For years, NewsBusters has reported the unfortunate incidence of vulgarity and virulence in the liberal blogosphere, as well as how some prominent politicians and left-leaning media members have expressed concern regarding how such behavior negatively reflects on the Democrat Party.
On Friday, this invective hit a new low at Daily Kos when a piece that was quickly promoted to the highly-coveted "Recommended Diaries" list had an extraordinarily deplorable title -- which will NOT be printed here for what will be obvious reasons! -- dealing with relieving oneself on the likeness of former President Ronald Reagan.
This piece of detritus is so vile (h/t NBer lumpy) I won't dishonor the former president, or my readers for that matter, by linking to it; before curiosity sends you over there to see for yourself, be forewarned to do so with an empty stomach and the understanding that you will be revolted beyond your wildest imagination.
This raises an important question:
How can Newsweek continue its relationship with Daily Kos proprietor Markos Moulitsas if his website allows such commentary?
Now, before you question my understanding of the first amendment, rest assured that I am by no means suggesting the blogger that posted this piece has no right to express such opinions. Nor, am I stating that Moulitsas shouldn't be allowed to publish such vulgar vitriol.
Not the case. Go right ahead. In fact, I think it speaks volumes about what indeed is happening in the nether regions of the far-left that will continue to make it difficult for the Democrat Party to be mainstream as long as it caters to such.
Instead, the question is whether or not Newsweek wants to be affiliated with someone that would allow an article to be published at his website that not only deals with urinating on a "Reagan toilet bowl decoration," but also contains such imagery in the title.
This is especially true given the fact that Moultisas, in his own FAQ section, has guidelines about what can be posted at his website including inside titles (emphasis added):
- Diaries which contain hateful or defamatory writing are prohibited.
- Diaries which are deliberately designed to inflame are prohibited.
- Deliberately inflammatory titles, or titles which contain attacks, are prohibited. Also, while this site doesn't prohibit profanity, please think very carefully before using any curse words in a diary title. [...]
When choosing a title, please avoid the following:
- Profanity in titles is disallowed. The use of asterisks is acceptable. Profanity in the title of a diary will be changed by an admin to contain asterisks (e.g., "Fuck" => "F**k"). Profanity in the text of diaries, and in comments, is OK; just keep the curse words out of the diary titles.
Is "piss" a curse word? One would think that when it's being directed onto a former president it is. Furthermore, let's understand that beyond just the title, Moulitsas makes it clear that "freedom of speech" does not give members the right to post anything they want:
But, what about Freedom of Speech?
Doesn't the First Amendment give me the right to talk about whatever I want here?
No. Daily Kos is owned by kos. The servers are his. He pays the bandwidth charges. He makes the rules; we are here as his guests. If he decides tomorrow that anyone not posting in iambic pentameter will be banned, your options are either to brush up on your poetry skills or find/start another forum.
Controversial 9/11 Diaries
DailyKos accepts that the 9/11 attacks were perpetrated by agents of Al-Qaeda. It is forbidden to write diaries that:
- refer to claims that American, British, Israeli, or any government assisted in the attacks
- refer to claims that the airplanes that crashed into the WTC and Pentagon were not the cause of the damage to those buildings or their subsequent collapse.
Authoring or recommending these diaries may result in banning from Daily Kos.
Interesting. So, Moulitsas has the right to ban posters at his discretion, and makes it clear that 9/11 Truther articles are forbidden.
Well, what about articles dealing with urinating on a picture of a former president, Mr. Moulitsas? Shouldn't that also be unacceptable to you?
Or how about referring to said former president as a "stumbling f**kwit?" Is that less offensive to Newsweek contributor Moultisas than 9/11 conspiracy posts?
Apparently so.
Moving forward, what was really ironic about this piece was its intention to depict the Republican Party in total disarray:
When History is done with these people it's going to describe them as the ruin of a generation. My generation.
I guess this writer is proud of what's currently happening to the Democrat Party, especially with a civil war looming at the Convention in August, and incompetents like Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, and Howard Dean at the helm.
Makes you wonder what grade this DKos poster would give the 110th Congress, and what accomplishments he or she believes have been made since the Democrat victory in November 2006.
This seems especially important given the following ruminations about the past:
So we didn't do anything about our national debt. We didn't do anything about our use of gas and oil. We didn't improve our nation's infrastructure. We didn't do anything about education.
Maybe so. However, what have Speaker Pelosi and Majority Leader Reid done concerning such issues since DKos readers and writers assisted in ushering them to power in January 2007?
Sadly, in this "diarist's" zeal to be inflammatory -- did I mention that's prohibited in titles at DKos? -- the failures of the left since coming to power sixteen months ago are irrelevant.
