For general discussion and debate. Possible talking point: a glimmer of hope.
Ben S. Bernanke and his fellow global policy makers may move to unblock markets for loans between banks and commercial paper as their next steps to combat the 14- month credit crisis. In the U.S., Federal Reserve chief Bernanke yesterday signaled he's preparing measures with Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson to unfreeze markets where loans aren't secured by assets. In Europe, the biggest slide in stocks since 1987 may push governments and central banks to coordinate aid to the region's financial industry and lower interest rates...``The Fed's not done yet,'' said former Fed Governor Lawrence Meyer, now vice chairman of Macroeconomic Advisers in St. Louis, Missouri. ``They're going to try to leapfrog ahead and do something even more dramatic.''...``Bernanke is a student of the depression, and it is not going to happen on his watch,'' said Michael Darda, chief economist at MKM Partners LP. ``The Fed will pull out all the stops until something starts working.''
This is one of the most uplifting articles I've read in weeks. Read the whole thing, and tell me what you think.
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
I'm having a little trouble believing the polls latelty.
October 7, 2008 - 04:10 ET by superconI'm not saying that all of them are rigged.I just don't think that they are correct.
If the polls are true then a lot of people are suckers.
Victory in Iraq.
Liberals suck.
McCain for Preznint.
are there that many fools?
October 7, 2008 - 05:00 ET by SouthJersey1953I agree. I cannot believe there are that many people out there blind to the follies of BHO's plans. It really scares me to think America will elect this guy. IF we think our economy is in trouble now, just wait...
McCain/PALIN '08
PALIN/Jindal '12
History shows...
October 7, 2008 - 08:24 ET by Indiana JoeDidn't the polls claim it would be Gore, right up to the actual election? And the polls said it was a "toss-up" between Kerry and Bush, IIRC. And we've had many polls, and seen how "sampling" affects them.
Don't get too worried, is my thought. Don't get complacent, but I don't think we should take these polls for any more than they're worth. Which usually isn't much.
Pep talk for the day. ;^)
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
All the pollsters had Obama winning New Hampshire in the primary
October 7, 2008 - 08:36 ET by superconRassmussen,CNN,Gallup and others had Obama up by twelve and he lost by three.RealClearPolitics is showing Indiana as a toss up state even though in 2000 and in 2004 Bush won by %15.7 and %20.7 respectively.
It is hard to believe that those numbers could shift so dramatically.
Victory in Iraq.
Liberals suck.
McCain for Preznint.
The polls are rigged, but who is doing it?
October 7, 2008 - 10:06 ET by general companyObama knows these polls are skeewd in his favore. How do I know this? Because one of his folks aknowlegded that they need at least a 5 point edge to be confident of winning any State. I was wondering why the next question wasnt "how come you know this to be true?"
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
GC,
October 7, 2008 - 10:17 ET by Indiana JoeI'll bet the answer would be something about needing a "margin" to assure the election wasn't "stolen... again."
You know that'll be the cry if/when they lose.
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
For what it's worth from Virginia
October 7, 2008 - 10:34 ET by Prester JohnThe town I live in, 25 miles outside of DC and which is very much Republican, just had it's fall festival on Saturday and the number of people wearing McCain/Palin stickers and carrying yard signs to take home was HUGE. I'd say something on the order of at least 10-1 over the Obamanistas if not higher. Now, I don't know whether or not that was a function of the Dems not having the right material to give to their people but in any event I was greatly surprised by the absolute numbers of people showing support for McCain.
And on a related note, from what I've seen it seems that an unusually high number of Obama stickers are on people killing, earth destroying SUVs.
Supercon,
October 7, 2008 - 10:13 ET by Indiana JoeExactly. I think that, if anything, I'd be more nervous about the polls if I were Obama. If the polls could be trusted, GWB would be an also-ran, not a two-termer.
However, I am concerned about Ohio. A Dem SecState there has created a situation where absentee balloting began before the deadline to register. So, one-stop registration and voting, anyone? Oh, and you don't need any reason to vote absentee, either.
Watch Ohio closely. At least this is already getting some notice.
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
Speaking of Ohio, it
October 7, 2008 - 16:27 ET by ckc1227Speaking of Ohio, it seems that the early voter turnout was less than expected.
http://www.wlwt.com/politics/17637922/detail.html
Obama's Economic plan: more taxes, more spending, more regulation. Prosperity here we come.
They are not to be trusted.
October 7, 2008 - 10:30 ET by JWFThey poll people in big cities where liberals live. Even the Republicans in cities view is skewed.
People in cities DEPEND on government. They need government for ---->
water --- has to be piped in, with little reserve if something goes wrong.
sewer --- has to be pumped out. again no wiggle room for failure.
trash --- has to be shipped out. daily. little room for backup should something go wrong.
food --- no room for a storage. needs to be a reliable supply .
crime --- dense populations have crime. they depend on law enforcement by government.
snow removal - if those trucks don't come in, no one moves.
and more....
Rural america is less dependent - we have wells, septic tanks, back yards to grow gardens in hard times, pay to haul off trash and if it don't get picked up this week, oh well store it in the garage, less population - less crime and we does like our guns now don't we. we have our 4 wheel drive suv's to get through snow, to hell with the plows!
They do not poll rural america, only in places dependent on government services and doleouts. The polls may not be purposely skewed, but I believe they are skewed.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
More...
