in that region of the world.  

double post

sorry... see below. :)

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

There is a reason why there

There is a reason why there are no other genuine democracies in that region of the world. "

And, President Bush is the reason there IS at least ONE genuine democracy in that region of the world.

Makes you wonder... maybe dreaming the impossible dream isn't such a bad thing.

Hope and change is certainly something that Bush was able to bring to one once-horrible region of the M.E.. He's owed a lot of gratitude for that.

And now, JRJ08, I will return to the wall where I was banging my head against it steadily as your posts continue to pile up on this thread.

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

Mr. Shy

Well said.

That explains it...

A genuine democracy that doesn't represent huge segments of the population, including the Kurds. A genuine democracy that has closer ties to Iran than to the U.S. Are you kidding? You think that a democracy can just be air-dropped on a highly fractionalized society like Iraq and, BINGO, instant freedom? You've been banging your head against a wall? Maybe that's your problem... 

JRJ08

Live with it and stop the laughable spin.

We conquered (oh yes, I'm sure that "aggressive", "warmongering" word is verbotin in your circles) and dismantled a horrible dictatorship.

We successfully planted a democratic government with a constitution.

Millions of Iraqi's now live in freedom.

We pulled this off in the HEART of the Middle East.

I know it burns, JRJ, but it happened. I seriously recommend you drop debating this one amazing success we achieved. Some others might be valid -- *might* -- but on this one you look totally foolish.

Thanks. 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

RINO PURGE CHAT

C-H-A-T

 

"Gov. Palin has been subjected to one of the most massive and dishonest pile-on smear attacks in the history of liberal media."  -- Lowell Ponte

Oh, that liberal media...

Governor Palin did a great job of smearing herself, every time she got in front of an audience or a television camera. The media just reported the facts. She's an idiot. 

Bite me, you terrorist-coddling troll!

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

Free, LOL-I think we need a TROLL PURGE C-H-A-T

Thick they are getting here at NB.  :-(

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

Right you are RD

Right you are.

 

"Gov. Palin has been subjected to one of the most massive and dishonest pile-on smear attacks in the history of liberal media."  -- Lowell Ponte

What we "pulled off"

 Many Iraqis don't have electricity or running water and are afraid to go anywhere where there are crowds, day or night.The oil is flowing, but the drinking water isn't. Yeah, it's a real paradise over there. You've obviously spent your whole life living in the "green zone". 

Say what?

"Paul Bremmer established the Iraqi form of government, not the Iraqis."

Say what?  Talk about the blind leading the blind! Didn't you see the LIVE news reports of Iraqi's standing in line to VOTE for their Constitution, a Constitution that was created by an IRAQI coalition of regional representatives?  Did you also miss the news reports of the Iraqi's who, once again, stood in line to vote for the people who would represent them in this newly created Constitutional government

Contrary to your argument, the Iraqi's chose their form of Government, we didn't choose it for them.

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

What about the invasion...

This just shows an ignorance of the facts. In case you hadn't noticed, we invaded Iraq, deposed its leaders and dissolved its army. Does the name Chalabi ring a bell? Paul Bremmer designed and constructed the Iraqi government. The voting you mention here took place AFTER the government was formed. Sheesh.

Uh, comrade Bill,

...we invaded Iraq, deposed its leaders and dissolved its army

Which is specifically what you liberals favorite America-hating international body of 3rd World dictator wanna-be potentates, your precious UN, duly authorized us to do.

Funny how you spineless lefties always manage to leave that fact out.

Then again, what should we expect from a group of people who think Hugo Chavez is a swell guy.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

So much for Israel

"There is a reason why there are no other genuine democracies in that region of the world."

So, Israel doesn't exist any more?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

»→ You're right Cobra

Rahm Emanuel rebuked his own father yesterday in a show of support for the Arab countries.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Scratch Afghanistan as well

I guess we can scratch  Afghanistan off the list as well.  I mean, really, how can anyone describe a government that was democratically chosen by their own citizens as a Democracy?

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

JRJ08, Israel is a Democracy,

Been there for ohhh 2,500 years..

Now a DEMOCRATIC COUNTRY

Why don't you try and read Israel's history book..

First Mutt's Viet Nam 2

IranianUranium

At least I can read...

