Ann Coulter Tells MSNBC Contributor His Government Worker Mom 'Is A Drain On Society'
You knew when you saw conservative author Ann Coulter was pitted against far-left MSNBC contributor and Nation magazine editor Christopher Hayes on HBO's "Real Time" sparks were going to fly.
Such occurred when Hayes told the panel that his mother works for the government prompting Coulter to respond, "She is a drain on society" (video follows with transcript and commentary):
CHRISTOPHER HAYES, NATION EDITOR AND MSNBC CONTRIBUTOR: The only thing that has been done, which is the Recovery Act, and CBO estimated increased employment by 1.5 to 3 ½ million people. That’s it. That’s the one concrete thing that has been done.
AMANDA FOREMAN, AUTHOR: I’m sorry, government does not create jobs.
HAYES: Sure it does.
FOREMAN: It doesn’t, no. Ideas create jobs. Innovation creates jobs.
BILL MAHER, HOST: During the Depression government didn't create jobs?
Once again Maher showed his stupidity. The unemployment rate in 1929 was 3.2 percent. After federal spending tripled from $3 billion to $9 billion, unemployment was 17.2 percent ten years later.
Liberals just can't get it through their heads that all the money and New Deal programs thrown at the Depression did little to solve it. But I digress:
FOREMAN: They were temp, they were temporary jobs. That’s not a job-job. Under Bill Clinton…
HAYES: What’s a job-job?
FOREMAN: Under Bill Clinton, 23 million…
HAYES: My Mom works for the government. She doesn’t have a job-job?
FOREMAN: That’s not a…
ANN COULTER: No. She is a drain on society.
(Applause)
HAYES: Oh. Thank you.
FOREMAN: I wouldn’t go that far.
MAHER: Your mother personally.
HAYES: Yes.
MAHER: We want you to know that. Your mother is a drain on…
COULTER: Well, you asked.
HAYES: Ann Coulter thinks you’re a drain on society.
FOREMAN: What Ann means, she's not a revenue producer. She’s not a revenue producer.
COULTER: Right. She’s a revenue taker.
FOREMAN: No, she’s gainfully employed, but she’s not a revenue producer.
COULTER: No, it's worse than not having a job, having a government job, because you have somebody doing something nobody wants, taxpayers pay for it, and they can never get rid of them.
Game, set, and match.
- Noel Sheppard's blog
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Comments
Incognito?
Submitted by IrateNate on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:07pm.
Chris Hayes is a real person? Wow. I always though that was Maddow with glasses on...
And as to Bill Maher, during the Great Depression, FDR's spending created work programs, not jobs. A "work program" is like welfare, only you have to hold a shovel.
You mean they had 'shovel
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:21pm.
You mean they had 'shovel ready' jobs back then??? These days it's just another phrase.....spit out, dutifully reported by the state-run media, and assumed to be 'real'..............even though Boy Blah-Blah joked about the fact that is was another sham.
And over here in the People's Republic of Hawaii (supposed birthplace of our Magnificent Monarch, as well as having that little cretin Neil UBER-COMMIE as governor), I'd actually like to see the welfare recipients have to DO SOMETHING - besides collect all of their benefits. I can think of all kinds of public tasks that need to be done.
Oh.....that guy Hayes is actually 'somebody'?? I watched this show for a while last night, and I thought he was just another lib from off the streets.
And guess what
Submitted by hbnolikeee on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:29pm.
they're shoveling?
I wish more "conservatives" would light it up like Ann
Submitted by sms5217 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 6:23pm.
Ordinarily, I would not watch the sleazefest and hate-mongering that is the Bill Maher show. However, when I saw that Ann Coulter was on, I had to watch, and I'm so glad I did.
Ann basically wiped the floor with Chris Hayes and Maher. In tennis, it would have been 6-0, 6-0.
I mean, every point that Chris and Maher made was rebutted, and rebutted completely in a comical, hilarious manner.
She mixed it up with strong sarcasm and wit, and basically, they had no answer for her.
I just wish that more conservatives, when invited, had a more take no prisoners attitude, like Ann. Every liberal show that invites Katrina van de Huvel and the "forehead", and other strong liberal flakes gets their all. Meanwhile, we are left to be satisfied with Ed Rollins and Alan Simpson?
Bravo to Ann for her virtuoso performance last night. I know that she is controversial and ignites some strong passions, and I may not agree with her on all issues, but hey, she fights a strong fight and never backs down.
