Edwards Endorses . . . Worldview of USA as 'Bully'

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It wasn't just Barack Obama's candidacy that John Edwards endorsed tonight. It was also the worldview that sees the United States as a "bully." Consider these lines from Edwards just-completed speech.
JOHN EDWARDS: There's also a wall that's divided our image in the world. The America as the beacon of hope is behind that wall. And all the world sees now is a bully. They see Iraq, Guantanamo, secret prison, and a government that argues that waterboarding is not torture [lusty booing from the crowd]. This is not OK. That wall has to come down. For the sake of our ideals and our security. We can change this. We can change it. Yes, we can.
Note that Edwards wasn't saying the America-haters of the world are wrong. To the contrary, he was clearly seconding their view of the US as a bully, for the supposed crimes he enumerated. For a moment there, I thought Edwards might be on the verge of a "God bless America? No, no, no" of his own. Is this really the kind of endorsement Senator 57-states needs?

I didn't note any comment on Edwards' "bully" remark in the immediate post-speech kibitzing on MSNBC. Will the MSM report the anti-Americanism of Obama's latest fan?

Note: All the world sees in America is a bully? No wonder nobody wants to come here.

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i remember when bullies

i remember when bullies used to liberate me from maniacal dictators all the time - and send me trillions in foriegn aid every year...

i so ashamed john:(

John Edwards is an America-hating ambulance-chaser.

'nuff said.

That's great! I had the

That's great!

I had the same thought (see below).

And to think that this

And to think that this America-hating ambulance chaser wanted to be our President...er...dictator.

Edwards is lower than what you scrape off your shoes after a walk through the barnyard.

Liberal: a power worshipper without power. George Orwell

Hey Trix

please do not insult what I shovel twice a day from my horse. LOL

Trix,

LOL-Actually, I was thinking whale feces in the deepest depths of the ocean.

But barnyard works, too. :-)

R D

Let's see..Obama is an America Hating Socialist and he has added Edwars the America Hating ambulance chaser!

PERFECT TICKET

Edwards must think that

Edwards must think that under an Obama Presidency there'll be more ambulances to chase.

Or maybe he likes the sound of "Vice President Edwards".

With Apologies to Pres. Reagan

John Edwards: Mr. Obama, tear down this country!

Lol. Could be an instant

Lol.

Could be an instant classic. 

"Abstain from McCain"

Edwards Endorses . . .

Edwards Endorses . . . Worldview of USA as 'Bully'

Edwards shouldn't be endorsing anything but hair and beauty products.

how does he sing that lee

how does he sing that lee greenwood tune again...?

I'm ashamed to be an American, where we all just a bunch of bul-leees...

or Toby Keith maybe?

please stick a boot up our *$$, it's the Democrat way... 

John woulda made a great US prez to be sure

To answer your question

yes, of course, I am sure bho LOVES this endorsement. The two of them will be one big twisted love fest. Just think how excited michelle "only now am I proud of my country" obama must be...

I remember during the

I remember during the debates, these two knuckleheads would make googoo eyes at each other and support each other's debate points. They were probably holding hands under the table.

I am wondering who and what groups are pushing for Edwards. On second thought, I don't think I wanna know.

I thought Edwards was never

I thought Edwards was never gonna' shut the heck up with his America bashing bull....you'd of thought he was announcing for Prez again... 

...as far as nobody wanting to come here...would somebody please tell the illegals that...it sure isn't going to be  any of the candidates we have running...they all welcome them with open arms and will guide them personally to any voting booth during elections.

ah...America...ain't it great...

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

bt,  it's probably

bt,

 it's probably because Edwards knows he'll never be up on a podium with anyone listening again - unless he can find himself a really cool gig - like that Al Gore did with Global Warming

BT

LOL

You are so funny. I was thinking the very same thing and I bet Obama was thinking it too.

You are really making me simile today.

Thanks

Delsa... You sure are

Delsa...

You sure are more that welcome..and I am so in a foul mood today after this polar bear announcement today, plus McCain and his leftist speeches for the last two weeks in town halls and such, like losing three now so-called safe seats for repubs and they still are not getting a clue...heck life is short, your thanks made me smile.

"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill

I don't see how this

I don't see how this qualifies as alleged liberal media bias?

Its a politicians opinion of how other countries see the U.S.... not something a media outlet reported. 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Of everything Edwards said

Of everything Edwards said in his endorsement speech, this is what lept out at me. Yet as I wrote in the item, I didn't hear it mentioned in MSNBC's post-speech analysis. I see that as bias.

