More Maher Idiocy: Football Is Democratic, Baseball Is Republican
It seems these days whenever Bill Maher opens his mouth, he's bound to stick his foot in it while saying something totally devoid of logic or factual basis.
Consider Friday's "Real Time" on HBO when with his final "New Rule," he claimed the economic business philosophy of NFL football is similar to that of the Democratic Party while Major League Baseball's is more in line with the Republicans (video follows with transcript and commentary):
BILL MAHER: So it's not a surprise that some 100 million Americans will watch the Super Bowl next week. That's 40 million more than go to church on Christmas. Suck on that, Jesus. It's also 85 million more than watched the last game of the World Series. And in that is an economic lesson for America, because football is built on an economic model of fairness and opportunity, and baseball is built on a model where the rich always win and the poor usually have no chance. The World Series is like the "Real Housewives of Beverly Hills": you have to be a rich bitch just to play. Whereas the Super Bowl is like Tila Tequila, anyone can get in.
Or put it another way, football is more like the Democratic philosophy. Democrats don't want to eliminate capitalism or competition, but they would like it if some kids didn't have to go to a crummy school in a rotten neighborhood while others get to go to a great school and their Dad gets them into Harvard, because when that happens, achieving the American dream is easy for some and just a fantasy for others. That's why the NFL literally shares the wealth. TV is their biggest source of revenue and they put it all in a big commie pot and split it 32 ways because they don't want anyone to fall too far behind. That's why the team that wins the Super Bowl in the next draft picks last - or what the Republicans would call punishing success.
[Applause]
For those of you familiar with how both sports work - something that Maher clearly isn't - you know the "Real Time" host was once again misrepresenting the truth to advance his liberal agenda.
The NFL does indeed have what's called revenue sharing, but so does baseball. As reported by CBS Business Network in 2008:
After hashing out their competing interests, large-market owners, small-market owners, and the players’ union initially struck a major revenue sharing deal during collective bargaining in 2002. Under the latest version, in effect through 2011, all teams pay in 31 percent of their local revenues and that pot is split evenly among all 30 teams. In addition, a chunk of MLB’s Central Fund — made up of revenues from sources like national broadcast contracts — is disproportionately allocated to teams based on their relative revenues, so lower-revenue teams get a bigger piece of the pie.
As such, baseball's revenue sharing is actually more socialistic than football's for the lower-revenue teams get a bigger chunk of the shared funds.
Makes Maher look like a bit of a jerk, doesn't it?
So does his point about the winner of the Super Bowl getting the lowest pick in the following year's draft. Baseball does the same thing giving the last pick to the winner of the World Series.
I guess you could call that strike two. But there were more wildly errant swings still to come:
MAHER: Baseball, baseball, on the other hand, is exactly like the Republicans. And I don't just mean it's incredibly boring. I mean their economic theory is every man for himself. The small-market Pittsburgh Steelers go to the Super Bowl more than anybody, but the Pittsburgh Pirates? Levi Johnston has sperm that will not grow up and live long enough to see the Pirates in a World Series. Their payroll is 40 million. The Yankees is 206 million. The Pirates have about as much chances getting to the playoffs as a poor black teenager from Newark has of becoming the CEO of Halliburton. That's why people stopped going to Pirate games in May, because if you're not in the game you become indifferent to the fate of the game and maybe even get bitter. That's what's happening to the middle class in America.
[Applause]
It's also how Marie Antoinette lost her head. So you kind of have to laugh that the same angry white males who hate Obama because he's redistributing wealth just love football, a sport that succeeds because it does just that. To them, the NFL is American as hot dogs, Chevrolet, apple pie, and a second giant helping of apple pie. But then again, they think they're macho because their sport is football, when, honestly, is there anything gayer than wearing another man's shirt?
As San Francisco Giants announcer Mike Krukow often says when someone strikes out, "Take some pine, meat":
- The San Francisco Giants won the World Series in 2010. They had the tenth-highest payroll in the league. Their opponent, the Texas Rangers, had the 27th-highest payroll. Only three teams spent less last year.
- In 2008, the Tampa Bay Rays made the World Series with the second-lowest payroll.
- In 2007, the Colorado Rockies went with the 26th-highest payroll.
- In 2006, the Detroit Tigers went with the 14th-highest.
- In 2003, the Florida Marlins won the Series with the 20th-highest payroll.
- In 2002, the Anaheim Angels won the Series with the 15th-highest payroll beating the Giants who had the tenth.
- In 2001, the Arizona Diamondbacks won the Series with the eighth-highest payroll.
So much for his "Real Housewives of Beverly Hills" analogy.
Add it all up, and the differences between the economic philosophies of these two sports as depicted by Maher Friday evening were totally non-existent.
Funnier still is that the "Real Time" host completely ignored what does indeed separate these leagues financially: football has a salary cap and baseball doesn't. This is what allows teams like the Yankees and Red Sox to spend so lavishly.
Maher ignoring this suggests he really knows little about these sports, for there's nothing more Republican than the belief that achievement should come with unlimited rewards, and nothing more Democrat than it shouldn't.
On the other hand, maybe the "Real Time" host didn't bring this up because he doesn't want to admit support for salary caps fearing that such a thing could some day be implemented by one of his employers to spread the wealth within the organization he works for.
As likely one of the highest paid at HBO, Maher mightn't think such a program was "Democratic" if he was forced to participate in it.
Now THAT'S entertainment!
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Comments
This fool knows nothing about
Submitted by ricklail on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 4:38pm.
This fool knows nothing about MLB or NFL. NFL and MLB teams don't share in merchandising. The Yankees are tops in this. The Yankees also have their own cable network. Without that they couldn't afford to make payroll on ticket sells and TV right alone, I don't think.
This revenue sharing goes on in college sports. Those schools that play in a BCS Bowl or any bowl share the bucks with their conference members. How could schools like Wake Forest or DOOK continue to play football on their ticket sells? Have you seen the crowds in BB&T stadium or Wallace Wade on a Saturday.
Same goes for the big dance. Notre Dame will not join a conference in football as long as NBC keeps shelling out the big bucks for their games. Beside football and basketball pretty much carry all the other sports. They give tickets away in Knoxville to pumpkin puke women's b-ball so it doesn't look so bad on TV.
Vols
Submitted by scarebear83 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 2:38am.
Hey now, don't be talkin' 'bout my Vols now, ya hear? :-P
If Maher means the democrats
Submitted by stratman on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 4:43pm.
If Maher means the democrats are comparable to the thuggish, rule-breaking, mean-spirited, viscious, arrogant, lying, undereducated, peacock preening, and/or criminal elements of the NFL... then I agree.
*Sorry, Jer. This was low hanging fruit not to be ignored and does not include you.*
Y'know what's really sad? He
Submitted by ant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 4:44pm.
Y'know what's really sad? He thinks he is clever and funny. Does he also not realize a great deal of his hero politicians got to where they are because of "Daddy" and almost all of them went to Ivy League Schools, where, unfortunately, they left common sense at the front door.
And maher knows about sports because.....
Submitted by Trix Rabbit on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 4:47pm.
All this coming from a loser who was and still is too much of a pantywaist to have played in either game.
For the MSM: In your pomp and all your glory, you're a poorer man than me. As you lick the boots of death born out of fear.
Ian Anderson "Wind up"
Hey, I'll bet that tilly
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:26pm.
Hey, I'll bet that tilly spends a lot of time playing backgammon with Hugh Hefner, rolling joints, chopping coke lines, and chasing underaged boys!!! That takes some kind of ability!!!
Yeah, I spend a lot of time
Submitted by Quasi-socialist on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:01pm.
thinking about revenue sharing when watching NFL football. That's why I love it. It's not about a quarterback under pressure managing to fling a pass downfield for a circus catch from a streaking receiver, or a CB biding his time to come out of no where and pick it off. It's not the linebacker firing himself like a missle over the top on a goal line stand...it's revenue sharing.
And draft order!
Hey Bill
Submitted by Ashrak on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:01pm.
Union demands see NFL football players let go every year because salary caps combined with league minimums make veterans unaffordable for any team.
Maher really has no clue whatsoever.
Does Maher even listen to himself??
Submitted by motherbelt on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:07pm.
The howler of the piece....
Democrats don't want to eliminate capitalism or competition, [HUH???] but they would like it if some kids didn't have to go to a crummy school in a rotten neighborhood while others get to go to a great school...
Then why do they so fiercely oppose school choice and vouchers????
They need to change the name of the show from Real Time to Surreal Time With Bill Maher.
I think he told another one
Submitted by ricklail on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:13pm.
I think he told another one when he said 100 million watched the Super Bowl but only 40 million got to church on Christmas. The 100 million is a worldwide figure the 40 million is only in the US I think. I would really doubt the 40 million figure.
It was estimated that 260 million world wide watched the World Cup in soceer.
I thought it was REAL SLIME
Submitted by Jack Bauer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:00pm.
I thought it was REAL SLIME with Billl Maher?
All of the above Mr Obama? --- How about ALL OF THE BELOW, instead.
Say whaaa?
Submitted by Cactus Kurt on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:08pm.
MAHER: "Democrats don't want to eliminate capitalism or competition"
Say whaaa? That's exactly what democrats want to do. That's their political agenda. Seriously, I think meningovascular syphilis has affected Maher's brain.
Bill Maher
Submitted by ProudAmerican58 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:04pm.
<TOILET FLUSHING>
Uhh in the NFL
Submitted by libfail on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:10pm.
There are no guaranteed contracts. So if you are let go that means shockingly you still don't get that money. So you have to perform to keep your job. That sound like the Democrats to you? Don't think so.
All one has to do is look
Submitted by ricklail on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:14pm.
All one has to do is look at the teachers union as an example of being paid and not performing. I think they are controlled by the Dems.
Coke is Republican. Pepsi is Democrat.
Submitted by The Vet on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:18pm.
Maher is an idiot.
I'll have a 'soft drink' once
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:25pm.
I'll have a 'soft drink' once in a while, but ever since Pepsi changed their logo to imitate the Boy Blunder flag, I won't touch it!!!!