October 7, 2008 - 10:49 ET by JWFIf a big city liberal were to lose everything they would be homeless. They cannot depend on family because they have mommy and daddy issues, duh it is why they are liberals. They have alienated themselves from everyone in their family. So they depend on their rich uncle to make all right, Uncle Sam.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
Polls are overall pretty accurate
October 7, 2008 - 10:59 ET by shawn228Most polls said Gore and Bush were a statiscial tie and that was true, same with Kerry and Bush and it came down to Ohio.
Polls predicted the Dems would take back the house and make serious gains in the senate in 06. They also accurate predicted that Senator McCain would be the Republican nominee, how many of you questioned that poll? It did come true right? Yes Unsane, I know the polls got Dewey wrong over a half century ago.
I would be seriously worried right now if I were the GOP here are is a list of the main pollsters
- Battleground (Obama +7)
- CNN (Obama +8)
- Diageo (Obama +6)
- Gallup (Obama +8)
- NYT/CBS (Obama +3)
- Rasmussen (Obama +8)
- Research 2000 (Obama +8)
- WSJ/NBC (Obama +6)
- WaPo/ABC (Obama +6).
The electoral map looks even worse. McCain pledged to have a campaign on issues, but it looks like he has to resort to character assasination if he has any chance of winning.
Real life video games are cool
You believe the polls, huh?
October 7, 2008 - 11:10 ET by Mary Louise TurnerYou seem to be predicting that Mr. Obama will win by a landslide, based on these polls and the electoral map. If it's true, it will be a triumph of epic proportions for the MSM and a disaster for ordinary Americans.
I believe the polls Mary
October 7, 2008 - 11:20 ET by shawn228...but I do not believe Obama will win in a landslide. The electoral map poll also includes states that are leaning Democrat and barely democrat.
Polls are important because they reflect how the country is feeling at the present moment, and just a few weeks ago that same site had McCain winning more states right after the Sarah Palin speech.
Real life video games are cool
That's right, Shawn
October 7, 2008 - 15:59 ET by Indiana JoeAnd "a few weeks" from now is the real poll. The one that counts. So, as you note, a lot can change in "a few weeks."
That's when the chickens will hatch.
"... smells like.... victory." - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
I love KFC Indiana Joe
October 7, 2008 - 21:45 ET by shawn228....but I am not counting any chickens, I am saying polls are pretty accurate and they are important because they convey how our country is leaning at the present moment
Real life video games are cool
Dear lord!
October 7, 2008 - 11:19 ET by JWFThanks for stepping on my point. Couldn't post your propydanga on it's own slot?
And who won in your statistical ties between Bush/Gore and Bush/Kerry again? Hmmm. I forgot. Weird, memory is a little off today. Hmmmm.
I too am seriously worried. It took me a month to get my 3'X6' BAMS (big ass McCain sign) due to the demand. I had to go to the next county to get more yard signs because they ran out here. And hippies keep running away, word is out 'bout the punchin'.
Big city liberals also love polls and maps and lists that show their candidate in the lead. It is all they have until they get their butt handed to them on election day.
Then they cry. A lot. And crawl back under the rock they oozed out of. Until the next poll season. It is a vicious hippie/liberal/crybaby circle but it is all they have between sanity and a rope and a heavy beam.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
George Bush won
October 7, 2008 - 11:26 ET by shawn228in the statistical tie JWF, the race was too close to call, thats is why the polls could not predict a winner. Gore and Bush came down to Florida and Kerry Bush came down to Ohio, so the polls were right about how close it was were they not?, so people cannot say the polls were wrong. However, if the electiion was held today and McCain beat Obama, then the polls would be wrong because most of them do not say statistical tie.
Real life video games are cool
RMC
October 7, 2008 - 11:41 ET by JWFRead my comment. Who said they were wrong? I said they were skewed and I listed why I believed so.
Further, they use a very small sampling and usually weigh the sample with an outsized portion of liberals.
Very similar to your sample of the last 2 elections. Earily similar if I may so posit.
Polls have been off since the dawn of polltaking when the first cavemen were asked if they prefered using leaves or grass to wipe their butts.
Current polls are off too, 23% of us prefer to wipe our butts with hippies then flush them down the toilet.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
PS: what happened to shawn227? Did the verbal smackdown of last week make him run away too?
JWF
October 7, 2008 - 11:43 ET by BlondeI got a call last week....typical Push Poll.
So I answered everything bass-ackwards. Straight line dem ticket, Obama all the way.
Just for grins.
David Gregory, do you know which damn network you lie for? ~ Uncle Jimbo, @Blackfive
I lie to pollsters also
October 7, 2008 - 12:48 ET by SouthJersey1953Haven't been polled lately but I generally lie to the pollsters when they do ask. I started way back in the 80's when the MSM was announcing winners as soon as the East Coast polls closed (I lived in Washington State at the time). I think that is what happened in '04 when the media were positive kerry would win based on polls...(I think they actually called a couple of states for kerry and then later had to change them over to Bush when the actual numbers came in.
McCain/PALIN '08
PALIN/Jindal '12
also remember the MSM gives
October 7, 2008 - 19:42 ET by TruthMongeralso remember the MSM gives dems a 20% advantage in blatant 24/7 promotion leading up to the elections
and they can still only manage a tie:)
Journalism is the opium of the liberals
Oops.
October 7, 2008 - 11:37 ET by R D HelmWrong place.