OK

That reasoning works for me.  Of course I don't agree :-)   But, I appreciate you clarifying your point. Thank you. 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Had he worded it

Actually, one other question, Mr. Finkelstein.

If Mr. Edwards had worded it differently... such as "Some around the world see a bully..."  Would you have as much as a problem with it.

I disagree that "All the world see is a bully" to be correct.  But, can we agree that there are segments of the world (aside from Islamo-fanatics), productive, intelligent members of the world... who see us in a less than positive light? 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Of course it's true some see

Of course it's true some see us as a bully. But I'd still have a problem with Edwards because he was siding with the people who see us that way.

Follow up?

Mr. Finkelstein,

First off... I agree with you.  He either worded it badly or is just plain wrong... and in no way do I think the world as a whole views us as a bully.

That said, I don't think Mr. Edwards would be "siding with people who see us that way."

Instead, don't you think he'd be playing to the opinion of some in this country who want to see the U.S. image improved around the world?

I guess what I'm saying is, is there something wrong with admitting our image 'aint the best right now in some places (to which you've agreed)... and saying we need to try to fix it?

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

I believe he was siding with

I believe he was siding with those who see America as a bully. He read off his list like it was a criminal indictment. Listen to the boos from the crowd. Who were they booing? Thugs like Ahmadinejad or the Myanmar rulers? No. They were booing America, and that's just what Edwards wanted.

OK

I'm assuming (and I could be way off) that it was your preceived intention of his words that you didn't like, then... and not the acknowledgement of our image in some parts of the world, and the need to improve that image.  (again, I could be way off). 

Either way, thank for the responses, Mr. Finkelstein.

 "I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

curator

We do everything for the world. Does the world ever come to our aid? NO..Hell NO

So here is what I'd agree on.

I don't give a damn what the world or John Edwards thinks of "THE United States" aka US

Actually, the amount of aid

Actually, the amount of aid and support we received following 911 and Katrina was overwhelming.  We just don't require the help as much or as often.  We are - as you pointed out - usually the ones giving.

I respect your opinion of not caring what the rest of the world thinks about us.  I would just caution that as the world becomes ever smaller... other nations become more economically developed... that xenophobic type of thought may not be condusive to us as a nation.

In fact, I would argue the regard to which our nation had been viewed from WWII on helped greatly in our advancements as a super-power.  (granted, our actions inWWII and it's conclusion catapulted us towards that end as well.) 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

WHAT?

"The amount of aid and support we received following 911 and Katrina was overwhelming."??

 What aid?  From whom? To Whom, When, and Where was it delivered?

If the world wants to forget history or worse yet, not teach it or reflect it truthfully. I can't help that.

And if OUR school system continues to leave our kids uneducated when it comes to American History and World History we will have no need for Historical Curators. 

 

xenophobic

curator,

It does not follow that if you are indifferent towards someone else's opinion that you also fear or hate them.

Poor logic.

Free Stinker

I could not understand the "xenophobic" comment?

Never thought of myself as a Nationalist.

Proud American...Yep

Delsa

Xenophobes hate or fear those who are different.

Thus, we could correctly call Liberals xenophobes, seeing how much they hate and fear our different political views. ;-)

Pledge to not support RINOs ever again!

How about we don't call or

How about we don't call or label anyone anything so we can keep the discourse cordial? 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Oh I took

xenophobic as an adjective can = biased: nationalistic, nationalist, chauvinistic, gung-hoish, jingoistic, xenophobic

I appreciate your thoughts

You're right..

Poor word choice on my part.

I probably should have used "isolationism."  Even that wouldn't have been totally accurate... but, closer.

What I was trying to convey was my disagreement to the the previous posters opinion that we shouldn't care what others think.

Thanks for the check.

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Fair enough.

Fair enough.

What I was attempting to convey

was. America is a great country and we need to be proud of all we do.

If we worried about what others thought, we might not make the correct decisions.

No one should be paralized worring about what others will think.

We all make choices throughout our lives. A country is no different. If this country ever freezes worring over what the rest of the world might think we are collectively toast!

Just so you know I am attempting to be civil.

Thank you

And I can see that you are...

And I agree with everything you said.

And making decisions without worrying about others thoughts has been a hallmark of this administration.  While I don't agree with many of his decisions, I admire his conviction.

I guess I just think the more the world likes and respects you, the easier it is to be a world leader.