Korean flag
Submitted by Model850 on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 5:30pm.
I used to work for Pepsi and was with the company when they changed their logo to look like the Korean flag. I mocked it then.
The new design is even worse with its eerie resemblance to the Barry logo. Yuck.
Attack the Gas Station!
Submitted by Unsane on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 11:06pm.
Seriously. Find a way to rent the Korean movie Attack the Gas Station! It will leave you in stitches. Your comment reminds me of one specific scene from that flick...
:o)
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Here's a few more
Submitted by Jack Bauer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:29pm.
Here's a few more Republican versus Democrat
ICE HOCKEY is Republican, ICE DANCING is Democrat
BOXING is Republican, BALLET is Democrat
NASCAR is Republican, PRIUS is Democrat
BASKETBALL is Republican, BASKET WEAVING is Democrat
WRESTLING is Republican, FLOWER ARRANGING is Democrat
Good game!!
All of the above Mr Obama? --- How about ALL OF THE BELOW, instead.
Nice comparisons Jack.
Submitted by Denny Crane on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:58am.
ROFLMAO
Which Holidays are which?
Fourth of July Parades are Republican, Gay pride parades are Democrat.
Memorial Day is Republican, Labor day is Democrat.
Presidents Day is Republican, Groundhog day is Democrat.
Easter is Republican, April Fools day is Democrat.
Patriot Day is Republican, National dance day is Democrat.
We Are The 53%
yep
Submitted by donabernathy on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 4:10am.
This is a year when both Groundhog Day and the State of the Union address occur in the same week. And, as it has been pointed out, "It is an ironic juxtaposition of events: one involves a meaningless ritual in which we look to a creature of little intelligence for prognostication, while the other involves a groundhog." roflmaoHopefully the Punxsutawney
Submitted by Hoosierboy on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:06pm.
Hopefully the Punxsutawney Groundhog will emerge, look around, and tell us that our SUVs and lightbulbs are not melting the polar ice caps.
Ask Yourself One Simple Question
Submitted by Bourbeau on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:36pm.
If no one, including Newsbusters,ever wrote or commented about a damn thing that Maher ever said, do you really think anyone would pay attention to his stupidity. The answer is absolutely not! The only time I see anything about this despicable individual is on Newsbusters, and quite frankly, it adds no value to me. It's the same for the likes of Olbermann, Matthews, Schulz , et.al.; why do we keep bringing attention to there nonsense? Let them listen to themselves, talk to themselves and mezmerize themselves, and give them no notice; believe me, with a little luck, they'll all just go away.
You mean like when President
Submitted by Jack Bauer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:59pm.
You mean like when President Reagan said 'Y'know, if we just ignore communism, it'll go away!'
All of the above Mr Obama? --- How about ALL OF THE BELOW, instead.
I have to read NB
Submitted by okiehawk44 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:37pm.
To keep up with the most current BS coming from Bill Maher. I don't get HBO on my cable contract and the last time I took notice, I'm missing nothing -- absolutely nothing. Without NB, Olbermann and Larry King, Maher is nothing and two of those are now gone. Should tell you something NB.
Actually, Maher is correct.
Submitted by Satchmo on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:38pm.
Actually, Maher is correct. The NFL has salary caps, revenue shating, rookie salaries are limited, etc. It is more of a communist system, and I'd say that's the Democratic Party for sure. MLB is based on the free market. There are no salary caps, etc. It is more of a free market system, and that's certainly Republican (even if the Repubs sometimes meddle with the free market).~Y'all hear that?
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 5:40pm.
Pervmo supports Bill Maher. In other news, the sky is blue, rain is wet, and Obama lies. *yawn*
Where did I say that?
Submitted by Satchmo on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 1:19pm.
Where did I say that?
~......
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 7:38pm.
In your first sentence. You said he was right, therefore you support his contention. Need me to draw you a picture?
Agreeing with Maher's point
Submitted by Satchmo on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 10:49pm.
Agreeing with Maher's point does not mean I support Maher as a person or ideologically/politically, which is exactly what you were trying to suggest. I don't know why you always resort to intellectual dishonesty.
~Oh yes, by all means
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 10:59pm.
Denounce me!
Bridle with righteous fury, roar with indignation, whimper, whine, mewl, and puke about the horrendous injustice visited upon you when I responded directly to your "Maher is correct" comment.
It makes you look so........credible.
You are not very bright are you? Really, you are not very bright
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:56am.
Stupid Butt Hurt Satchmo Troll: Actually, Maher is correct.
correct : conforming to or agreeing with fact, logic, or known truth <a correct response>
Wrathful Brunette: Pervmo supports Bill Maher.
support a (1) : to promote the interests or cause of (2) : to uphold or defend as valid or right
right 3: conforming to facts or truth : correct <the right answer>
Seriously, you are really really really Stupid. I do mean REALLY REALLY STUPID.
Life is REALLY REALLY hard for you, isn't it?
You go Satchmo. Tell us.
Submitted by The Vet on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:23pm.
The state of the Parties according to Satchmo the Stupid Butt Hurt Troll -
Second Cousins is Republican.
First Cousins is Democrat.
Sisters is Just Plain Fun.
Small corrections
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:40pm.
Football does not have a rookie salary cap...yet. That is likely in the next CBA, though.
Baseball has the Luxury Tax for all payrolls above a certain level, typically occupied buy the Yankees, the Red Sox, the Mets, and now the Phillies.
Just lettin' you know...
Yeah, I know. It still fits.
Submitted by Satchmo on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 1:19pm.
Yeah, I know. It still fits.
Satchelmouth, you are talking about your ---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 6:01pm.
dunce cap, right?
MD
For the sick freak
Submitted by Unsane on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 11:09pm.
Actually, sick freak, the NFL and the MLB are free to arrange their revenue sharing however they damn well please, as both the NFL and the MLB are private entities.
Feeding your attention addiction again, Incestmo?
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
I never said otherwise. You
Submitted by Satchmo on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 10:12am.
I never said otherwise. You really struggle with reading and critical thinking.Shut up, sick freak
Submitted by Unsane on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:12pm.
You sure enjoy lecturing people on YOUR FAILINGS, don't you, sick freak?
Incestmo, before you wag your finger in my face about reading and critical thinking, you better STFU and read my dismantling of your arguments for the Unfair Tax (among others by myself and other posters). Until that day you shouldn't bother worrying about other people's comprehension skills.
Worry about that instead of worrying about which of your female relatives are available for a date tonight.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Football, basketball and
Submitted by tvhall on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:20pm.
Football, basketball and baseball are where all of the athletic thugs go in High School - therefore these sports are all democratic (That is team sports depending on the collective - terrorizing campus because they ultimately end up being school sanctioned gangs - sort of like tax collectors, unions and the confidence racket).
On the other hand Swimming, Cross Country, Wrestling, Tennis and the like are Republican each depending on individual effort and the benefit of those efforts supporting the team in the aggregate.
Geez, tv...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:38pm.
Get dumped in a few trash cans in high school? Still smarting from the wedgies?
I played football and baseball. My teammates and I were not roaming the school's halls like gangsters terrorizing the populace. As a matter of fact, we performed more service hours volunteering in the community than any of the other sports combined.
Think you better go back and reevaluate that one...
Sorry, while not trash
Submitted by tvhall on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:58am.
Sorry, while not trash canned, my statement stands both from my experience as a teen and as a High School Teacher. While there are exceptions these three sports have the majority of kids with low GPAs, discipline records, and demonstrated hightened sense of entitlement.
Athlete-students
Submitted by Unsane on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 11:13pm.
From my college perch, there are no "student-athletes", only athlete-students. As a high school teacher, I am sure you are well aware that high schools only exist to be sports training arenas and as a place where kids are provided a GREAT social environment.
My dealings with athletes in general, across all sports, indicates to me that it doesn't really mater what sport is played: that sport has priority at all times.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
I think someone secretly performed a lobotomy...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:21pm.
on Maher while he was sleeping...Lord, this man is so pathetically stupid. What kind of a mind tries to equate football with the Dem party and baseball with the Repubs? Well, based on Maher's asinine theory, I must lean Democratic since I love football (always have), but don't have much use for baseball.
Here's my theory...Baseball is Democratic because baseball players, like Democrats, believe that it is perfectly okay to cheat to win...Case in point-Baseball players have long used steroids to bulk up and to increase their strength to unfairly and artifically improve their level of play...The Democrats believe in using every underhanded device they can find to try to steal elections (which they have managed to do more than once, and almost did in the presidential election in 2000).
Wonder what Maher would think about that??
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Hmmmmmm...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:34pm.
Just one problem:
Football has had testing for steroids since the 1980's. Baseball just now finally got around to it.
Steroids were popular on the gridiron long before they were considered for the diamond.
That may be true but...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 7:24pm.
I believe that most would agree that steroids' damaging effects have been far worse on baseball that on football. Look at the difference in the number of home runs since baseball banished steroids...The numbers have plummeted. When the NFL banned steroids there was not such a precipitous drop in the performance of the players as there has been in baseball. There have been a number of baseball records that have been artificially broken because of steroids, that I believe should not be recognized. The same generally cannot be said for football. I am not aware of record holders such as Emmitt Smith, Dan Marino, Tom Brady, or Joe Montana (and others), ever testing positive for steroids. Can the same be said for Barry Bonds, Mark McGwire, Roger Clemmons, or Sammy Sosa (and others)? No.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Point taken, Prairie, but..
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:33pm.
Barry Bonds has NEVER tested positive for a banned substance.
Not. Ever.
However, it should be pointed out that the ratio of pitchers caught using banned substances versus hitters is more than 2 to 1. The difference is that, outside of Roger Clemens, the pitchers that have been caught are not the stature of the hitters that were caught (Sosa, Gonzalez, McGwire).
But remember that Denver Broncos great Lyle Alzado DIED as a direct result of his steroid use. And the Raiders were BIG confessed users in the early part of the 2000s. And Shawne Merriman of the Chargers was banned for 4 games in 2006 after testing positive for HGH.
