When the Larry Craig case broke, I noted the New York Times's unusual diffidence in reporting it. Senator, Arrested at Airport, Pleads Guilty was all the Times's cryptic headline told us, failing to indicate Craig's name, party affiliation, or the crime for which he had been not merely "arrested" but to which he had pleaded guilty.
At the time I surmised that the Times's bashfulness could have been "the triumph of political correctness on matters gay over the paper's partisan impulse." That theory is borne out by the paper's editorial of today, Disowning Senator Craig.
The Times's bottom line on the matter:
Being stupid as a member of Congress is hardly a reason to be ridden on a rail from Washington . . . The rush to cast him out betrays the party’s intolerance, which is on display for the public in all of its ugliness.
Curious aside: whoever wrote the editorial had gone metaphor mad. Check these out:
- The Republican Party is in quite a rush to keelhaul Senator Larry Craig [Keelhaul? Shiver me timbers!]
- No similar leadership chorus for judgment has been heard about any number of other scandalous revelations on the party’s plate. [Note: it may be desirable to avoid "chorus" allusions under the circumstances.]
- hardly a reason to be ridden on a rail from Washington. [Echo of the Old West for the Senator from Idaho?]
- Underlying the hurry to disown the senator [disownment: occupational hazard for wayward sons]
- the party’s record in demonizing homosexuality [get behind me, Satan!]
- The rush to cast him out [another Satan reference in the same paragraph. Is the Times going biblical on us?]
—Mark Finkelstein is a NewsBusters contributing editor and host of Right Angle. Contact him at mark@gunhill.net.





















Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Consuming Your Own
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 05:59 ET by allanfA rare moment from the Times. It's pro-gay stance triumphed over partisanship.
The Republicans will find it very difficult to ever be a majority party of they are willing to cast aside sitting representatives based on misdemeanor charges or mere accusations. United States Senate seats don't grow on trees.
The Democrats know all they have to do is sit back and smile. The Republicans will consume their own. It is one thing to cast aside members convicted of felonies. But accusations, innuendo, violations and misdemeanors? Would the House belong to the Democrats if Gingrich and Delay were still there. Principle without effectiveness is for the indolent and idle.
The seats don't grow on trees, BUT
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:07 ET by sarcasmo(And unlike with Vitter, who lucked out by dint of his state's Democrat governor -- this fact can't be stressed enough...) Idaho is a red state. Idaho's governor is guaranteed to appoint another Republican -- no-doubt the very Republican the state party wishes to take-over for Craig. This connected Idaho politician, should Craig resign, will then be able to start his campaign from the Senate seat he wants (a distinct advantage).
JMR
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Forgiveness
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:15 ET by allanfThe way for Craig to obtain total absolution in the press is to admit he is gay and annouce he is switching to the Democrat Party. He would be lionized in the press for his courage. Republicans would face a media frenzy accusing them of "gay bashing"
I think Idaho Republicans should back off. The best way to lose a Senate seat is to consume your own. Wait for primary time if you want him out.
Absolution...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:21 ET by Sergeant ROCK... would then be granted by sarcasmo for being outted. Then he could join the rank and file of 'normal' homosexuals.
Idiocy
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:22 ET by sarcasmoSee above.
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Whining
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:25 ET by Sergeant ROCK*See above!
Country hick gets the big city treatment.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 05:55 ET by upcountrywaterI know it's a crime to park in a handicap zone.
How much is the fine for pooping in a handicap toilet?
Assuming while pinching I don't step over the line.
CROCK
Entitlement over infrastructure every SINGLE time.
Cop makes a fool of, himself Larry Craig says he hallucinated
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:25 ET by SportPoliticsDon't miss the cop punk freaking out, and Larry Craig whipping the **** out of him.
http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/08/31/craig.arrest/index.html
Wait a second...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:31 ET by sarcasmoYou mean you STILL believe Sen. Tappinfoot after hearing him & hearing that officer?? Wow...Now I'm really impressed with the power of faith. :) But my question regarding the Idaho Statesman remains for you just as my Mobil-question remains for the lefties: "Where's My Check???"
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Wait as long as you like
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:57 ET by SportPoliticsYou mean you still know he's gay because your tinfoil gaydar is working as good as all the accusations against Karl Rove you believed, too.
My answer regarding the IS remains the same as well, they already OWN you, you are their slave, and the only two checks you'll ever see you'll put in the mail. First is the failed one for your closeted gay leader Ron Paul ( and he ACTS like a fag all the time), and the tax check to the feds as you grind your teeth on a doobyastubbie.
Hilarious...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:06 ET by sarcasmoUnintentionally, as is usual with this entity, but hilarious nonetheless. And for the record, I've never said or believed much of anything about Karl Rove, in this thread or elsewhere, so you're wrong about that, too. And I love how this turns into BS-accusations about Ron Paul when dimwits run out of coherent arguments -- it's happened before on this thread, and now it happened again with dimwit#2. That's why I respect you guys so-much -- the truth is SO important to you. ;)
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Yes and that's why I respect you so much...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 16:41 ET by SportPoliticsthe sarcasm is lost on you, in the fogging stank cloud of thc, and your leader passes your smell test completely.
Dear NYT...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:28 ET by sarcasmoIT'S NOT "STUPIDITY." This is a politically-incorrect (for both sides of the aisle now...) case of why "the closet" is dangerous. Considering my homie BJ-Bob and now Senator Tappinfoot's incident, I might start trying to rename "the closet" to something more-accurate, like "the men's room." Craig, it seems, unless you think that cop's a liar, has SOMETHING TO HIDE which (when combined with a high-level security clearance....) can be a very dangerous thing to US national security.
I mean, let's face it, I have almost-0 "gaydar," but even-I wasn't exactly shocked when Barney Frank finally got around to admitting he was/is gay. These closet-homos are different -- it always starts for me with about 2-3 seconds of shock at the incident because mensrooms happen to be disgusting. This is followed immediately by an assessment of humor-potential, which generally lasts 2-3 weeks. As I've said, Florida's BJ Bob incident still takes the gold for joke-material, but just barely.
The closet-homos simply behave differently than the "out" homosexuals I know. Out ones, frankly, act a lot more like heterosexual couples act as far as keeping it in the bedroom is concerned. IMO this closet vs non-closet security risk escapes the NYT in their reflexive bias, and they're not thinking this through due to that bias.
