In an interview with Bill Clinton aired on Monday's NBC Today, correspondent Cynthia McFadden pressed him on the scandal swirling around the Clinton Foundation, but she quickly moved on to gush over the "heartwarming stories" of the charity's work in Africa.
McFadden, traveling with former president in Africa, began the segment by declaring: "Bill Clinton is making no apologies as he tours some of the African programs his foundation has raised billions to help fund." Clinton proclaimed: "I don't think there's anything sinister in trying to get wealthy people and countries that are seriously involved in development to spend their money wisely in a way that helps poor people and lifts them up."
McFadden explained the controversy:
But his wife's run for president has triggered a new level of scrutiny and criticism....He tells me 90% of the donors give $100 or less. But it's who's giving the big money that's causing the headache. Over half of the donors giving $5 million or more are foreign, many of them foreign governments. Under mounting pressure, the foundation recently announced it will only take money from six western countries.
Turning to Clinton, she wondered: "Is that an acknowledgment that it was a mistake not to stop the other foreign donations before your wife ran for president?" Clinton replied: "No, absolutely not. It's an acknowledgment that we're going to come as close as we can during her presidential campaign to following the rules we followed when she became secretary of state."
McFadden failed to push back with the obvious point that the Clintons failed to follow the ethics rules laid out by the Obama administration.
Suggesting the scandal was more based on appearance than substance, she asked: "Do you understand, though, that the perception itself is a problem?" Clinton defiantly declared: "No. And look, I don't want to get in the weeds here. I'm not responsible for anybody else's perception."
McFadden then began to fawn: "But even while the criticism at home rumbles, the heartwarming stories here in Africa are undeniable. Like here at the Starkey Hearing Foundation program, where 150 children and adults will get hearing aides today."
As Clinton helped fit a hearing aide into a boy's ear, McFadden observed: "You look like you know what you're doing, Mr. President." She enthused: "This little boy will hear for the first time."
Moments later, she touted:
If he's troubled by the controversy swirling back at home, there is no indication of it here. These are some of Nairobi's poorest kids, a sampling of the 10,000 who are now attending high school thanks to commitments made through the Clinton Global Initiative....The program has been a whopping success. 98% graduate, 94% go on to college. In Africa, he's greeted as if he's still president. And if you close your eyes, you might think you're right back on the campaign trail as he tries to shrink the gulf between himself and regular folks.
McFadden did challenge the former president on his wealth: "You certainly didn't grow up wealthy, but you've become a wealthy man....Over the years he's made a lot of money giving speeches. While his wife was secretary of state, he gave eleven of them which paid him $500,000 or more....why do it, Mr. President?"
Clinton claimed: "To pay my bills..." McFadden responded: "Regular working Americans look and say $500,000 for a speech?" Clinton brushed the concerns aside:
...if I had a business relationship with somebody, they would have a target on their back from the day they did business with me until the end. Any kind of disclosure is a target. But it looks bad. There's no facts, of course, but it looks bad....people like to hear me speak. And I have turned down a lot of them. If I think there's something wrong with it, I don't take it. And I do disclose who gave them to me. So people can make up their own minds.
Once again, McFadden ignored the Clintons' past failures to disclose.
Clinton made it clear he would continued to give paid speeches while his wife pursued a presidential run: "I gotta pay our bills."
Mcfadden concluded the piece: "Until then, there are many more people to help and lots more money to raise. Bill Clinton says he trusts the American people to see the good work the foundation has done for fifteen years and to realize that criticism is political."
Here is a full transcript of the May 4 interview:
7:00 AM ET TEASE:
MATT LAUER: NBC News exclusive. We're in Africa with former President Bill Clinton as he tours some of the places that benefit from his family's foundation. A foundation under fire for taking money from foreign countries like Saudi Arabia.
[ON-SCREEN HEADLINE: Clinton Defends Foundation]
CYNTHIA MCFADDEN: Do you understand, though, that the perception itself is a problem?
BILL CLINTON: No.
LAUER: Why he says it's all for good and what he's doing to quell the critics.