If only other Republicans and Conservatives brought their "A" game like she does.
it was relief....in return for swinging that pick ax
Submitted by Paarl on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 6:26pm.
at the tail end of the WPA or CCC..it led my father to flying school somehow...that createda pilot for the army air force and a job in civilian life after the war...
I have no issue with relief or the 99 weeks of unemployment...after all it is Obama's destructive economic policies that are leading to '0' recovery and people are hurting..they are real victims to a destructive mentality in this current government...
Paarl of Rhodesia
holding a shovel
Submitted by russedav on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 6:58pm.
It's good enough for government work: ten or twenty supervise one holding the shovel who is the only one actually working.
*Applause*
Submitted by Dave81 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:13pm.
Hats off to Ms. Coulter. What a marvelous description of government employees. There are so many pointless government jobs that do nothing buy suck money out of the hands of people who are actually contributing to society.
To quote Thomas Paine: "Government, even in its best state, is but a necessary evil; in its worst state, an intolerable one."
Except she didn't distinguish between pointless . . .
Submitted by Galvanic on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 7:02pm.
. . . government jobs and others.
I worked in Federal government jobs for 24 years and collect a pension. I never thought it was pointless, nor did the men and women I worked alongside. Family separations were long and arduous, sometimes I got shot at, and some of my workmates lost their lives on the job (There's a holiday set aside for them every May). Pointless? I would rate it more meaningful then being a pundit, TV panelist, or author, but then maybe I just don't have the proper perspective, seeing as I was and presumably remain a drain on society.
Coulter revels in being provocative, but I'm not going to applaud her on this one.
Galvanic*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 7:17pm.
You and I agree on one thing. Most front line government employees do their job, long hours, and some of us did get shot at. But working for a state government, unlike feral employees, means I now have a small pension.
My complaint is that in every agency, there are too many mid and upper level management positions. This took resources, equipment, and personnel from front line . I think what Coulter meant was the every growing bureaucracy and countless jobs that produce no direct services to the people is costly, wasteful and non productive. Hiring upper level managers is the current theory. Most of these jobs, both state and federal, are outside of the "civil service" category. That opens up opportunity for political paybacks for do-nothing jobs at very high pay. Coulter does have a tendency to sensationalize, but so do others. Republicans are terrorist, bring a gun to the fight...etc. But delving into her meaning based on our own experiences with government bureaucracies and she may have a point.
I don't disagree wtih anything in your post, cajun2
Submitted by Galvanic on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 11:35am.
Coulter is what she is, and I think she's good for the political discourse. She's deliberately provocative and occasionally over the top, and that earns her guest spots on TV shows and sells books.
Nonetheless, her tendency to throw broad generalizations on the table is occasionally off the mark -- and she apologizes once in while -- and risks pissing off potential political allies.
Stupid
Submitted by GregE on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:24pm.
Liberals will say government does create jobs, because they're speaking literally. A government job IS a job. Yes. So they call it a job created. Nevermind that it takes X amount of taxes to fund that job, which de-funds the private sector to create the government one and the private sector has to adjust.
Let's run with the literal for a second. If that is the case, let's say in one year, 2 million jobs are created in the economy, and let's pay no attention to 3 million others that were lost. In the literal, yes, 2 million jobs were created, yet reports will always in such a case say that 1 million jobs were lost. The net job numbers is what matters most. They get away with the mindset of "government creates jobs" because there is no way to actually quantify how many private jobs were lost because of the government one.
To say government creates jobs is the opposite of the way job numbers are reported. The latter is correct, the former is pixie dust.
'1.5 to three and a half
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:25pm.
'1.5 to three and a half million jobs'???? Boy, that's covering your bases!!! And don't believe it anyway.............even IF the government has been 'producing jobs' - in whatever capacity that they are - the private sector (who REALLY produces the jobs) has been losing a helluva lot more.
Wow. I'm as impressed with Amanda Foreman, a mother of five,
Submitted by Rush Fan on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 1:55pm.
as I am with my favorite conservative female commentator, Ann Coulter. Although no fan of nutty Bill Maher, his selection of guests is notable
Christopher Hayes
Submitted by Conservator on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 2:02pm.
It's about time someone tackled this imbecile who's a Chris Matthews' Messiah. Leftist extremists like Hayes will never place themselves in a position where they have to really defend their political ideology. I guess he thought he would be among similar simpleton minds on HBO's "Real Time." However, Maher is no match for Ann and Hayes is an arrogant pretentious patronizing patsy progressive.
