Michael Moore Justifies Rev. Wright as Example of Black Rage

Photo of Matthew Balan.
By Matthew Balan | May 1, 2008 - 16:21 ET

After Jimmy Carter and Joy Behar, CNN’s Larry King had a prominent liberal guest on his show for the third night in a row on Wednesday, this time Michael Moore. After King played a clip from Bill O’Reilly’s interview of Hillary Clinton which concerned the issue of the Rev. Jeremiah Wright, Moore pulled out the "black rage" card, as well as the stereotypical rich white liberal guilt. "[Y]ou have to ask yourself, Larry, what's it like to be black in America? And what kind of rage would you feel? And if you did feel that rage, what kind of things would you say that, at times, would be outrageous, crazy even, because you've had to live through this for so long. And I do not believe, as a white guy, that I am in any position to judge a black man who has had to live through that." [audio clip here]

Moore appeared as a guest on "Larry King Live" for the entire hour of the program. His comments on Wright came twenty minutes into the program. Besides explaining away Wright’s many polarizing and outlandish statements, he also attacked Hillary Clinton for her actions in the campaign, as well as his more usual targets of George W. Bush and John McCain.

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MOORE: I would never refer to him as -- in the way that Senator Clinton just did. You know, I can say that I would disagree or that I wouldn't use the language that he used or whatever. But to go after him like this, I just think it's a diversionary tactic, it distracts us from the real issues. And the issue is John McCain is four more years of George W. Bush. John McCain is four years of George W. Bush. That's what we should be talking about and not what an elderly black man is saying because he's upset on how he's been treated. And let me say this, too, because I've received a number of letters from older women, especially, who support Hillary Clinton. And they support her with great passion because they've had to suffer as a second-class citizens in this country.

If you're a 50, a 60, a 70 -- I've had letters from women in their '80s and actually a 90-year-old woman who said to me, you know, I lived in a time where, as a woman, had my mother decided to go and vote, she'd be arrested -- arrested and thrown in jail because she wanted to vote in the United States of America. So women feel this -- a similar sense of trying to undo what's been wrong for so long. And women, to this day, don't -- they're not paid the same, in terms of what men are paid. They don't have a lot of the same opportunities that men have. And so I understand that anger, too, and that frustration and that outrage. And I guess what I -- I guess the difference I see here is, is that I have not heard Senator Obama try to make people afraid to vote for Senator Clinton because she's a woman. I haven't heard anything out of his mouth. But for her to try and make white, you know, working class, as they say, people vote for her and not him, to frighten them with words like Farrakhan and Hamas and things like that, I just -- I just think that that's not necessary.

King then asked Moore about McCain and his experience as a POW in Vietnam, and his subsequent service as a U.S. Senator. At one point, King hinted about McCain’s reputation for having a temper.

KING: What about what John McCain gave for his country?

MOORE: In terms of...

KING: His body.

MOORE: Well, and the torture that he went through?

KING: Yeah.

MOORE: And now he votes.

KING: He can be a little angry, too, can't he?

MOORE: Yes.

KING: And the war that ended unpopular.

MOORE: Well, I guess that's -- and we've seen him angry. And as a senior citizen, maybe he's experiencing things now, as an elderly American, where it's not the same as if you were a young person in this country. Certainly, if he wanted to go and get a job, other than U.S. senator at his age, he'd have a pretty hard time, wouldn't he?

KING: He probably couldn't get it.

MOORE: He probably couldn't get a job, even though he's able-bodied and can still work. So it's good that all these issues come up and we have...

KING: So they all can have gripes?

MOORE: Well, no, not me because...

KING: You have no gripes?

MOORE: Well, I'm not -- I can't -- no. I have no gripe about the fact that I'm a 50-year-old white guy because we've been running the show for a long time. And it's time to open it up, I think, and let some other people run this show.

Speaking of an "elderly American" who might have a "pretty hard time" finding a job, the host himself, Larry King, turns 75 this year.

Earlier in the program, reacting to another clip from the O’Reilly interview of Clinton, King brought up the issue of taxing the wealthy. Moore explained that income tax rate of 70 percent would be acceptable, and King referenced a celebrity’s experience of taxation during World War II.

KING: Are we discussing the host's [O’Reilly’s] wallet or what?
 
MOORE: Yeah, I...
 
(LAUGHTER)
 
KING: Or taxes?
 