You'd have to live in an
October 7, 2008 - 16:19 ET by ckc1227You'd have to live in an alternate universe to believe associating with terrorists and America-haters isn't an issue. It may even trump all others because it gives insight into how he might deal with all those other issues.
"it looks like he has to resort to character assasination if he has any chance of winning."
It's not character assasination if it's true. Besides, Obama assasinated his own character years ago when he chose to associate with terrorists and racist America-haters.
Obama's Economic plan: more taxes, more spending, more regulation. Prosperity here we come.
I notice you left out the
October 7, 2008 - 18:10 ET by ThisnThatI notice you left out the Zogby poll -- the only poll that got it right last year.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
Unfreezing loans
October 7, 2008 - 04:40 ET by DavidRWhile I'm always glad to see a regulatory wall come down, such as that of commercial paper for banks, I'm troubled by all the talk of unfreezing loans.
Yes, if loans were slowing, action should be taken to get them flowing again. However, there's no much proof of slowing loans lately, at least not according to the Fed's own numbers.
As shown in Bank Loans Have Not Dried Up ( http://www.forbes.com/2008/10/01/interbank-lending-ted-oped-cx_ar_1001reynolds.html?partner=email ), compared to the same time last year, bank loans to consumers are up 9.5%, business loans are up 15.5%, and real estate loans are up 4.1%. Interbank loans are down modestly, but less than you'd expect given the recent shake ups, seziures, and sales of large companies.
Howdy, DavidR,
October 7, 2008 - 10:23 ET by Indiana JoeLooks like your first post, dude! Welcome to the best site on the web.
I had to run earlier, didn't finish the OT article, but the thing with the loans caught my eye. I'm not real financially adept, but it seems to me that un/under-secured loans is kind of at the heart of this mess. I hear Europe has problems that include something like a -40% loan-to-asset valuation. Sounds like a bad thing to me.
And easing up on unsecured loans, if I read the OT article properly, sounds like throwing gas on a fire to me. Maybe I misunderstood, though.
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
I SAY.....
October 7, 2008 - 06:02 ET by MrShyRelease the hounds on Obama. Palin AND McCain!!
CNN just did a "keeping them honest" segment on the Ayers connection, and while it sort of wrapped it up on a more positive "so what specifically is McCain going after?" note, they still spent a good 10 minutes listing the many things they did together and the money that moved around, including into the hands of Reverend Wright.
And THAT was just from Palin mentioning Ayers once in her rally speech.
I say bring up ALL of his dirty associations, because they all have a lot of meat to them. Enough of this, and enough intimidation by the MSM.... "oh, it's going to backfire in McCain's face, he's up against the MSM..." blah blah.... Nonsense.
The truth is the truth, and the people can parse it all perfectly fine on their own and make the final judgement.
This is not smearing. This is doing the job the MSM purposely failed at doing!
NOW PLAYING:
Governor Palin Get Your Gun
Capitulation?
October 7, 2008 - 06:44 ET by ThisnThatThey say the markets have to undergo a capitulation (where everybody sells until there are no more sellers) before a market recovery can begin. Was there a capitulation yesterday?
Well, if not -- then I don't know how to describe it. At one point (around 3:00pm or so), the internals were as ugly as I've ever seen. To wit:
I've never seen a ratio of 2:2800 before. Also, the number of stocks hitting 52-week lows exceeded 1,200. That's a huge number. So, stay tuned. There may not be any more sellers left.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
I would think we are close mr. thisnthat.
October 7, 2008 - 10:12 ET by JWFI am pretty rational and I am getting freaked out by all the doom and gloom talk.
Capitulation arrives when everyone that wants to sell has sold. Only buyers are left.
It has been doom and gloom talk for months now. I think we are getting close.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
TNT
October 7, 2008 - 10:36 ET by Noel SheppardTNT,
You are wise beyond your years, Grasshopper.
The internals before yesterday's final hour rebound were like nothing I've ever seen, including on Black Monday '87. And, with the VIX hitting 58, one HAS to wonder if that was the height of fear.
However, the question is whether or not the fear is rational? If people are selling out of fear of a global financial meltdown that doesn't occur, then their fear is irrational. On the other hand... ns
NS, You're right -- and
October 7, 2008 - 18:14 ET by ThisnThatNS,
You're right -- and we can expect some more down draft before it turns up. Interesting to note, though, that the markets have gone down 20% over the past 12 days. In 1987, it went down 25% in one day -- but the recovery was swift. I'd much rather see it go down fast like this, than dribble out over a long time. It usually means a quicker recovery. Hope so at least -- I'm putting in a few coins at each down draft.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
The Market And Politics, Kind Of
October 7, 2008 - 12:02 ET by JDWConsider the wins which the libs have created out of losses.
The market in the state it is currently in, how many communications companies are in trouble? What happens to conservative talk show stations when their parent companies fail? What if a lib billionaire decides to buyout their stock at what now is a gimme and simply bury the companies?
JDW
DAILY WAVE
'Hey Chuck, Stand Up!'
Is the Community Reinvestment Act part of free enterprise?
»→ Dick Morris
October 7, 2008 - 06:50 ET by Cool ArrowDick Morris on H&C last night says it was Ayers who directed $50 million over five years to Obama via the CAC (Annenberg) grant.
Might I interject here, If any of you casual acquaintances out there would like me to take care of the disbursal of a similar sum of chump change, I'll be happy to do the walking around.