Color me unsurprised.
On a more positive note, regardless of the current condition of the Republican Party, and its unfortunate movement to the middle in the past eight years, conservatives should at least be heartened by the notion the Democrats continue to curry the favor of the Netroots, for the further they move to the left, the less they represent the majority of Americans.
Think about it.
—Noel Sheppard is the Associate Editor of NewsBusters.













Comments Policy
Despicable
May 10, 2008 - 14:12 ET by Gary P JacksonDespicable sub-humans.
Nothing will happen to them now, but when they reach the Pearly Gates, the sign will read "No Vacancies".
As you say Noel, words that describe these "people" shouldn't be repeated in polite company.
Gary
May 10, 2008 - 14:17 ET by Noel SheppardGary,
Quick couple of questions: did you go there to see for yourself, or heed my warning? Also, do you agree with my decision to not post the title or the link? ns
Moulitsas is a secret "troofer".. I bet.
May 10, 2008 - 14:26 ET by Jack BauerThat must really enrage his posters because HE KNOWS, as do we all, that probably half his audience believes the opposite.
But I'm guessing that if he allowed the mentally challenged loons to post what they actually believe, he would so alienate those Democrats with an ounce of savvy he couldn't get any access at all. O'Reilly would run with that all night long.
Unbelievable
May 10, 2008 - 14:26 ET by CobraManSo this type of material is what passes for civil discourse at the Daily Kos? Unbelievable.
Rest assured, now that NB has covered this, that diary will soon disappear down the memory black hole. After all, the left is the bastion of love, tolerance, and acceptance, right?
Rest assured also that some Daily Kos member will soon be here trying to justify this by pointing to some right-wing blog, that no one has ever head of, and accusing them of doing something similar. That seems to be the standard defense these days.
It Gets Worse
May 10, 2008 - 14:29 ET by Superman569 Positive Marks. 0 Negative Marks.
Superman, gotta be that ol' "new <LIBERAL> math.".
May 10, 2008 - 22:18 ET by upcountrywaterX amount of consensus percentage units. V/S data fact math.
F=ma V/S feels good ,as good as running out the clock.
Over 8,000 Bucks/ year. = 50% drop out rate.V/S "free market"
get em in the schools, HOSE them with the MSM.
mind numbed robots..
The POPE says, GOD BLESS AMERICA!!
IranianUranium<sleep>New/Infrastructure/repair?/ROFLMAO
Online behavior study
May 10, 2008 - 14:31 ET by Jonah JohansenA couple years ago I read a very informative study comparing the online-forum behavior of liberals and conservatives.
(Note it was done by amateurs, specifically a group
of students in a upper division psychology/sociology class) What they did
was monitor and record the interactions between conservatives and liberals on a
thread devoted to politics/current events on Bruce Springsteen’s web
page. The group of students doing the research seamed to be a mix of
liberals and conservatives.
What they found in their
study actually shocked the liberal students working on the study.
They found that an
overwhelming amount of the hostility, rudeness and anger came from the liberal
posters compared to the conservatives. They found a clear pattern of the liberal posters verbally
assaulting the conservative posters. There was a fairly stark contrast
between the level of venom and hostility each group expressed towards their
ideological foes. The liberal or left wing posters actively and persistently
sought to drive people who disagreed with them on the right, off of the
forums. In most cases the lefts hostility and ugliness caused the
conservatives to eventually exit. The experimenters of course observed the big difference in the frequency of
profanity and sexual themed insults.
One thing that was really shocking and disturbing was a
case they came across during the study, in which one of the more passionate and
extreme leftists actually went as far as making threatening phone calls
and real world actions to harass a conservative poster who had hung around and
resisted the normal regimen of online harassment. If I remember correctly, it
involved posting the conservatives home address, phone number and employers
name, I forget the exact details but it was really over the top.
It is only one study and an amateur one at that; but
it reflects the tone and online manner I have personally seen online when
dealing with the left.
Nothing is sacred to the left
May 10, 2008 - 14:36 ET by jefflebowskiThese are the same people that gathered and screamed profanities at President Reagan's hearse as it and his family passed on the way to burial.