Just something to keep in mind when making and executing foreign police, I feel.

Which, I think is something Sen. Edwards was intimating towards.

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

"Just something to keep in

"Just something to keep in mind when making and executing foreign police, I feel."

First I heard of that.

That's just wrong!

;^)

Indiana Joe

I thing it was foreign policy

Just sayin

Thank you

Thank you, Delsa.

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Well-stated, Delsa,

...and a long way from either xenophobia or isolationism.

It's a xenophobic world, apparently

"that xenophobic type of thought may not be condusive to us as a nation"

Isn't this just what Edwards was saying about "most of the world" when he claimed that they consider us bullies (until the NEED us that is) and claimed that "this is not ok?" Doesn't this indicate that "most of the world" has xenophobic types of thought when it comes to America?

Doesn't that also indicate that Edwards AGREES with "most of the world" and thinks that America is the big bully on the block? It sure seems like it to me.

BTW, most of America doesn't have many"xenophobic" citizens and any claim that we do is just plain wrong. How can a country that spends BILLIONS of dollars every year in foreign aid, and even higher amounts in private donations to foreigners in need, be even remotely considered as xenophobic or a bully? That's a very poor assessment of this great country and it's citizens who are the most charitable people in history. Americans are willing to die so that others may be free.  You can't get any more charitable than that!

No, he doesnt

While not being able to speak for Mr. Edwards, I don't think he 'believes' American to be a bully.

I believe his quote was "the rest of the world sees a bully."

And he wants to correct that misperception.

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Implicit in his statement

Implicit in his statement is that "the rest of the world" is correct when they "see" a bully.  In other words, it's our responsibility to modify our behavior as an act to change their perception of us...it's not up to them to see the error of the perception.

Anyway, who gives a rat's a** what this ambulance-chasing shyster thinks?

 Anyway, who gives a rat's

 Anyway, who gives a rat's a** what this ambulance-chasing shyster thinks?

Sen. Obama.  And a lot of middle American whites who may vote for Obama as a result of Edwards' endorsement.  Which is a group Obama has had difficulty attracting.

 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

The middle Americans you

The middle Americans you speak of are a hell of a lot smarter than that.  The only people who buy this charlatan's racket anymore are the idiots in the jury pool and the sleazebags in the Plaintiff's Bar.

Some may disagree

I don't know.  Obama's polling numbers have been very bad among middle American whites... especially men.  That's an area where (the only area, actually) where Edwards was doing well while he was still campaigning.

Every analyst I've seen (conservative and liberal) say its a huge 'get' for Obama.  A change to reach out to a section of voters whom he's not been doing well.

I'm not saying it will work or not... but, that's the pervasive thought behind it all right now.  Druge was even speculating Edwards could be the VP nominee to - again - try to shore up the middle American whites.

(if we could lose the name-calling - i.e. "idoiots" "sleazebags", I'd appreciate it).

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Didn't Edwards get something

Didn't Edwards get something like 7% of the vote in WV without even being on the ballot? Edwards brings the support of the group that Obama has been losing a little of lately: blue-collar whites. 

With all due respect, I am

With all due respect, I am not about to moderate the expression of my intense (and correct) distaste for John Edwards and his riff-raff followers for your comfort.  And I won't take lectures on name-calling, either.  It's not as if I called you a "sleazebag" or an "idiot".  Besides, what if I did? 

Its not about me...

Its not about me, man.  Its about keeping debate and discourse on a level that keeps people engaged... as opposed to name-calling which discourages people from taking part in the talk.

And I know you're not calling me names.  But, when you throw them out there at all, its just disappointing.

And if you did, well its not like I'm going to run through the CPU screen or anything.  You can obviously do what you will.  I simply woulnd't engage you in discussion.  But, seriously... isn't that counter-productive?  Why not keep things respectful? 

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Look, I've got nothing

Look, I've got nothing against you.  I respect you.  I throw out the names in reference to John Edwards because I'm sick and tired of him being portrayed as an honorable man.  He is not.  He's a thief who made an absolute fortune conning pliable jurors into bankrupting medical practices (with the perverse consequence of making health care more expensive and less reliable) through slick presentations and phony charm.  It's a shameful indictment on our political system that he was able to parlay his little shakedown operation into a term in the Senate, two Presidential primary runs and a Vice Presidential general election run.  The fact that he subsequently used his wife's cancer recurrence as a sympathetic springboard to his second failed Presidential bid should tell you all you need to know about the man.  He is not worthy of respect, only contempt.  If benign name-calling is the worst he and his subordinates are subjected to, we should all be so lucky.   