So don't get too high and mighty.
Don't lecture me...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:57pm.
about being "high and mighty"...Okay? I was simply responding back to your post...If you don't agree with me, fine, but don't condescend to me by saying I'm "high and mighty".
I never said that football hasn't had a problem with steroids, and I am well aware of what happened to Lyle Alzado. I did say that I believe that it has been a bigger and more damaging problem in baseball. And as for your contention that Barry Bonds never tested positive for steroids or other banned substances, etc., you might want to take a look at these...
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,487633,00.html
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2727325
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Easy, big guy...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:13pm.
I did not intend to be condescending. I just was pointing out some key facts that may have been overlooked.
After all, the steroids in baseball episode is still very recent, as opposed to the issue in football.
The NFL has banned steroids since 1987, but the problem stretched back all the way to the early '60s. That's a long time to have a problem and not deal with it.
On the other hand, MLB's issue with PEDs did not begin until the late'90s-early 2000's and was dealt with almost immediately. The punishments handed down by MLB (first offense, 50 game ban) are far more than the NFL's (first offense, 4 game ban).
As for the links you posted (thank you, BTW) you are missing a key point. The alleged failed tests the government's prosecutors purport to have were tests conducted at the BALCO labs (and seized illegally, according to the defense). Bonds has never tested positive in the official tests administered by MLB. If you read my post again, you see that is exactly what I said. You and I have no way of knowing if the prosecution really has what they say they have. They could be bluffing to get a conviction, any conviction. There is a reason this has not gone to trial after more than 7 years (Bonds first testified before the grand jury in 2003; his indictment in 2007 is for lying to said grand jury).
Here's my question (and I apologize for getting so off topic here, NB'ers): if the government's case is as iron clad as they attest, why has this not gone to trial simply over the testimony of one man (Greg Anderson, who refuses to testify)? Surely the government's case can withstand the loss of one witness, yes?
My point, because this has gone on too long: you can't paint baseball with one brush and football with another due to PEDs. They were a bigger problem in football going back a great deal further than baseball, and the NFL took quite a lot longer to deal with the issue than MLB did. If anything, football in general and the NFL in particular are far more guilty.
Actually, it's gal, not guy...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:47pm.
But, no biggie.
As for the discussion at hand...You seem to think that I've been attempting to defend or explain away the NFL and its problems with steroids and how they've handled them...I haven't. I fully admit that the NFL has had issues with steroids for years. That said, I still believe that steroids effects on baseball has been a bigger problem that has more directly affected the performance of the players, and the teams and the league as a result, and which has led to the fraudulently and artificially setting of new records. As for Bonds, just one look at the guy before and after the whole steroid issue with him blew up will tell you that he was very clearly using something...The same can be said of other players as well. Physically these players have far less bulk now and their level of play has decreased.
As for what will ultimately happen in Bonds' trial, who knows...It is a bit of a mess. But I don't for one minute believe that he is not guilty of using performance enhancing drugs. Both baseball and football have had issues with steroids, etc., and both sports have mishandled the problem in the past, which is totally unacceptable. As for which sport has had a bigger problem with PED's, we just may have to agree to disagree.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Apologies, my dear...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:55pm.
And we may have to agree to disagree.
But, speaking as someone who has played both sports at a high level (1 year of college football before destroying my knee and drafted out of high school by the Indians), I can state unequivocally that steroids could only hinder attempting to hit a baseball flying at you at 95 MPH. That's all hand/eye coordination, which is affected negatively by PEDs.
It is funny that I was first exposed to PEDs at a football camp in high school...back in 1979! I refused, but uppers were another story.
You'll find C-Town
Submitted by Blonde on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:05pm.
....that many of us ladies here are rather, um, avid sports fans.
For example, I for one am known elsewhere on the internet as Blonde Gator.
So to totally derail this thread, what do you think of Scamnesty, his Heisman, and Auburn's NC?
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
I'll tell you, Blonde...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:21pm.
I think the NCAA, and the travesty that is their "investigation" into the Cam Newton situation, are a farce.
The whole recruiting process of this guy (by Auburn, not Florida) out of Blinn JC stinks to high heaven. I just don't get why they let him off the hook.
I won't argue his Heisman, but we all know what that and $3 will get you at Starbucks. He will not be a QB at the next level.
As for the BCS title, well...they sort of earned it. I will go to my grave absolutely convinced that Saban had the Tide lay down in the second half of the Iron Bowl. That way, the SEC gets to divide up more $$$$$$ among its schools for the third straight year. The Tide proved in the first half they could whip Auburn, then laid down so the Tigers could go to the BCS title game. I have no proof, but...it looks pretty obvious.
Right you are, Blonde...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:22pm.
There are quite a number of us "girls" here at NB that are big sports fans, you and I included. I think sometimes, that fact gets overlooked, dismissed, and/or forgotten about.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
No apology necessary...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:30pm.
And yes, we will have to agree to disagree on this one...
So.....Who do you like in the Super Bowl?? I say it's going to be the Packers...Thoughts?
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
As a 49'ers fan...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:38pm.
I can't stand the Steelers getting ahead of us by two.
Pack all the way. And you don't know how much it hurts to say that.
LOL! Oh yeah...I understand that...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:52pm.
We're Cowboys fans in this house, and with our 5 Super Bowl wins, the Pack with 3 wins still has some catching up to do, but I'd rather see them win than the Steelers. Up here where I live, the Vikings and the Packers are the big teams, so folks up here are juiced about this...We'll see.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Prairie & C-town
Submitted by MrShy on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:05am.
"We're Cowboys fans in this house, and with our 5 Super Bowl wins, the Pack with 3 wins still has some catching up to do, but I'd rather see them win than the Steelers."
The Jets have 1. Still.
- Shy Deep House
Join Mr. Shy and The 1* Percent
Bummer...One SB win...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:18am.
:-( Sorry...But they came darn close this year after all, and there's always next year for Gang Green...Hang in there.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
They came close
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:38am.
...the last two years, but...
Loved "Hard Knocks," though.
Now let's go eat a God-damn snack!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_aqypLU9F0
C-town
Submitted by MrShy on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:50am.
Hey, we've been a moribund franchise since 1969, for the most part, going to the AFC Championship twice total.
Now Mr. Footsies has taken us to the AFCC back-to-back, and we're young and talented and a contender to stay for some time. So, he's instilled the winningest attitude since the Namath days.
We just need to really have a dominant regular season and get a "God-damn" home playoff game... or two... finally. :)
- Champion Shy
Join Mr. Shy and The 1* Percent
Yep...Ol Rex strikes me as...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:51am.
a wings and ribs guy...Just a guess.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
I believe that most would
Submitted by Newsbusterbrown on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 8:51am.
I believe that most would agree that steroids' damaging effects have been far worse on baseball that on football.
Nope. The effects are exactly the same. The only reason you don't notice it as much with football is 1) there are far more football players that use them (NFL steroid policy or not), so it's hard to stand out among the crowd using PEDS and 2) the vast majority of fans don't worship football records like they do with baseball.*
In football, there are more bigger and stronger players than baseball. That's just a fact. If so, that means NFL players either use more steroids to bulk up or you can build yourself without using them. If the latter, then why do fans get up in arms at records falling?
* Record-breaking moments were the only reason why Congress attacked MLB a few years back, of course. If none of the big records had fallen, I'm not sure MLB would have been forced to enact a drug policy. Which is sad, since the only real reason PEDs should be banned is for heath reasons, not stupid records.
“There are no easy answers, but there are simple answers. We must have the courage to do what we know is morally right.” - Ronald Reagan (1964 Republican Convention)
My Kids are off to college.......
Submitted by Redrowan2000 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:31pm.
The first thing we did was cancel HBO. Specifically because of cretins like Maher. I'm still pissed off about his 911 comments that made him a left wing darling. My kids are independent thinkers and we don't always agree but one thing we did agree on was that Maher is a Di_k. the kids liked some of the movies and the series on the "Band of brotthers and the Pacific operation was something they had me watch.
"Don't let the bastards grind you down."
We don't subscribe to HBO specifically because of Maher...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:42pm.
As for the movies, we either see them in the theater (rarely) or wait for the dvd(s) to come out...We will not help subsidize Maher and his idiotic, hateful lies and bs. The last time we subscribed to HBO, Reagan was in office. As time went by, most of the stuff that HBO ran was mostly material that we were never interested in, so we cancelled it. We toyed with the idea of starting it back up in 2001 when Band of Brothers was on it, but we decided not to pay for it just for one show. When The Pacific came out, we decided against it simply because of Maher. We have since bought both Band of Brothers and The Pacific, and though we had to wait, we aren't sorry because we won't subsidize any channel on which Maher has a show.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
Not mentioned, of course...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 6:33pm.
Is that the two highest paid players on the 2010 San Francisco Giants are Barry Zito and Aaron Rowand.
Both signed as free agents to contracts all true Giants fans (yours truly included) would love to see voided. Or better that they never happened.
Zito did not make the post-season roster AT ALL! Rowand got one start and a few innings of defense and a few pinch at bats. Yes, yes...he hit a 3-run triple in the WS, but it was hardly vital in a game the Giants were up 5-0 at the time(and went on to win 9-0).
Take those two out of the picture and the Giants' payroll is in the lower half of the league.
In other words...a big payroll doesn't mean JACK! The Yankees have had the highest payroll for the last 10 years (probably more) and have won exactly one world championship...the same as the Giants, the Diamondbacks, the Angels, the Marlins, the White Sox, the Cardinals, and the Phillies.
Finally, Maher is right in this aspect: Football is more like Democrats because they impose a salary cap. "Hey, let's limit how much someone can make! Spread the wealth around! That'll show those bastards!" Sounds like Socialism to me.
But then, Baseball imposes a Luxury Tax on all payrolls above a certain level.. That money is spread around to the Pitssburghs and Kansas Citys of the league...just another form of Socialism.
When it comes right down to it, Maher doesn't know the proverbial shit from Shinola.