The unwashed left has no values. They are truly disgusting. The unwashed left will always make fun of those with morals and values. Have you ever really looked at these protester types on the left? They are freaks and have nothing to contribute to society
Noel, you were right not to post that trash. I don't have (or want) to read it to know what to expect from the Daily Kos.
i used to frequent numerous
May 10, 2008 - 16:41 ET by mister josephi used to frequent numerous web boards. i was openly conservative, and for the most part, people were polite. i took a moratorium on most of the web boards after 2004's elections. apparently being a conservative is invective enough to be attacked personally, called all sorts of names, and insulted routinely and without provokation.
apparently 'passion' replaces 'decency' when it comes to the internet. and thus it was the shock of 2004's election results, when the newly-budding Internet culture was reminded of the existence of the Silent Majority, and liberal-types went bananas. if the entire of your world thinks like you do, then you start to percieve that those who do not are wrong.
i lost "friends" in 2004 simply because i didn't think like they did, and i've lost "friends" in 2008, simply because i said "i don't like barack obama." it's sad when people tie their identity so tightly to a political candidate, and it's sad to see people claim open-mindedness and tolerance, yet turn around and be anything but when you do something so simple as say 'i disagree with you.'
I have a cousin who has said he never wants to be within 500 ft
May 10, 2008 - 17:53 ET by terrigMisterJoseph, I have a cousin who thinks Obummer can walk on water and sent a mass email telling us all how wonderful he was. Well, I replied back that I didn't think he was so great, etc. He said he hoped if he saw me it would be in a casket (this guy is pushing 60) . Fast forward-last Saturday our Aunt passed away (this is the first of my father's siblings to die since his half brother at Pearl Harbor). He called my father asking if I would be attending the "festivities"-his words not mine and my dad replied that I would be flying in on the first flight out of Dulles for the funeral on Weds. and leaving that evening on the last flight back. He then replied that he wasn't leaving AZ even though this Aunt was his Godmother if I was going to be there. He then asked if my "terrorist" husband would be there (hubby is in the Army) and my dad just hung up on him. Unfortunately, this is the behavior of these people.
BTW he loves the HuffingtonPuffington Post and the Kooks.
Hi terrig... Now that is
May 10, 2008 - 18:02 ET by bigtimerHi terrig...
Now that is just beyond pathetically sad...he has mental problems IMHO...unfortunately some of us all have what I consider crazy relatives in our families.
Just my two cents.
'nuff said.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Hi Bigtimer,
May 10, 2008 - 18:03 ET by terrigYeah, he's got problems that's for sure. I never had any problems with him until I responded to his "manifesto" on Obummer, then I was the worst person ever!
The real kool-aid drinker
May 10, 2008 - 18:21 ET by NL207The real kool-aid drinker libs are all like this. Beware of them in the workplace! These people will not hesitate to assassinate the character of conservatives in the workplace and take other negative actions that willl affect performmance apparaisals and salaries. They could care less about actual job performance. They will form these negative opinions and take punitive actions solely based on politics.
This has led me to change my approach to business life over the years. I now religiously eliminate these people when I discover them on whatever grounds I can find. I justify this to myself on the grounds that these lefties are, by virtue of their intolerance of political opinions divergent from their own in the worklplace, harmful to the business. They cannot be trusted to render honest opinions about the work of others who do not share their politics.
Huh?
May 10, 2008 - 18:48 ET by mandrake"I now religiously eliminate these people when I discover them on whatever grounds I can find. I justify this to myself"
What, they now sleep with the fishes in the east river? You 'eliminate' people cause you think they're too liberal?
Leave the liberals. Take the
May 10, 2008 - 19:09 ET by balboaLeave the liberals. Take the cannolis.
Cannolis
May 10, 2008 - 19:13 ET by Free StinkerLOL! ;-)
mandrake... NL will speak
May 10, 2008 - 19:24 ET by bigtimermandrake...
NL will speak for himself...I know exactly what he meant though...if you run a business, big or small and a non-productive leftist with a chip on his shoulder that may have or does have an agenda to begin with in his/her life they will look for anything and everything to bring forth a lawsuit if possible...that is what he meant about punitive damage, anything to bring you or the company down...it has been going on for years...or haven't you noticed?
Trial lawyers, ACLU, feel good laws, over-bearing regulations that are so over-board it is beyond maddening.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Ya, but I was in business
May 10, 2008 - 19:34 ET by mandrakeYa, but I was in business too at one time. And to give a person a bad annual review based on politics is unfair and self-defeating.
I worked with a few who's politics I detested..they were Quebec seperatist supporters. However, they were also quite smart..so I gave them good reviews anyway.
"to give a person a bad
May 10, 2008 - 19:44 ET by NL207"to give a person a bad annual review based on politics is unfair and self-defeating"
Exactly my point. And I have observed that the Kool-Aid kid liberals will invariably do exactly this. Sometimes it is not a "bad" appraisal, but it is almost always a lesser appraisal than the employee earned on the merits of work. They are not to be trusted with the best interests of the organization.