Israel has been there for "2,500 years"? Really? I thought it was just 60 years. Dang! You do realize that most of the people who formed the first Israeli government were not born there. 

Id like to see proof.

"Democracy is a labor-intensive form of government that doesn't work properly in a violent atmosphere with deep religious divisions and a non-existent educational system."

I'd like to see proof of this.  After all, what you describe is AMERICA in the first 100 years of it's existence. Remember the Indian Wars?  The Spanish-American War, The Mexican-American War, etc?  Democracy seems to have to worked for us, why can't it work for other countries as well? American Democracy even survived a Civil War, and you can't get much more violent than that!

Obama: My job is above my pay grade

Thank you. You have

Thank you.

You have brought some sanity to these boards!

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

so the majority here are

so the majority here are insane?

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

No, just delusional. I am

No, just delusional.

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

of course then wolfie

you are wrong? or lying? which is it?

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

»→ botg

Has optometrist displayed any ability to think for himself, or is he still just expressing his willingness?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

>>>--->

i think he's waiting to be taught how

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

You're no conservative

You're a socialist.  I have a verrrry long memory, Texas Wolf.

 

Verrrrry long?

Shouldn't use big words that you don't really understand. Just because it's fashionable now to call people "socialists" doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. People who resort to using these kinds of "dirty words" just don't have any ideas of their own. When you retire, will you send your Social Security checks back to the government and refuse to let MediCare help pay for your medical care because you hate socialism? Anything short of that will just mean you're a hypocrite.

false dilemna there jrj

no doubt my friend Blonde has already more than paid for any benefits she will receive.  Unless of course all payments she has made are returned with say 4% compound interest---a deal i'd take in a minute.  As to any name calling, if the descrirtion fits claim it with pride, why are you ashamed of your views?

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

JRJ and Tex

You two should collaborate with Michael Moore and make a movie. You could call it "Every excuse you ever wanted to give for terrorists". You should both wear the liberal label with pride.

And you JRJ, are a fool!

For a one week wonder here, you sure sling stupidity like a professional.

So, let me give you a little lesson here, JRJ.

TexasOptomist used to post here as TexasWolf.....and actually linked to the World Socialist Website all the time.

Of course, if you had any sense, or couth, you might have just kept your insults to yourself until you actually understood the situation.  But alas, you are a garden variety troll.

You may go now.

We need a better class of troll, here.

 

It's "TexasOptimist" not "Optomist"

It takes about two seconds to "understand the situation" here. Don't flatter yourself. There's not a lot of complex thinking going on in this blog. Admit it. I've made it a lot more entertaining and instructive for you guys lately. Otherwise, you'd all just be wanking each other, and how dull would that be. 

(yawn)

(yawn)

Sheesh....you're a Spelling Nazi, too

I see my point totally sailed right over your head.  Go figure.

If that's the best you've got....that's plain pathetic.

Glad to see you learned a new word today.

We need a better class of troll, here.

 

 

TO, you are a libtroll who hasn't had an original thought...

...since birth.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

And you think Sarah Palin

And you think Sarah Palin rocks!

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

amazing coincidence - we

amazing coincidence - we are too! 

NO Ayers was NOT

Ayers was the typical angry college kid during the late 1960's. If you lived through that era, you know exactly what his mentality was because it was prevalent everywhere.

unless the typical angry college kid planted bombs which we did NOT!!   i know i was there

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

YOu know?

Wow! You were there? Really? Or did you just jump into Mr. Peabody's Way-Back machine and hurl insults from a safe distance? Maybe you weren't a "typical angry college kid". Maybe you thought the Vietnam war was a good thing. Remember Kent State? 

do i remember?

isle vista, berkeley, Kent State, yeah even Haight Asbury and the angels at the Stones concert.  As the Who said "this ain't no social crisis it's just you having fun" how do you think socio-paths have fun?

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

It's Isla Vista, not Isle vista

Isla, not "isle". It was nice there, until they burned down the bank. 

---yawn--- i'm bored --- see

---yawn--- i'm bored --- see you later

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

»→ JRJ

People call Los Angeles "City of The Angels".  Is there something wrong with that?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Comrade Bill,

I think I have noodled out the reason why, four decades later, you remain so very bitter about this country's involvement in Vietnam, and probably Korea, too.