Always wondered how the Shinola people felt about that comparison....
The other thing is that Democrat men tend to beta males,
Submitted by WarEagle01 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 7:19pm.
somewhat effeminate and submissive. The complete opposite of football. Seriously, just look at Democrats. They are just so sissified. Take Maher for instance. The only manly thing about that guy is his mullet. Seriously, Democrats and football. Maher, you totally beclowned yourself on this one, boy.
it's television that creates NFL parity & MLB disparity
Submitted by OffTheLows on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 7:58pm.
Yankees can get a ton more money with local television rights than the Brewers for example, so by extension the NY payroll is much higher.
But pro sports are by definition unusual circumstances. Unions don't make a lot of sense, but they're probably necessary when you grant leagues antitrust exemptions. The difference in the real world of course is that we don't want other countries to be more competitive than us, and execessive taxation, regulation, and political interference picking winners and losers in favored/unfavored industries.. all of which are bad habits displayed by the left.
Maher's Comments
Submitted by John Galt1776 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:25pm.
Actually what he says makes a lot of sense
Most of the athetes in the NFL and NBA and its fans are Blacks and Democrats. Most of their fans are Demorcrats.
Most of the fans in baseball are White and probably Republican or Independent.
You're painting with a broad brush there, John...
Submitted by PrairieSky on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:29pm.
Have you taken a poll or done research to back up your contentions? If so, I'd like to see them.
"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction...It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them (our children) to do the same." ~President Ronald Reagan
I gotta go with Prairie here, John...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:41pm.
A very large percentage of those black athletes are multi-millionaires that don't like paying the exorbitant taxes imposed by Democrats. And since it is always Democrat controlled state legislatures and city councils that want to tax the single game earnings of out-of-town players, they are forced to pay extra taxes.
They may be proud to have a "black" man in the WH, but they are not too keen on his fiscal policies.
Er dude,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 8:49pm.
There are more than a few Falcons and Braves players who live in my brother's subdivision (my brother bought his house from a Braves player who had been traded).
I used to play golf there all the time, and I can tell you for certain that none of them are dems.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Well, Dave, I think that even
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:23pm.
Well, Dave, I think that even the rookies make more than $250 K per year, so that automatically puts them in the 'rich' class................that might make them think a little bit more about who they support.
killa,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:28pm.
LOL - Nothing turns a dem into a repub faster than signing a multi-gazillion dollar contract.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Er Dave*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:25pm.
My buddy, my friend, mon ami, my heart is racing. Can you get me some Brave's players autographs?
c2,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:49pm.
I rather doubt it right now, as the only time I ever ran into them was around the clubhouse and on the golf course.
The Falcons once had so many players living in there that not only did the player members have their own lockers, but the team had a really big one, too. Not sure if the Braves have a team locker there.
LOL - Now that my brother has achieved former millionaire status, he had to drop his membership to the club early last year, so I haven't played there in over a year.
That really sucks, too, as all you had to do was dial up the clubhouse, let them know when you would be arriving, and a fully-charged cart would be waiting with your golf bags already on it.
And if you went to the driving range, they would send someone out with a bucket of balls for you, and an adult beverage if you wanted one.
When you came in from the course after a round, you could have any repairs and adjustments made you needed, and they would put your clubs away for you.
He may be getting his membership back eventually, as so many have dropped theirs that they have had to slash the membership fee to attract more people.
I hope he does, because I really, really miss playing there. Talk about being spoiled rotten. :-)
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Let me know, Dave!
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:22pm.
I'll drive down from Chattanooga to hit the links with you! And your brother, of course (he is, I will assume, a solid conservative like you).
In the meantime, come on up and we'll hit Bear Trace at Harrison Bay. At 7,111 yards from the Championship tees and a rating of 74.9, it should be a fun day!
http://www.tngolftrail.net/beartrace/harrisonbay/
C-town,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:14pm.
I've never played there but I have a friend who has, and he really liked it.
Next time I'm up that way, and if the arthritis isn't flaring (I have it in both shoulders and my right hip), I'll give you a shout.
LOL - As for my brother, he is almost as conservative as me, but he is only two steps to the right of Attila the Hun. :-^)
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Now that's funny!
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:36pm.
I don't care who you are!
See you then!
Ok Dave*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:23pm.
I will confess, I hate golf but been a Braves fan since they were in Boston, yes I said Boston. Since I wont be getting any authographs, heres a quiz for you and no cheating!!!
Who is the only player to play for the Braves in all three franchise cities?
NO CHEATING!
cajun...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:51pm.
Just to be clear, you DO mean the only player to have played for the Boston Braves, Milwaukee Braves and Atlanta Braves, right?
Gosh, great question. Obviously it would have to be someone who began his career shortly before the franchise moved to Milwaukee and finished it not too long after the move to Atlanta.
I have a guess. But I don't think it's the correct answer.
Jer
Jer*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:26pm.
jeez, sometimes you sound just like a lawyer!
c2,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:56pm.
Without cheating, I would think it would be either Hank Aaron or Dusty Baker.
Or perhaps Warren Spahn or Phil Niekro.
Damn, I should know this. I feel like such a dummy. LOL.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Dave and cajun...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:58pm.
My guess is Spahn or Eddie Matthews.
Jer
Close..
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:03pm.
Spahn missed by one season...poor bastard went to the Mets for the '65 season before finishing his career with the Giants.
Right on with Eddie.
Yeah, you win C-town.
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:10pm.
"Either or" answers don't cut it. Plus I put an extra "t" in Mathews.
Jer
So did I, Jer---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:17pm.
but then - matthew-mathew-, close enough for government work. Unlike using the word reticence, though, right? Oh, you never have gotten back to me on that, have you? Do you plan to?Matthew...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:25pm.
Not sure. I'm a little reticent.
Jer
Now THAT, Jer, ---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:33pm.
was a darned funny response
Good one.
Rest assured, however, bud, that as you called me out (however politely) in the title line of that particular post, I shall, since I was correct with that word usage, expect your "acknowledgement" of same to be in the title line as well; not buried on page fourteen, a la the NY Times.
M-mm-mmm.
I love the smell of victory.
MD
Darn it, Jer,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:12pm.
LOL - I should have cheated.
Hey, I was just a kid back then.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Nahh...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:08pm.
Baker and Niekro not even close. Both never played in Milwaukee, much less Boston.
Aaron was SIGNED by the Boston Braves, but did not make it to the majors until the '54 season, their second in Milwaukee.
Spahn missed out by being sold to the Mets after the '64 season finished. He missed the move by a year.
That's easy...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 10:59pm.
Eddie Mathews, one of the greatest to ever play 3B.
I have his '74 Topps card as manager of the Braves and his '67 Topps card with the Astros (where he hit number 500).
C-town---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:06pm.
didn't Eddie Matthews once hit four homers in a game? Or was that Rocky Colavito - back in the day. MDColavito did...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:14pm.
for the Indians in '59.
You might be thinking of Joe Adcock, who did it for Milwaukee in '54.
Only 15 players in history have done it, and two did it the same month and season. Any guesses without peeking? HINT: one from the AL, one from the NL, and it was May of 2002.
C-town...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:21pm.
Need more help. Give us the teams.
Jer
Teams and positions
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:32pm.
Seattle's CF.
Los Angeles' RF.
Okay, C-town...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:39pm.
Then obviously Griffey for Seattle and, and, and...give me his initials.
Jer
This will give it away, but...anything for a friend
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:42pm.
Seattle Mariner's CF M*** C******.
Los Angels Dodgers' RF S**** G****.
So Mike Cameron, not
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:54pm.
So Mike Cameron, not Griffey. And LA right fielder, Sergio Garcia, of course.
Jer
Ha ha ha! Good one!
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:04am.
Cameron is correct (May 2nd).
The iconic second coming of Hank Greenberg.....Shawn Green (May 23rd).
Five players in the AL (the last before Cameron was Colavito in '59...almost 43 years). Ten in the NL (every decade since 1950).
MIke Schmidt (April '76) has the distinction of hitting all four consecutively AND needing extra innings to do it.
http://www.baseball-almanac.com/box-scores/boxscore.php?boxid=197604170CHN
md...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:16pm.
Not sure about Mathews. I think Bob Horner may have hit four. Stan Musial hit five in a double hitter. Willie Mays hit four in a one game, I believe. And I think you're right about Colavito.
C-town probably knows.
Jer
Jer---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:20pm.
Good point.
Anything C-town doesn't know about sports, ain't worth knowing.
MD
Jer,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:21pm.
Horns did hit four homers in one game. I also remember that the Braves still lost the game.
Boy, did they ever suck back then.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Yep...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:25pm.
Horner did it in '86.
Mays did it in '61.
Any guesses on the two that did it in the same month (May) and year (2002)? Remember, one was in the AL and one was in the NL.
Tick, tick, tick...
C-town...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:29pm.
I said we need more help...names of teams. Please.
Jer
Done...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:33pm.
See above.
ok guys*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:06pm.
Yes it was Eddie Mathews, He played his first season in Boston 1952, played the entire tenure in Milw. then played his last season at Atlanta's first year.
Warren Spahn was a good guess and he was awesome. He facinated me because he threw left handed. Never saw that before ( I was a child) so I would try it in the backyard with my brothers. My mom made me stop when I broke all the windows on the garage....LOL
It was a great question, cajun...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:30pm.
One of my favorite sites of all time is www.baseball-almanac.com. If you love baseball, consider supporting them. They have more than half a million pages of facts and history. A great site for baseball freaks like me.
15 more days until pitchers and catchers report. HALLELUJAH!
Can't wait for baseball season, C-town...
Submitted by Jer on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:51pm.
I don't care if every damn player in the BIGs is a Republican. [Who was the Yankee player in the '94 strike year when asked if he was going to be on a picket line said...screw that, I'm heading for the country club to play golf. Or something like that.]
Baseball is America.
Jer
Jer,
Submitted by Dave. on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:10am.
Yeah, I have never card about the political affiliations of the players, either.
As long as they can play, that's all that matters.