MOORE: You know, he asked me the same question when I was on his show. He goes, how much would you -- how much would you have me pay in income tax, 50 percent? I said no, more. Sixty? I said no. No, more. Seventy? I said, yes, sounds good. You'd have me -- you'd have people -- we'd have to pay 70 percent in income tax? I said, no, no, not, we, Bill, you.
 
KING: Do you know...
 
MOORE: I'd have a law that you would pay.
 
KING: You know in World War II, Frank Sinatra paid 90 cents on a dollar.
 
MOORE: Yeah. And was a wealthy man.
 
KING: Yeah.
 
MOORE: He lived quite well, didn't he?
 
KING: He managed to struggle through.
 
MOORE: Right. And Bill O'Reilly is worrying about having to pay 39 percent.

—Matthew Balan is a news analyst at the Media Research Center.

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Here's the problem: I can

Here's the problem: I can totally see what Moore is saying, and I agree that there are in fact many black people who have had to live through some atrocious things.

BUT...when do they start moving forward as a people? How many black people use that rage that's passed down generation to generation as a reason to drop out of school, to commit crime, or simply to continue not trusting and despising "whitey"?

Nazis tried to wipe out the Jews. It doesn't get more atrocious than that. But they've moved forward, while never forgetting the past.

Some black people are moving forward. And it doesn't make them "Uncle Toms" or anything like that. It usually makes them successful, and content.

comparing blacks and jewish people

the main difference between these two groups of people is this:

blacks were captured, enslaved, were forced to live apart as families (men with men, women with women, no extended family) for hundreds of years effectively destroying the family dynamic... then they were 'freed' but treated like animals with little-to-no rights for another 100+ years... finally they were given the right to attend the same schools and actually vote AND were simultaneously expected to behave just like white folks; without the family structure and a with history of being told they were subhuman. are they treated equally today? ask the JENA 6 or Sean Bell's family.

jews can at least have a historical context. they can know what their families were about before WWII. as horrendous as the holocaust was, it didn't last so long that there is no memory of what having grandparents are about. once the nazi regime fell, great efforts were made to rectify the wrong; including prosecuting the criminals, establishing the state of israel (which has become the #1 recipient of US aid in the world).

what qualifies my opinion? my black wife of 7 yrs, my beautiful bi-racial children, our quest for understanding and my attendance at a predominantly jewish university studying fascism.

black rage. don't understand it? i certainly don't condone it, but how angry were you after of 9-11?... or the execution of daniel pearl? it might give you an idea.   

 

Since you brought up the

Since you brought up the JENA 6, I'll say this:

Six black kids beat up a white kid because they were mad, and because he was white. They put him in the hospital. As far as I know, one kid was convicted. Not even sure if he did any time.

But if the races had been reversed, beaters and victim, there would still have been protests and marches to make sure that each and every one of the white perpetrators was punished to the fullest extent of the law. It would have been a "hate crime." So you're right; they weren't treated equally. IMO, they got off easier than 6 white kids who beat a black kid would have.

You're right about the differences of experience between Jews and blacks. But the point is, you have to move on. If you can only feel anger about the past, you're not going to have much of a future. And a pastor should help lead his people into the future, not encourage them to dwell on past grievances.

Abeautifulperson: It

Abeautifulperson:

It seems that you associate slavery with the destruction of the Afro-American family.

Historically you will find that a hard-sell if you interview Africans-Americans over the age of 90.  Most of them will tell you that the African-American family in the 1900-1950 timeframe was relitively solid and built tight communities. 

During this period it seems that while empoverished and discriminated against, the Black family was coherent.

IT was the social policies of the 1960's that devestated the African American community. 

BD, sorry but I just can't

BD, sorry but I just can't help stepping in. Interview African-Americans over the age of 90?? Really, there are that many eh?

Well if they did survive past 90 it was because the were lucky enough to have a stable family...others who died young might not have been so fortunate.

I selected that age group

I selected that age group because they would clearly remember the Pre-WWII environment when families of all races were the most coherent.

But if you rather not go that far, you can ask people like Thomas Sowell (Born in 1930) who has on several occasions indicated that the black family as a unit was strong in the mid-portion of the last century contrary to what would be expected if Slavery had such a pervasive influence on them.

From my reading I have to agree with him.  I also agree with the caveat that families of differing demographics (Races, ethnicities etc) were strong during this period.

I myself have witnessed the steady and continued disintegration of families since I was born in 1963. 

Well, I think that you can

Well, I think that you can always find examples of strong families in any race or age..even in todays world. But for me the question remains, were Africian-American families disrupted more than most by slavery?