"Anyway, who gives a rat's

"Anyway, who gives a rat's a** what this ambulance-chasing shyster thinks?"

His hairdresser? I mean stylist.

"Abstain from McCain"

Yeah, I suppose if I was

Yeah, I suppose if I was getting $400 a haircut I could be made to care.

Except when we need money.

Except when we need money. Aren't we in debt to a lot of foreigners?

So I hear...

Maybe we'd have more money if we stopped giving so much of it away.

"Sorry I don't have my mortgage payment this month, I used the money to open a soup kitchen."     

Hey, there's an idea. I wonder if we could go over the Foreign Aid records, and deduct past aid to our debtors as credit?

Works for me.   ;^)

Only in the Democrat party,

Only in the Democrat party, an "endorsement" by an all-time loser like John Edwards could hold such significance. Sadly, with the "maverick" at the top of the ticket, Republicans might not be able to grasp this opportunity and crush these morons in the fall. Pity.

Mark,

I don't know about you, but every time I hear some bleeding-heart MSM story lamenting the shortage of medical practitioners in many rural areas of this country, the very first name that pops into my head is always John Edwards.

Edwards sucks... But damn

Edwards sucks...

But damn he had good hair today!

"Abstain from McCain"

Your comments brings back

Your comments bring back the famous video clip of this sweet boy primping like a school girl in front of a mirror before he went on stage. ;+]. What a duffus.

So what

I hope a video surfaces of Bill Hemmer's interview with Brit Hume on today's Election HQ program. Hemmer asked Hume for his reaction. Unfortunately I didn't write it down or record it, but Hume's answer was on the order of "Who cares?" or "So what?" Whatever it was, it was a perfect response.

The question should be, what did Edwards want for his endorsement? VP? (He lost that race last time.) Supreme Court (shudder!)? Attorney General? Gag!

When you put the clowns in charge, don't be surprised when a circus breaks out.

How are Edwards' remarks

How are Edwards' remarks anti-American?  Anti-Bush administration, yes...but, not anti-American.  It is Edwards' opinion that the policies of the current President have created a wall concealing the true America--a great nation which is and should be a beacon of hope to the rest of the world.  But the wrong image is being projected--or stated differently, the right image is being obscured--because of bad policies. 

Edwards may be dead wrong in his assessment, or he may be overstating the magnitude of the "wall", but he is not guilty of anti-Americanism.

Jer

Jer-Jer-Jer... You are

Jer-Jer-Jer...

You are such a disapointment. 

"Abstain from McCain"

Sorry to disappoint, Clear...

Sorry to disappoint, Clear...Look, I'm not saying I agree with Edwards.  As a matter of fact, I don't.  But neither do I believe his words imply a lack of love for this country, or should be construed as anti-Americanism.

Jer

Haven't you learned that

Haven't you learned that anything perceived as being against Bush's policies overseas is inherently anti-American? 

Bal & Jer... See TM's

Bal & Jer...

See TM's post below.

 

"Abstain from McCain"

For Anyone

Clear or anyone who'd like to take it...

I understand your dislike of Sen. Edwards.  Don't dispute it, either.

But, my question is... is there something wrong with 1- admitting the US's reputation isn't the greatest right now.. and .... 2- saying we need to try to fix it?

I know some are saying Sen. Edwards 'hates America.'  But, it seems to me he just wants America to be even more respected than it is now.

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

Reputation according to

Reputation according to whom? Reputation according to the Palestinians, the Iranians, the Israelis, the Chinese, the North Koreans? If so, I understand your point, but we shouldn't have to ingratiate ourselves to our ideological counterparts.

our reputation is tons

our reputation is tons better than it used to be - I was around for the cold war, bud...

our global rep has never been better...

unless you actually believe the MSM propaganda...

travel abroad and get the untarnished versions yourself...

I have

I have travelled abroad.  I've been told by many people who were in charge not to let it be known we were American.

Its sad, but we've been told by MANY people (here and abroad) to say we were Canadians.

This is what we were told to practice both in safe cities and in other places where... I felt less than safe.

 

I would disagree that we are held in better regard now than during the Cold War.  I was around for it, too, by the way.