Actually, what I object to
May 10, 2008 - 19:45 ET by NL207Actually, what I object to most about them in the workplace is they will not hesitate to give a negative input or performance appraisal to an employee who has convservative or any other political views for that matter which conflict with those of the liberal. Instead of using the goals and best interests of the business to guide their actions, they use Marx! This is not just unfair to the employees whose lives and careers they taint with this trash, but it is self-defeating to the business as well.
So you do it to them
May 10, 2008 - 20:20 ET by cleverpigSo you do it to them first!
Excellent plan. You simultaneously GUARANTEE that someone will be fired unfairly and that it won't be you, instead of waiting around to find out if the liberal in your office had any intention of causing trouble in the first place.
Bravo.
I find NL's view to be
May 10, 2008 - 20:25 ET by balboaI find NL's view to be incredibly jaded and narrow-minded. I've NEVER come across a liberal in the work place who wanted to take down the company or anyone who had differing political views than their own.
boa...you and cp seem to
May 10, 2008 - 20:32 ET by bigtimerboa...you and cp seem to either not have read all of this from the beginning of NL's comments or it is going right over you heads...intentionally.
Figures either way.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Well, I can't speak for Bal
May 10, 2008 - 21:00 ET by mandrakeWell, I can't speak for Bal or CP..but I really do represent the 'does Mandrake have a brain?" comment.
To quote George Harrison in A Hard Day's Night..
Q: Are you a mod or a rocker?
A: I'm a mocker.
Perhaps "Kool-Aid drinking
May 10, 2008 - 21:07 ET by balboaPerhaps "Kool-Aid drinking liberals" got switched to all liberals in my mind. If so, then I apologize.
I'm pretty sure NL would
May 12, 2008 - 00:14 ET by cleverpigI'm pretty sure NL would consider me a kool-aid drinking liberal, so I reserve the right to be horrified by his sentiments :)
I believe the official term
May 10, 2008 - 19:36 ET by NL207I believe the official term is 'termination', which has some other more unfortunate connotations. In the vernacular, "fire" them. i.e., discharge them from employment.
NL... Anybody with a
May 10, 2008 - 19:46 ET by bigtimerNL...
Anybody with a brain knew what you meant...intentionally making a mountain out of molehill here....just so typical.
Just my two cents...
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Does Mandrake have a brain?
May 10, 2008 - 19:48 ET by NL207Does Mandrake have a brain?
In the context of this
May 11, 2008 - 13:43 ET by mandrakeIn the context of this article, one might find that comment..shall we say delicious?
Oh I could tell you why the oceans near the shore...
Wait, so what you "meant",
May 12, 2008 - 10:51 ET by JasonCWait, so what you "meant", NL, is that you do pre-emptively fire leftists because, as a group, they're just unproductive agitators? And what BT is reacting to, RE: "mountain out of a molehill" is the (obviously sarcastic) implication that you do something violent to them?
But this is something you actually believe is appropriate; firing acknowledged liberals before they can cause any trouble in your organization?
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
That is quite sad, but just
May 10, 2008 - 18:06 ET by balboaThat is quite sad, but just recently on this site we've had people say they thought King should go back to being a "hood ornament," and another who said that the only thing he wants to read in re: to King is his obituary, then he'd know another liberal soul was safely in hell, or words to that effect.
As usual, they do it so
May 10, 2008 - 18:11 ET by terrigAs usual, they do it so it's okey dokey? Of course not, I have never said that King should be dead, I just said that I was (and did) send my autographed book back to ME as did my brother and the picture that he used to be proud of. Why you think we have to take crap from people like that is beyond me, you may think it's okay but not me.
As for my cousin, I am saddened but I have done nothing to him except to say that my husband and I support the mission, he has to do this mission-not the cousin and that if he thinks that two bitter people who are living the American dream are the best candidates for office, that was his opinion but others in the family felt different. That was when he wrote back and said that next time he would see me would be in a casket or better yet being put into the ground at St. Mary's cemetary. Yeah, real nice but you probably think I deserve it though.
As usual, they do it so it's
May 10, 2008 - 18:22 ET by balboaAs usual, they do it so it's okey dokey?
Never said that.
Of course not, I have never said that King should be dead,
Didn't say that, either.
Why you think we have to take crap from people like that is beyond me, you may think it's okay but not me.
Hat trick!
I'm saying that your cousin's attitude is not relegated to just Kos and kooky left.
Here is a newsflash for you
May 10, 2008 - 18:34 ET by terrigHere is a newsflash for you balboa-it seems to be more frequent on the left. I think you would agree if you would get your head out of the sand and really look at it. You implied that I had said something about King needing to be dead, I don't appreciate it. I will not let you get away with supposition such as that.
It is more frequent on the
May 10, 2008 - 19:03 ET by balboaIt is more frequent on the left, as far as I can tell. I didn't imply you made the comments about King.