I can't claim to have read as much American history as you. I do know a lot fled north to Canada and that must have been disruptive to famlies.

Sure, but the post slavery

Sure, but the post slavery era fostered coherent families.  Therefore, the effect of slavery had been overcome for this to occur.

If in the post slavery era, 9 out of 10 babies born were born out of wedlock, you would have a point, but this is not the case.  During the 1910-1930 timeframe improvements to the social condition had pretty much solidified most Black families.

It is not until later (1960's) that you see the disintegration of the black family.

"There is a class of colored people who make a business of keeping the troubles, the wrongs, and the hardships of the Negro race before the public. Having learned that they are able to make a living out of their troubles, they have grown into the settled habit of advertising their wrongs---partly because they want sympathy and partly because it pays. Some of these people do not want the Negro to lose his grievances, because they do not want to lose their jobs." ---Booker T. Washington

Ok, I really don't want to

Ok, I really don't want to drag this on since you clearly know more about it than me. But why was Martin Luther King Jr. moved to give his famous "I Have a Dream" speech in 1963? Wait that's the year you were born...I get it it's all your fault! :-) 

Everything else seems to be

Everything else seems to be my fault, might as well add this...

You could go with a 60-70 year old range

To get the answers to your questions, you could speak to people in their late 60's on up. Prior to the 1964 Civil Rights Act, the black family was a 2 parent home, just as the whites. At that time, the percentage of college graduates was higher, as were the test scores in the k-12 grades. The Civil Rights Act and Brown vs Board of Education were long over due but something terrible happened..What should have helped has hurt the black community. Rather than running and expanding their win, they stopped, dead in their tracks and went backwards...Nobody can keep a black person down like a black person can!

i gotta site for you:

http://www.stormfron...

seems like you'll lots to talk about with this crew. 

 

That was uncalled for -- IMHO.

"There are two types of people in this country; those who provide freedom and those who enjoy it." MM says...

abp, you owe every member of NB an engraved apology.

That was beyond irresponsible.

You are fast becoming one of the most loathsome individuals I have ever encountered on this site, or any other site, for that matter, and I am going all the way back to the Usenet days.

You are probably one or two posts away from being tagged as a troll.

Trust me, should that happen, it will suck to be you. :-)

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

ABP,

And here I was giving you the benefit of the doubt, until now.

Btw, this is how we deal with racists around here. If you don't apologize, then a formal protest to the mods may be in order. Without an apology on this board, we will be forced to conclude that your link is who you really are.

ABP

As a fellow Canadian, I find your remarks very dissapointing. To disagree with conservatives is one thing, but to compare them to a organizion like the KKK is really below the belt.

You should be ashamed of yourself. JMHO

"no one can keep a black person down like a black person" ?!!

THIS is a racist statement which received absolutely no condemnation by anyone on this site... but from me. 

its fricken larf that pointing it out incites a demand for an apology. i have dealt with racists many times. it was a racist statement. as well were a few more subtle comments, which i am not going to bother to point out, that were polite but still racist.

the nasty, negative, attacks i have read on this site AND the threats i have already received, will ensure i will not be apologizing to the users of NB. 

its a shock when someone suggests you are a racist. well, get over it and think about it. i live in a predominantly black, middle-class neighbourhood, in a country (not canada) that is majority black and run by black people. half my family are educated blacks and i raise two very intelligent black children.

call me a troll? no problem. if vehemently disagreeing with negative and occasionally (not always) racist statements is being a troll. then i am guilty.

i KNOW there are NB folk would much prefer to sit around and share their latest insults about michael moore or barack obama or whichever 'liberal' target without being called on it.

forget it.

i straddle the fence and share thoughts with 'liberals' as well. i gotta say, NB seems to be a collective of polarized and very negatively charged personalities. not all, but the negativity is comparatively disproportionate. i have never read so many vindictive and offensive comments. so to hear that everyone on NB needs an apology and is offended is simply ridicules.

btw, my response was to a specific comment. should anyone else feel they were being targeted who did not comment, its not my fault the structure of this site is so poorly set up.  

perhaps i should be reported on, and kicked off the site. stifle dissenting opinions. but until then, i am here to:

"expose and combat anti-liberal bias"

 

 

Abp,

The only thing ridiculous here is you weak attempt to defend yourself. I have heard many black people I know say the same thing, only they put it more like "...noone will f!*k you like your own people." Are they racists when they say it? When you look at the Sharptons, Farrakhans, and Wrights of the world, what conclusion comes to mind? It is a fact that some in the black community make their bones off of keeping black people of the mind that whitey is responsible for all of their problems. Hell, Wright said that blacks and whites learn with different parts of their brains. Is this statement racist? If not, then neither was Pam's.