You, like most lefties, are at heart, communist sympathizers. You will never publicly admit this, but you betray yourselves by your actions in whom you are willing to publicly defend.

I am guessing here (not really), but I'll bet that you are one of these "utopian totalitarian" types who actually believes that the USSR was a "classless society." That, of course, is utter nonsense, as most people in that unfortunate "empire" lived in abject poverty (but, as you and your ilk see it, they were all equal, right?) Their only mission in life was to work themselves to death in support the elite few in the highest places of power. The upper classes, if you will. If they resisted in any way, they were promptly hauled off to the Gulag, to work themselves to death for the "good of the state."

You probably also believe that Marxism was created to help the average person, so that they could all "share in the prosperity." Only problem is, there is no prosperity to share, as Marxism was created specifically to put a very small number of people in ultimate power and keep them there.

Marxism was pretty easy to sell to the uneducated peasants of the world, who were more than willing to go along with it, as their knowledge of basic economics was virtually nonexistent. This, of course, was why the Stalins, Maos and the rest of the dictators of history would go after the true intellectuals in their respective countries soon after gaining power. The true intellectuals knew Marxism was a ploy, and would never work in the real world.

You steadfastly resent the fact that this country actively fought against what is essentially a form of slavery twice in the last century, both in Korea and Vietnam. You cannot quite get over the fact that the United States of America, which was founded upon principles that are diametrically opposed to Marxism in every way, actually interfered with the plans of the utopian totalitarian's efforts to bring Marxism to the masses.

The blatant support of you lefties for Fidel Castro is not only well documented, but is legendary among those of us who actually cherish true freedom, a concept that is utterly lost on you and your Marxist brethren. Even today, given the hell-hole Cuba has become, you on the left still hold that murdering bastard up as some sort of an example to be emulated. You and your ilk resent the Cuban embargo by the US, while totally ignoring the massive economic aid that has been pouring into Cuba from other countries, yet Cuba curiously remains a hell hole.

We saw this resentment manifest itself again in the in the blatant support of Mao on the part of you utopian totalitarians. Mao, who got his rocks off watching millions of his own people die, either through starvation or outright murder, was held in rather high esteem by you utopian totalitarians. His death was lamented by many of you, and I remember reading not a few writings of those of your ilk who were somewhat saddened to see the passing of such a "visionary."

We saw this resentment on the part of you utopian totalitarians yet again in the 1980's, when many on the left were castigating Ronald Reagan for his opposition to the Marxist Daniel Ortega, and to communism in general. Your opposition to Reagan had nothing to do with whether or not he had bent some obscure law, but everything to do with the fact that, once again, the United States was interfering with the progress of Marxism.

You on the left had a collective conniption when Reagan referred to the USSR as an "evil empire." Truth of the matter was, it was an evil empire, under which many millions of people had died, either through starvation or outright murder (Notice there is a pattern developing here.) Yet, in the face of that, you who were sympathetic to "the cause" fell all over yourselves praising Gorbachev, who was doing all he could to preserve the status quo. Thankfully he failed in his mission.

We saw this yet again in the 1990's, when certain Clintonistas were falling all over themselves praising murderous dictators like Kim Jong-il, who, like Stalin and Mao, had a bit of a problem in that his people were either dying of starvation or being outright murdered (there is that pattern again.)

We are seeing it yet again in the left's blatant support of Hugo Chavez, whose country, despite having a huge supply of oil in the ground, is even now approaching 3rd World status.

Your boy Bill, who you have done nothing but defend since you were first admitted here, is a big buddy of Hugo's, and is not exactly un-fond of Fidel. The organization he was once a member of, and to this day, refuses to condemn, was evil to its core.

As I see it, you support everything that Bill Ayers stands for.

So go ahead, keep right on defending this low-life POS here on the pages of NB, as all you are really managing to accomplish is putting yourself on his level.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

Don't forget, the targets

Don't forget, the targets of the WU were viable.

I am a conservative who is willing to think for himself.

I lived through that

I lived through that era.  I was in college in that era.  Ayers is a murderer, using as his means the same as Timothy McVeigh.  The only difference was the number of people killed.  Ayers' total was three policemen and the occupants of the bomb factory in NJ that blew up prematurely.   He should have been executed, just as McVeigh was.