"...but just recently on this site we've had people say they..."
As much as balboa blathers on
May 10, 2008 - 19:36 ET by HumblepieI must agree with him. There have been post from people wishing Mr. King was killed by the car and a few other comments what are not in tradition of NB or most of us bloggers. I personally wish him no ill will, but, has and will continue to question his position on the troops. Remember, we're illiterate and cannon fodder.
As far as balboa, he has actually stood up against some of the rants at Stephen's site. Say what you will, he does present the facts... most of the time anyway.
During this time with political correctness at its zenith, I reserve the right to let you know you're an idiot.
Aw, shucks...[insert
May 10, 2008 - 20:05 ET by balboaAw, shucks...[insert blather].
Humble ?
May 10, 2008 - 21:38 ET by well99"I must agree with him. There have been post from people wishing "Mr. King was killed by the car" and a few other comments what are not in tradition of NB or most of us bloggers."
That was posted on NB?If that is true then they are no better than Kos Kids or those Huffers.I was in the army but as far as King or wishing any other harm that aint right.Well there are a few I would like to go nose to nose with but in a straight up way.It is a knuckle dragger thing.Olberman for one.Anyhow it aint right to wish someones death ...unless it is a terrorist.
How true
May 10, 2008 - 21:52 ET by HumblepieI have found that most daily bloggers here try to be civil, but occasionally some do more damage than good. I love the comments in "Weekend Photos." But to make fun of a persons because of personal misfortune or bad photo op, is another matter. If we don't have the sense to police ourselves then we are no better than Huffers. We must always remember to practice the "Golden Rule, Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
By the way we1199, Air Force rules, lol
During this time with political correctness at its zenith, I reserve the right to let you know you're an idiot.
Humble
May 10, 2008 - 23:45 ET by well99There will be a few that go overboard.Probably me in some cases.Yet you dont see no death watches here or people wishing someone dead.Just a note Humble:The Air Force use to be part of the Army....lol
True
May 10, 2008 - 23:54 ET by HumblepieI always compare death watches to Islamic stupidity (ie, we will kill you for speaking ill of us.)
At least we had the sense to ask for a divorce.... thank you Hap Arnold. lol
During this time with political correctness at its zenith, I reserve the right to let you know you're an idiot.
Crazy ol' Cousin, Terrig?
May 10, 2008 - 18:19 ET by acumenSad to report Terrig that I have a brother (lives in Ashton, Oregon - explains a lot) that is equally keen on telling others how to think (feel?) and becomes even more deranged than usual when confronted with an opposing view (tolerant left?). After being deluged with truther vids and other assorted moonbattery emails I politely asked him to take me off his mass-mailing email list as I didn't want others on his list to think I subscribed to such craziness. Didn't phase him....emails kept coming. I was forced to set up a block in my email account to stop his madness. Caller ID is also my friend.
God bless you and your husband for your sacrifice. As someone who grew up as an army brat I understand the sacrifice the wives make as well. I don't think ya'll get enough credit. Keep the faith.
Did you know yesterday was military spouse day?
May 10, 2008 - 18:38 ET by terrigProbably not, I just happened to catch it on Fox when W signed the Proclamation earlier this week. I know it 's tough on kids too growing up, moving all the time, etc.
When I married my husband, my brother's wife was having a fit that we went under an arch of swords and that we were cutting the cake with his "weapon". I informed her that the swords are basically used to cut cakes and for arches now days, not to ride on a horse and slice someone's head off. She left the room for the cake cutting. They're coming to visit soon, should be a rocking good time. :)
Did not know that Terrig
May 10, 2008 - 18:56 ET by acumenThanks for the info. It's about time. Happy belated spouse day.
terrig...
May 10, 2008 - 20:02 ET by PrairieSkyFirst, let me say I'm very sorry about your aunt. I am also sorry that your cousin chose this occasion as the opportunity to pick a fight with you (and your husband, it would appear), concerning your political leanings, and you husband's honorable service to our country (my husband is ex-Air Force). I have a suspicion that there is more going on with your cousin than his problems with your political loyalties. Anyone who would respond in such an inappropriate, unprovoked and vitriolic way clearly has something else amiss with themself and/or their life. Just remember that this situation was not instigated by you, and reveals a lot about him. Hang in there!!!
"...peace is the highest aspiration of the American people. We will negotiate for it, sacrifice for it, we will never surrender for it, now or ever." President Ronald Reagan, January 20, 1981
I assumed from your article
May 10, 2008 - 14:35 ET by JasonCI assumed from your article that there would actually be a picture of what the title suggests. Which there is not. This struck me as little more than over-the-top buffoonery, which did, I might add, make sport of Clinton as well. The particularly offensive image suggested in the title is certainly no worse than what is satirized in this article (which many fellow NBers liked the first time I posted it a few months ago) and the term "stumbling f---wit" is certainly no worse than what Clinton, Carter, and Obama are called daily by posters on this site.