JMR
PS Mark, if you're avoiding something relatively-tame chorus allusions, you might also want to avoid using the words "get behind me" anywhere NEAR the Sen. Tappinfoot story, if you know what I mean! ;)
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Absurd
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:36 ET by Sergeant ROCKSo, you're saying that those that identify themselves as 'homosexuals' are less dangerous to national security than those that don't? That's absurd! Do you have any proof of this?
Sure
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:41 ET by sarcasmoIf I threaten (let's assume by now that proof can be easily obtained...) to reveal that Barney Frank's a homo, nobody cares. Conversely, if I threaten (with proof, once again) to reveal Sen. Tappinfoot likes sex with men he doesn't know in dirty places, Sen. Tappinfoot is likely to care enough that I might be able to influence his vote. Calling Barney Frank something like "Barney Fag" (not the brightest move ever by a guy named "Dick Armey" fer heavensakes!) has no similar dangerous potential effect on national security.
JMR
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I agree with sarcasmo....the
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:44 ET by motherbeltI agree with sarcasmo....the old "security risk" homosexual thing died with the Cold War. If someone is openly homosexual, their value as a blackmail target is nil. It's only when someone doesn't want it known that they are homosexual that they become a risk.
Only partially correct
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:51 ET by Sergeant ROCKIn either case, homosexuals are promiscuous and that is what makes them a possible target just as much.
You have 0 proof that homosexuals
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:03 ET by sarcasmoAt least, the "out" ones, behave more promisciously, do you?? The closet ones are obviously more dangerous due to something to hide, but my point is and has-been about the "out" ones. They're all-too-normal, it seems.
Even a "halfway-out until the left outed him" homosexual like Ken Mehlman, for example, was apparently trusted for years with some of the Republican Party's highest-level info. He didn't betray our party or behave promiscuously AFAIK, and despite Republican Congress spending which evoked drunken sailors using stolen credit cards, the eventual electoral disaster was relatively-minimal, and IMO it was not Mr. Mehlman's fault.
JMR
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Ron Paul Gay?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:11 ET by Sergeant ROCKWeird, the restroom antics demonstrated have been attributed to homosexuals seeking sex from other homosexuals. If that is not promiscuous, I don't know what is? So, you're making the claim that 'outed' homosexuals are less inlcined to be promiscuous? Or, is it that ALL of those that frequent restrooms, bath houses, etc. looking for gay sex are still in the closet?
funny, in that usual, unintentional way...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:18 ET by sarcasmoI'm claiming exactly what I said above already. The promiscuous ones appear to be bisexuals with a heterosexual relationship and kids in both cases we have seen this year. In both cases, they don't want to admit they're bisexuals/gay/whatever you want to call it. I stand by all my words.
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Unfounded Claims
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:25 ET by Sergeant ROCKRight, you're saying that being an 'outed' homosexual makes you far less inclined to engage in promiscuous behavior than heterosexuals. And that behavior such as frequenting restrooms for gay sex is behavior attributed only to those that haven't come out of the closet.
Wrong.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:34 ET by sarcasmo1. I never said that. See above for my words, instead.
2. Yes, the closet ones appear to be attracted to anonymous sex in mensrooms with other men, even though they're married to women. That's life.
JMR
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Nope, you're wrong
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:42 ET by Sergeant ROCK1. That's the implication - you read it again.
2. 'Appear' doesn't make it a fact. As though, being a 'closet-homo' makes you less gay??
Quit belching gay-rights propaganda, apologist.
Nope.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:49 ET by sarcasmo1. Your hallucination is NOT what I said, people can read for themselves.
2. I never said "appear" made anything a fact, or that closet-homos are less gay/bi or more gay/bi -- they're just more likely to be that way in mensrooms than the "out" variety in my experience reading the news this year.
3. I'm an apologist for nobody, I stand by all my words, as usual.
Situation: normal. I'll say what I want, when I want, and how I want, no matter what you want.
JMR
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Sarcasmophile
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:00 ET by Sergeant ROCK..reading the news this year.
And People Magazine too, I would imagine. You arrive at your premise using pro-gay media sources?
Again you make the claim that 'closet-homos' are more inclined to engage in promiscuous behavior than 'outted' homos as though there's a big difference between the two.
Situation normal - another apologist exposed.
Nope
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:21 ET by sarcasmoYou're not gonna find Barney Frank in a mensroom asking an undercover cop for sex. He's out. The ones who do that aren't out, hence the difference I've shown. It has nothing to do with media sources and everything to do with the facts, and sources like that tape with the bisexual Senator & the vice-cop.
JMR
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Sarcasmophile
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:23 ET by Sergeant ROCKOf course not, he has a tenant that runs a gay prostitution ring from his apartment. Why go out for milk when you have a cow at home?
And THAT, not being homosexual...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:30 ET by sarcasmoShould have been the end of his political career, IMO. I don't vote in Taxachusetts, though, and the "out" homosexuals I know seem to save it for the bedroom. I like people who act that way, heterosexual OR homosexual. With Craig & BJ-Bob, I have 2 examples of closet bixsexuals/homosexuals who are also politicians. If you were correct, then we might occasionally find 'out' homosexuals gettin' in the same kind of trouble, but so far, not. The good news is the humor-news.
JMR
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Incorrect Assumptions
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:38 ET by Sergeant ROCKIn case you haven't noticed, this website is about media bias. You wrongly assume that an 'outted' homo (adored by said media) would be exposed to the same scrutinty as a 'closet', or more importantly - Republican. Not so.
Provide proof otherwise, then.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:40 ET by sarcasmoYou've so far given me 0 proof for ANY of your allegations. By contrast, I have supplied the real-life proofs of both BJ-Bob and Sen. Tappinfoot. I rest my case.
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Self-Adulator
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:45 ET by Sergeant ROCKYour example of two is akin to a poll of 936 people representing the opinion of 100% of the people. A flawed premise. You have also failed to show where being 'closeted' homo makes you less gay than an 'outted' homo. Gay is gay. And you have no case to rest.
Nice try though.
BS.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:50 ET by sarcasmoFind me a counterexample of one, then, if my premise is so-flawed. And I've never said anything about the closet making homosexuals either more-gay or less-gay than being "out," so that's yet-another hallucination on your part...Read my words. My case is rested.