BOTH are racist and unacceptable to me

enjoy your weekend. i gotta run. we'll be in touch next week.

Pointing someone to a Storm

Pointing someone to a Storm Front website is rarely a good idea if you want your argument taken seriously.

So you would disagree with

So you would disagree with the Rev.Wright's assertions that black kids (and Africans) can't learn in a disciplined manner because their brains are different from whites?

This despite the fact that it has long since been established that, contrary to assertions form white supremecists thru the 20th Century, we are all members of the same species: homo sapien sapien.

I guess you don't go along with Obama's mentor on this one: because that's a pretty racist thing to believe, and people who believe that are racists, that's beyond dispute.

It is odd though that Senator Obama had never heard this Eugenics based claptrap until last Monday at the National Press Club.

Not sure I can believe that myself.

Vote 4 change. Vote 4 anything. See Jack & Mr Shy's first campaign ad for the ONLY viable 3rd party candidate.

apb, you couldn't correctly define racism with written

apb, you couldn't correctly define racism with verbal and written instructions, a dictionary, and a twenty minute head start.

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

Interesting... Point out

Interesting...

Point out that the liberal social policies of the 1960's are what really devestated the Black family, and you are suddenly treated by Abeautifulperson in this dispicable manner.

I guess it was the only direction he had to turn as he had no answer.

i only allow myself 30 minutes on this site a day MAX

sorry i cannot comment on all opposing statements or opinions. there are certainly plenty.

but i invite all NB users to join GNN.tv and share their views. i certainly don't agree with all the users there, but perhaps some folks who consider themselves conservatives could counter the information on their messageboard. it certainly isn't the easiest thing in the world, for me to join NB to disagree with people. in fact, there is a core of nasties here.

its much easier to hang with people of like-mind and say what everyone else is thinking.

30 min maxman

I guess your time is up.

Bye.

abp, it wouldn't hurt our

abp, it wouldn't hurt our feelings at all if you spent that 30 minutes somewheres else.

Like here.

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

communist? me? no way.

the rot that CAN take place within communism is as un palatable as unregulated capitalism. no better and just as destructive to the fabric of society.

oh i'm a capitalist. but not the kind that would enjoy sipping champagne on my yacht while foreign slaves work for me for a couple dollars a day, 12-hr days, 7 day weeks. and much to the suffering of my business, i do as little business with such companies. amazingly i manage to run a successful business & take care of my family. 

 

"the problem with capitalism is people get so caught up on the execution of the task they rarely take the time to ask themselves if they should." — me. 

The Jena 6 are a gang of

The Jena 6 are a gang of thugs who snuck up behind an unsuspecting victim, cold cocked him, and then proceeded to stomp the crap out of him after he was defenseless.

They deserve the same fate as those who murdered James Byrd.

Couple of problems with your

Couple of problems with your post: Jena 6 ruthlessly beat up a kid because they were angry at him. Are they supposed to get away with that? That would make them "equal"?

Second, are you saying black families don't know what their families were about before WWII? How so? 

Jena 6 + something just flew over your head...

there is a bit more to it than 6 guys got mad. there were a couple guys (black) who showed up at the party and got beaten up by a larger number of others (white) mere weeks before. there was the gun pulled (white on black).

but the ultimate was the noose hung in the tree by whites to threaten blacks... actually the ultimate was: when complaints were made, the white authorities dismissed the act as a prank. in the incident: blacks beaten up, whites charged with assault. whites beaten up, blacks charged with attempted murder, bail withheld. ?!

if someone was hanging a noose to threaten me (cuz we all know what that means in the south) i'd be pissed. but i guess 'they' should just get over it.  oh and no comments on the unarmed guy who caught over 50 bullets, eh?

re: blacks in WWII. please reread my statement. you missed the point entirely.

is segregation still alive and well? all the brothers and sisters reading this, raise your hand....

...didn't think so. 

 

 

Did the black kids beaten up

Did the black kids beaten up wind up in the hospital?

The Bell incident is tragic, but I don't know enough particulars to comment.

What does this site have to do with segregation? 

Mindless liberal bulls**t

Mindless liberal bulls**t muttered by an unabashed apologist for violent, racists black youths.