"John McCain has not talked about my Muslim Faith" - Barack Hussein Obama
Cool... The $50 mil was
October 7, 2008 - 11:59 ET by Clear thinkerCool...
The $50 mil was part of a 2 to 1 matching grant program, so Ayers had to raise more grant money. The total ended up being $150 million. And yes, Obama was selected as the administrator of the foundation for Ayers. Surely just a coincidence, right?
Something Stinks About Obama
Making Fun of AGW http://giovanniworld.wordpress.com/
»→ The Obama Job Cuts
October 7, 2008 - 07:42 ET by Cool ArrowCan McCain possibly drive home the point that the Obama Job Cuts proposal is not good for the country, and certainly not going to help his entitlement darlings? He won't even be able to fund his Expanding Government Proposal If he taxes small business out of the market.
Never mind, Jiuliani is talking about it right now.
"John McCain has not talked about my Muslim Faith" - Barack Hussein Obama
Hey, my Dish Network sat
October 7, 2008 - 07:48 ET by nadadhimmiHey, my Dish Network sat receiver has been tuning itself to the new Obama channel automatically. It's done this 4 times so far. I didn't even know it existed until I was directed to this channel by the dish. MyGod, this is straight out of the book, 1984. Big brother is not only watching, he's telling me what to think. Welcome to "Change" comrades. Has anyone else noticed this? My God, this is just a hint of the Government control in the offing for us.
NJ Comcast channel 8
October 7, 2008 - 08:12 ET by billbOur local public access channel 8 is even in the tank for Obama!
RMD
October 7, 2008 - 08:08 ET by billbAARP members need to start a movement to suspend the Required Minimum Distribution for this year. No one should be required (by law) to sell a portion of their retirement into a government caused market collapse. So while Cramer on NBC is "yelling fire in a theater" the IRS will financially penalize us for NOT selling!
»→ I sold out yesterday
October 7, 2008 - 07:57 ET by Cool ArrowI lost 2.5% yesterday, and feel somewhat fortunate to be dead even on the year.
Don't know how long I'll sit out, but I'll bet there are a lot of us holding out today.
"John McCain has not talked about my Muslim Faith" - Barack Hussein Obama
Obama campaign
October 7, 2008 - 08:33 ET by Indiana JoeRobert Gibbs is accusing McCain of airing "lies" about Ayers on FNC right now.
"Dispicable, dishonest attack." They want to talk economy, when Mac smoked them on it yesterday. They want to talk about leadership. So talk. Say what you want. Why do they think they need "permission?" Maybe coz they think we should need permission to talk?
"American people losing their jobs and their homes." More BS.
Gotta run, quick post.
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
I am getting a little more than tired of the doom and gloom talk
October 7, 2008 - 09:01 ET by JWFPeople keep trying to freak us all out.
Another Great Depression! - Don't forget 75% of the people that wanted jobs had jobs in the Great Depression.
Buy Gold! - Yes. And the price of gold has not budged all that much since the serious doom talk started.
The economy will collapse! - Really? Does that mean I don't have to pay my mortgage or credit cards now?
Hyper inflation is coming! It's the 70's again. - Well which is it? inflation or deflation?
It is new! It will be a combination! Dinflation! Stagblation! - Oh just shut up! We will burn hippies for fuel or grind them up to make new roads. We will be fine. Can't eat them but a little spice and ground up hippies make fine pet food.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
»→ JWF
October 7, 2008 - 09:10 ET by Cool ArrowHere's an idea. Be a contrarian.
If you think the prognosticators are wrong, invest early and often today. According to Stuart Varney it could be a great day.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
I like Cool Arrow.
October 7, 2008 - 09:47 ET by JWFI am 45. Still got 20 years. I am already 100% invested.
When everyone is running for the hills, THAT is the time to buy. Yes, they are running for the hills. I am buying as soon as money becomes available.
I invest in dividend paying stocks. I am putting more money in as soon as I get it.
I tell the 20somethings my hamburger story.
You go in to a restaraunt to buy a hamburger every day. $1.00
Which will make you happier? Going in tomorrow and the hamburger is $1.20 or that hamburger is now 80 cents.
I will take the 80 cent hamburger every time.
boom/bust is not dead, but oh my lord the over the top world is gonna end stuff is getting on my nerves.
I am also diversified. I have 10% of my money in www.cool-arrow.com
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
»→ JWF
October 7, 2008 - 09:54 ET by Cool ArrowI actually clicked on the link. Guess I should get the domain, huh.
I'm sittin' on the cash right now, waiting for the moment to strike.
Today just looks too unpredictable to me, but if they tank late, I'm jumping back in.
Got to buy them before the "owned by" date so's I can get the dividend, for sure.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
JWF,
October 7, 2008 - 10:34 ET by Indiana JoeI'm not that into the market, mainly MFs in my 401k. I mean, I have a bit in there, but I'm not knowledgeable in all the ins and outs. But I understand your point. The panic seems more harmful than the actual economy. Not exactly "harmful," maybe, but overblown?
And, IIRC, you were/are a bail-out contrarian, were/aren't you? Well, since they claimed we had to do it to "save the markets," and from what I can see, the markets haven't cared, you seem vindicated on that. The ups and downs, while dramatic, seem to be swinging around a fairly stable point to me. Sure, they're trending down, but not at a suicidal rate. Looks like a good time for some thoughtful moves.
Or am I missing something?
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
We are in it for the long haul.