JMR
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Self-Adulator
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:53 ET by Sergeant ROCKYour example of two is akin to a poll of 936 people representing the opinion of 100% of the people.
Case dismissed.
Nope.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:58 ET by sarcasmoYou've still failed to come up with one example. Not one. I've supplied 2 politician-examples from a 30 day period this year alone. IOW Case won.
JMR
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Sarcasmophile
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:02 ET by Sergeant ROCKNope. Like I said, two doesn't make your case. You can try all you want with the dodge and parry, but the fact remains you have no case. Quit belching your homosexual propaganda. It doesn't hold water.
Continued failure
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:05 ET by sarcasmoTo come up with one example in the face of my 2 doesn't mean victory, it means defeat.
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Ron Paul Caught In Mensroom
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:23 ET by Sergeant ROCKWhat I took issue with your assertion that 'outted' homos are less dangerous than 'closeted' homos. You have no such proof that this true.
Then, you made the claim that all the bad behavior associated with the gay culture is the fault, not of gays, but rather the fault of bi-sexuals and heterosexuals. Again, 'appears' doesn't make it a fact.
And you make the false claim again implying that 'closeted' homos 'appear to be attracted to anonymous sex in mensrooms' right after denying that you said such such a thing in the previous posts. The obvious implication by you is that most, if not all, of those that frequent mensrooms are 'closeted' homos and that somehow doesn't count as a negative against the gay culture. Because, they're simply 'bi-sexual or heterosexual' and therefore not gay enough.
Your semantics aside, presenting two politicians that were 'outted' doesn't make the case for anything that you've said. My dispute wasn't that there weren't any to be found, but rather your apologist rhetoric concerning the issues I raised.
you're full of it.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:28 ET by sarcasmo1. You have no proof it's false. I have 2 examples, you still have 0.
2. Bad behavior is the responsibility of individuals who do it, not groups as you imply. I've never said anything else despite your hallucinations.
3. I have apologies for nobody & nothing in this debate. I stand by all my words.
JMR
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Self-Adulator
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:33 ET by Sergeant ROCKTwo examples of what? That two politicians got outted? What the hell does that prove? A cursory scanning of what you've posted proves me correct. You're playing semantics here and trying to divert attention away from the simple fact that you made assumptions that simply cannot be proven. Your apologist rhetoric nets ZERO effect.
Discussion over
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 13:12 ET by Matthew SheffieldI don't like where this is heading.
Did you ever think you
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:42 ET by motherbeltDid you ever think you would see the day that the NYT ecitorial board would be arguing against throwing out a Republican senator????
This is hilarious. They are really stuck between a rock and a hard place. How to disparage a Republican Senator without alienating gays. As long as there's a chance Craig might come out and say that he's "gay", they have to hedge their bets. The undercover cop wasn't pretending to be underage, so they can't spin this as a pedophilia, rather than a homosexual issue.
So, the gay agenda wins, for the moment at least.
Duh !! The only reason
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:42 ET by midnight cowboyDuh !! The only reason the NYT is defending Craig is that they don't want him to step down so he can be a punching bag for the dems for the next year. If he's gone, it won't be effcetive to beat a dead horse.
midnight, I happen to think
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:53 ET by motherbeltmidnight, I happen to think the Times is standing up for Craig because of the gay issue.
With your DUH! are you implying that I am (or anyone else who disagrees with you is) too stupid to see the "real" reason: i.e. the one that YOU espouse?
That smacks suspiciously of a liberal argument: if you don't agree with me, it's because you're too dumb to see the "truth".
I get a little touchy about stuff like that.
Motherbelt, no doubt the
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:28 ET by midnight cowboyMotherbelt, no doubt the Times is standing up for the gay issue. The whole DUH part was that to me it seems pretty obvious why the Times is doing what it is doing not to devalue other points of view. In my opinion the gay demographic is not going to abandon the Times even if they came out against Craig. I don't recall but what was the Times opinion on Foley? My take is they can get alot more mileage out of Craig if he doesn't step down and use him as a whippimg boy like WaPo did with Allen and the whole "macaca" incident. I have doubts that if Craigg wasn't up for re-election next year the Times may have sung a different tune. A year's worth of badgering might either flip the seat or get a RINO in office.
Craig "arrest"
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:46 ET by dalecarusoIncredibly, when you think of it ... Was Craig arrested for coming up to an undercover male police officer and saying something along the lines of: "Hey, you have GREAT buns ... what to have sex?" No. Sgt. Dave Karsnia says that "... he recognized Craig's hand gesture as a signal aimed at initiating sex."
Later in his report, Karsnia wrote that the gestures were consistent with efforts to find a sexual partner in the men's room.
Later in the story, we lear that Sgt. Karsnia has "arrested at least a dozen men in the airport's bathroom for sending signals he believed were aimed at initiating sex. Each time, Karsnia walked suspects to a spot where they could speak privately, without embarrassing them.." Can we infer from that, as Karsnia did from gestures only, that he is just lurking around men's rooms?
Did they use to call this "entrapment" .. Which apparently is the excepted norm of police procedure.
So was the NYT correct in saying that Craig was guilty of stupidity .. I would say - yes -- Stupid for pleading guilty to the reduced charge of disorderly conduct.
I also found it interesting, a comment that Karsnia made on the tape.. "Embarrassing, embarrassing. No wonder why we're going down the tubes." Political motivation??? Gee, if so, couldn't "profiling" be argued?
Just so no one can get the wrong idea ... this entire comment was written with my hands in my pockets ... didn't want to give the wrong message. Good God, wait a minute ..... many of you might not be old enough to remember this expression ... If my hands are in my pocket, that might be consistent with "playing pocket pool."
He was detained for 45 minutes, and fingerprinted.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:41 ET by sarcasmoBut do you really believe the officer had/has a political motivation?? Fascinating. And how to explain this one staying out of the news media for longer than Florida's own BJ-Bob incident, despite the fact that it happened a month earlier to a higher-profile politician?
JMR
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I don't know about
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:31 ET by TheDeuceI don't know about politically motivated, but a cop looking to make arrests and has a gig trolling restrooms for gay sex. I'm thinking he better be gay or get a high conviction rate cause I'd guess this guy is the butt of numerours squadroom jokes.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Lord , please forgive me and bless the pygmies in Guana.