Draft the unemployeed
Submitted by Vonu on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 2:03pm.
There's your government jobs.
That works for me
Submitted by mandrake on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:11pm.
Where do you what to send me? Anything is better than the street.
The government has to TAKE
Submitted by Slyrr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 2:45pm.
The government has to TAKE money from taxpayers to 'create' this job, and KEEP taking it from them, more and more every year, to sustain it.
Coulter was spot on right. I would have added 'LEECH' though. If the political class had the brains and the guts to reduce government to proper numbers and limited functions, they'd have more money than they'd know what to do with and pay off the debts in crackerjack time.
Close to home
Submitted by nkviking75 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:17pm.
Wow, that hits close to home, since one immediate family member is a retired government worker and another is currently employed by our state. Even so, it's hard to justify the retired person's job (which was funded by government grants and no longer exists) as a necessary function of government. The current employee is doing something more necessary, but the functions of her agency could probably be handled by a private contractor more cheaply. BTW, the current worker hates her job, but stays mainly for health insurance as well as the bennies and the wages (as opposed to a similar job in the private sector). Both relatives do (or did) their jobs well.
“Always love your country — but never trust your government!" -- Bob Novak (1931-2009)
When you put the clowns in charge, don't be surprised when a circus breaks out.
Private companies do not
Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:41pm.
Private companies do not always do things cheaper. Employees of a government are usually more loyal and dedicated than private. In addition the government has no profit motive whereas the private company does. Some of the engineering companies I dealt with if not most always complained about their budgets when I told them what they had to do. I told them tough do it right the way we want it, with the force of the city behind me. Private does not take over ancillary duties either.
Case in point is survey duties which were privatized. Used to be we could just call for a spot check to make a quick decision but private takes at least a week with miles of specific instructions and then they screw up. Because they don't know what we want and don't care whereas our in house crews knew what we needed and sometimes we go out with them to make sure we got it with no return trips.
What's time to a bureaucrat*!
Submitted by upcountrywater on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 4:51pm.
18 months to get a building permit, on Oahu for a run of the mill basic home.
So what's a contractor to do... Start building without a permit, take pictures and get fined double, that is less than the cost of the interest payments , on the construction loan. Of course the inspectors gave some folk big re-do orders, costing big bucks...Just maybe a bribe zone in there somewhere?
At one time New Zealand had a train system, ran by the government, 50,000 employees and the trains never ran on time.... Well in the 90's NZ sold the train system to a private contractor. The trains run on time with only 10,000 employees.
Hawaii has a state fun freight system, it takes 2 weeks to get freight from 100 miles away.
You Didn't Build That.
used to be we could just call
Submitted by ckc1227 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 5:13pm.
used to be we could just call for a spot check to make a quick decision but private takes at least a week with miles of specific instructions and then they screw up.
Gee, I wonder if the "miles of specific instruction" and government bureaucracy have anything to do with that, lol?
No it has to do with the idea
Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 2:27pm.
No it has to do with the idea of the survey company incentive to make money. They will not go to the extra lenghths required if it ain't written down. Whereas our crews knew what we wanted and we had contact with them. The private crews did not care if it wasn't specified. The old crews knew if the conditions changed to call us if problems arose or the crews thought we needed to know more. Think of it going to McDonalds or a nice sit-down with wait staff.
Government needs people to
Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:22pm.
Government needs people to work and perform tasks for it just as private business does. Si take offense at being a drain on society because I performed above what my job was. I felt my job was to protect the citizens of Dallas and Dallas itself. I performed a useful function as did my coworkers.
I may give you a pass if your gov post is over 100 years old.
Submitted by upcountrywater on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:46pm.
No worries Dan,
We live in the leisure age of oil both of us will be out of work when the oil flow stops.
Roads could be privatized. Drive by views of 6 guys resting on the shovel ends while the 1 newbe digs, will go away.
FAA could be privatized, ..FYI.. FAA still uses electronic devices that require "tubes". The good thing about the FAA is that it can't be sold and shipped offshore to India.
How about building inspection. The financier for the project could hire a private company to check and see the job progressed as stated on the plans, for far less than, the fees and fines the city could levy. Not to mention the boat loads of time saved not dealing with the gov inspector person to show up whenever.
In the era of cell phone videos, all that, gov body being present on the job site is rendered near useless.
You Didn't Build That.
You are gonna love this ...
Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 2:44pm.