Besides, they already have a word for those that can't play.
Bums. :-)
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Bums
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:20am.
AKA the Los Angeles Dodgers.
That I don't know, but...
Submitted by C-townGiant on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:19am.
...this is my favorite quote about the '94 strike:
"I'm rich. What am I supposed to do, hide it?" - Detroit Tiger Lou Whitaker, arriving in a stretch limo for a players' union meeting during the 1994 baseball strike.
Sugarloaf?
Submitted by Kingfish17 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:18pm.
Just wondering.
"You can’t go take a trip to Las Vegas...on the taxpayer’s dime." Barack Obama
Kingfish17,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:30pm.
St. Ives.
As for Sugarloaf, I was working for the engineering/surveying company that did that subdivision, as well as the golf course, and was running a field crew at the time.
Greg Norman showed up one day to hit some balls off a few of the tees to see if he liked the layout, as it was a course he designed.
That was pretty cool.
He was much shorter than he appeared on TV.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
wow Dave*
Submitted by cajun2 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:34pm.
derailed this thread didnt we?...LOL
c2,
Submitted by Dave. on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:45pm.
Yeah, and it always seems to be Noel's weekend threads that get clobbered, and I seem to always be involved in some way
LOL - No wonder he isn't talking to me anymore.
-Dave
Vote for the American in November
Yes you did
Submitted by Denny Crane on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 1:16am.
But it was a nice derail!
It's always fun for us youngin's to learn a little history.
We Are The 53%
I didn't hear ol' Donkeyface
Submitted by killa37 on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:22pm.
I didn't hear ol' Donkeyface say that '900 million Mooooooooooolems WON'T be watching the Super Bowl.....................suck on that, Muhammed'!!! I know that football is an American sport, and, as we've been told by Boy Blunder, American is one of the biggest Moooooooooslem countries in the world....................
Maher
Submitted by PrimalElements on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 9:25pm.
Why this guy gets any ink is as much a mystery to me as
why blacks vote democrat.
It's a strange phenomenon
Submitted by hbnolikeee on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:14pm.
A lot of actors and comedians start out their careers and were funny and then something happened. They became famous. They succeeded. And they all seem to show their gratitude for the great life that they have suddenly had bestowed upon themselves by becoming nasty, arrogant and hateful.
For example:
Why these folks don't just appreciate all the good that life has placed at their feet and instead spit lots of poison, I just don't understand.
However, having said all this BILL. Try to get it into your head you were an entertainer and you blew it and now are just a nasty a-hole. Enjoy your bucks and stench.
That's why the NFL literally shares the wealth
Submitted by donabernathy on Sat, 01/29/2011 - 11:58pm.
Hey Billy...do you need a lesson on the stock market...you know ...the place where people buy and sell shares of publically owned companies and share in the profits......... And Please...tell us about all the inner city kids ...... you see in the stands at the Super Bowl.... Bwahahahahahahaha..... Ya really need to stop drink'n the bong water
roflmao
"Suck on that, Jesus"?
Submitted by RealVet on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 8:49am.
"Suck on that, Jesus"?? I'm sure this dopehead doesn't have the cohones to say the same about Mohammed.
Anyone who thinks this baboon-face is funny likes to stand in front of the monkey cage for hours, holding out hope that that one of them just might eat their own feces.
Lenin's corpse just had an orgasm listening to this hump.
Suck on That....
Submitted by donabernathy on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 9:21am.
Bwahahahahahahah..
Hey Bill..... Rush Limbauh ... Make more money than you could dream to make and an audience size that .......well ....... put it like this...... all your viewers wouldn't even fill his coin purse. Suck on that "green with envy " Billy.
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
roflmao
Speaker John Boehner
Submitted by gotmail87 on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 10:51am.
Speaker John Boehner Retreating on the Debt Ceiling http://bit.ly/frFOfb
Noel Sheppard forgot one major fact about Baseball
Submitted by Dotcoman on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 12:47pm.
He left out the fact that Major League Baseball under the jurisdiction of Congress and has been since it has been exempt from most federal anti-trust laws laws since 1922,
That's why Cogress gets to call MLB Players in for grillings and photo-ops over drug use, and you don't see them calling Michael Vick in for for dog fighting or Brett Farve in for being a jerk.
silly is as silly does
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 2:20pm.
I like Maher for the same reasons I like most people I disagree with: the guts to say publicly what he wants to say. As many a politician has said, "I don't question another's motives." I also like the variety of folks with differing opinions he brings on his show. What I'd like to see less of is the "making fun of" the voices in the minority. Pretty much the same downside as any talk show from Limbaugh to Matthews. I used to think that adversaries could push each other to be better, and in sports, whether individual or team, I find that to be true. The game benefits. The country is not a game. How do we get past the "holier than thou," "I'm rubber and you're glue" misrepresentations?
~Speaking of misrepresentations,
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 7:44pm.
Syrius, how many times have you been banned from NB? About a dozen now, isn't it?
big fish don't take the bait
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 11:07pm.
Obviously I'm no big fish. Just an old fisherman getting started late in life.
Wrathful Brunette is one hot name. Well chosen?
I'm new at this. Tell me more about the banning, please. I don't want to misunderstand your understanding of freedom of speech.
And who is code name Syrius?
I'm not interested in demanding your time. Ignore me or give me some of your thinking about misrepresentation from left and right. Passive aggressive didn't work with my ex-wife either.
Wrong. You deliberately leave your little calling card.
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:04am.
You have been outed. Go back to DKos where you are just another little nothing gnat amongst all the other nothing gnats that never get noticed.
Stop annoying us. I have a deaf cat that is crying. And I am calling out to him like an idiot because I am wasting my time talking to the only idiot that has had more accounts than Dead Zippers.
The usual whine
Submitted by Unsane on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 11:25pm.
Indeed, the country is not a game, hence the desperate need for passionate, intense disagreement.
I'm not about to put aside my principles and philosophy just to make people feel better.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
honey and vinegar
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:43am.
To me, and the way I read the Constitution, that depends on the principle. Some friends of mine think religion is a principle. Some even think they must convert me. It has stifled our friendhip.
Can you help build? Can you help deliver a product? Are any principles and philosophy open to "passionate, intense disagreement"? Do you agree to abide by the laws of the land? These are important to me too. It's harder to get there when we shout at each other.
By the way, thank you for providing substance in your response.
Can you go away?
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:50am.
Can you build an exit? Can you deliver your butt elsewhere? Is it annoying asking complete strangers stupid questions? Do you disregard multiple account rules of websites? Honesty in important. It is harder when people come back time and time again pretending to be a complete stranger.
Go away Syrius. You have been exposed once again for the 20 time retread you are.
I get it:
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 1:44am.
Syrius was a poster here and he (or she) wasted your time with stupid questions that you wasted even more time responding to. To accomplish what, Vet? I assume you have fought for this country and I thank you for enabling me to teach 35 years of youths that there's no such thing as a stupid question. In battle, there probably is. So we bring different backgrounds. I benefit from reading the right's view of the left and the left's view of the right. Pretty much mirror images. I like to have a place where I can go and not have to deal with what I don't want to deal with---fishing a river in the BWCA. Blog comments is a place of information, not a place of peace for me. Perhaps NB is for you. If it's that important to you, I (Bosco, my one and only account name wherever I comment) will refrain from NB. You'll have to make someone else your Syrius.
It's not enough to be right.
Oh dear. What if I am wrong? Have I chased away a good man?
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 2:04am.
No.
So long. Don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya.
~Translation:
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:02pm.
F#@#% b$#^#, sonofa%$E^&!! How does she F$?^#^%# DO THAT?!?!
Go^%#$%#t, now I have to sign up for another ^$#@in' account!! --bosco/bubbaster/SideShow/protocol_9/Justasec/OddJob/Ubercon/Syrius....to name a few
SideShow
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:13pm.
That was it. I was trying to remember. I have a forum that is still leftover from his banning.
Oh bosco. Waiting for you here.
The return troll SideShow can't back up what he says. 13 months bosco. Still waiting.
~Hope you've got something to keep you busy
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:22pm.
while you wait.
Poor Plugs, he didn't make it six posts with this account before he had his mask ripped off. Bummer.
Bwahahahahahaha....
Bru & Vet
Submitted by Blonde on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:36pm.
I think you are mistaken re: Bosco.
"Sheddy" on the other hand. Shawn busted him in 2 posts.
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
Maybe you are right.
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:58pm.
Whatever he was, he promised not to come back. And we all know how honext and truffies trollies are. I put that promise in the bank and used it as credit for a loan. A promise like that from a trollie like him, pure gold.
Wait... You don't think he will go back on that promise and my loan ends up getting recalled? Where will I house my championship Belgian Racing Pigeons?
END fake civility
Submitted by Unsane on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:23pm.
We NEED to shout at each other. When people like you whine about our supposed need to "come together as Americans", this ALWAYS means "Unsane, will you just shut up and turn over every single economic and political freedom you have over to the government, please? You are stupidly standing in the way of us becoming Happy Little Socialists. Stop."
BS. What we need to do is to dispense with our fake civility. It would be better for the country if the President (no matter who or from what party) were, for example, relentlessly booed and heckled as he or she entered the HR to give the SOTU. Even better if the President went before the House once a week for Question Time, as the British PM does.
In truth, we are too civil, and there isn't enough nastiness in politics. And we desperately need it, for, after all, since the press has decided to become a mouthpiece for one side, and refuses to question anything that one side says at all.
There are very real differences between us, and papering them over only makes things worse.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
My goodness
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 9:05pm.
The ambiguity of "refrain"
Absolutely end fake civility, and let's not paper over disagreements.
I don't get how putting aside some deeply held beliefs to achieve a common goal is always a bad thing. Trust is tough. Money and popularity are no friends of trust.
I remember the movie Miracle doing something pretty rare in entertainment land---a pretty accurate job presenting the steps to beating the Soviet hockey juggernaut in 1980 at Lake Placid. The Massachusetts and Minnesota hockey players had to do some major re-ordering of priorities to enable visionary taskmaster Herb Brooks to lead the USA to gold. He had an understanding that no path is straight.