Why is it that lefties believe that 'the people' noted in the 2nd are different than the 'the people' mentioned elsewhere in the Bill of Rights?
The Times has slaughtered you
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:50 ET by SportPoliticsand you don't even seem to know it.
How pathetic.
Furthermore the majority of republicans have declared the Senator GAY - against his own word, and AGAINST the guilty plea, and against the police interview- where he also denies it.
So the truth may in fact be, you crazed lunatic republicans have let your gay hatred kick a straight republican out of your way, who was entrapped as he said in the police interview, that certainly most of you have no clue has been released.
The Times has slammed you into the wall and broken your skulls, and you've helped them by accellerating the crashing fracture, and you haven't a clue you've done it.
You people are PATHETIC.
Guilty or Not Guilty?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:55 ET by Sergeant ROCKSo, what's your verdict? And what should be the outcome?
Sgt Rock
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:37 ET by SportPoliticsIt was entrapment just as the Senator said on interrogation tape. He had to correct the punk cop, who shrieked he wasn't stupid, that he was being disrespected, and that he knew what he was doing. The cop is a skumbag.
When the Senator said right away to the cop, you propositioned me, the punk skumbag lying piglet said "we aren't going to get into that". Of course the Senator, being respectful (nearly)the entire time agreed. He was also careful to try not to call piggy boy a liar, until of course he had to tell him he saw something that didn't happen. Punk boy whined, and Senator again told idiot piglet he didn't do that, doesn't do any of this, and sadly didn't tell him to **** ***.
Then piglet, reaching for the empty sack between his own legs, smarted off by asking "have you been successful in bathrooms here before".
I see, so piglet boy was caught lying, but somehow after the Senator told him he wasn't gay, has never done that, and absolutely did not do what piglet tried to say he did, and caught piglet describing the wrong hand, it's ok for piglet to call him gay (and a liar) by asking if he was successful there before.
I don't believe the cop at all. He's a skumbag punk liar, and demands more respect than he is willing to give, just like a democrat, just like all the lib liars I've ever met.
The Senator is NOT of that note.
It reminds me of the insane child molestation cases I've heard of from the late 80's. What we have here is a psychotic spree of "lookers" and "lurches", just hoping to find another set of rich white guys raping a black hooker, but in this case it's closet searching psychos, with the preachy type conservative now the STEREOTYPE none of the "he's gay no matter what" crowd can't shake.
Law:
Now you sit down to take a crap after waiting for an open stall (piglet said both sides of him were occupied ), you hold yer trousers off the floor with your knees, you tap a shoe on the tile, and pick up a piece of toilet paper, yer a roving faggot trying to hook-up with secret signals.
WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP.
That's the verdict.
The outcome should be a lesson for whomever deserves it. We shall see.
300 interviews at that Idaho Statesman, and they couldn't find the goods. Their star witness is a hidden ex repub turned democrat on the hunt. His story is really, really BAD, and very,very questionable.
The goods aren't in the bust either, and piglet tells him he doesn't call the press, and pay the fine and it's all over. The cop report states the senators record is clear. So he's never been arrested, he figures he never will be again, it's a fluke. Just pay it and forget it.
He also said he travels to that airport ALMOST WEEKLY.
I'm certain the Idaho Statesman knows that, and any democrat of any note who wanted to find out would know as well.
Pretty amazing coincidence, especially when nothing happened, except the only thing needed to make all the years of partisan smear attempts actually have some stick to them.
Who has the gay underground signaling link from prior to this incident ? Anyone ? I know, piglet does, he's experienced.
Good points
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:45 ET by Sergeant ROCKBut, don't you think that pleading guilty to a lesser charge was a bad move?
Well maybe it was - maybe it wasn't
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:49 ET by SportPoliticsDon't you think if he fought it, it would have been in the news anyway, and the same amount of people would have called him a gay cruiser, and he's probably smart enough to know that.
He's OJ buddy, and he ain't black.
Assuming he gets away with it...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:50 ET by sarcasmoOJ might be a pretty good analogy! Thanks! :)
JMR
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Bad Move
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:52 ET by Sergeant ROCKI think it was a bad move. I don't think that he was wise to do so, especially when the case against him is pretty weak. You can bet that in either case, it would've been in the news. Pleading guilty just makes it worst.
Not if...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:55 ET by sarcasmoYou're desperately-hoping it'll go-away, because you're aware the newspaper back home is already investingating the same allegations from others...
JMR
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Negative Ghost Rider
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:02 ET by Sergeant ROCKWhen has it simply 'gone away' when the target is a Republican? That only works for liberal democRATS.
By definition...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:18 ET by sarcasmoIf it "went away," we would not know about it. Look, as I've said, Idaho voters had every right to think they'd elected C. Montgomery Burns. One morning, to much potential-humor, they woke up and discovered they'd instead elected Waylon Smithers!
JMR
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Well, what's worse ?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:06 ET by SportPoliticsThere aren't many who care about the facts, they know the truth no matter what the facts are.
All the murders and torturing in USA war prisons add up no matter what too.No facts or evidence or trial outcomes will EVER change that perception. Wasn't the link here for acquittals here just yesterday ? LOL - Yes indeed it was. It matters how much ? rofl
It's clear by the news coverage I've seen that he was attempting anal rape in the airport restroom, and has been ****-****** on the side secretly for a very, very long time.
We don't need ANY evidence. Secret unknown rendevous and disputed secret signals are good enough, because by the time anyone hears of them there are multiple stretched prostrate glands and a most evil terror on the unsuspecting family in definitive certainty.
America, the insane station of Nancy Grace's, everywhere.
Sports, I just can't seem
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:09 ET by LeonSports,
I just can't seem to understand your bitterness over this matter.
Craig pled guilty. End of story.
He could have easily pled not guilty and fought the charges. It was essentially his word vs. the cop's word, he had a fighting chance of getting the charges dropped.
However, he pled guilty. Which to me, indicates that he believed that he was doing something wrong.
You're right that we don't need any evidence. He already pled guilty.
Not-Guilty
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:11 ET by Sergeant ROCKHe was in an admittedly, no-win situation. However, pleading guilty to a lesser charge and then having that press conference saying he wasn't gay, etc. only compounded his woes.
But I would tend to agree with you, a little bit, on your assertion that he was quickly denounced by the GOP with such a weak case against him. However, I would argue that had he not entered that guilty plea it wouldn't have been as great.