You are gonna love this ... My job was dealing with the builders and contractors. I say one thing it just takes time to review and approve plans. And most of the rules and regulations are there for a reason. Normally we don't hold up plans, it's the other side who are because they won't play by the rules. I have been threatened a few times and attempted bribery more than I can count, but I was looking out for the citizens and businesses of Dalas as a whole; not jut one but all. We would get blamed for the contractors over promises and delays all the time.yes, I resemble that...
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:26pm.
Although my job at the FAA helped keep people from dying in a smoking heap of wreckage, she's absolutely correct in that I was a revenue taker. All of us who work for a government entity are.
Some of our jobs could be farmed out to the market. Some of them cannot for various reasons such as unlimited liability. It is something that has to be visited continually by elected folks who actually want to do the people's business and not a bunch of monkey business. If my job was farmed out it might not have saved a whole lot of money in actual operational costs in the long run, but it could have been billed to the users, the airline passengers, and not the taxpayers. The airlines are free riders on the tax payers' dime. It should be stopped. There are other examples.
TSA for one...
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 3:30pm.
I'll add to my previous comment in that creating TSA as a government agency was stupid from the git go. Nothing good will come of it. It's more free riders for the airlines and the airports. They should be paying for security not people who never go near an airplane.
canada privatized their FAA/air traffic control
Submitted by Paarl on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 6:32pm.
Nav Can ., I beleive it is called..a cousin of mine was instrumental in its establishment...privately run ..at a profit..with fees from airlines/passengers...and it PAYS taxes to the provinces and feds in Canada
Paarl of Rhodesia
OMG!!
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:09pm.
What ever would all our GS-14 controllers and GS-12 techs do??? Besides fall asleep on the job that is.
Shhhhhh... don't let the civilians know. I mean... I mean... IT COULD BE THE END OF EVERYTHING!! [/sarc, for the folks in Rio Linda]
Government jobs
Submitted by alabamawingnut on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 4:37pm.
are important in some respects, police, fire, child protective services and such..But when we read that the department of energy alone has over 16,000 employees, most of us little people have to wonder; what the hell are all those people doing?
Destroying our ability to supply energy to the public.
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 4:54pm.
I mean it's like teen pregnancy. If you want teens to stop having sex just open a cabinet level position to improve the enjoyment of sex in American teens. Within six months pregnancies will plummet and with eighteen months teens will stop having sex altogether.
The overhead just continues to rise
Submitted by Kenyon Schraeder on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 4:50pm.
Nearly 40 years of working for sales-based organizations within an aggressive roller coaster industry taught me that the only people who actually generate revenue are the salespeople. Everyone else, including the CEO, and myself as a tier manager, are part of the organization's operating overhead, that is, an expense.
That's not to say that all the people who are working but who are not in sales aren't contributing. Not all at. We are each essential to the organization in our own way. We're just not the ones generating the revenue that helps to pay us or generate a profit.
A job is something that should largely perpetuate itself, i.e. whatever work one does in earnest to earn an honest wage, in turn, helps the employer to survive within a market, grow its revenue and continue to pay that wage.
Government is not a real employer in the actual sense and it cannot "create" jobs. It can only pay out of taxpayer revenues those who were once unemployed to no longer be unemployed. That's not a job in the truest sense of the word. That's more of a government subsidy as it helps to promote greater dependency on government.
And I'm NOT ridiculing those who are paid by the government or diminishing their worth or marginalizing them. But some folks simply refuse to acknowledge that the government "hiring" more people is not the solution to rising unemployment, especially if there are fewer and fewer "salespeople" left to generate the revenue required to pay everyone.
Nobody eats 'til somebody sells something.
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 4:56pm.
A truism for the ages.
.
I enjoy a very significant---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 7:12pm.
retirement package after many years as a member of a Fire Department.
While I recognize the severe drain on local coffers that is an attendant cost required to support "safety" retirees like myself and retired law enforcement personnel - I know that local entities are adjusting by setting forth conditions now that will reduce the benefits package that will be available to those currently entering the safety work force when their retirement time comes.
I would share the concerns over some of the "outrageous" retirement monies paid out, i.e., receiving more money when retired than was actually made when actively employed, but for one reason: the country is now supporting a fourth generation of welfare queens and weenies; people who have never worked a day in their lives, and who, because of the screwed up system put in place by politicians to ensure garnering the welfare class vote, never will work a day in their lives.