A leader has a vision and finds in those around him/her what is needed to keep progressing along the developing path. If we are going to succeed with poverty, abortion, debt-deficit-spending, terrorism at home and abroad, and on and on, I believe we need to trust and respect each other in ways some are unwilling to do. Demonizing the left or the right, believing and acting as if "my instincts" are automatically right won't get 'er done.
My grandaddy sold Frigidaires during the Depression and got paid eventually most of the time. He died with a late model Caddie in mint condition, two stores, three businesses, and a gorgeous cabin on the best point of the best lake. He coulda had more by making it more difficult for those who had less.
Sure we'll get burned sometimes. They ain't no guarantees and it's not enough to be right. What am I missing?
Maybe a sense of follow through, Bosco---
Submitted by matthewdean on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 10:00pm.
as you indicated one post back that you were heading off towards the sunset, as it were, never to return. Jest a funnin', eh?~FYI
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:13pm.
When Syrius gets wordy it's often because he copypasted someone else's words. He went on a diatribe about atheism with his OddJob ID, and a poster named katainkent promptly linked to the atheist website he plagiarized the whole screed from. Syrius himself is rarely good for more than a string of one-liners and rhetorical questions. Oh, and rape fantasies when he feels he's safe. Like at Kos.
Whatever Protocol_9
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 10:33pm.
Wrathful Brunette forgot justasec and bubbaster. What was that lumin-something that torqued me?
Don't take too long to get hostile. gigablast don't keep stuff forever.
~Look again, dahling
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:09pm.
I only left out a few of the more insignificant ones that got banned before I even got to tangle with them.
LumenNation was pi314.
Oh that is right. They were tag teaming me.
Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:25pm.
Dang New NewsBusters deleting all the old comments. I still think I might be missing one between protocol_9 and SideShow. Ah, not important. Sideshow was the one PM'ing me trying to get personal information. Update ---- You are right. There is 2 blogs left with lumenNation (2 N's). Not Syrius.~Yup
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:41pm.
I used to get PM's from his various ID's protesting innocence...right before he sent the profane one telling me he really didn't care if I outed him, anyway! So there!
Check your PM's for some FYEO info.
Did you see my post to troglodyt?
Submitted by The Vet on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:08am.
I was just talking about that movie to make my point that parrots talk. Oh this is freaky. Oh this is...man I like Sheena Easton. What were we discussing?~...
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:53am.
Not sure, but I think it was the relative hotness of the different Bonds. Connery was definitely the winner, hands down, and I really think Daniel Craig is second, with Roger Moore third, and then Pierce Brosnan.
And no, I hadn't seen your Bond reference. Guess we were just on the same wavelength. Ah, that explains the pizza craving I had last night!
Grow a spine
Submitted by Unsane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:00am.
I don't get why I, and Rightists in general, must ALWAYS put aside MY deeply held beliefs in order to make YOU feel good.
You are one of two things, bosco: intellectually dishonest or totally wishy-washy.
Let's take your issues, point by point:
Poverty will never be cured as long as we have a human race. There will always be people who continually make stupid decisions with their money, among other things. This is not the governmen't job.
Leave the abortion issue to states, and watch the controversy go away.
If I have to live on a budget, like the rest of the real world, so should the government. We should be demanding the government give us the same level of efficiency the supermarket industry churns out on a daily basis.
Terrorism must be defeated by being proactive.
On these basic principles I WILL NOT COMPROMISE.
You analogy to Miracle is extremely stupid.
Feel free to GROW A SPINE. This IS a republic. You need to grow up and accept that fundamental differences are always going to exist. I am NOT going to cheerfully give up MY pronciples just because of YOUR need to FEEL so GOOD.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Another step
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:07pm.
Teaching in a suburban public school, a $500/yr Catholic school, a $30G/yr private school, an inner-city public school, and an adult education class over 35 years, I've observed many similarities and a few differences among schools/teachers/students/parents: the less money, the longer the odds. Certainly money is not The Answer, but it helps. I applaud the idea of No Child Left Behind, while its implementation has sidestepped learning in the 21st century. But it is a step.
I supported TARP and the stimulus. As I drove cross-country last summer, the number of times I had to slow and stop as a road project progressed gave me plenty of opportunity to observe the job-killing aspects of safer transportation.
Unsane, you write: "Poverty will never be cured as long as we have a human race. There will always be people who continually make stupid decisions with their money, among other things. This is not the governmen't job."
I agree. I also think people make stupid, legal decisions regarding other people's money. Goldman Sachs is just one example of legally gaming the system. And you're right, the government is barely a step behind.
You write: "Leave the abortion issue to states, and watch the controversy go away." Which controversy? Women dieing in back-street abortions? Back in the mid-'60s, a number of young women would disappear from my high school, some for six or seven months, some never to return. No one ever returned with a baby---adoption? abortion? foster care? Tough love may not be the answer to unprotected sex."If I have to live on a budget, like the rest of the real world, so should the government. We should be demanding the government give us the same level of efficiency the supermarket industry churns out on a daily basis."
Absolutely. Supermarkets have competition to provide. Somewhat similar to states and politicians. The feds, on the other hand....
"Terrorism must be defeated by being proactive."
Way too many variables here for me. I see it as you (and I) see poverty---it will always be with us. While fighting it proactively, I'd prefer not to make it worse. It's a messy world. Bombs dropping on innocent civilians is easily misunderstood.
So, my spine remains straight, I still think the Miracle analogy has some merit, and I think each person decides what principles are inviolate. Then we sort it out. While I am not a Christian, I don't cruise past the idea that one must give up oneself to a higher power in order to find oneself.
Thank you for your response.
Slowly you reveal yourself
Submitted by Unsane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 3:45pm.
Bosco, money does NOT help education. If you were right, NJ and DC should be churning out vast armies of Shakespeares, Salks, "Kelly" Johnsons and Mozarts every single spring. Instead they turn out functional illiterates. I think what education needs is LESS money, and they simply need to fight for extra money like the rest of us in the Real World do on a daily basis.
Thank you for openly declaring yourself to be a business-hating Socialist with your attack on Goldman Sachs and your declared support of two programs which have only served to drain capital from the private sector. If you supported "stimulus", you would go for an elimination of the capital gains tax, and the setting of corporate and indivdual income tax at 17% regardless of income with absolutely no loopholes or breaks of any type for anyone or anything.
By the way: there is NO such thing as "too big to fail". If a company fails, it needs to fall.
Your emotional whine on the abortion issue cuts no ice with me. If a woman didn't want to have a kid, ALL she needs to do is to pin her knees together. Works every time. As I am equal opportunity, guys should keep their pants zipped. I'm not religious, but I am coming around increasingly to believe that people like you support abortion because you view life as extremely CHEAP (and you perhaps even view childbirth as something akin to taking a dump). If abortions were prohibited with the exceptions of rape, incest or danger to the mother, I wouldn't lose any sleep at all. Leave it up to the states.
I really would like to know HOW terrorism got worse since 9/11/01. I will take that comment as your saying your way to prevent terrorism is to make America as weak and as whiny as possible. Unfortunately for you, history shows that America isn't attacked because it is too strong. In fact, when people are on notice that America gets poked in the eye at the great personal risk to the poker, people tend to not poke.
if you want to alleviate poverty, great. Start a charity or participate in one.
Miracle is beyond a stupid analogy. It was Herb Brooks's way or the highway. Sports teams do not practice representative democracy. But then, considering how sickened you are at people having disagreement (a natural consequence of being in a representative democracy), methinks representative democracy leaves you with a sense of extreme repulsion. I think you'd be a lot more comfortable in a dictatorship than in a representative democracy.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Yes, if I can pick the dictator
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 7:47pm.
That life is too often treated as cheap does not make it cheap. I am blessed with two children who observed both parents teach and work other jobs in the summer, and sometimes during the school year, to make ends meet. Both chose to go into teaching themselves. One thing I learned from teaching is there are very few simple answers to how a person learns. Blaming the kid was not successful. You are right, money is not The Answer. Skunk Works kept things small, focused, and paid big for results. Money matters. Books and labs matter. Teachers matter. We're nowhere near figuring out educating everyone.
My family of teachers has worked with many brilliant students. Some were brilliant in their studies, some in activities peripheral to school. That they are not replacing Shakespeare, Salk or Mozart is a credit to the greatness of those folks, not a condemnation of this and recent generations, and not even a comment on schools. I did not know "Kelly" Johnson till your mention. Wikipedia's inclusion of his Skunk Works Rules of Management struck me as my kind of dictatorship. Unfortunately, it depends on the dictator. Herb Brooks, yes. Kelly Johnson, yes. Dictators make governing simple, and simple, well, I'll let you fill in the blank.
It's easy to say if a business fails, then let it fall. With some Big businesses that means thousands of now unemployed families, not to mention the businesses who fed into that business with raw materials and the thousands of families dependent on selling that product. I don't think it's that simple---let 'em fail. I'd like to believe it's that simple; I just don't think it works. I was surprised to read that criticism of Goldman Sachs = anti-business. I just do not support individuals or companies who get to stack the deck to succeed.
Finally, national defense, something you described as national offense when it comes to terrorism. War sucks but it is better than the alternative. Athens and Sparta each won a few with pretty different approaches. There's a place for simple response and there's a place for nuanced response. One size seldom fits all, no matter how much government or its citizens try.
Silliness
Submitted by Unsane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:06pm.
I see. It makes sense now. You want more and more more money poured into education because you think teachers deserve massive salaries just for showing up. I don't think so. And you completely, and I suspect quite purposely, miss the point of my comment that NJ and DC should be cranking out vast armies of Shakespeares, Salks, Mozarts and "Kelly" Johnsons every year. It's great you caught the Skunk Works reference, but again, you completely, and I suspect very purposely, miss the entire point. DC and NJ get more money per student than any other part of the country, yet they churn out functional illiterates in their "graduations" every spring. Yet they whine and whine and whine that they just need more money. I would suggest the opposite is true.