Rock, It's also very
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:13 ET by LeonRock,
It's also very important to keep one thing in mind. He had plenty of time to strategize.
Original incident: June 11
Guilty Plea: August 8
What was he doing during those two months? Why wasn't he preparing to fight? Why didn't he get a lawyer?
If he had signed the plea agreement on June 11, his excuses about no counsel and being confused might be valid, sadly, he signed it on August 8.
People (i.e. Sports) seem to be conviently ignoring this fact.
Who knows?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:18 ET by Sergeant ROCKWhich is why that there's a presumption of guilt by many. So far, it would seem that he's done everything he can do to prove himself guilty of something. But, then again, could it be that he just got bad advice from his advisors?
Perhaps Rock, But that is
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:22 ET by LeonPerhaps Rock,
But that is some terrible advice.
Would you ever plead guilty to anything that you didn't do no matter how small or insignificant?
I sure as heck wouldn't.
The only reasonable conclusion that I can reach is that he was actually guilty and he was hoping if he pled guilty it might just be forgotten. AND he was almost right if it hadn't been for rollcall.
You all agree with Leon 100%, note that
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:20 ET by SportPolitics" The only reasonable conclusion that I can reach is that he was actually guilty and he was hoping if he pled guilty it might just be forgotten. AND he was almost right ..."
______________________________________
So of course, it was almost forgotten wether he's actually gay or not, and wether he actually did anythnig wrong or not. So you admit his gamble to make it go away almost worked. I see he is smarter than you, and you cannot make sense out of your own kookball lines up there, because THEY DON'T GO TOGETHER.
You have to believe he is GAY - and GUILTY no matter what his plea was or wasn't.
Therefore, if you can claim he is gay no matter what, and has done something wrong no matter what, then you can admit to yourself and others "that keeping it a secret almost worked".
The prior two conditions you place on that admission are not conditions he neccessarily had to deal with, no matter what you believe.
1. He may not be gay
2. He may have done nothing wrong
_________________________________
A politician calculates, and one can easily see his gambit of buried forever is INFINTELY better as a gamble than the current situation, and is way more likely to have been better than a fight in court which would have been 24/7 coverage for who knows how long, with days of dissing the outcome no matter what, and declaring him queerbait #1 no matter the outcome of the trial.
So, his gambit ALMOST worked as you admitted, and indeed it was his only likely chance to avoid what is happening now.
It's nice that the republicans totally agree with the democrats this time though. Really, really nice. Not for the same reasons, but it's really nice to see them settle together on the outcome.
mutual verdict: He a gay cruiser lying sack of hypocritic lechery, and he needs to go right now!
I think it's amazing (if any republican could bring themselves to listen) to the police interview and read the police report, and still has the same ideation.
It certainly makes me think a lot of republicans are very,very stupid.
Who was the Reagan
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:34 ET by TheDeuceWho was the Reagan offciail, once cleared of all indictments, who asked something to the affect of, 'Where do I go to get my credibility back?'
Why is it that lefties believe that 'the people' noted in the 2nd are different than the 'the people' mentioned elsewhere in the Bill of Rights?
Hey SP
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:04 ET by NoMoreClintonsYour syntax is pathetic, not to mention your goofy train of thought - if that's what you want to call it.
NoMoreClintons
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:09 ET by SportPoliticsYes, and you know he's gay, because your tinfoil hat gaydar is blinking red, throbbing for you, and you like it.
Folks, let's look at the lighter side of this...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 06:55 ET by sarcasmoThese incidents, when combined with YouTube, are instant comedy-gold!!!
JMR
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What poppycock!
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:01 ET by c5then(sorry for the pun).
Does the NYT miss or is it just closing it's eyes to the fact that the real issue is that the Senator lied to police and and then lied to prosecuters by pleading guilty to something he didn't do, or..., is lying now aboput whether he did it. IMO, this has nothing to do with whether he's gay, straight, or whatever, it has to do about trust in an elected official.
The day that "politician" became a career choice is the day we started losing the Republic
Try the innocent line once c5then
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:33 ET by SportPoliticsIf you'd listen to the interview, and ASSUME he didn't lie, then all you have is his words after the fact to whine about, whre he claims he made a bad decision.
I don't believe he did make a bad decision. I believe a lot of others are making very bad decisions, including that police and the police force, the media, and most of the republicans, and the demcorats are filled with glee.
When our system is so screwed up that a person has to make a gambit between guilty and guilty when they obviously by the FACTS are not, how is it their decision is incorrect ?
I'd really like a clear minded individual to answer that.
So far Larry Craig has kept his word. He told the officer he wasn't gonig to fight him. He didn't.
He also gave his statement, where he denied the charges completely, and it is now public.
He KEPT HIS WORD.
The complaint all the dullards have is an admission to a court or in a courtroom they feel is more important than what has happened now that the ogling public and press are having their field day fun with him.
I submit to you, he took the correct decision, the only one he could make, the only chance he had. Tom Delay swore none of it was true and he was forced out. Libby was massacred. Trent Lott was squashed for words.
I don't quite understand how ANY OF YOU - especially given all your reactions to the "humping in the restroom" scenario you ALL have declared occurred, could expect anyone else in the entire world to imagine they wouldn't know it was coming.
If this man was acquitted in court, evey single one of you would still believe he was queer bait. EVERY ONE OF YOU that believe it now.
If I was he I'd tell you all to FO.
TappinFoot Has A History
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:12 ET by NoMoreClintonsLet's not forget that Sen. TappinFoot has a history of cruising for gay sex in men's rooms as compiled by various sources, one of them his hometown newspaper. His somewhat tortured and lame explanation as heard on the audio recording doesn't exactly inspire one to assume he is innocent. He obviously appears to be attemting to explain his way out of a bad situation. I think it's called "doing the backstroke". Where is the indignation that an innocent person would be expressing? Who among us would venture to reach down to the floor for a piece of toilet paper in a public restroom? What was he going to do with it? Yuck.
Obvious Solution
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:15 ET by Sergeant ROCKWould be for Craig to switch parties.
Perfect, Sarge!
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:22 ET by RJLOL!