If indeed these filth you are defending were defending their "honor", they might have had the decency to fight their victim one-on-one.  They did not, revealing themselves as bullies and cowards.  If indeed these thugs were justified in their actions, they would not have struck the first blows.  Unfortunately, they DID strike the first blows.   If these vermin were indeed honorable, they would have struck the victim in the front, where he could plainly see them.  They did not. They approached in stealth from the rear and struck with neither warning nor mercy.

 These Jena 6 are UGLY people.  Continue to defend these vermin and be known by your associations.  

I could be wrong, but I

I could be wrong, but I think he's saying that the white kids were merely charged after they beat up the black kids, while the black kids went to jail for beating up the white kid.

I have no idea if that's true or not. 

Bal,

I believe that is true. However, the severity of the injuries to the victims was what determined the severity of the charges.

That's what I figured, too.

That's what I figured, too. Obviously, the white kids weren't right in attacking the black kids, either. I just don't think portraying the Jena 6 as helpless victims is correct.

The white kids were

The white kids were attacking the black kids?  Where did you get that idea?  From these liberal morons like ABP?   The white kids were accused of hanging a noose in a tree, purportedly to discourage blacks from congregating under that tree.  They were not accused of assault, that is, physically striking blows against the persons of anyone, Jena 6 or otherwise..  I have seen no allegations that the Jena 6 were ever assaulted by anyone, white or black.  The only assault alleged was the beating of one white student by the Jena 6, a student not even clearly associated with the noose-in-the-tree business.

Balboa: A pastor from

Balboa:

A pastor from Jena has written an interesting and informative piece about the city of Jena and the juvenile problems last year.  I have not seen or heard this refuted.  If you or anyone else has verification to the contrary please post. 

http://www.authorsden.com/visit/viewarticle.asp?AuthorID=17296&id=32967

RRAM Tough! 

Jumping in late, but here's

Jumping in late, but here's another one.

I had read this some time ago, from the husband of a Jena HS teacher.

Great artical MB, you would

Great artical MB, you would think if the media had any scruppels they would print this every where 

 

"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg

Excellent article MB which

Excellent article MB which appears to corroborate what the pastor from my link stated.  Thanks.

I have no doubt that MSM screwed this story up and created problems that never should have occurred.

RRAM Tough! 

don't put words in my mouth

who called the jena 6 helpless victims? you? i certainly didn't.

but they do exemplify the inequities and double standards. hanging a noose is a hate crime, criminal and typically punishable. when the black students pointed it out to the 'authorities' it was not taken seriously. i don't justify any of the violence perpetrated by either set of troublemakers. both were wrong, but after the lead up and circumstances, it is not entirely shocking (i didn't say justified) they lashed out. YOU nor i can say we can truly empathize.

here's an example which may parallel and you may be able to relate to: "america deserved 9-11". if you heard that over and over from the rest of the world, it would piss you off. if you took a complaint to what you considered the authorities and they blew you off and told you to stop whining, you'd be even more pissed off... perhaps even lash out... at an easy target, maybe? more of a symbolic one even? (allow me to spell it: I-R-A-Q).

note: i am not saying i believe america deserved 9-11. i merely use it as an illustration to give you something which may help you to empathize. 

there certainly is a parallel of actions. 

So, hanging little nooses in

So, hanging little nooses in trees is a hate crime...
...is flashing gang sign in an effort to terrorize a hate crime as well?????

In the end, HATE is not a crime, just a human emotion.

yeah, it is when it involves nooses in trees after 3000+ lynches

... and these days deadly weapons are a pair of sneakers.

but hate isn't a crime here on NB. its a sport.

 

Sorry, but I don't think

Sorry, but I don't think that's an actual hate crime. It's disgusting and awful, but not a hate crime.

Bal: I must say I am not

Bal:
I must say I am not comfortable witht he very notion of "A hate Crime."

I think it strikes to the very heart of the first amendment, it criminalizes thought and speech.

If I wanted to protest against, lets say, conservatives, I could hang businessmens ties fashioned as nooses in a tree . This would send the appropriate message.

I could protest against hippies by hanging Tye-dyed t-shirts in a tree fashioned as nooses. THis would also send an approriate message.

Both could be considered "Hateful Acts" by the people it is focused upon. But both would not likely be considered a hate crime.

So why should any other speech be considered a hate crime

My Dear; uglyOnInside, U can do better than that!

How about your GODLESS buddies Mao and Stalin = 100 MILLION murdered.

The POPE says, GOD BLESS AMERICA!!