This is inaccurate. Ayers

This is inaccurate. Ayers never killed or even injured a single person. You're guilty of distorting the facts. And it sounds like you've got a terrific "string 'em up" mentality, which must make your parents proud. 

sir, are you a

sir, are you a lawyer?

member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008

OK. There's no reason to get

OK. There's no reason to get nasty and start insulting me. Have I called you a name? Yet? 

its a simple question - are

its a simple question - are you?  :) And no I dont believe you have called me any names.  Did you intend to start?

member of the Conservative Independant Witness Protection Program since Nov. 5, 2008

OK. There's no reason to get

OK. There's no reason to get nasty and start insulting me. Have I called you a name? Yet? I'm losing track.

»→ JRJ

I asked in another thread, and you chickened away before answering, so I'll ask again.

Is it Hitler's finger on the trigger of a smoking gun that turns you against him, or is it the actions of his organization?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Ah! I remember the question.

Ah! I remember the question. It's not that I "chickened away". I just have this inflexible policy about not answering stupid questions. Sorry. Did I miss any others? By the way, what happens when you untie LYDSEXICs or whatever it is in your signature?

»→ That's simple

"I just have this inflexible policy about not answering stupid questions."

And though it's not a substantive answer, it is nevertheless, an answer.

You really are a conundrum, wrapped in an enema, and cloaked in a riddle, aren't you?

Your inability to answer my question concerning a divergence of the Ayers/Hitler parallel does not render the question stupid.  It just lays bare your inability to reason beyond very shallow limits.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

»→ Come on JRJ

I sent you on a piscatorial excursion a good while ago, and you still haven't returned with what you're looking for?

Come on, JRJ.  I know it's a big WEB, but you do know how to use a search engine, don't you?

BTW, it's a trap.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Inacurrate?  In a pigs

Inacurrate?  In a pigs eye.

You obviously do not understand what it means to be an accomplice or an accessory after the fact.  By being an unrepentant FOUNDER of the Weather Underground Organization, Ayers has associated himself directly with the criminal acts committed by that conspiracy of which he was a part.

Now, do you deny that the WUO was responsible for the police station bombing referenced here?   Ayers is one of the prime suspects in this unsolved murder.  Or do you deny the bomb factory that exploded here, killing WUO members Diana Oughton, Ted Gold and Terry Robbins, was operated by the WUO?

It appears that Ayers was in fact likely a principle to one of these murders, that of Sgt McDonnell, SFPD.  He is, by his own admission, a principle in the US Capitol bombing.  He is likely an accomplice to several of the other bombings and he is most certainly an accesory to the other murders committed by the WUO.  That makes him guilty of capital murder.  He should be executed.

All points mine.  you lose.

JRJ

Wow.  If you are a conservative, I'm a pickle.

I suppose that so long as Al Quaida, Hamas, PLO, IRA, etc bomb buildings and cars without the intent to kill people (irregardless as to whether their bombs are wrapped for shrapnel) that they are not really terrorist organizations--merely criminal protest organizations.  That's really amazing.  I suppose that if they had actually killed that boy and his family who were present in the home at the time of the bombing it would merely have been an unfortunate accident?  And the car bomb at their family vehicle is also not intended to actually harm them?  Just to harm their vehicle?  And if it was your family trapped, terrified, inside a burning house with a bomb on your family vehicle, you would honestly, HONESTLY, believe it was merely an act of extreme vandalism not actually intended to hurt you?  HONESTLY?

I've not read your response to that, and I'd like to see you address it honestly, if you can.

Dear Pickle....

Again, you've made my point for me. All of the organizatons you've mentioned here are well-known for targeting innocent civilians. Unless, you think Al Qaeda would be happy to set off bombs in unoccupied buildings. I don't know where you're getting this "shrapnel" crap, but it has nothing to do with what William Ayers did. Each of the scenarios you describe in this post only applies to a handful of acts perpetrated by a more violent faction of the Weather Underground. Ayers didn't advocate hurting people and he NEVER did. You can't create an imaginary scenario, as you've done here, then accuse somebody of causing it. That's ridiculous. If Ayers had ever intended to injure or kill anybody, I would be calling for his head, too. Furthermore, the charges against him would never have been dropped on some technicality. You need to hitch up to reality here. A terrorist's intent is to maim and kill. Period. That's what causes real terror. $200,000 damage to an unoccupied government bathroom is NOT terrorism. It's a crime, but it's not terrorism. Sarah Palin called Ayers a terrorist hoping it would make people fearful of Obama. That is McCarthyism. Is that what you want to associate yourself with? Is this the face of the new Republican Party? Because, if it is, it will never win another national election in this country. 