I don't know about that airport-mensroom
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:24 ET by sarcasmo(Which, BTW, is said to be very out of the way for air-commuters, which might be part of its attraction for closet-homos come to think of it!) but I've been in the Union Station mensroom. Yech! I'd think twice about picking up a $1 bill off that floor, much less a piece of (what might be used!) asswipe!
JMR
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There he goes again!
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:29 ET by Sergeant ROCK...which might be part of its attraction for closet-homos come to think of it!
lol.. so, again you demonstrate your ignorance of the facts. Only 'closet-homos' engage in promiscuous behavior?? Why do you have such disdain for 'closet-homos' anyway?
Yes, only the closet ones
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:33 ET by sarcasmoSeem to frequent mensrooms. The ones I know personally are "out," and they have disdain, like me, for those who frequent mens rooms. If you don't mind sex in mensrooms, so be it.
JMR
Rally online with fans of Dr. Ron Paul.
Homophiles
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:38 ET by Sergeant ROCKThat's the most assinine comment yet. You have zero proof that this is fact. You can blame 'closet-homos' for everything that makes homosexuality look bad all you want, but the simple fact of the matter is A) Your assertion is false and B) They are still GAY!
Frequenting restrooms is only ONE of the promiscuous behaviors found in the gay culture - outted or not.
More unintentional humor...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:45 ET by sarcasmoI stand by all my words.
JMR
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Sarcasmophile
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:48 ET by Sergeant ROCKWell, of course you do. You have the right to be delusional or just plain wrong.
Here You Go Sarc
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:17 ET by stratmanGeorge Michael
Pop Star busted TWICE for gay public bathroom sex.
Michael was already "outed" and had gay lover/boyfriend/fiance waiting at home for prison sex whenever he wanted.
Having sex in a bathroom is a sexual predilection, a kink, and not a sine qua non of "closeted" homosexuals. Having sex in a bathroom can also be a result of its ease of obtainment and the anonymity involved. Most every male I know has entertained the idea of easy, quick, no strings attached sex, regardless of sexual orientation, and a good number have achieved that goal - the classic one night stand. Males being the more consistently aggressive seekers of sex are also more willing to have sex in less than discreet places to satisfy their urges.
Hooking up in bathrooms is hardly new, gay or straight. What one gay will do another may not. It's all about the predilections of the individual, not whether they are closeted or not.
It is no surprise that there also is a pecking order in the gay culture/community. Anonymous bathroom sex is frowned upon by your friends. Pre-HIV days, the bath houses were a popular meeting place for gays, outed or not, to have public sex, even with anonymous individuals. I wonder if a part of your friends' disgust is based on health principles rather than solely on "proper" interpersonal behaviour? I'll bet they have done things publically or at risk of discovery to themselves in the past. Most people have done something in retrospect they consider risky or foolish and chalked it up to being young and stupid.
Gay public bathroom sex is not the domain of just closeted homosexuals. It's time to drop the false premise.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
Good example, but...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:25 ET by sarcasmoNot a politician, and (to me, anyway) George always seemed sorta gay-but-closeted -- but maybe that's polluted by my opinion of the music! :) Anyway, the closet does, for whatever reason, seem to be more of a mensroom just like I said, and please note George didn't deny his sexuality once-busted. I continue to think it's hilarious, but it's going to remain a problem for the Republican party until he resigns.
JMR
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Remember When Gay Meant Happy?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 13:02 ET by stratmanNot a fan of his music either, regardless of his sexual orientation.
I found another recent gay public bathroom sex arrest that is distinguished by its participants amoungst other things.
Gay public bathroom sex has been a problem in at least half a dozen different airports in the country. Atlanta police have arrested 45 individuals so far this year, twice as many as for baggage theft (not surprising given their track record with baggage theft). Police believe that individuals learn of these location from the internet. A couple of college professors and a CEO of a bank were caught. No mention on whether they were on the down-low, but, the police official said:
That statement would tend to support your closeted homosexual preponderance theory though not as the sole domain of closeted individuals.
In another article about the Altlanta busts, the chairman of MARTA transit in Atlanta was arrested for gay public bathroom sex while engaging in a birthday BJ with a guy he met on Craig's List. It is not known if he claimed as his defense he was only blowing out the candle on his birthday cupcake. I'll bet he wished he had just graciously accepted the crappy tie or coffee mug gift and left it at that.
Then there was the case of Tucker Carlson being approached for gay public bathroom sex. Carlson claimed he got a friend to return and assault the perpetrator.
Here is a story of catching a killer in a gay public bathroom sex sting. A "happy" ending for society but not for Mr. Psycho.
And where are the customary comparisons to Florida state Rep. Robert "Bob" Allen, R-Merritt Island, who was arrested for soliciting an undercover male officer for sex in a men's restroom at Veteran's Memorial Park? Leon needs to do their homework better. I understand why blaster didn't - he's an idiot to begin with who couldn't tell his ass from his elbow without a Media Matters Talking Points instruction card.
There are more examples but I just don't care to research it anymore.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
I agree, that music was awful.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 13:15 ET by sarcasmoAnd to be specific, my "maybe we should call 'the closet' something like 'the mensroom' instead" theory (which only seems true given this year's headlines, I have no way of proving it!) would be that this sexual behavior is just more-common among the closetted, not that it's solely their domain. His district is Republican-enough that it's likely BJ Bob would be re-elected if he could survive a primary, but that seems unlikely at this point...
JMR
Rally online with fans of Dr. Ron Paul.
Funny you mention that. A
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 14:10 ET by stratmanFunny you mention that.
A toilet or the bathroom itself have been called "Water Closet" and "Wash Closet"!
Maybe whomever settled on those names knew more that we might have suspected.
Craig could be re-elected if he pulls the proverbial rabbit out of his... hat. It would have to be a pretty big rabbit. Stranger things have occurred.
I think the path of least resistance for the Party would be to find a less controversial candidate. How difficult could that be?
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
Semantics
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:32 ET by Sergeant ROCKGay public bathroom sex is not the domain of just closeted homosexuals. It's time to drop the false premise.
He's under some sort of delusion that there's a difference between the two. Gay sex is gay sex, no matter if you're in the closet or not.
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Examples
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 12:34 ET by Sergeant ROCKWhen Democrats engage in sex scandals or clear-cut corruption, they retain their seats as long as they keep the cash flowing – just ask Gerry Studds (re-elected six times after having sex with a male congressional page), Barney Frank (re-elected eight times after his gay lover ran a male escort ring out of his apartment), Mel Reynolds (re-elected despite facing an indictment for sexual assault and criminal sexual abuse of a 16-year-old campaign worker), Sen. Charles Robb (re-elected despite credible sex scandal allegations) and Gus Savage (re-elected despite fondling a Peace Corps volunteer).