IranianUranium<sleep>New/Infrastructure/repair?/ROFLMAO

 

Would you be surprised to

Would you be surprised to find that more innocent people have been killed by thugs belonging to gangs than those who have been lynched?

so... lynching is good?

by that rationale, the US government is an even bigger criminal gang, nuking hundreds of thousands of unarmed civilians in Japan and more recently: IRAQ.

i suppose we could go to McCain's church, have a look at some of the things he has said over the years. 

http://www.236.com/b...

its interesting that even with these comments, it has been a non-issue. yet another double-standard. 

i don't think a candidate should be vilified by the opinions of those around them, whether it be McCain or Obama.

 

→ abp

Which church does McCain attend?

♣ a seal

abp, are you so intellectually vacant that you

abp, are you so intellectually vacant that you are unable to distinguish the difference between an endorsement from someone a candidate has never met vs. a twenty-year relationship?

Of course, the ability to do so would require empoying linear logic, which is the reason you cannot make the differentiation, as you have none.

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

That's a very good point with Wright/Hagee

However, it seems reversed with Ayers/Liddy, which could become a political issue for McCain in the future if this line of thinking is pushed too-hard. The "big government is good no matter what the consequences" Nixonian-wing of the Republican party is, after all, what many Americans fear most of all. Including me. And note what this guy, who is an economics professor (at George Mason University, even) says at the end about the Bear Stearns bailout...
JMR

The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.

Your posting shows a lack

Your posting shows a lack of understanding of the just war theory.  I shall recommend you study it before continueing this debate.

Reference the Reverend Hagee situation.  As I am to undertand it, Hagee is not McCains spiritual leader, but rather just an individual who has flocked to McCains banner. 

As much as I would like to remove the senior Senator from homestate of Arizona from his senatorial position, I cannot hold the hagee matter against him anymore than I can hold the New York Giants culpable for any riots that occured post Superbowl.

gang sign?

btw, when we are discussing race relations, to raise the topic of gang signs seems that you are suggesting that to be black is to be a gangster? so are 75% of black people in gangs, 40% or just the jena 6? just curious your thoughts on this. 

i wonder... was the white crew who hung the noose, were they gangsters? or just fun loving college material who made a joke that didn't go over well? and the white guy who pulled the gun at the corner store before the schoolyard incident. was he a gangster? or just a fearful, citizen who felt threatened. and the white guys at the party who pounded the blacks... they were just bouncers doing their jobs? terrorized party goers? or gangsters?

again, while it might not be in-yer-face, the racist overtones of comments just as 'gang signs' would be noticeable to anyone but an insensitive person (insensitive def'n: not readily responsive or aware, deficient in sensibility). 

 

"Do unto others as they would like to be done unto."        — me 

Who has cornered the market

Who has cornered the market on gangs? What makes up the majority of the membership of bloods and crips? What overwhelming majority of artists make gangs an INTEGRAL part of their popular music? Is it Pearl Jam? White Stripes? Plain White Ts?

discourse. good. now we are getting somewhere.

who has cornered the market on gangs? are you referring to the commercial market? that's easy: mainly whites. whites produce and distribute the vast majority of the music from a small number of black artists, for the consumption of a majority of white suburban youth. eminem may be in the minority of artists, but the MILLIONS of CDs sold aren't all bought or even mostly bought by blacks. the gangsta stereotype is greatly assisted by whites. (i didn't say blacks aren't involved... or a victims...). GTA IV, anyone?

my issue with the gang sign comment is the jump from black students to crip/blood gang members. perhaps the jena 6 were just a bunch of pissed of young black men. getting into a fight doesn't make you a gang member. suggesting as such is a racial stereotype.

"their popular music". see comments above. hiphop is HUGE. it international. chinese, indian, brits and lots of white folk rap. (btw, i personally only like a bit of it).

the point i am trying to make is that there are is a racial stereotype that most black youth are thugs and gangsters. but it is not true. there are an estimated 65,000 crips & bloods from 37.1 million blacks (that's assuming all crips & bloods are black).

even kids who get into trouble are tagged as gangsters. the incarceration rate is much higher with black vs whites. prison sentences for the same crimes are longer...

consider this: its not so much a racial problem in america. its an economic one. the poorest are the least educated. the poorest the more inclined to be involved in crime. whether white, black, hispanic or otherwise. but its better for some to perpetuate race as the issue. because to point at race is to keep the finger off them.

although some on NB would like to think it was all just fine for black americans until the 60's, even then many didn't have a pot to piss in. many blacks have come from no money to middle and upper class. but those blacks aren't in the news, are they? 

i suggest that poor whites have much more in common with poor blacks than a poor white would ever have in common with the late, KEN LAY. who's company ENRON stole more money from white folks than the crips & bloods ever could, combined. ENRON execs. talk about a gang of thugs. just cuz they wear suits doesn't mean they don't cause plenty of grief. 