The world of education has an entitlement mentality as you demonstrate. From my perch, they get way, way too much money as it is, especially when measured by the actual results. Education needs a very heavy dose of The Real World. Teachers, for instance. Far too many of them walk around thinking they need to be paid and treated like multi-millionaires just for showing up. From my experience, especially from my perch where I get to encounter a great deal of high school "graduates", they can stand to take a massive pay cut until such time they get off their asses and decide to stop being mediocre.
You want more money for books, labs, teachers? Good. Freaking EARN IT. When my comany wants to expand, like many, many others, it must EARN the privilege. Education needs to do the same. Let's stop pouring money into a pit, and demand they do what the rest of us must do when we want more money.
You are absolutely anti-business, and your whine that companies "stack the deck to succeed" shows me further than you are anti-business. And letting companies fail IS that simple. You think companies exist to provide jobs. Not so. Companies exist to make a profit. The end. If they hire people, great. But they are under no obligation to do so.
Funny how you mention Athens and Sparta when you forgot one of the biggest lessons of history: violence works. It works and works every single time it is tried, and if it fails, you are not being nearly violent enough.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
As far as you go, I agree
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:51pm.
Fascinating idea to strip out not just the Dept. of Education. Get rid of all public education. Privatize. How does that end up? Would no child be left behind? Does it matter?
I love it. Kids who have no interest in "school" could attend an alternative or home school or not attend at all. Elite education? Fuhgeddaboutit! I never went to school a day in my life.
What are the odds of success? You got me thinkin onthis one.
Are you really telling me that GS didn't rig the house on those mortgage packages? I'm not saying it wasn't legal; I'm saying they rigged that house to get theirs whether the house was bought, sold, rented or burned to the ground. It doesn't so bad when I put it that way.
Thanks for continuing to
Submitted by Unsane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 4:02pm.
Thanks for continuing to reveal yourself as someone who believes with all his heart that the government solves everything, and that when you whine for people to "come together as Americans" and "stop shouting at each other", what you REALLY mean is that I shut up and proceed to very cheerfully turn over as much of my political and economic freedom as possible to the government (they know best, after all).
If we got rid of public education (I will ignore the fact that this would violate my state's constitution), believe me, the kids would just about be better off. See, you are very naive. You seriously think public schools exist to teach children. Not so. Public schools in the United States exist for athletic children and to provide the children a GREAT social environment. But you simply refuse to accept that.
Strangely, the United States has an atrocious public school system, but a university system that is a world beater. Why is that? I would submit that this is largely due to competition: public AND private schools fighting over a limited number of dollars which are attached to each student in the form of the tuition money. In so doing, the universities work hard in putting together quality academic programs to serve their students better. Why we cannot do something similar in Grades K-12 I have no idea. Oh, I know why...people like you who keep insisting that if we simply poured the entire GDP of the United States for 100 years into the public schools, the kids WILL MAGICALLY BECOME SMARTER, in spite of more than ample evidence that more money doesn't solve everything.
You, bosco, are unreal. If a painter you hire for your home does a shoddy job, do you happily triple the dollar amount you are paying them? With your attitudes towards education, it sounds like that this is your approach to life. I don't share this attitude. I fire the idiot and get someone who CAN do the job, and otherwise work everyday to deprive the incompetent of their money.
Maybe if we starved the schools of money, and forced them to make the same hard decisions businesses across America make every single day, maybe they would spend their money more wisely. Maybe they'd finally dump their incompetent teachers, and learn to hire fewer administrators, and stop burning so much money on crap that does not advance the true mission of school.
I think if the government got the hell out of the mortgage business, and fully privatized Fannie and Freddie, and quit forcing banks to give mortgages to people who have no business whatsoever taking out a mortgage, you'd have nothing to say about Goldman Sachs. But thanks again for revealing yourself to be anti-business and pro-government.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
I think we'd agree that
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 1:04am.
I think we'd agree that government is best at providing for our common defense, both national and local. After that I'm not convinced. I am convinced that programs like Social Security and Medicare meet needs that otherwise were not being met. And I acknowledge that becomes a slippery slope that is not a fun ride. I do see a role for government to do what is not getting done and I'm willing to pay what the tax code says I should pay.
You really got me thinking with the education idea. What you know about teachers and teaching has led you to your opinion and I certainly agree that there's lousy teachers, lousy administrators and lousy schools and that only $ is the answer, not. The vast majority of teachers range from competent to brilliant, but I have the bias of 35 years of observing kids' eyes lighting up when TheTeacher enters their presence (no, no, not me). I know there's a lot more of them than there are Hall of Famers in any sport. Public education is an aircraft carrier, not a speedboat; it takes a while to turn around and focussing on removing incompetent teachers is one of many important steps.
Back to education on the supermarket/college model. What would I see if K-12 became like WalMart and Omaha steaks and 7-11; like Ivy League, state universities and community colleges. I wish I knew some high-end food places and some low rent accredited 2-yr schools but such is experience. I sorta see in high school, but 5 year olds? There are already high schools that pretty openly admit they are there to give "high school" athletes the "best" experience. That school is a powerful social experience is kind of like saying rain is wet except this rain contains natural chemicals that eat through every layer of hoped-for protection and when it stops bothering you or preventing you from being you is when you grow up.
Now I'm putting the roads on that model. The wreckage I'm seeing makes high speed rail (privately owned) look like a money maker.
Now I'm putting ______ on that model.
Now my brain is bent putting elected officials on that model.
I'm pretty new to this posting thing (despite my vast experience as those other names) (I couldn't resist) but this back and forth every day or so has affirmed my respect for people willing to shout alternately.
(The painter example was not your best work---your idea of teaching is similar to your idea of painting a house? Were you a wall as a student?) (A better example would be...dang, you got me thinking again.)
I agree that whatever the gov. did to force mortgages where the numbers say no was bad. It's one of those road to hell is paved with good intentions things. Beware slippery slopes. And I like business. How could I enjoy my America without it. But I do have a problem with what we as a country are willing to accept regarding bonuses paid and minimum wage.
Bosco
Submitted by MrShy on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 2:26am.
Bosco, on the nanny state and government being the solution to what "ails" man:
1) I acknowledge that becomes a slippery slope that is not a fun ride.
He acknowledges it. But, he oddly acknowledges it as "not a fun ride." But, I presume from that choice of words, a ride that nonetheless is necessary, in his view.
Wait, yep, I was right...
2) I do see a role for government to do what is not getting done and I'm willing to pay what the tax code says I should pay.
What is it that's "not getting done" exactly, without the government hand-outs? Who's not doing something they should be doing? For starters.
Well, whatever that vague thing(s) is that's "not getting done", he's ready to blindly pony up whatever more the government needs.... to..... finally fix it.
/sarc
- Shy Grooves
Join Mr. Shy and The 1* Percent
reach exceeds grasp
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 11:37am.
Go for the gold has such different meanings.
Things that government does that otherwise get done even more poorly or not at all:
Social Security
Medicare-Medicaid
Interstate highways
National parks
Food safety
Monopolies
International police
Voting rights
Government is not TheAnswer, but it helps.
Whoops
Submitted by The Vet on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 12:27pm.
Syrius is feeling more and more at home and starting to act like himself.
Never saw Syrius in action, but---
Submitted by matthewdean on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 12:18am.
an ass-munch by any other username is still an ass-munch.
MD
Huh?
Submitted by Unsane on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 1:14am.
International police? What the hell is that? By the way, the federal government does very little law enforcement. Nice job at conflating.
Social Security and Medicare/Medicaid should be fully privatized.
Interstate highways fall under defense, but could be better placed under Article I, Section 8, Clause 7 of the Constitution.
Monopolies? Huh?
Voting rights - again, handled under the Constitution. Read Amendments 15, 19, 24, 26.
To you, government is THE ONLY ANSWER. Note your responses infused with extreme terror at the notion that education could actually do with less money.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
my answers
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 2:40pm.
By international police I meant the US Armed Services acting as the world's policeman. (And yes, I reveal nothing that would surprise you that I did consider the term policeperson). Iraq, Kosovo, Somalia, Iran-contra come to mind.
Putting interstate highways under defense. I love it. I'm more leery of the Post Roads Constitutional option. It's going to be hard enough to keep a lid on what constitutes interstate.
Monopolies: I was thinking of anti-trust laws, totally overlooking the post office, the Fed, etc.
So voting rights is a place, like immigration, where the Feds are NOT doing what is mandated.
Government is not the only answer.
Infused with terror? I'm glad I don't live in the person you and some posters describe.
Government kills
Submitted by Unsane on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 8:57pm.
I will take your first paragraph as an admission that you don't much care for the military and want the United States to be as weak as possible on the world stage. It also further exposes you to be an extremely poor student of history. (What the Iran-Contra affair of 25 years ago has to do with the military is beyond me. I suspect that sometimes you type just to see yourself type.)
Go back to 1956. The Interstate Highway system was designed for defense. Period. Again, study some history for a change. The Army was screaming for there to be a way to rapidly move forces from one coast to another as far back as the 1920s and 1930s, when the precursor to what we now call U.S. Highway 50 was being built.
Monopolies: the Postal Service does not count, please consult Article I, Section 8, Clause 7 of the Constitution. I am quite pleased the Fed is a monopoly, created by Congress to aid the Congress in the coining of money and regulating the value thereof, which again is a explicit power of Congress found under Article I, Section 8.
You have failed to read Amendments 15, 19, 24 and 26, I see.
Actually, you do live inside the person I and other posters describe. Why can't you learn to stop being intellectually dishonest?
Government in many cases is not the answer at all. Government does one thing very very well: It kills people.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Are you dumb or just acting dumb?
Submitted by Unsane on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 1:07am.
You are convinced that Social Security and Medicare are meeting needs that weren't being met because you are an extremely poor student of history and human nature.