JerkRJerk08

"A terrorist's intent is to maim and kill. Period."

dictionary.com: the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, esp. for political purposes.

Now go away. Please.

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

No. You go away.

As Howard Cosell would say, your juvenile insults are "spitballs against a battleship." And, once again, your trip to the dusty dictionary makes my point. You don't "intimidate or coerce" empty buildings. When was the last time a terrorist "threatened" an empty building? Vandalism is an act of protest that is defined by physical damage to real property. Terrorism is creating terror through violent acts that are intended to maim and kill human beings. 

Scorecard

Fire the score keeper.

it's like troll smackdown

it's like troll smackdown 101 here today

we need a challenge dammit 

Dominate education now 

Stubborn Guy (edit, h/t Free :))

"Terrorism is creating terror through violent acts that are intended to maim and kill human beings."

Find a credible dictionary source that has the words "maim" or "kill" or any word referring to killing of living beings. Also, in this definition, it HAS to be pointed out that without these actions it is not terrorism. 

I provided you one from dictionary.com, which would be considered by all as the online standard-bearer.

Now get crackin'. 

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

OK...

According to Dictionary.com, a "terrorist" is "a person who terrorizes or frightens others." In this case, "others" seems to refer to human beings. The word "building"or "bathroom" is no where to be seen. Name a single terrorist group anywhere in the world today that doesn't target human beings? Terrorists blow up buildings to get at the people inside them. How many empty pizzarias, buses, and market places have been attacked by suicide bombers? Now it's your turn to get crackin'. 

no jrj

you destroy things to intimidate people, are you so deficient as to not make that elementary connection?

 

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

OK, you win...

So, you actually believe that Ayers was trying to "intimidate" the United States government and its military infrastructure by "destroying" a bathroom? And you think that "intimidation" is equal to terrorism? Therefore, you must think that most of the people who protested the Vietnam war by surrounding government buildings were terrorists. Difficult to argue with that impeccable logic. 

fertile imagination there jrj you imagine a strawman

"i don't know if i want white america to remember or forget that Jesus Christ was the first non-violent revolutionary--- ah dig it ---there's something happening here what it is ain't exactly clear"

but you go on defending a terrorist in the name of peace

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

Buffalo Springfield...

Uh, I'm not defending terrorists, kid. I'm just helping you understand what the word means so that you won't keep misusing it. 

who needs your help?

you probably still believe John Lennon was a guy who believed in sharing---who just happened to die with almost a half a billion in the bank

As far as terrorism -- the goal is to change policy by frightening the population the means is a secondary concern, killing works but is not necessary.

if you are as old as i and haven't figured some of this out by now you may just be hopelessly narrow minded.

time to graduate from 4th street dude

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

I think, JRJ

That you're a coward.

You may go now.

 

More names?

And, of course, you're so brave for posting that remark in an anonymous forum. Your folks must be very proud.

No, RJR

I think you're a coward because you haven't replied to my earlier post, where I caught you red-handed being a wanker.

But you're not adult enough to admit you were wrong, ergo sum....you ARE a coward.

You may go now.

 

ergo sum?

How dare you call me a wanker? I've never wanked in my life. Not once. I will only admit that I have been wanked in the past. So watch how you throw that word around. It might hit you in the eye. By the way, I never saw your "earlier post". Otherwise, I would have been happy to wank you. 

Bring it on, troll boy.

Blonde's School for Trolls will be open for the next half hour.

Hint for you:  You got all worked up because I pointed out that Texas Optomist is a Socialist.

Do your own work.

 

 

you've never wanked? are

you've never wanked? are you sterile??

 

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

Good news for you...

Hey, Einstein. You don't have to be fertile to wank. I think the term you're searching for here is "impotent". Look that one up in your dictionary. 

jrj

you obviously haven't a handle on all the meanings of the term.  best you make some friends across the pond to explain it to you.