October 7, 2008 - 12:25 ET by JWFWe not selling. We are buying.
I bought Altria in 2001 when they were facing a moutain of lawsuits. They have almost paid for themselves in dividends alone.
It is time to separate the men from the boys. And the men are buying.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
JWF,
October 7, 2008 - 16:38 ET by Indiana Joe"We not selling. We are buying."
Yeah, that was kind of my take, too. Wish I had a little excess capital laying around, but I guess I just have to trust my MF managers.
"... smells like.... victory." - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
Folks, this is all about
October 7, 2008 - 09:33 ET by dscottFolks, this is all about the price of oil and gasoline. What the Fed and Treasury is doing is treating the symptoms. Just as Congressional committees are picking their scape goats such as the Lehman Bros CEO (who doesn't get any sympathy from in any event after pocketing $480 million) to distract the public from who really caused the mess.
The charts tell the story: http://futures.tradingcharts.com/chart/RB/B8 November futures delivery of gasoline, the price of gasoline is dropping, more importantly look at the run up and how that coincided with the bank collaspes. When energy prices run up fast, costs run up fast and therefore businesses and consumers respond by cutting costs. The people with the low FICO scores were the first to be laid off because they work in sectors of the economy that are sensitive to energy prices and surprise, surprise they couldn't pay the mortgage. This is one of the biggest coverups in US history, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, i.e. the Democrat Party under the AGW scam ARE RESPONSIBLE for the run in energy costs via the drilling ban that tanked the economy. Read the charts: http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/twip/twip_gasoline.html#demand Demand for gasoline is cratering due to the slowing economy. The rescue of the US economy is firmly underway by the market itself addressing the real issue, the price of gasoline, NOT the government's faux solution. The price of gasoline is dropping, or hasn't anyone noticed lately? http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/twip/twip_gasoline.html#prices
The solution is clear and no cost to the taxpayer, DRILL BABY DRILL.
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, starving the poor one gallon of ethanol at a time. Fill your tank with E85 and cull a village.
dscott,
October 7, 2008 - 10:41 ET by Indiana JoeSpeaking of oil, a thought occurs. Why is it that while the price of oil has fallen around 30% in the last week or so, the price of gas has only fallen about 10-15%? Around here, at least.
Don't get me wrong. I'm not exactly complaining, and I'm not bashing "wind-fall profits," I like to think I'm a little too sane for that. And I realize it takes time for price-drops to get to the pumps. And more than the cost of crude goes into the price of gas. But it does seem like price rises get there quicker, no? Okay, that's capitalism for you, I get it.
But it does look like, while a $1 increase causes a 4-cent bump at the pump, a $1 decrease only makes for a 2-cent decrease.
Just an observation.
"... smells like.... victory!" - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
I will help out my bestest friend Mr. Indiana Joe.
October 7, 2008 - 13:02 ET by JWFDon't forget oil has to be refined. And we have a shortage of refineries. A new refinery has not been built in over 30 years. A refinery in Chicago was stopped from expanding recently because of environutties. And they were exceeding all of the EPA standards in the proposed expansion.
Also, these refineries have to make 50 different grades of gas according to the 50 different requirements of 50 different states.
Then they have to shut down, reconfigure, and make diesel, heating oil, etc.
It is a wonder gas is not more expensive.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
JWF,
October 7, 2008 - 17:21 ET by Indiana Joe"bestest friend?" Okay, thanks... I think. ;^)
Well, I fully understand there are many other factors that effect the price of gas besides the price of crude. My point, though, was that all of that being equal and independent of the price/bbl, increases seem to be faster and larger than decreases. For instance, no less refineries now than last month (I think), and no more grades being created.
Assuming no other variables change (seasonal right now, maybe), I just thought it odd (but not surprising, I guess) that the amount of change due to $/bbl seemed more going up than going down.
So, I remarked upon it.
"... smells like.... victory." - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
There will always be a
October 7, 2008 - 14:07 ET by dscottThere will always be a delay between the price of oil and gasoline due to refining issues, however, to address the question of dollar for dollar parity there are two issues: the ramp up by refineries to produce home heating fuel this time of year and the supply vs demand balance both are related. The refineries due to limited capacity (you can again thank the Democrats and environmental extremists) have to scale back production of gasoline to ensure enough home heating oil is produced and stored up for the winter heating season up north. The price of any product is NOT the cost of the product, it is determined by the demand of the product, charge what the market will bear. Because demand is dropping like a rock, meaning supply is better matching demand, competition now has set in to lower the price of gasoline.
We all know why demand is dropping, it's called a recession in the offing (two quarters obviously hasn't past yet giving a negative GDP). If the morons in the central planning bureau will get some brains or fear of the voter, they will encourage domestic drilling by sharing the royalty payments with the states. The chief morons among them being Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, Democrats ALL. It would help it the Repub wannabe Arnold of CA would just go negotiate with the oil and gas companies drilling could commense immediately, but don't hold your breath. Political Correctness is stupidity wrapped with fanaticism on steriods.
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, starving the poor one gallon of ethanol at a time. Fill your tank with E85 and cull a village.
dscott,
October 7, 2008 - 17:23 ET by Indiana JoeRight, I know there are other considerations. In fact, my response above to JWF pretty much replies to you, so I'll just save some cyber-ink and refer you to that.
Thanks. ;^)
"... smells like.... victory." - Robert Duvall, Apocalypse Now
I agree I.J.