You are again purposely missing the point. School is supposed to be SOMETHING of a social experience as ALL interactions with human beings are supposed to be. The difference is that public education in American presently places that FRONT AND CENTER. The actual purpose of a school - teaching and learning - is placed deep on the back burner, if it is there at all. Your commentary suggests to me that this state of affairs does not bother you in the slightest.
Schools should be for the shocking activities of TEACHING and LEARNING (depending on perspective), not on athletics, not for being great places to meet friends and hang out.
And yet again you completely, purposely, miss another key point. You analogies once again suck. (I never thought of a 7-11 being a restaurant, for one thing.) You are so upset at the idea of parents deciding how best to educate their children that you want them ALL to be taught with as much mediocrity as possible. I'm not a fan of mediocrity, especially when I know we can - and should - do better.
And of course you purposely, cheerfully miss another point - are you dumb or just acting dumb? In no other endeavor - painting a house, whatever you like - do we actually pay money hand over fist for mediocrity and crappy workmanship. We fire the idiot. But not education, oh, no. If in the world of education, people do a crappy job, your immediate contention is THAT THEY SIMPLY NEED MORE MONEY. In no other field of human endeavor is total crap so thoroughly rewarded, time and time and time again. When people do crappy work in the Real World, they get fired or go out of business. Time to hold educators to the same standard - if you suck at educating, then find something you are actually good at.
Thanks for further revealing yourself to be a pro-government, business hating Socialist in your last sentence. What other people make isn't my concern. It sure as all hell is not yours. It is none of your damn business. By the way, I like a minimum wage, too. Of $0.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Well, I'm not acting
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 3:10pm.
I'd appreciate some more information about how Social Security and Medicare ignore the lessons of history and our human nature. I'm guessing it's If you give somebody something they'll just want more for nothing until our society collapses? I see some of that, not as powerfully as you. Most people I know would take a crappy job over no job at all. As far as I know, there'no living wage law, just minimum wage which is plenty hard to change up or down. As it should be.
You and I have different experiences with schools, teaching and learning and (our) money. Would you like to own the Yankees for the price of the Twins? Sometimes those deals are out there. I wonder how world-magnet medical schools would fare without federal funding.
"if you suck at educating, then find something you are actually good at" Absolutely. Support of the struggling teacher (mentor, training) may not be the most cost-effective use of money.
And, approaching finally for me on this thread, I am pro-government, pro-business, pro-entrepeneur. Each has a place the size of which we determine when we vote.Didn't some politician say "The only poll I pay attention to is the one that elected me." I'm with the voters, even when my preference isn't preferred.
Still trying to hide true feelings
Submitted by Unsane on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 3:41pm.
Simple: how were the elderly taken care of before Social Security? In fact, how have the elderly been taken care of even after Social Security has been implemented? Hint: the idea of a "retirement", among many other things we take for granted in modern society, are extremely new concepts in the grand scheme of things.
There shouldn't be a "living wage" law, but there should likewise be no minimum wage law. Res tantum valorum quantum vendi potest.
Your second paragraph is bizarre to say the least. Those world-magnet medical schools can be funded from other sources other than the federal tit. As desperately as you want all of us to orbit DC, it isn't necessary.
Some teachers do not struggle. Some teachers simply suck at what they do. I had a few brilliant teachers in my time. I had some that completely sucked. (Example: I had one junior English teacher in particular who was in teaching for the summer vacations. That was clear as a bell.) Most were mediocre and forgettable. Maybe if we rewarded ones that were good, continued to pay the mediocre ones with mediocre pay, and fire stupid and incompetent ones, we could get somewhere. And maybe the way society looks to teachers will drastically improve.
If you are with the voters, even when you preference isn't preferred, that makes you wishy-washy; spineless. I have ideas that people aren't necessarily opposed to; many are ideas people simply don't give a crap about. But do I abandon them because the masses don't care about them? No. And you cannot be pro-business. Every time you have posted here, it has been with a rigorous defense of government, and has been sprinkled with attacks on business. When you aren't intellectually honest, debate suffers.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
Not much new
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 7:09pm.
Does membership in your country switch when the party in power changes?
I didn't vote for George W. Bush but he was the President of the United States so he was my President. I choose to support my President whether I voted for him or not. There's policies he developed and statements he made that I agreed with and ones that I disagreed with. Do you think I shut up either way? Despite some folks repeatedly making fun of him, becoming a two-term President is not something you find on dummies' resumes. Besides, I bet ol' George himself got more than a chuckle out of many of his "gaffes"---the guy had a sense of humor to boot.
So if I kept a list of what someone calls me, I could add these. I'd rather read and write on topics that make more sense to me.
It's difficult to shut me up
Submitted by Unsane on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 9:01pm.
Citizenship in my country does not change whenever there is a change in leadership. But it doesn't mean I roll over and worship whoever comes into power like God, either. It doesn't mean I stop thinking and blindly trust whoever enters office. Again, I think you would be much more comfortable living in a dictatorship.
I reserve the right to question my government as much as I damn well please no matter who is in office, for even those I have supported have had some rather dumb ideas.
"CONSUMED DEMOCRACY RETURNS A SOCIALIST REGIME" - Slayer, "Fictional Reality", from Divine Intervention (1994)
I'm glad you cleared that up
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 10:11pm.
I'll stick with the form of government we have.
With the exception of the dictatorship part, I agree completely with your last post. In my reading, a certain amount of parrot-posting is present. Understandable. Different websites attract (cater to?) different audiences. I don't mind that. We seldom agree and sometimes we do and we kept writing with a measure of respect. If I'm supposed to insult someone or psychoanalize or tell them what they're really thinking to get respect, I can do just fine without it. You may be difficult to shut up. I am trying to learn when to.
The only stimulus money spent
Submitted by Hunter12 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 3:54pm.
The only stimulus money spent on any of the jobs you got stopped at during your cross-country trip last summer was for the sign that said the construction stopping you was funded by TARP money. Look at the lead time or approval cycle on a construction job and you'll get an idea of why the Obama claim of "shovel-ready" jobs was total BS.
"An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last." - Sir Winston Churchill
Lead time
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 11:40am.
That makes sense.
Maher makes a good living
Submitted by Cowboy on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 4:06pm.
Maher makes a good living just being talked about. It doesn't matter how stupid the things are that come out of his mouth, as long as they contain enough anti-conservativism.
Next step up... the Comedy Channel... I hope...
He's a reason I dropped HBO a couple years ago
I think George Carlin would is turning over in his grave...
Submitted by buzzyboop on Sun, 01/30/2011 - 5:31pm.
I think Carlin would go off on Bill.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=om_yq4L3M_I&feature=player_embedded
When football starts taking
Submitted by Hoosierboy on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 12:20pm.
When football starts taking points away from teams that are winning and giving them to the losing team, then Maher will have a point.
Some other suggestions:
1. Repeal NFLDADT and let gays serve openly in the locker rooms.
2. The NFL rulebook is a living document that should be interpreted in light of changing times and circumstances. As such, the simple fact that a ball hits the ground before it is caught is not grounds for an official to rule the pass incomplete.
3. The New England Patriots nickname glorifies a bunch of white, male slave-owners.
4. When an offense invades the defense's territory, the defense should have a duty to retreat. They have no right to punish the offense who is just there to make a better life for themselves.
5. Names on the back of players' jerseys is an invasion of their right to privacy. They should not have to identify themselves if they don't want to.
hilarious---original?
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 7:51pm.
#4 is priceless
bosco---
Submitted by matthewdean on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 2:08am.
Unsane's "painter" example was exemplary as a reference comparison for dealing with those in academia who are inept.
Your comment following your attempted denigration of that comparison, "Were you a wall as a student?", was, troll or no, one of the stupidest sentences ever to come through a keyboard.
MD
I wonder
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Thu, 02/03/2011 - 11:21am.
I am not bright enough to understand your point but thanks for getting me thinking.
Troll and trolling are terms I'm beginning to understand. I first met Troll the noun in the the story of the 3 billy goats Gruff. That troll made some bad choices.
I first met troll the verb about the same time fishing with my dad's dad in his old green rowboat. First I rowed and he fished. Then he rowed and I fished. I asked why we couldn't both fish at the same time and he told me that you troll to find a honey hole. Then we'll both fish.
The noun is not complimentary and the verb is. Cool word. I have no difficulty being seen as either but I see myself as more (not surprisingly) the verb.
Glib, specious, AND smarmy; but a thinker---
Submitted by matthewdean on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 12:28am.
Thank you one and all, says Bosco, for getting me thinking. Well, Bosco, you may not be a self-starter when it comes to thinking, but you are definitely a hoot when it comes to being mealy-mouthed!~Food for thought
Submitted by Wrathful Brunette on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 2:59pm.
Syrius once boasted to me that when he signed up for multiple accounts (while traveling, so as to take advantage of different IP addresses) he would use them and/or give his lib friends access to them. I believe Syrius bailed on this one after I called him out. The style changed and from no mention of profession he suddenly went to talking almost exclusively about being a teacher.
who I am
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 3:34pm.
This Syrius person. You got me interested so I googled it and found Sea Prince and Fire Child and some other starry stuff.
"They" also wanted me to know that Sirius (I am skeptical when the y changes to i w/o adding -es) is the "brightest star in the firmament."
Clearly not me though my planetary citizenship has been called into question at times.
Bosco comes from Bosco Bosconovich, the nickname given me by my Little League baseball coach when I was 6 years old. I was aware of trolls then and soon to learn about trolling. I continue to learn new uses.
I thought about your recurring final quote. There's an element of humor in that sad situation.
And I still think the name Wrathful Brunette sounds hot.
What does the squiggly line mean in front of Food for thought? (And this guy was a teacher? Just another example of what's wrong in today's world.)
matthewdean
Submitted by Bosco1123 on Fri, 02/04/2011 - 3:32pm.
I have benefited from some of your posts on various threads at Newsbusters. The ones that dealt with thinking beyond name-calling. I'll continue to look for those.
Sorry, Bosco---
Submitted by matthewdean on Sat, 02/05/2011 - 3:07am.
I don't think I am congenitally able to post without name calling. You have me mixed up with that other matthewdean.