I see this piece as an angry, occasionally funny, but mostly just silly and over-the-top piece of lowbrow writing. Not really something to get worked up about.
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
And there it is
May 10, 2008 - 14:48 ET by CobraManAnd there it is. I knew it wouldn't take long until someone used the "yea, but you guys do it too" excuse.
Well, trite as it may seem,
May 10, 2008 - 14:53 ET by JasonCWell, trite as it may seem, explain to me why you all are being indignant about a satirical article that several of you refuse even to read for yourself, when cheap shots and name-calling directed at liberal politicians are all over this site. I'd be happy not to use the childish "well you guys do it too" if you have a reasonable excuse for this outlandish hypocrisy...
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
There you go again
May 10, 2008 - 15:14 ET by CobraMan"I'd be happy not to use the childish "well you guys do it too" if you have a reasonable excuse for this outlandish hypocrisy"
There you go again. Same old "well you guys do it too" excuse, only this time you're using it to justify using it.
I admit that I'm doing it,
May 10, 2008 - 15:21 ET by JasonCI admit that I'm doing it, now tell me how it's incorrect.
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
Like my mother used to say
May 10, 2008 - 15:36 ET by CobraManLike my Mother used to say: "If your friends jumped off a bridge into traffic, would you jump off that bridge too?"
In other words, if you think it's wrong for the members of NB to make posts similer to this, then it must be wrong for the members of the Daily Kos to make them too. But you are actually defending them, so you must also be defending the posters here that act the same way, correct?
So, which one is it? Is this type of civil discourse a bad thing or a good thing?
Crickets
May 10, 2008 - 19:10 ET by acumenCrickets
So, which one is it? Is
May 10, 2008 - 20:14 ET by cleverpigSo, which one is it? Is this type of civil discourse a bad thing or a good thing?
Assuming you mean uncivil, then Bad. But so is throwing stones out of your glass house.
cp... There is absolutely
May 10, 2008 - 20:27 ET by bigtimercp...
There is absolutely no comparison of this site to the leftists sites...none.
I for one am getting tired of this all....you on the left here are still here aren't you? How long do you think any of us conservatives would last on those sites for just expressing the opposite views without the profanity, immaturity and vile hatred I have read on those sites over the years...hmmm?
Btw...so what if anger surfaces here once in awhile, it is supposed to be a good outlet now and then when we have to put up with the tripe that comes from people like Moulitsas, HuffnPuff, King, Kerry and all the other leftist msm talking heads to-boot daily...let alone some trolls too.
There...I feel better.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
How long would you last?
May 12, 2008 - 00:26 ET by cleverpigHow long would you last? No one's hand comes shooting out of the computer screen and smothers you for goodness sakes, you brush it off.
And I think that it is fine if anger surfaces here once in awhile as long as someone brings the tone back down. The fact is that lots of liberals read this site and never post. They see threads with hundred of mocking comments about how stupid liberals are (it was one of those that got me to register on NB) and they go quietly back to their own websites and get back at you by writing nasty things. Those nasty things will have more profanity than yours, but I really think they both do the same kind of harm.
So when I come here and say "Hey you're doing the same thing." It isn't to excuse the offense. It is instead to point out that when you respond by calling liberals disgusting and immoral you are just perpetuating the nasty cycle.
Listen cp... I am sick of
May 12, 2008 - 00:35 ET by bigtimerListen cp...
I am sick of your smarter than everyone else attitude here...You know damned well I was talking about about how long someone like me would last on your leftists sites if I posted what I thought.
I am not playing your cuter by half arguments that you come back and play a day later and a dollar short...so save it for someone who really gives a flying fig for all your oh so cute above it all prose..
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
I'm not sure why my
May 13, 2008 - 01:57 ET by cleverpigI'm not sure why my "cuteness" annoys you so much, but I'm sorry it does! Is it the smiley faces? I use them to try and take the sting out of things.
I'm honestly trying to make a point here, but I'll let it drop for the sake of your blood pressure :)
Ooops! I mean :|
Actually been to Kos Kids and Huff
May 12, 2008 - 01:04 ET by well99"They see threads with hundred of mocking comments about how stupid liberals are (it was one of those that got me to register on NB) and they go quietly back to their own websites and get back at you by writing nasty things."