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

http://newsbusters.org/blogs

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/mark-finkelstein/2008/05/14/edwards-endorses-worldview-usa-bully#comment-612787

i travel abroad too - in parts of the UK you better not let it be known you are Muslim or Pakistani

in mainland Europe there are all sorts of ethnicities that need to keep their mouths shut

hell if you support a rival football team in the wrong neighborhood YOU WILL LITERALLY GET THE BLOOD AND PISS ABSOLUTELY BEAT OUT OF YOU

this is not an exclusively American phenomenon, it's a centuries-old human phenomenon 

To curator - One reason

Americans are told sometimes to keep a low profile is because we are easy marks.

We are easy targets for all kinds of reasons. Sometimes it is because kidnapings are common in some parts of the world.

As a flight attendant I traveled extensivly over seas and to South America. The world can be a very dangerous place but not because we are not liked - rather because we are easy targets.

Also known as suckers.

As someone who spends a

As someone who spends a great deal of time overseas, and has for the past 23 years, there is a difference between a nation that is regularly taken advantage of and one that is respected.

People, particularly Euro's LOVE us when we make them feel comfortable with their inadequacy.  (Example:  Oh, that is okay, do away with you last armor unit, we will cover for you in Afghanistan, etc) or we are sticking cash in their pockets (Don't worry OXFAM, we will send our nations entire stockage of MRE's to Rwanda...You can keep sending the politically connected administrator to lose most of them)

But who do they come to when it is time to deploy a pair of Nuclear carriers off a coast of some nation who is holding hostages.  Let me clue you, it usually is not flying the Tricolour of France.

You have been worried about being "Loved" not "Respected".

I will take respect any day.

Not Terrorists

Earlier Mr. Finkelstein even admitted there are areas in the world - not Islamo-fanatics -, education, productive members of the world, who don't have the best of opinions of the US right now.

I agree, we shouldn't ingratiate ourselves (good word, by the way)... but, and I said this in another post... I just think that the more the productive members of the world like and respect us the easier it is to be a world leader.

And, I hope we can all be in some agreement that there are parts of the globe where we want our image to be better.

That's all I was saying.

And, I think  thats what Mr. Edwards was intimates towards as well.

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

and there are all kinds of

and there are all kinds of people that dislike the French, the Brits, India, China, Isreal, Egypt - every single nation is unpopular in many ways - so what's the point of dwelling on this - so some people dislike us - it happens no matter what we do - NO MATTER WHAT WE DO BILLIONS WILL DISLIKE US...

Dislike is not necessarily a bad thing - dislike can spring up from all sorts of healthy situations - eating your vegetables, getting a crown from the dentist, a drill sargeant kicking a boot up your ass - which will save your ass on the battlefield...

This "Amerca is disliked" BS is nothing more than a distraction and complete waste of time - it's a misleading DNC cheap shot for petty partisan points for a political party that is bankrupt of ideas and desperate for relevancy 

But..

 there are all kinds of people that dislike the French, the Brits, India, China, Isreal, Egypt

But, if we hold ourselves to a higher regard than anyone else... shouldn't we expect to try and exemplify that everywhere else?

NO MATTER WHAT WE DO BILLIONS WILL DISLIKE US

Does that mean we should stop trying to change their minds?  And I'm not worried about all the billions.  But there are many out there I'd like back on our side.

This "Amerca is disliked" BS is nothing more than a distraction and complete waste of time

That's your opinion and that's fine.  But, you don't think there are areas of the world that don't like us that should?  And you don't think that harms us in anyway?

"I don't think our troops ought to be used for what's called nation-building."
-George W. Bush, October 11, 2000

live by proper morals and

live by proper morals and ideals and let the chips fall where they may...

I'm a Christian fundie, and being crucified daily is part of the deal - if people don't hate me alot I start to worry if I'm doing the right thing...

Trying to "be liked" by as many people as possible is not a healthy goal in my opinion...

That wasn't the goal of my Lord and Savior...

Living righteously is my goal - and in this sin-soaked world I will be hated by billions for it...

Am I in a twilight zone? I agree with everything TruthMonger

said in this thread and I'm kind of shocked that it's coming from him. Other countries have never liked us for being the biggest country that is powerful and successful

Mark had the best point that proves everything. People flock to come and live here more so than any other country. That is where the proof is. We will know that everyone likes us when we are poor and destitute and they give us lots of charity. We can be one America of lovable losers.

No thanks Obama and Edwards.

curator, I do not give a rat's left gonad what the rest of the

curator, I do not give a rat's left gonad what the rest of the world thinks about us.


Does that mean we should stop trying to change their minds?

If it means wussifying ourselves to win the rest of the world's approval, then yes.