Whoah

I don't think you realize how racist your comment is. Black people cornered the market on gangs? Are you kidding me?

Look, you clearly don't realize how you're manipulating the word "gang" here to mean "crips/bloods" or whatever your simplistic notion of a "gang" is. So, I don't think I should even bother trying to formulate an argument. However, I have three words for you.

 

West. Side. Story.

You got to be

You got to be kidding.

If  you talk to any gang unit officer, you will find that gangs are usually minority based.  Higher percentages of Blacks, hispanics, etc, than caucasian.

There are reasons for this, but facts are facts....

I am trying to make the

I am trying to make the point on the futility of "Hate Crimes."

The white kids who hung the nooses are scum.

THe black kids wearing bandannas, brandishing glocks and listening to C-Rap who victimize people straying into their "Turf" are likewise scum.

But no one ever accuses the gang members of hate crimes. Why is that?

By definition, aren't all

By definition, aren't all crimes technically hate crimes? 

"Abstain from McCain"

CT: You could make a case

CT:
You could make a case for that.

Mugging? Obviously a hatecrime....
Assault and Battery? Obviously a hatecrime...

Rape...murder...child

Rape...murder...child abuse

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

Concur with that BT.

Concur with that BT.

BD... If the lefties

BD...

If the lefties really want to push this hate crime crap, they should hand themselves over to the authorities immediately. I have never seen a more hateful group than those on the left. I know for a fact that most of them hate you and I, so that begs the question...can we get them arrested? 

"Abstain from McCain"

Boy, abp, you sure aren't scoring a lot of points here tonight.

if someone was hanging a noose to threaten me (cuz we all know what that means in the south)

Really?

I probably know more about the War of Northern Aggression (what government-schooled types such as you refer to as the "Civil War") than probably 98% of the general population.

As I write this, I can look out my window and literally see the very path that Gen. Sherman took upon leaving Kennesaw Mountain on his way to torching my hometown of Atlanta.

Would you please explain to all of us igner't types just why it is that so many former slaves who moved north after the war, wound up coming back to the south and, in many cases, working for their former owners?

Is it because the northerners treated them so well?

Hardly.

And in the years since, particularly the last fifty, no ideology has done more to harm black Americans than has liberalism. It quite literally has replaced the plantation owners as the new slave masters.

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

And in the years since,

And in the years since, particularly the last fifty, no ideology has done more to harm black Americans than has liberalism. It quite literally has replaced the plantation owners as the new slave masters.

RD...you said a mouthful there friend. 

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

Thanks, bt.

Abp here is becoming decidedly tiresome.

What the American people are looking for is somebody who can solve their problems. - Barack Obama, April 27, 2008

I believe the most prominent

I believe the most prominent figure currently claiming blacks and whites have different brains; and who wants to segregate the races for education purposes, is the Reverend Wright.

Vote 4 change. Vote 4 anything. See Jack & Mr Shy's first campaign ad for the ONLY viable 3rd party candidate.

Bravo, bal

Good post. Good points.

Also, Moore tries to paint Wright as just an "angry black man" whose statements can't be attributed to Obama. But he's NOT just a black man, he's a pastor. He's the spiritual guide for his congregation. He's who they look to for guidance.

And what he gives them is reasons and excuses for under-achievement. Like his remarks the other day about how black kids can't be expected to learn like white kids, because their brains are different. So he helps them justify failing in society.

And Obama was a member of that congregation for 20 years. He sat in the pews and listened to that "guidance." And that makes Wright more than just some "angry black man."

I'm glad you said that

I'm glad you said that about the brians being different...if a white person had said THE SAME THING, the very same words......don't chnage one word......he would have been killed on the spot..

 

Jimmy the greek,  "The black is a better athlete to begin with because he's been bred to be that way -- because of his high thighs and big thighs that goes up into his back, and they can jump higher and run faster because of their bigger thighs. This goes back all the way to the Civil War when during the slave trading, the owner -- the slave owner would breed his big black to his big woman so that he could have a big black kid."

 

that was the last we ever heard from him.