Actually that is a crock.Are those the same ones that do the Tony Snow death watch?Or maybe they hope Nancy Reagan slips in the tub and kills herself?Maybe they were the ones gloating over 181 Iraqi civians killed in one day last year.You can try and rationalize anything you want but blameing NB or someone saying because your a certain party your stupid.It isnt going to make you write nasty things.People do that on their own.So own up to it and dont try pushing the blame on someone else.There are some good people on here and they are liberal or seem to be but dont cuss every 2 words but actually debate.People like Jer,Shawn,Jason C or balboa(Closet Neo Con).You can make excuses but bottom line is no one forces you to post garbage.Just a note:I do agree that calling all libs stupid or whatever doesnt accomplish much.It really doesnt make sense to but we are all guilty of generalized at times.
w99...Exactly...plus I
May 12, 2008 - 01:21 ET by bigtimerw99...
Exactly...plus I will never forget when VP Cheney was in Afghanistan I think it was and the msm made it sound as if he almost got it by terrorist, which he may very well have, the posts on the left were horrendous like I couldn't believe about wishful hoping for his death...it was beyond normal people, and the left are suppose to be the loving we take care of all of you gentle souls on earth...oh please, I beg any of you here, just go to NewsBusted after the comedy segment has been on and see what these creatures say...it is unbelievable...I do not think I can stomach it again without coming completely unglued in response to them.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
BT
May 12, 2008 - 01:32 ET by well99Yup it was Kos Kids I remember some there wishing him dead.Not sure on Huff.I have no use for extremes one way or the other.The problem is site like Huffs,kos kids , and DU are nesting grounds for these extremist.They sit there posting hate and feed off each other.Nice thing about NB is you can get into a debate without all the @$%# .Unless it is from me...)I do slip occasionally.
w99... I have to hit the
May 12, 2008 - 01:45 ET by bigtimerw99...
I have to hit the sack pretty soon..but I have never seen you ever get anything close to the vileness of these creatures...come on...you have never been anything but enjoyable to debate...in fact at times I don't even think of you on the other side anyway until you made a thing about it last night.
Hope you are following me here.
Anyhoo..have a good one friend.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
BT
May 12, 2008 - 02:06 ET by well99Good night BT.Have a good week friend.
Who's glass house are you refering to?
May 10, 2008 - 20:58 ET by CobraManWho's glass house are you refering to? This site is nothing like the Daily Kos, that's one of the reasons that I like this site so much.
Satirical , my eye
May 10, 2008 - 15:30 ET by CobraMan"I was mocked. A few of us mocked right back."
It this what you classify as satirical? That's a direct quote from your so-called satirical article, written by the author himself, followed by a photoshopped Times cover that uses profanity.
This isn't satire, not by a long shot. It's nothing more than pent-up anger released as profane insults.
JC
May 10, 2008 - 14:49 ET by Noel SheppardJC,
You are aware that Onion is indeed a satirical site? You think DKos is?
As for what members here call Carter, Clinton, or Obama, have you ever seen vulgar ad hominems about these folks published by one of our writers? Hmmm? ns
That article is obviously
May 10, 2008 - 14:54 ET by JasonCThat article is obviously meant as satire also.
By the writers here? Only Warner Todd Huston. But - and correct me if I'm wrong, as I do not frequent DailyKos - isn't this a user-submitted piece?
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
JC
May 10, 2008 - 15:01 ET by Noel SheppardJC,
You think this was satire? Why? What leads you to believe that? Please clarify.
As for Warner, when did he write something that included profanity? ns
I couldn't say for sure
May 10, 2008 - 15:21 ET by JasonCI couldn't say for sure that Warner uses profanity per se, but he does regularly and carelessly apply terms like idiot, moron, and traitor, both to politicians and those he disagrees with. Whether or not actual curse words are used is, to me at least, not really consequential.
I don't doubt that the author is truly bitter toward the targets of that essay, but I don't think it was the horrendously offensive thing you made it out to be. I really don't see the difference between it and the Carter editorial, except for the target of the satire.
Who can revolt if man has become a simple conglomerate of organs, a person barely free enough to use a remote control to choose his channel? -J. Kristeva
JC
May 10, 2008 - 16:36 ET by Noel SheppardJC,
Wait a minute. When I asked you if an NB writer had ever published profanity here, you named Warner. I think you should either back it up, or apologize to him.
Furthermore, idiot, moron, and traitor ARE NOT profanities, and the difference is INDEED consequential.
Finally, I asked you to back up your assertion that this piece is a satire. Can you do so or not? Whether you don't see the difference between this piece and the Onion one is, in your words, inconsequential. You claimed it to be satire, now please prove it. ns
Noel...In the interest of
May 10, 2008 - 18:54 ET by JerNoel...In the interest of accuracy, your original challenge to Jason was to supply an example of vulgar ad hominems--not the use of "profanity" by Warner.