Safety personnel had to successfully complete competitive written, physical, and oral exams to get into the desired career field; and then actually put in the time on the job to earn, and reach, the goal of a munificent retirement.
Hell, at least they put in the time.
The welfare class denizens don't do jack sh*t, never have, never will; but certainly shall endeavor to blithely live out their worthless existence on the backs of those who are responsible enough to work for a living.
Until, in an attempt to clean up and minimize governmental money deficits, generational welfare is done away with completely, I will shed no tears for those entities bemoaning a "lack or shortage of funds as a result of the exorbitant costs attributed to maintaining the public safety retirement system".
MD
thank you for your service
Submitted by wizardjr on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:17pm.
In general the public salutes our cops and firefighters, although while being busted in a bar brawl or DUI some of us may not be appreciative at the moment (*grin*).
There'd be more than enough money for your retirement if we dumped all the mandates for welfare, unneeded educational requirements, etc. Secondly you need to stop the lawsuit lottery as well. I'm not sure we can reverse this Cargo Cult society the ruling class has built. If we don't we become Greece at best, Zimbabwe at worst.
Like my DI used to say, "Life sucks. Then you die. Suck it up Alice." (I don't think he ever did remember my real name without looking at the name tag *grin*)
wizard---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:35pm.
"Cargo Cult society".
Love it!
MD
Do you know about the
Submitted by killa37 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 12:53am.
Do you know about the original 'cargo cult' from WW 2???
killa---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 3:30am.
Yeah, that's why the comment tickled me; I picture the current welfare weenies waiting with arms outstretched for goodies to fall from the sky.
Actually, that's not too far removed from the actual process, more's the pity.
MD
True story.........but the
Submitted by killa37 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 4:16am.
True story.........but the original Cargo Cult was working for the USA in the jungles and hills in order to HELP the USA win the war, and they had a lot to do with the success. I don't think that we could say that about the current Cargo Cult!!!
MD, same here,
Submitted by UpNorth on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:30pm.
my pension from the PD isn't extravagant. But, to hear some of the people bitching during the city's budget hearings, you'd think all the Police and Fire Departments do is go play golf, go on vacation and then expect to retire at public expense. Much like the resident at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Except for one minor thing that the local media ignore, year in and year out. In the 27 years that I worked for the PD, the city contributed what was supposed to be their "contribution" exactly two times. Our pension fund is probably one of the 10 healthiest in the Midwest, not because the taxpayers kept it afloat, but because the firefighters and police officers kept it funded, and invested the members' money very wisely. And, most importantly, did NOT let the city "borrow" from it when they wanted to. Now, they cry because the years of non-contribution have caught up with them. And, that's the fault of the pension fund members too.
As to the "welfare queens and weinies", in the city I worked in, the incidence of Cadillac and Buick ownership, per capita, was located in the "poorest" section of that city. After all, if you have no bills for food, liquor, rent or utilities, you can certainly afford to drive the best.
UpNorth---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:50pm.
It would seem that only law enforcement, fire department, social workers and welfare department personnel see the actual "spit in the working individual's face" results of just how high on the hog these worthless bosstids and beeches live.
I can't speak to the veracity of this story from the late 1960's, but I heard once that a welfare hog complained to her worker that she needed additional money over and above her norm because she needed to purchase a crib for her newborn.
Seems the poor infant was relegated to sleeping in the box the new color television came in.
Liberals, welfare, political correctness, and now Obama and his molemate; the hits just keep on coming.
MD
MatthewDean*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:10pm.
Though I was a government employee, I saw many people "sleeping" on the job, affirmative action put incompetents in decision making positions(ha), political appointees assigned to do "favors" from agency regulations.
Many govt. employees are professionals, dedicated to their professions and serve well. But then you have those who contribute nothing to the system and are in fact responsible for the disarray and waste in government duties. Here is one example
Having worked with the "poor", there is no question that our entitlement system must be revised . These programs were meant to be a "hand up" not "hand out". When there is no contribution, their is no sense of value, when there is not accomplishment, there is no incentive. I have posted this link before but this example is why we are in serious need to reform entitlement programs
cajun---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 3:49am.
While the thinking that led to Affirmative Action was likely initially put forth with the very best of intentions, the program has certainly paved the road to hell in some workplaces.