October 7, 2008 - 19:57 ET by HillbillyKingIt seems to me that the price of gas always shoots up WAY faster than it comes down. I also agree with ds's explaination about how the whole thing works. I still firmly believe that we (the public) get gouged to some degree, but I've found these charts to be the best evidence that the relationship between gas and crude is legit.
Crude futures for the last year
Gas futures for the last year
If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you.
Don Marquis 1878-1937
Barney Franks is bringing sexy back
October 7, 2008 - 10:36 ET by lareehttp://bellalu0.word...
»→ Barney Frank sexy?
October 7, 2008 - 10:44 ET by Cool ArrowThe Washington Post reported Frank, who is openly gay, had a
relationship with Herb Moses, an executive for the now-government
controlled Fannie Mae.
WELLLL! Looks like this Moses was parting more than the Red Sea.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
Bawney Fwank says that we who criticize the FMs are racicts.
October 7, 2008 - 11:38 ET by R D HelmI was wondering when that worthless bag of gas was going to get around to this.
Apparently, the Community Reinvestment Act has become, like SS and abortion, yet another liberal sacred cow.
Never mind that the reverberations from its passage are now being felt around the world.
If we were living in sane times, this jerk, along with his loverboy,
who once worked for Raines, would be on their way to the slammer.
-Dave
If this nation is to be saved, it will be libertarian principles that save it.
Okay, something light for a change
October 7, 2008 - 11:40 ET by BlondeThis is pretty funny....campaigning (Jib/Jab)....my favorite part is the Clinton's, you'll see why. Bambi on the unicorn is pretty good, too.
And a bit of local interest....Sarah was here last night, raised a bunch of money. Of course, the Obambots were protesting. I bet that was interesting, the intersection referenced is about as tony as it gets. Had I known there was a protest, I'd have taken my McCain/Palin sign and joined the fun of the counter-protest, LOL.
Palin's visit sparked a colorful protest at the busy intersection of Federal Highway and Camino Real. Though the protest was led by supporters of Obama, it was nearly overtaken by dozens of McCain-Palin supporters.
No kidding it's colorful...it's Boca Raton, where the only colors allowed are pink and shades of pink!
Oh, and Sarah invited a little girl who wrote her a letter after the convention, nice touch.
David Gregory, do you know which damn network you lie for? ~ Uncle Jimbo, @Blackfive
J, LOL-That Jib/Jab piece was classic.
October 7, 2008 - 12:20 ET by R D Helm-Dave
If this nation is to be saved, it will be libertarian principles that save it.
I know, Dave
October 7, 2008 - 12:44 ET by BlondeI loved the crowd scene at the end, too.
We laughed so hard when we saw it.
I still think Bill in his undies is the best part.
David Gregory, do you know which damn network you lie for? ~ Uncle Jimbo, @Blackfive
Canadian socialist die-hards are upset.
October 7, 2008 - 12:14 ET by R D HelmApparently private health clinics are popping up all over, and some people there don't like it one bit.
"The contention that for-profit health care can exist along with a
public system is not true," said Natalie Mehra, the report's author and
director of the coalition.
Oh, really? It appears they can to me.
"It is a take-away from the public
health-care system."
No Natalie, you twit, it provides a service that there is clearly a market for that the incompetet government boobs cannot accommodate efficiently, if at all.
And you wonder why socialists scare the hell out of me.
-Dave
If this nation is to be saved, it will be libertarian principles that save it.
Suicide Watch aka The Glenn Beck Show
October 7, 2008 - 12:26 ET by Chris NormanBeck has become unwatchable. His old "It'll never work and we're all going to die" routine has become so aggravating (and yet so depressing) it has made watching his show an ordeal. Rush's success comes from his basic optimism, while Beck has become just a tiresome and sardonic scold. I know we're in serious times, but I don't need to watch a cheerleader for disaster - especially his frequent guest - that insufferable Eeyore, Peter Schiff - who seems to delight in predicting financial calamity and lectures people that they have too much - all the while we know that he himself is wealthy. He's like the Bill Mahr of finance. Beck needs to back away from this trend and start talking solutions - not just whining about the bailout bill (it's done) and railing against everyone and their mothers. He's going to hurt himself and his show if he keeps this up. I know I'm done with him until he does.
McNotObama '08
Same Same!
October 7, 2008 - 12:28 ET by JWFDVR still records it. But I have been deleting it until he takes a chill pill.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
I wonder if his ratings are
October 7, 2008 - 12:36 ET by Chris NormanI wonder if his ratings are holding up and, if they are, I wonder how people can subject themselves to his whining and gnashing of teeth five days a week (actually four nights and one Friday night of him interviewing Ted Nugent for the umty-umpth time. I began to kind of like Beck at as an alternative to O'Reilly until he began his "The Great Financial Disaster Tour".
McNotObama '08
Chris,
October 7, 2008 - 12:48 ET by R D HelmIt has gotten to the point where I can no-longer watch any news-related TV at all.
-Dave
If this nation is to be saved, it will be libertarian principles that save it.
Me too - too depressing. I
October 7, 2008 - 18:47 ET by Chris NormanMe too - too depressing. I do like to listen to Rush if I'm driving while he's on. He always makes me feel a little better - he doesn't whine and he's - in his words - "of good cheer".