Bonus: S.D. Teen accuses Senator of fondling
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Intolerance
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 07:52 ET by kdizzydazeI knew that word was going to come out sooner or later. Those evil, intolerant Republicans.
Funny, I don't feel intolerant.
God Made man, but a monkey supplied the glue
Mark, I only see 3 actual
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:24 ET by LeonMark,
I only see 3 actual metaphors in the 6 examples you listed.
I would revise your sentence to say, "whoever wrote the editorial had gone MILDLY metaphor mad"
Craig Hypocricsy
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:29 ET by LeonWe've heard a lot about hypocrisy concerning Craig (i.e. Matthews saying deviant, etc.)
But to me the most striking hypocrisy is the way the Republicans on the Hill have handled this scandle as opposed to the Vitter scandal.
Vitter suffered minimal backlash as a result of his heterosexual, extra-marital affairs with a prostitute.
So why all the calls for Craig to resign?
Because he was hitting on a man. That's the only reason. If he had been cruising a park for a femal prostitute, apparently nobody in the Republican party would care.
No, Leon, look at the politics...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:34 ET by sarcasmoAs I said, Vitter was lucky enough to do his whoring-around in a state with a Democrat governor. If he gets dumped, she replaces a Republican with a Democrat. Idaho's a red state with a Republican governor, so if Craig's dumped it has little or no political effect. IOW, there's some hypocrisy, but it's POLITICAL, not sexual. If you're an effective homosexual political type like Ken Mehlman, the Republican party is still quite a big tent.
JMR
Rally online with fans of Dr. Ron Paul.
Ah Great point
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:39 ET by LeonAh Great point Sarc,
You're probably right. I never even thought of that.
Love the Ken Mehlman reference. He might just be the gayest man in politics.
I saw him out and about a couple of years ago in DC with a friend of mine who was working on the hill (aka making $8/hr, pouring coffee, and living off mommy and daddy) and his dancing (if that's what you call flailing your arms limp-wristedly) was arguably on of the top ten gayest things I've ever seen.
As I said, Vitter was lucky
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:40 ET by deus_ex_machinaAs I said, Vitter was lucky enough to do his whoring-around in a state with a Democrat governor.
So much then for DeLay's talking point about Republicans addressing and Democrats re-electing.
That depends
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:42 ET by sarcasmoVitter could still be forced (perhaps, ironically, by this incident!) to resign.
JMR
Rally online with fans of Dr. Ron Paul.
That Depends indeed (good
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:50 ET by deus_ex_machinaThat Depends indeed (good pun, sarc).
Personally, I'm generally not in favor of making anyone resign unless they're convicted of a crime. If their constituents want them to stay, it's up to them. Despite what DeLay said yesterday, it's not the parties that re-elect these people, it's the voters. Now as for committee assignments, that's another thing entirely.
Assinine
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:34 ET by Sergeant ROCKIf he had been cruising a park for a femal prostitute, apparently nobody in the Republican party would care.
That's idiotic. You're projecting again, because everyone knows that would apply to democRATS - not Republicans (See also; Bill Klinton).
So Rock, How do you
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:37 ET by LeonSo Rock,
How do you explain the overwhelming acceptance by Republicans of Vitter's immoral behavior?
Vitter gets a standing ovation at a lunch a few days after his admission, Craig gets calls to resign.
Vitter actually had sex outside of his marriage, Craig only tried to have sex outside of his marriage.
So, why did Vitter get a free pass?
Not by me..
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:41 ET by Sergeant ROCK.. he didn't. Bill got a free pass too. So then, can we conclude that you're upset when a Republican gets a supposed free pass than a democRAT? That, of course, based on the assumption that democRATS routinely expect better behavior from Republicans than themselves.
I don't know what you're
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:45 ET by LeonI don't know what you're trying to say.
I don't care about adultery. It's not something that affects me at all. If guys want to cheat on their wives, then by all means, go right ahead.
At the same time, I'm not a Republican that constantly proclaims my moral superiority.
In your case...
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:51 ET by Sergeant ROCKAt the same time, I'm not a Republican that constantly proclaims my moral superiority.
.. you would be accussed of neither.
Not much I can do about Vitter, since I don't live in his state. But is good to hear that you democRATS have no intention of claiming moral superiority or engage in moral behavior.
Ok Rock, For a second I
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:53 ET by LeonOk Rock,
For a second I thought you were interested in having a discussion.
Clearly that is not the case.
Leon Ickes
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:55 ET by Sergeant ROCKWith a partisan hack? Surely you jest!
with 'partisan hack'
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 08:59 ET by sarcasmoDefined as "anyone."
JMR
Rally online with fans of Dr. Ron Paul.
The self-adulator..
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 09:03 ET by Sergeant ROCK..strikes again!
For what good it might do...if any.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 10:24 ET by mattmNo, you're just a Democrat who constantly proclaims your moral superiority. That's what your final comment is.
If you want to make a hypocrisy argument you'd better figure out a way to do it without making yourself look like a hypocrite.
The GOP has a traditional values plank in their platform. But this doesn't necessarily mean that if one Republican turns out to be a pervert, that the whole party is hypocritical. It depends on what the Party does. And if the Party decides Craig is not a good representative of the GOP platform, he'll be gone.
On the other hand, the Democrats have an anti-war plank, so when one of their own comes back from Iraq saying he's seen progress and is changing his position, the Dems go after him - as they should...but if they try to claim to be superior on national defense issues, like Kerry tried to do, then they are the ones being hypocritical.
None of this is surprising. But the people on the Left who are trying to make hyporcisy arguments are way off.
In this article the NYT is supporting him supposedly because their gay-is-OK agenda trumps their anti_GOP agenda...that's fine for them, but it's also OK for NB to point it out.
But you're mistaken if you don't think adultery affects you at all; it most certainly does. It goes to what kind of a society we live in. If we live in a society where personal commitments are honored, everyone benefits, if we live in a society where personal commitments are violated constantly, that harms everyone. You can't trust anyone and no one can trust you. This is extremely harmful.