Most of the criticism directed our way is fueled by envy, period.

Funny how these same people always come running to us when they get their asses in a bind.

Maybe next time they come knocking, perhaps we should just refuse to answer the door. 

 

  Having traveled to

 

Having traveled to numerous locations in Asia / Mid East, I have experienced some hostility. But after interacting with locals on an individual basis I feel they realize that we are not what their Government / Press represent. Unfortunately, it's nearly impossible to make direct contact with a country's entire population, so preconceived misconceptions will persist.

Americans are a kind and generous people, admit it.

 

American Dream – 10,000 politicians swimming to Europe with a lawyer under each arm. 

American Dream – 10,000


American Dream – 10,000 politicians swimming to Europe with a lawyer under each arm.

LOL-Eileen, would it not be better of said politicians were at least carrying one on their back as well?

I mean, that would be an additional 10,000 barristers being removed from not only our already over-crowded court rooms, but from the gene pool as well. :-)

Oh, and welcome to NewsBusters.

if that's the case he

if that's the case he should have said the Bush administration is perceived as a bully, right...?

Right you are

TruthMonger

You hit the nail right on the head.

Edwards said exactly what he said. Can't escape the fact that words mean things.

Edwards hates America, Obama hates America, and together they are a perfect couple.

Both are ready willing and able to screw America.

And don't forget, Delsa..

And don't forget, Delsa...as a white Democrat, Edwards [according to a poster earlier today] also hates children, his father, Jews, his family, the Bible, God, and the troops.

Jer

Are you attempting humor, Jer?

I did not read the earlier post. Therefore, your comment leaves searching for its jist?

 

Not really, Delsa...I guess

Not really, Delsa...I guess the constant drumbeat of "Democrats hate...hate...hate...HATE" is wearing a little thin.

Jer

Jer

I think the hate thing has to do with the fact that Democrats are always saying how much we, as Americans are not doing, and NEVER suggest or tout how much, we as Americans, DO. 

The hate thing is screamed from Rev. Wrights pulpit!

"God Damn America..God Damn America" and "Her chickens have come home to roost"  The "her" refers to AMERICA.

It is the pulpit Obama sat in front of for TWENTY years! Obama had no problem adoring a man who, for all those years, preached HATE.

And I should believe Obama does not hate?

Edwards who never heard of a GOOD company. When our companies feed and cure the world.

The hate reference has to do with the fact that democrats do not see anything good with America. At least that is what I glean whenever they speek.

When democrats denigrate the United States over and over again, what are we left with?

They hate this country.
 

Delsa...I was as appalled

Delsa...I was as appalled as anyone by Wright's "God damn America" rants, and I stated so here as soon as they were publicized.

But one could argue that the Reverends Falwell and Robertson also had their own "chickens coming home to roost" take on 9/11 which they attributed to God's vengance for various liberal transgressions.

I think where you and I differ is over what seems [to me, at least] to be a characterization of political dissent by Democrats as somehow tantamount to the denigration of America.  I disagreed with much of the criticism of Clinton's foreign policy by Republicans a decade ago, but I never considered that criticism to be un-American.

Jer

Jer

Clinton didn't have foreign policy, Clinton had fun!

He had the best welfare gig going.

He has lived off the taxpayers dime all his life and the White House was just the final step to the biggest government pay check ever.

His fun in the oval office was not un-American it was un-becoming of an Officer ie: Commander and Chief and un-becomming a gentleman.

Neither of which could be accused of being.

 Bill is a democrat and it was he that denigrated America not his foreign policy.

Okay, Delsa...I should have

Okay, Delsa...I should have known better than to mention Bill Clinton's name.

Jer

Well said Jer

By jove, now you've got it!

Maybe so, TM...but, I think

Maybe so, TM...but, I think his point is that the Bush administration has unfortunately caused America to be perceived as such. 

As I hinted above, I think Edwards has taken a thread of truth and woven it into a blanket accusation.

Jer

IMO it's the DNC along with the

IMO it's the DNC along with the partisan MSM that has successfully marketed that perception - not Bush's policies:)

how do you like that blanket accusation?

wove some truth in there for ya 

Not bad, TM...IMO it's a

Not bad, TM...IMO it's a combination of questionable policies and exploitation by DNC and MSM.

Jer

I'm fine with Edwards take

I'm fine with Edwards take actually - it harms the DNC more than it harms us

Bin Laden, Hezbollah, the PLO, Chavez, North Korea, Iran - they have some "questionable policies" too...

but the Dems never, EVER ask those questions...