MD
In a very real sense, the election of Dear Leader was a form
Submitted by virginia republican on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 12:57pm.
of "Affirmative Action" by the voters, at least those plagued by White Guilt. The Dems produced a totally unqualified radical candidate with all kinds of baggage (unpublicized and/or overlooked by the MSM) who received many votes merely because of the color of his skin. Now we're all paying the price. Thankfully, some of the ones most adversely affected by Obama's inept performance in office are those most likely to have voted for him. Poetic justice in action.
I seriously disagree
Submitted by mandrake on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 1:14pm.
The Republicans produced a rather lame ticket with McCain/Palin. Got to do better next time..and time is running out!
Score - virginia republican---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 7:49pm.
99.5% ---
mandrake ---
.5%, and lucky to score that high considering that without Palin on board, McCain had no campaign whatsoever.
MD
Not really
Submitted by mandrake on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 7:58pm.
You see I actually made money on that election. In Canada it's legal to bet on American elections. I await the next one with wallet open!
Your profit, mandrake---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 8:59pm.
in no way matters in regard to my poll.
My poll was very scientific, you see. :o)
MD
i agree mostly
Submitted by ohio granny on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:38pm.
I absolutely agee we should change the welfare system. Every adult should have some skin in the game. You really only appreciate what you earn. No one has the right to demand to be supported by someone else being obligated to work.
Most private employers has gone from a defined retirement to some kind of 401. Public employers still mostly have defined retirement. This must change for new employees and others who are not close to retirement age.
Employees in private companies have an incentive to keep the company in business. Not so with public employees. They cannot go out of business. The incentives are totally different. A lot of employees who work for small business have no retirement. They are totally on their own.
And I agree mostly with you, ohio granny---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 8:59pm.
though I would state that without "public" employees performing the many jobs that make life easier for all of us, we citizens would be 'totally on our own'. :o)
MD
Government "jobs"?
Submitted by mdgiles on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 6:43pm.
"Nearly 40 years of working for sales-based organizations within an aggressive roller coaster industry taught me that the only people who actually generate revenue are the salespeople. Everyone else, including the CEO, and myself as a tier manager, are part of the organization's operating overhead, that is, an expense."Whatever you sell, you either have to make it or buy it - which makes the buyers or manufacturers just as important as the sales people. Indeed when the sales people are more important than anyone else, you end up with the cars Detroit used to turn out (read: shiny new garbage). In addition somebody has to track the money you're paying out versus what's coming in. And whatever the salesman sells requires that it be recorded and delivered in some manner to the customers. The Salesman is simply part of a unit that creates revenue, and it could be said that no part of the unit could exist successfully without the rest of the unit. The salesman - no matter what they tell you - aren't the only ones necessary to generate revenue.
You missed the point entirely
Submitted by Kenyon Schraeder on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:21pm.
I never ever said that the salespeople were more important than the rest. Please, go back and re-read my post carefully. I said that in sales-based organizations, only salespeople generate revenue.
Now, for the actual analogy itself.
Without people who are generating revenue (taxpayers), the overhead soon collapses the business (economy) under its own weight because of all the people on the the government payroll or the dole, take your pick. The base of taxpayers within the United States is steadily shrinking while the number of people directly dependent upon the government for income (overhead/expense), is increasing. And, the revenue proposed from taxing the "rich" more (raising prices) generates a mere pittance over the next 10 years when compared to the deficit and debt. That's not a viable solution but it is a great talking point for the Dems to trot out and it plays well to the romantics who love the idea of a modern-day Robin Hood.
Government cannot create jobs and government employees are an expense or overhead so please don't be offended. Why are they? Because the taxes that they are paying out of their wages cannot offset their actual cost to the taxpayers. Let's think about who's paying for the bulk of their benefits and their retirement. It's the same, by the way, in any private company. The cost of the employees' benefits is far greater than their contributions and is steadily eating away more of the profits. That's why the quickest way for a company to lower overhead and immediately improve the bottom line has always been to "cut heads", i.e. lay off people.
Bureaucracy, by definition, is inefficient at best. And, this is all compounded further by millions of people who are not working but getting assistance of some kind, our politicians love of more and grander entitlements, welfare, food stamps, etc., etc., and so forth.
Our Nation's TOTAL overhead or expense has eclipsed its revenues dramatically.
For every gov't worker we need 20 or so new private jobs created
Submitted by GerryC on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 7:40pm.
Let's just suppose that one new gov't worker makes $60,000 a year with all benefits and retirement included. I am happy for the lucky person that gets one. But here is the basic problem of our current situation.