 

 

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
 -Thomas Jefferson

Of course Michael Moore shouldn't judge Wright

because he has said similar things and propagated similar conspiracy theories. He is just like him. Full of hate. What a joke.

Remember This One?

After the 9/11 attacks, Lumpy said that if there had been more black men on the hijacked airliners, Atta and company would have never succeeded.

Hi Del, LMAO... I

Hi Del,

LMAO...

I didn't know about that...now that is rich isn't it coming from him...what a hypocrite.

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

Have you noticed

that King seems to have the same people on over and over again? How far does a career have to sink to have Carter, Moore and Behar as regulars?

Poor ole blacks??

You can't classify Hussein O or Wright as black, or poor. Both are white enough to have lived the privilaged life since they were born and are now millionaire's. Both used 'black' to enrich themselves with little care for the poor blacks of the country.

 

Old, Retired and glad of it.

Obama and Wright.  Both

Obama and Wright.  Both Harvard Graduates.

When did you graduate from Harvard?

Wright didn't go to Harvard.

Wright didn't go to Harvard.

"Both are white enough"...?!

come on ole man, those kinds of comments are of the "leave it to beaver" era. but please enlighten us as to how much you have studied the lives of both of these men... beyond what you watch on FOX and read on NB. 

Well, as a white guy (and

Well, as a white guy (and one who unfortunately shares the same last name), I feel perfectly qualified to judge Michael Moore:

A brainless loudmouthed waste of oxygen. A monument to the sad state of American "education". Like Steve Miller and Pam Anderson, proof that one can have a career without possessing a shred of talent.

"You know in World War II, Frank Sinatra paid...

...90 cents on a dollar."

And almost all of it was going to the evil military industrial complex that defeated the Nazis and Imperial Japan rather than to a bloated federal bureaucracy and the 10s of millions of people who are dependent on government handouts.  A minor difference IMHO.

It's too bad that BOR didn't point that out to HRC when he had a chance.  He did call it socialism but he should've called it stealing.

Who you callin' White?

My WhiteRage is beginning to get the best of me.

We've all suffered

Every human being that's ever been alive has suffered injustice in one form or another. Some have been through some pretty horrific events in their lives, and they aren't all blacks. If we, as a society, are going to give blacks a pass on their anger and bitterness because of past events in their lives, then I guess we also need to apply that to everyone else in society. The rapists, child molesters and murderers who all claim to have suffered some sort of terrible mistreatment in their youth should now have an excuse for their behavior. Don't they have a right to express their anger and bitterness too? If we are going to apply this standard for blacks, then it should apply to all. Let's just all carry around a big fat chip on our shoulders for the rest of our lives, cause we've all had something happen to us that wasn't too pleasant.

Kris...You are exactly

Kris...

You are exactly right...I am so sick of this all.

We all have a life story...some are not so good, some are fine, but this has gone on long enough now.

Equal rights for all...most of us do not go around whining and crying about trials and tribulations that happen to us...

Move on, pick yourself up, grow up....face reality and shut the heck up already.

It is tiresome.

Btw...I tried to get through the Moore/King leftist BS, could not do it. 

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

Read "Black, Like Me" by

Read "Black, Like Me" by John Howard Griffin and get back to me on that.

the list is getting longer

 

Michael Moore, Douche

 

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.
 -Thomas Jefferson

It looks like that diet is

It looks like that diet is going well... 

 

Ronald Reagan, 1962: I did not leave the Democratic party, the party left me.

Insert: your name, 2008, and the Republican party.

Romney / Jendil  2012 (if,we survive)

USA... That was the first

USA...

That was the first thing I thought of when I was attempting to watch some of the tripe...then it was the hat... it's getting really old, I wonder if he has have showered and changed clothes yet in years...he gives me the creeps, makes one shiver just looking at him, let alone the balderdash coming out of his mouth...which also makes me wonder if he brushes his teeth too...

I rarely do this too when talking about a person...but with him, you just can't help yourself, and imagine the same ol' tennis shoes and socks.....ewwwww....

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

Thanks, as far as Moore is

Thanks, as far as Moore is concerned I don't think I want to imagine anything with him. lol. ewwwww

Well well

Looks like Mike is right.

It is black rage alright. This great Black man he referes to only has ten million in his bank account, complements of his church going flock and adding insult to injury, he is stuck having to live in a 25,000 square foot plus mansion, on a golf course, in a mostly white neighborhood.

Yea, I can see why he would be full of rage.