They might want to try it out once in a while...

does anyone have a quote from Edwards complaining about terrorists at all...? 

I challenge him to focus on that FOR JUST ONE DAY...

bet he couldn't bring himself to do it... 

On the contrary, they've

On the contrary, they've tried it out quite often.  But maybe not enough to suit you.  I hope and expect all of those will be prominent issues in the coming months.

Jer

can you post any quotes -

can you post any quotes - would love to read em...

It takes a sissy

to know a bully! John Edwards is a waste of oxygen. Go back to chasing ambulances! NC learned a long time ago what the rest of the country knows now....you're a loser!

Jer, If there is one man

Jer,

If there is one man that can motivate me to vote for John McCain, it's not John McCain (obviously).  It's this greedy, ambulance-chasing sleazebag John Edwards.  As I see it, the Democratic Party is way too tight with the Labor Unions and (especially) the Trial Lawyers...and the two interest groups that I see as most responsible for the increasingly exhorbitant cost of doing business in this country are the Labor Unions and the Trial Lawyers (well 3 if you count the environmentalists).  After all, what's the point in spending all that time, money and idealism on learning to treat the sick if you have to spend your nights worrying that the John Edwards of the world are out to shake you down into bankruptcy?  For the life of me, I don't understand why John Edwards is held in such high regard.  For all the careers and lives that he and his ilk have ruined, you'd think that the media and the Democratic Party would avoid him like the ebola virus.  While this guy has been lining his pockets at the expense of medical practitioners, doctors have been forced to take unnecessary precautions to avoid frivolous litigation.  Medical care has gotten worse, not better, because of people like John Edwards.  I wish I could better explain the rational reasons for my distaste for this man, but my anger has gotten the better of me.   

fitz...my view of Edwards

fitz...my view of Edwards is not quite as harsh as yours, but I've never been particularly impressed with him.  Frankly, I consider the guy a lightweight. 

I'm no more enthusiastic about the upcoming election than most Republicans seem to be.  Three hundred million Americans and this is the best we can do?

I would never vote to reinstall the Clintons in the White House no matter where Hillary might position herself politically--which apparently has been to outflank Obama for the "center" [wherever the hell the center of the Democratic party is these days].

McCain is trying to be all things to all people, veering left and right, attempting to appeal to everyone, but risks alienating many--especially the Republican base--in the process.  However, I will note that my former concerns about his age and mental acuity have been somewhat alleviated in recent weeks.  If his intellectual sharpness remains anywhere close to that of his 94?-year-old mom, there should be no worries in that area.

I would like to think if Obama were elected, he would belie his voting record, and govern as a pragmatic, unifying centrist.  A role of the dice though.

Jer  

Jer, I think Obama will

Jer,

I think Obama will end up governing like a centrist...the natural instinct for 2nd term self-preservation will ensure that.  I certainly don't think he will skew any further left than Clinton or McCain would.  Despite his liberal voting record, I don't think he is seen as the hyper-partisan that Boxer, Schumer, Durbin, Kennedy, Reid or Pelosi are...even if it can be argued that each one (Boxer included) is more qualified to run for President than he is.  His tone, his personality and his composure make him an infinitely more acceptable candidate than Chuck Schumer would be.

I believe that Conservatives have good ideas; however, the Republican Party is unwilling (or, more likely, unable) to articulate them properly.  We have too many McCains, Gingriches, Schwarzeneggers, who, lacking the ability or application to advocate conservative policy with clarity, simply concede policy arguments to the left.  Like him or not, I believe John Bolton is the perfect example of someone who communicates Conservative policy clearly.  Dick Cheney took John Edwards to the woodshed in their 2004 debate.  Tom McClintock, a California State Senator who will hopefully win election to Congress in November, is the best person I've ever heard when it comes to discussion of fiscal policy (addressing specific line items where wasteful spending can be cut to help balance the budget).  With no little bluster, John McCain likes to portray himself as a "straight talker".  If anything, he's an intellectual lightweight who believes in compromise for the sake of compromise...and then uses the media to inflate his sense of moral superiority.  I have much more respect for someone who has a point of view (liberal or conservative) and comes armed with supporting evidence than I do for someone who governs by polls and "feelings".  But I suppose the best candidates for President have a difficulty in that they're largely unelectable...not a broad enough appeal.