Look, I like Warner--even though he has accused me of being a communist sympathizer--but he does occasionally get a little too "colorful" with his rhetoric, and I would submit his following description of FDR would qualify as a vulgar ad hominem:
FDR is the greatest destroyer of America that ever strode the halls of our government....an American pariah....He was a petty, brash, hateful little man whose crippled exterior matched his blackened and bent interior.
By the way, Warner's NewsBusters profile describes his writing as "irreverant".
Jer
Jer
May 10, 2008 - 19:57 ET by Noel SheppardJer,
That was my original request. Then, JC named Warner, and I asked:
As for Warner's FDR comment, where's the vulgarity? Now, granted, vulgar can mean many things. However, as it pertained to this discussion, and this DKos post, shouldn't it have been assumed to mean obscene or lewd? I don't see anything obscene or lewd in Warner's FDR comment, do you? ns
Vulgar does not just mean
May 10, 2008 - 20:35 ET by cleverpigVulgar does not just mean obscene or lewd. Course, unrefined, crude, rude all also fit the definition of the word.
I think one of the many differences between the left and right is that most people on the left are not offended by actual curse words so much as they are by the sentiment behind them. It's a cultural, generational difference.
For instance, I have a pretty casually foul mouth in my daily life, but I am almost never deliberately nasty to anyone. On the other side, I consider some of the sentiments expressed about liberals in these very comments extremely insulting, whether or not any bad language is actually used.
For me, and I think most liberals, the key is the intent behind the language. If a curse word is said playfully, so what? But the politest of language can be used to deliver scathing attacks if you know how to do it.
As an example, this statement from further up in the thread illustrates my point nicely:
The unwashed left has no values. They are truly disgusting. The
unwashed left will always make fun of those with morals and values.
Have you ever really looked at these protester types on the left? They
are freaks and have nothing to contribute to society
You could include "f@#$wit" in there or you could not. It wouldn't change the meaning for me one little bit. And then there's NL, whose delusions about how all real liberals attack their coworkers and don't care about job performance is profoundly more scary to hear than some random swear word.
cp....You seem to
May 10, 2008 - 21:02 ET by bigtimercp....
You seem to intentionally try to critique every little thing that your leftist thin-skinned heart doesn't like....why do you stay here then, all I can see from you is you are a trouble maker who wants this site and conservatives to bend even more with politeness to the likes of critters like you.
I'm tired of it.
Leave if you aren't happy.
What NL said was his opinion, like it or not...what jeff said was his opinion like it or not...your nit-picking all the time is getting way past old..and that is my opinion.
Jer..by the way...you too. Some of us agree with WTH's opinion about FDR...
I cannot believe how far we are bending here for all of you leftists.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
bt... Jer..by the
May 10, 2008 - 21:29 ET by Jerbt...
Jer..by the way...you too.
Meaning what?
Some of us agree with WTH's opinion about FDR...
So, you agree that FDR was a ..."petty, brash, hateful little man whose crippled exterior matched his blackened and bent interior"?
Jer
Jer... I am not going to
May 10, 2008 - 21:42 ET by bigtimerJer...
I am not going to argue with you all night, I knew what WTH was trying to convey, if we cannot express our opinions here without worrying about offending everyone else all the time with every little word we say and how others are going to take it all the time... we are in big trouble...
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Well, bt...I didn't
May 10, 2008 - 21:58 ET by JerWell, bt...I didn't realize you and I were arguing at all until you tossed my name into your post to cleverpig.
Jer
Jer ... LOL...and now
May 10, 2008 - 22:12 ET by bigtimerJer ...
LOL...and now for a big sigh...
I shouldn't of used the word argue okay?
I just know you well, where you are headed ect. you and WTH have been going at it forever and you won't let go, so you used him for an example..
That's all.
I'm just tired of seeing the constant complaints here...mostly by the mushy middle and the lefties...good golly, just move on sometimes..I see where some people say this isn't in the tradition of NBs that haven't even been here that long, you ought to have seen it long ago...this site sure has come a long way baby.
I just think everyone should get some breathing room without the constant complaints.
My two cents for now...
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
bt... you and WTH have
May 10, 2008 - 22:35 ET by Jerbt...
you and WTH have been going at it forever and you won't let go...
Do you have me confused with Leon? I said earlier that "I like Warner". Furthermore, we have rarely "gone at it". I objected to his FDR comments, and I took offense when he implied I was a commie sympathizer and that all my posts were jokes. Otherwise, our exchanges have been predominantly friendly banter. Maybe you don't know me as well as you say, or as well as I had hoped.
Jer