That is $60,000 that taxpayers must support. Since 45% of Americans pay no income taxes, that means that we must create about 20 private sector jobs to support this one gov't employee (given that the average taxpayer who does pay taxes forks over $5,000/yr in income taxes).
For every gov't job Oh!Bummer brags about, we go further into debt, and nothing is created except a new bureaucrat (that produces nothing) and that will never be fired or has their position eliminated.
It is no startling revelation that there are government workers
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:05pm.
who are dead weight. I've seen them...I've dealt with them...they exist. But Coulter's baseless, presumptive, personal indictment of Hayes' mom is a noxious smear borne of such monumental ignorance that I doubt even this publicity-addicted political diva deep down in her tiny heart really believes such incendiary drivel.
The notion that all government workers are, ipso facto, a drain on society is so shockingly absurd that if this actually were a tennis match, she would have lost by default and most likely suspended for the rest of the year.
Jer
Nice one, Jer,
Submitted by UpNorth on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:22pm.
but really, " publicity-addicted political diva deep down in her tiny heart"? I didn't think you felt that way about San Fran Nan. :)
Coulter could kick San Fran Nan's ass---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:46pm.
and make her like it.
Verbally, physically, mentally, emotionally, AND ideologically.
Same with Barbara Boxer, Dianne Feinstein, Debbie Wasserman-Schultz, Claire McCaskill, Kathleen Sibelius, and Bawney Frank.
Ann might have a tougher time of it physically with either Big Sis Napolitano or Little Sis Kagan, but there is no doubt she can throw a baseball farther than Barack Obama can.
Lib-Dims - manly women and effeminate men.
With these bozettes and bozos running amok in D.C., no wonder this country is screwed up.
MD
MD, you left out
Submitted by UpNorth on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:01pm.
another big time, big girl, Debbie Stabenow. Who just today announced that she wants the taxpayers to foot the bill for $2Billion for lithium batteries. Seems Ever Ready's just can't keep up with Debbie's "needs".
$2B for research to make the Chevy Volt viable? Why? If the public wants that crappy little eco-car, they'll buy it, if not, let it be another example of why the government had to bail out GM, in the first place.
What about Nurse Ratchett???
Submitted by killa37 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 12:58am.
What about Nurse Ratchett??? I hear that she can throw a pretty good lamp!!! And if she got on top of Coulter to give her the 'Thunder Thigh Tap-Out', I think it would be curtains!!! Or maybe even the 'Cankles Crush-Out'!!!
Not a big fan of Nancy either, UpNorth...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:01pm.
I've been calling for her [and Reid's] ouster from leadership positions for nearly three years now due to chronic ineptitude.
Jer
Just a little
Submitted by UpNorth on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:02pm.
chain pulling, Jer.
I know, UpNorth...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:08pm.
I noticed the :). I'm smilin' too.
Jer
So, Jer, do you consider Obama ---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:30pm.
to be in that category?
Chronically inept?
MD
Obama is in the
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:33pm.
occasionally inept category.
Jer
So, is sitting on the fence an ---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:40pm.
indication of genetic predisposition, or a result of your training as a lawyer?
Jer's answer to this query: "Yep".
MD
Gee, Matthew...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 11:12pm.
You forgot to include what would have been your 1,000th posting of the trenchant retort "You are a liberal". Since Jeter got his 3000th hit today, the timing would have been ideal.
Jer
No logical correlation, in this instance, between ---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 11:24pm.
1,000 and 3,000 except for the fact that they are both numbers.
What you apparently fail to grasp is that for me, "liberal" is both synonymous with dipsh*t, and completely interchangeable with a##h@!*.
Works for me. :o)
MD
Yes, Matthew...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 11:38pm.
and aside from its utter irrelevancy, your 10:40 post was a masterpiece of deductive analysis.
Jer
However, you have succeeded in
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 11:41pm.
wearing me down. I'm tired.
Later, Jer
But they do it tooo!
Submitted by Boudin on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:25pm.
Right?
Who does what tooo?
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:54pm.
Jer
Your right Jer
Submitted by Boudin on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 10:43pm.
Tis, a stupid argument!
It's just part of their depraved mentality.
Submitted by Ill wind blowing on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 3:58am.
It is the Coulters, Becks, Limbaughs, Foxians, etc of this world who are a drain on society. They are the most worthless, unproductive parasites that this morally debased, Mammon worshipping society can produce.
These vampires can make up to 50 million a year. Can you imagine, not merely the filthy lucre that these demons make, but how much it breaks down to on a dollar per word basis? That's 200,000 dollars in a single day. How many words can their sphincter mouths hurl in that one day of arduous work? One hour? A single minute?