I am not above voting for a Democrat...in the right circumstance.  Hell, I voted for Clinton and Dianne Feinstein in 1992 because they were running against RINO failures.  If McCain came up against a Harold Ford or a Bill Nelson instead of Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama (but I would sooner see Clinton, Obama or McCain in the White House before I saw Edwards there), I could see myself voting for the Democrat.  As it stands now, I may write in a candidate or skip the Presidential portion of the November ballot altogether...such is my level of irritation with McCain.

-fitz 

 

McCain is trying to be all

McCain is trying to be all things to all people, veering left and right, attempting to appeal to everyone

A thoughful and reasoned analysis.

But I'd be a tad harsher on McCain -- most conservatives are!! And from what I read of Republican insiders, the party is in full panic mode.

It now appears that the GOP is so far up sh+t creek, the methane has destroyed any semblance of brain activity.

And the guy with the paddle is McCain, he's supposed to be the "leader," but he's the perpetual "maverick," who's only interested in smacking conservatives around the head with said paddle

McCain is a man with no real roots. Mavericks don't have roots. They only have "attitudes."

He seems to be a man with no guiding political principles, except what pops into his head based on "his" notions of "honor."

You can't be both a "maverick" and lead the party you represent. It's an inherent contradiction because as a "contrarian" you are in an untenable situation.

And his constant harping and scratching on issues which don't resonate with the folks he needs to turn out HIS vote indicates that this is exactly what is happening.

McCain's selfish adherence to his "maverick" status wins out every time.

Vote 4 change. Vote 4 anything. See Jack & Mr Shy's first campaign ad for the ONLY viable 3rd party candidate.

Thanks Jack... Anyone in

Thanks Jack...

Anyone in the "Mother Country" available?  Blair would be ideal, but, heck, I'd take Maggie Thatcher at this point.  Maybe we could fast track a constitutional amendment making ex-British PMs eligible, but disqualifying once and for all anyone born in the Canal Zone.

How about a lend-lease deal?  We need help.

Jer

Hey Jer -- despite all I

Hey Jer -- despite all I said...

Still joining you guys and becoming an American. Okay --despite rumors to the contrary, compared to all others America is still the greatest country on Earth! No doubt.

If you're interesed in a conservative, check out Boris Johnson who was just elected Mayor of London and is an actual conservative a la Maggie.

He also happens to be a natural born US citizen (born NYC 1964), who, apparently, also harbors US Presidential ambitions... maybe a long shot but still funny that he was born in the US and McCain wasn't.

American Spectator/Boris Johnson

Vote 4 change. Vote 4 anything. See Jack & Mr Shy's first campaign ad for the ONLY viable 3rd party candidate.

Jack...I was unaware of

Jack...I was unaware of your intention to become an American citizen.  Congratulations.

I read the piece on Johnson.  Isn't there a period of residency requirement in addition to the natural born citizen qualification?  Does Johnson meet it?

Jer

Yep, 14 years residency.

Yep, 14 years residency. But how's "residency" defined? Does the constitution enumerate that?

But I'm assuming that can't mean unbroken living in the US? That means you couldn't trek the world for a couple of years as that would "break" your 14 years of residency?

Reading that article I got the impression he paid US taxes, and had a US residence.

To be honest it's a fanciful thought on his part. But fun to consider., which is why I mentioned it. I don't expect it to happen!

Vote 4 change. Vote 4 anything. See Jack & Mr Shy's first campaign ad for the ONLY viable 3rd party candidate.

Crossing Under

Maybe Edwards can perform his "channeling" service for Michelle, that is until Barry decides he does not want to punish her, again...

HEY BRECK BOY!

I have a quesiton for you...WHY THE FLYING F*** DO YOU HATE AMERICA?! NOBODY IN YOUR STATE EXCEPT THOSE IN THE SOCIALIST ENCLAVES CARE FOR YOU ANYMORE!!!!

 

I would try to offer some kind of rationale, but you commie fascist pigs do not believe in rationale!

 

You want to see a bully? Try me after an argument with one of your fellow commie fascists, Breck Boy!

Reason for current "world" opinion.

The New York Times and a dozen other leftist titans-of-communications around the world have been at constant war with the Bush administration (Bush's America) since 2000.  Its their ideological imperative.

Additionally, since leftists outright own 98% of the humanities departments in colleges and universities throughout the Western world, there is a constant flow of newly trained journalists, teachers and artists to join the chorus of the left in demonizing "Bush's America."

They now hope that feather-weights like John Edwards can harvest this fake crop of shame and use it to manipulate voters.

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