   “The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.”   -Chief Justice John Roberts

Blonde...

I also think that your username fits you nicely.

Thank you

You are apparently not totally stupid.

 

Is that irony?

Is that irony?

Is that irony? Or are you

Is that irony? Or are you just wanking me?

Actually, I'm ignoring you

Which must totally annoy you since you had to reply to me twice.

 

But you just responded, so

But you just responded, so you're not ignoring me. Or, are you still wanking me? Not that I mind... the wanking, that is. 

Ayers set bombs and blew

Ayers set bombs and blew things up.

That's violence. That's terrorism.

Next. 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

Next...

Post hoc fallacy. Not all violence is terrorism. That is not to say that violence is good, either. 

JRJ08

Aren't you exhausted with all your losing here? And do you have no shame? 

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

Well, I am a little tired...

But I have single-handedly taken on the mob and emerged without a scratch. And I've done so without calling anybody a jerk or or a nazi or a bigot or a nincompoop. 

JRJ08

"But I have single-handedly taken on the mob and emerged without a scratch. And I've done so without calling anybody a jerk or or a nazi or a bigot or a nincompoop."

Hey, could have been a lot worse.

JRJ08, it only gets more hostile when you keep getting out-argued (word?) and bludgeoned with facts, but insist on hanging out, jucking-jiving, sliding the goal posts, etc..

What do you expect?

Believe me, if any of us meanders on over to your lion's den (i.e., DKos, Huffington, you name it) we'll get eggs and wet toilet paper hurled at us from every direction right on our first posting. 

 

You're the next contestant on...
THE MESSIAH IS... LEFT !!

 

»→ JRJ

"Not all violence is terrorism."

I know you've been trying to defend Ayers for the last couple of days, without liking the fellow, of course. 

So since this is all about Ayers, could you please explain to us just what is not terroristic in nature about Ayers' bombings, attempts at bombings, and manufacture of bombs complete with roofing nails and fencing staples.

Just curious as to what it is that attracts you to him.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Whatever you say, Bill.

-Dave

Did this country just elect Obama/Biden, or was it Soros/Ayers?

I'm so busted...

I'm so busted...

scorecard

RD: 1

JRJ: 0

 

"Gov. Palin has been subjected to one of the most massive and dishonest pile-on smear attacks in the history of liberal media."  -- Lowell Ponte

JRJ, You flailed on the first time I posted this, care to try

again?

Democrats started the KKK, killed Lincoln , Jim crow laws!

Samples:

The only people who have floated the idea of a possible
President Obama assassination have been liberal Democrats. Note: John
Wilkes Booth, a Democrat, assassinated Republican President Abraham
Lincoln for his freeing of slaves, so this kind of has precedent.

It was the Democrat Party that gave Blacks the poll taxes and literacy tests to keep them from voting… Republican. It
was the Democrat Party that created the Ku Klux Klan as an enforcement
arm to terrorize Black and White Republicans. It was the Democrat Party
that repealed anti-lynching legislation, yet today their very liberals
are hypersensitive any time a noose appears in public.

As far as Rendell’s comments, he’s more ignorant than racist. Since “conservative whites” are… conservative, the chances they would vote for a Democrat in the first place is slim.

Yea you are " so busted.."

 

First Mutt's Viet Nam 2

IranianUranium

With the minor exception

With the minor exception that I'm not a democrat. You dope. 

»→ Riiight

A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.  James 1:8

How's that piscatorial excursion going for you?

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

Slim?

And, of course, you don't include any of these people in your list of "conservatives": David Brookes, Susan Eisenhower, Peggy Noonan, Kathleen Parker, Colin Powell, Ken Dubenstein, George Will and Scott McClellan. They're all notorious left-wing liberals. Face it. The Republican Party is no longer a "party". It's a collection of factions, ranging from moderate to people like you.

→ JRJ08

I hardly think the conservative movement needs your coaching while excreting its waste.

  • LYDSEXICS UNTIE!

you are patently wrong about

you are patently wrong about the democrats starting the klan..and i am no democrat...the the klans orgin started with some bored men looking to start a fraternal organization..i was NOT started as a hate organization..now whether some men who were racist and democrats(and let us not pretend that there were not an equal amount of racist republicans).took it it a direction to terroize newly freed slaves is entirely possible