McNotObama '08
Peter Schiff has been right - too bad the truth hurts
October 7, 2008 - 19:27 ET by PopularTechSorry if the truth is too much for you but the only solution is to pay down your debt and save money. The reason the Japanese did not suffer in the 1990s is because they had large personal savings, Americans today have jackshit so yes it is going to be bad. But don't worry just keep spending, charging up those credit cards and use up the rest of the equity in your house, it will never run out.
He is also not complaining about you having too much, he is pointing out you are an idiot for living beyond your means. Being in debt but owning a lot of stuff does not make you wealthy, it makes you fiscally irresponsible and an idiot. We will now pay the price for being financially irresponsible and there is nothing the government can do to fix it, they can only make it worse.
Peter Schiff - FOXNews: Bulls and Bears (Video) (4min) (December 16, 2006)
Peter Schiff - CNBC: Kudlow and Company (Video) (8min) (August 28, 2006)
I notice the drop-off in
October 7, 2008 - 19:28 ET by Roger the ShrubberI notice the drop-off in Glenn Beck watchability is directly proportional to the number of times the perpetually-whiny Ron Paul appears as a guest.
Still making fun of Ron Paul? Pathetic
October 7, 2008 - 19:48 ET by PopularTechI would think anyone with half a brain would be honest enough to admit he was right at least now. I was no Ron Paul fan but he was the only candidate trying to warn people about what was happening and you still make fun of him. It seems that political ideology is more important than reality at least for some partisans.
Ron Paul explains why the bailout is a bad idea on Fox Business News (Video) (10min)
Ron Paul saw it all (Ludwig Von Mises Institute)
I guess calling someone who was right "whiny" makes you "feel" superior but all it does in reality is make you now look like an idiot.
»→ Ron Paul
October 7, 2008 - 19:51 ET by Cool ArrowI am happy with my portfolio today because of Ron Paul.
You won't catch me badmouthing the guy. Ron Paul remained a true statesman last week when John McCain ran into the arms of George Bush and Hank Paulson.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
It's Dr. Ron's
October 7, 2008 - 20:28 ET by HillbillyKingconnection to the troofers that prevents alot of people from listening to what he has to say.
http://www.youtube.c...
Even when the troofers put out the correct info;
http://www.prisonpla...
the stigma of being linked to some dumbfucks that believe 9/11 was an inside job is enough to sour people on Dr. Ron.
Imo, that is their loss. Course they are probably the ones that are in debt up to their eyeballs and will never learn anyway, so f@ck em.
(FTR, this comment ain't directed towards the shrubber)
If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you.
Don Marquis 1878-1937
Reverse Psychology with Ron Paul and his "Fanatics"
October 7, 2008 - 20:42 ET by PopularTechI have actually looked at it as the 911 Truthers latching on to Ron Paul. Since Dr. Paul believes in freedom of speech he has no problem with them speaking and thus does not call for them to shut up. That indirectly links him to their ideology even when he admits he does not believe 911 was an inside job but did call for a new investigation. The two biggest problems with Ron Paul was his fanatics calling for "Revolution" and the 911 Truthers. Both turned people off. You cannot run a campaign like that and get anyone but the conspiracy nuts to latch onto it.
HB, like you linked they frequently put out decent information and actually dig up interesting stories but then spin them into wild conspiratorial fantasies. This is really a shame as quite a bit of the actual information they have to present is very interesting, I just do not agree with the conclusions.
Alex Jones is essentially a Constitutional Libertarian with a wild imagination which is a shame.
Once upon a time,
October 8, 2008 - 01:57 ET by HillbillyKingAlex Jones was a conservative. Then he got swallowed up by the "belly of the beast". :-}
Back on topic, I too have learned some interesting info, but like you said, it's the conclusions that I can't abide by. It is a shame, no doubt about it.
If you make people think they're thinking, they'll love you; But if you really make them think, they'll hate you.
Don Marquis 1878-1937
If Ron Paul could get out of 1916
October 8, 2008 - 00:39 ET by JWFI think he would be much more believable. He comes off as an isolationist, ignoring all of our commitments since the 2 great wars.
And it appears he loves the gold standard. Which is kinda nice but the problem is no one is on the gold standard. And the inherent problem with the gold standard was the inflexibility of the money supply. You can not easily increase or decrease the money supply as demand warrants. You need to dig more money out of the ground to increase the money supply.
Also the man is a whackjob. Alright, let's say you are against the current war X which we are involved. The problem is the war was approved by Congress and the President. Once you have troops committed and dying, you must finish the job. No matter what Congress is in now and who the President is now.
Also, he seems to want some pretty radical changes which will not sit with the population at large. I believe he wants to get rid of the Fed and gawd knows what else.
And yes, that high pitched whiny voice is irritating to the xth degree. Does not help
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
Cindy Sheehan to start her own political party.
October 7, 2008 - 12:42 ET by R D HelmShe is going to call it the First Party.
"no matter what happens, we need to consolidate the energy against Imperialism and work on building another party movement."
I think she should call it the Fruit Party.
-Dave
If this nation is to be saved, it will be libertarian principles that save it.
The First Party? or The Worst Party
October 7, 2008 - 13:04 ET by jefflebowskiI'd love to see this Sheehan kook in a debate. While I am very sorry her son died in Iraq, he knew the dangers when he enlisted. Then re-upped for another tour.
This woman is really stupid and the fact that she has embraced Chubby Chavez and other enemies of America makes her laughable.
Jeff Lebowski
www.angrywhitedude.c...