Amoralism is not Liberty.
Oxymoron?
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:16 ET by Sergeant ROCKA democRAT proclaiming moral superiority that is.
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Argumentative As Usual
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:34 ET by stratmanLeon:
Who plead to and was convicted of a crime while professing no guilt? Craig.
Who admitted guilt and asked for forgiveness despite no charges filed or convicted of a crime? Vitter.
If you are so blinded by partisan politics or moral ambiguity to not acknowledge the difference then you are not worth further engagement on the subject.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
In a nutshell
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 11:36 ET by Sergeant ROCKNothing more to add.
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stratman, while the
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 12:41 ET by Jerstratman, while the differences are indeed obvious, the responses induced by those differences strike me as odd.
In the first instance, a misdemeanor plea (accompanied by a denial of guilt) is met with calls for resignation, while in the second, an admission of immoral behavior is applauded.
Help me out.
Thanks, Jer
One Of The Things Is Not Like The Other
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 13:59 ET by stratmanOne admits his wrong behaviour and and deals with it in a relative straightforward manner. No charges have been filed and, obviously, no convictions of a crime... yet. Republicans are human beings too, despite the Left's demonizing, and are capable of foregiveness towards a remorsefull person. I would not be surprised, though, if Vitter was punished in some fashion by the Senate if convicted in the future. Foregiveness and personal responsibility are not mutually exclusive entities.
The other pleads guilty and is convicted yet continues to profess innocence. Craig is neither accepting responsibility nor displaying attritional behaviour for his conviction. Diminished capacity or inability to seek legal counsel has never been an issue which could moderate the punishment leveled by his peers.
If someone lies to you and you know they have lied to you but still claim to not have lied to you, do you treat them the same as someone that has lied to you but then admits they lied to you? Would one garner more contempt from you, or, would these two scenarios be "equivalent"?
Then there is the subject of the degree of wrong doing. Can one make a case that public bathroom sex, gay or straight, is less defensible than discreet adultery in a politician? I think so. Can one make a case that adultery is less wrong than having $90K in bribe money in your freezer for a politician? I think so.
I am not sure how one can say which politician is less sleazy when it comes to public bathroom sex versus violating the ethical foundation of being a politician and the public's trust by accepting bribes. Each makes a mockery of societal rules and values but in very different ways.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
stratman, I appreciate your
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 17:41 ET by Jerstratman, I appreciate your response, although I may have to get back with you later on a couple of points.
Thanks, Jer
Jer, I'm sure there will
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:39 ET by stratmanJer,
I'm sure there will be an opportunity to discuss politics later.
Have a good evening.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
I still have to admire that Idaho Statesman
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:13 ET by SportPoliticsWho for some reason spent 7 months researching the "gay" accusation against Craig, then did a personal interview with the wife and voice modified recording of ex-repub now demo accuser, 300 interviews, travelled to DC twice, and to his home at least once.
Now that's a dime spent. That's what reporters and newspapers and tv news stations need to do to every single person serving in the military as well. We need to make sure we find out whom is gay.
But of course none of this matters since he "pled guilty to toe tapping".
Ya gotta love our new legal system, where one skumbag punk sitting on a toilet with his pants down can claim there was toe tapping or shoe bumping, when of course he was hoping it would happen, and the masses of drooling morons claim like it uis and should be against the law, and claim it's just law, as well.
ROFLMAO - MORONS everywhere. We have a dumbed down populace, even on this NB server.
The Idaho Statesman is and
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:17 ET by bigtimerThe Idaho Statesman is and always has been nothing but leftist fishwrap...with an agenda...just like the majority of leftist fishwrap.
Period.
In a conversation recently,
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:20 ET by 4arrowIn a conversation recently, someone suggested that if all men in government have secret sins which would bring them down then they are all vulnerable to being 'leaned on' to vote a certain way. I keep thinking about this.
4.... Including women in
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:24 ET by bigtimer4....
Including women in politics/govt. too.
my message was cut off.
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:29 ET by 4arrowmy message was cut off. Public confession and then reconcilliation is the only way to a fresh start.
Otherwise pols are beholding to creeps and not to citizens.
Bigtimer Not sure if that
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:32 ET by 4arrowBigtimer
Not sure if that was meant for me but yes, women schysters too.
4... ...my message was
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:34 ET by bigtimer4...
...my message was cut off.
You having thunder and lightning storms too?
My power has went off twice since being here in the last hour while posting...
LOL...
T & L lucky your
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:40 ET by 4arrowT & L lucky your community. We haven't had a good long rain all summer. Next wet will be snow no doubt.
4... I am gonna try this
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:53 ET by bigtimer4...
I am gonna try this again.
It is the same here...the rain didn't last long, there will be fires for sure.
It will be a very long hard winter... Ijust feel it.
We here can predict the
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 19:02 ET by 4arrowWe here can predict the severity of the coming winter by the pinecones on the tops of the trees in the back
4... Same
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 19:11 ET by bigtimer4...
Same here.
Squirrels started very early getting them to drop and store for the winter...very early.
}}---> message cut off
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:48 ET by Cool Arrowaka bobbitized.
~LYDSEXICS UNTIE!~
}}---> Enuff with the confessions
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:39 ET by Cool ArrowHow about while in office they don't engage in activity that would open them up to blackmail. This might also make them think twice about making politics a lifelong career.
poly = many
Ticks = bloodsucking insects
politics = many bloodsucking insects
~LYDSEXICS UNTIE!~
An oldie but a
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 18:41 ET by stratmanAn oldie but a goodie.
And still funny.
Killing them with kindness isn't working. Time to get scrappy with the Donkeys.
Cool Arrow,They've
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 19:10 ET by 4arrowCool Arrow,
They've engaged before and all the way up the political ladder. Think about who they represent if they have secrets. At least EMK's sins were out in the open, and I am no fan of his.
The only thing for it IMHO is confession and contrition, with hope forgiveness but GET IT OUT IN THE OPEN SO YOU CANNOT BE BLACKMAILED!
}}---> Teddy's sins
Fri, 08/31/2007 - 19:16 ET by Cool ArrowSo you're content with "I walked around in a daze for about 9 hours before I reported the accident to the authorities"?
Most people would suspect 9 hours is plenty of time to sober up, too. But since he denied alcohol was involved, are you saying you buy it?
~LYDSEXICS UNTIE!~