I don't know how many words one of these ghouls can vomit in one minute so let me figure out how much money they make by the second. Let's say that they slave over their microphones for four hours a day. Their hard earned labor would come out to about $14 a second.
So, in four seconds they make more money, uttering a sentence or two of demonic speech, than a minimum wage worker makes in one full day of toil.
Yet a minimum wage worker's piss is worth more than the entire circus band of Conservative clowns; and his shit is more precious than the entire Congress and Senate put together.
Let me guess,---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 4:10am.
you don't like George W. Bush, either.
MD
A waste of skin ...
Submitted by NL207 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 4:24am.
each and every one of you liberal nincompoops.
Clean up in aisle 9, toxic spill on the floor.
Submitted by UpNorth on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:10am.
You do manage to confirm that the old saying is true, "profanity is the last refuge of the truly ignorant".
Thanks for playing, now toddle off to DU.
Well, that was entertaining.
Submitted by bkeyser on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:17am.
Enjoy the rest of the Castro Freedom Festival.
Incredible...these trolls are coming out of the woodwork
Submitted by Blonde on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:32am.
Barry must be worried.
The influx of seminar posters is unreal.
They're surely not winning many converts with such wit, grace and charm as exhibited above. I'd like to take the soap and a firehose to illwind's screed.
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
Good morning, Sheriff.
Submitted by SickofLibs on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:35am.
;)
Well, podna
Submitted by Blonde on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:50am.
What can one do with a 3 am drive-by?
Pathetic little piece of detritus.
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
I wonder what
Submitted by UpNorth on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:44am.
the going rate is for a seminar troll is these days? From the quality of their posts here, it sure can't be a lot. Then again, a troll with a bathroom fixation can't be worth much, even to Soros.
UpNorth
Submitted by Blonde on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:49am.
I think the answer to your question is in illwind's little rant up yonder.
I do believe it's the fixation on his abysmal rate of pay that has him so on edge, poor little seminar fella. I've never seen such a swamp fevered cry of class envy on these boards before. Seems like he's been listening to too much Obama.
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
This is what moonbats do at 4 AM, folks.
Submitted by SickofLibs on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:29am.
But seriously, we're so sorry about what happened to Olbermann. He'll be back, bigger than ever, don't you worry.
Get dressed guys*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:40am.
All NBers should put on their haz-mat suits. Drive by sto' bought trolls will be popping up even more in the coming months. As Obies' approval numbers go down, as he utters even more obvious lies and his true agenda becomes apparant, the MSM is going to go even more nuts. For sto'bought trolls to infiltrate every conservative site on the internets, means Soros is spending lots and lots of his money. Hope the puppet master goes broke then we vote out Obie.
Ya gotta
Submitted by killa37 on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 12:33pm.
Ya gotta admit..............'ill wind' picked hmself a great name, because it's 'passing wind' out both ends of his pathetic being.
Question: If his mom is
Submitted by deerjerkydave on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 9:26pm.
Question: If his mom is gainfully employed why does the government have to tax the public?
Answer: Because the gain she acquires is greater than what her job produces.
As Mark Levin asks: How much energy does the department of energy create? How many kids are educated at the department of education? How much food is created by the department of agriculture? How much medicine has been created by the FDA? These agencies do not create jobs, they redistribute wealth by taxing it from people who earned it from REAL society-benefiting jobs in the private sector.
------------------------
"The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the Federal Government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State Governments are numerous and indefinite. -James MadisonGovernment jobs vs private sector jobs...
Submitted by dasher on Sat, 07/09/2011 - 11:59pm.
The question one must ask is how many private sector jobs are lost for every government job created? It appears that government jobs force a loss of jobs in the private sector, and it may very well be more than 1:1 ratio. To create a government job, pay the salary, the generous benefits, and the effect on the private sector the government employee has may kill off many jobs. Especially if that gov't employee enforces regulations or creates regulations. Since Øbama has increased the number of federal employees substantially, it may be directly causing the higher unemployment.
I think you got the name wrong...
Submitted by Bill Brasky on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:00am.
Christopher Hayes? No, that person is named Rachel Maddow.
Transcripts
Submitted by desertphreak on Sun, 07/10/2011 - 10:38am.
Thank God for the transcripts because the NB fanfare at the beginning and end of the segments is FAR to loud and irritating. LOSE IT!