Belmont University
October 7, 2008 - 15:41 ET by ricklailI broke out in a laugh this morning when the radio news called Belmont University, site of tonight's debate, a Christian college. About a year ago the Tennesse Baptists voted to remove funding from the school. Belmont has gone the same way as Wake Forest, Furman, Richmond, Baylor, ie to allow professors of the Bible that don't even believe it. There is a high school classmate of mine that doen't hit from the same side of the plate as the rest of us who is a professor there. Please call it what it is-a liberal Christian school.
I wil give them one thing. They do have one of the best music schools in the country.
My memories of Belmont
October 7, 2008 - 19:08 ET by nkviking75I was a student there in the early 90's, and while there were more Christians there than in the general population, you'd be forgiven for not knowing it was a Christian college. Lots of snobbish rich kids.
They're known for their music business program. Among the alumni are Tricia Yearwood, Brad Paisley, and Steven Curtis Chapman.
When you put the clowns in charge, don't be surprised when a circus breaks out.
»→ Neil Kashkari
October 7, 2008 - 17:25 ET by Cool ArrowWho the hell is Neil Kashkari?
This is the man in charge of $700 Billion dollars as of today.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
CA.... ...LOL... I
October 7, 2008 - 17:34 ET by bigtimerCA....
...LOL...
I don't know, but his last name fits the bill...does it not?!
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
»→ Cash/Carry
October 7, 2008 - 17:42 ET by Cool ArrowSure does.
He's only 5 years out of school and now the biggest name in the Financial Market.
"We cannot win with eggheads and African-Americans." - Paul Begala, Democrat racebaiter
Neel Kashn'kari...another
October 7, 2008 - 20:01 ET by bigtimerNeel Kashn'kari...another Goldman/Sachs alumni...
I enjoyed the comments by the posters after the article.
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
I got a call last night
October 7, 2008 - 17:32 ET by bigtimerI got a call last night from a young gal who said she was a volunteer, I asked her questions before I answered any, anyway she said she was from a group I think it was called Obama for America or some such out of Vermont...she was wondering how I was going to vote...blah blah blah...
I had so much fun with her...and left her laughing...
I don't think she understood what happened when she hung up...
I'm still laughing.
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
Bt...I GOT A BETTER STORY!!!
October 7, 2008 - 20:02 ET by TheSterI needed to register to vote to change my address. I saw a guy registering people to vote in the Fry's Electronics parking lot. OBAMA crap all over the place...his shirt, hat, car, "vote here" written on back of an Obama sign, etc.
I gotta get this done anyway...so I might as well mess with this guy! I pull up and parked my car right next to his little card table. It's 1pm cst...right during Rush's show...which I am listening to as usual!
I get out...crank up the radio so I...and he...can hear Rush loud and clear while I'm standing by my car. I get the form...I play stupid and make him explain every line on the registration..he has to raise his voice to get heard over Rush. I start filling out the form on the trunk of my car...thus keeping him there to answer all of my made up questions.
I can tell he is getting irritated by having to listen to Rush...so I'm really going to mess with this guy!!! Right as I get ready to sign it...I "mess up" the signature...OOOPS!!
I gotta start all over again!!!
I made this LIBERAL listen to 25 minutes of Rush Limbaugh!!
The look on his face was PRICELESS!!
Ster.
"What do Barack Obama and Osama bin Laden have in common? They both have friends who bombed the Pentagon." -Rush.
Ster... I'll give you a
October 7, 2008 - 20:05 ET by Clear thinkerSter...
I'll give you a pefect 10 just for creativity. Well done!
A Very Strange Political Blog
Making Fun of AGW http://giovanniworld.wordpress.com/
CT...just be glad I'm on your side!
October 7, 2008 - 20:15 ET by TheSterHehehehe.
Ster.
I know I'm looking over my
October 7, 2008 - 20:17 ET by balboaI know I'm looking over my shoulder for the latest "loud radio" attack...
Ster...that is
October 7, 2008 - 20:17 ET by bigtimerSter...that is hilarious...I mean absolutely hilarious...I wished I could of been there...
Good job friend...
You know, I'd give anything to have a recording of my call with that gal last night...
My husband didn't understand who or what I was talking to or about...I finally would say something and wink at him when I'd answer with a big old grin on my face...or ask her a question and play with her mind...
I'm telling you it was great fun.
Liberals can be fun to play with..kind of like a cat and mouse game...the liberals never know what hit them, until it's too late.
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
That sounds like a good
October 7, 2008 - 20:35 ET by ThisnThatThat sounds like a good day, Ster. I would add one more thing to make it perfect.
Pretend you didn't know something, and you had to make a phone call. Call Rush's show -- explain quickly what's going on, and could Rush either take your call over the radio (as you ask Rush how to fill out the form!), or if he couldn't take your call, talk to the group at Fry's Electronics parking lot over the radio. That would have made this guy's day absolutely miserable, I think.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
»→ Take a moment now
October 7, 2008 - 17:36 ET by Cool ArrowTake a moment right now and pray that the debate will go according to God's will.
Those of us who believe in God owe it to our Republic that we hold it up before Him and invite him to do his will for it.
praying right now. America
October 7, 2008 - 18:38 ET by cocodriepraying right now. America was dedicated to Jesus at the very beginning and it's still His.
Posted to wrong area.
October 7, 2008 - 18:45 ET by Chris NormanPosted to wrong area.