7:09 AM ET SEGMENT:
MATT LAUER: On the Democratic side, it's all about Hillary Clinton. She's been drawing criticism over certain donations to her family's charitable foundation. And in an NBC News exclusive, Bill Clinton is answering those critics. NBC's Cynthia McFadden went one-on-one with the former president. Cynthia, good morning to you.
[ON-SCREEN HEADLINE: Bill Clinton Defends Foundation; Addresses Questions Surrounding Fundraising]
CYNTHIA MCFADDEN: Good morning from Nairobi, Matt. As Hillary Clinton's campaign for the White House intensifies, so does the criticism of the foundation that bears her name, that of her husband, and her daughter. She stepped down from her role at the foundation when she announced she was running, but some have questioned whether her independence was compromised by the foundation's large foreign donors. Well, I've come to Africa to see the work of the foundation and to talk to Bill Clinton about the criticism.
Former President Bill Clinton is making no apologies as he tours some of the African programs his foundation has raised billions to help fund.
BILL CLINTON: I don't think there's anything sinister in trying to get wealthy people and countries that are seriously involved in development to spend their money wisely in a way that helps poor people and lifts them up. I don't think there's anything bad with that. I think it's good.
MCFADDEN: But his wife's run for president has triggered a new level of scrutiny and criticism.
CLINTON: There has been a very deliberate attempt to take the foundation down. And there is almost no new fact that's known now that wasn't known when she ran for president the first time.
MCFADDEN: He tells me 90% of the donors give $100 or less. But it's who's giving the big money that's causing the headache. Over half of the donors giving $5 million or more are foreign, many of them foreign governments. Under mounting pressure, the foundation recently announced it will only take money from six western countries. [To Clinton] Is that an acknowledgment that it was a mistake not to stop the other foreign donations before your wife ran for president?
CLINTON: No, absolutely not. It's an acknowledgment that we're going to come as close as we can during her presidential campaign to following the rules we followed when she became secretary of state.
MCFADDEN: He defended the $10 to $25 million given by Saudi Arabia.
CLINTON: I don't think that I did anything that was against the interests of the United States.
MCFADDEN: Do you understand, though, that the perception itself is a problem?
CLINTON: No.
MCFADDEN: You don't?
CLINTON: No. And look, I don't want to get in the weeds here. I'm not responsible for anybody else's perception. I asked Hillary about this and she said, "You know, no one's ever tried to influence me by helping you." No one has even suggested they have a shred of evidence to that effect.
[ON-SCREEN HEADLINE: Bill Clinton Defends Foundation; Focuses on Work Being Done as Hillary Runs]
MCFADDEN: But even while the criticism at home rumbles, the heartwarming stories here in Africa are undeniable. Like here at the Starkey Hearing Foundation program, where 150 children and adults will get hearing aides today. [To Clinton as he helps put a hearing aide in a boy's ear] You look like you know what you're doing, Mr. President.
UNIDENTIFIED WOMAN [STARKEY HEARING FOUNDATION]: He's done this many times.
CLINTON: I've done these in Uganda, Zambia.
MCFADDEN: This little boy will hear for the first time.
CLINTON: Good?
[BOY GIVES THUMBS UP]
CLINTON: Good!
MCFADDEN: Much of the work is far from glamorous. At a clinic in Nairobi, Chelsea Clinton witnessed the use of a zinc and rehydration packet to treat the second-leading killer of children, diarrhea. [To Chelsea Clinton] You guys bought a million of these.
CHELSEA CLINTON: We did, we did. We bought a million, which we donated to the government.
BILL CLINTON: There's never been anything like the Clinton Global Initiative, where you've raised over $100 billion worth of stuff that's helped 430 million people in 180 countries.
MCFADDEN: If he's troubled by the controversy swirling back at home, there is no indication of it here. These are some of Nairobi's poorest kids, a sampling of the 10,000 who are now attending high school thanks to commitments made through the Clinton Global Initiative.
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: My dream is now real.
MCFADDEN: The program has been a whopping success. 98% graduate, 94% go on to college. In Africa, he's greeted as if he's still president. And if you close your eyes, you might think you're right back on the campaign trail as he tries to shrink the gulf between himself and regular folks.
BILL CLINTON: When I was born, my mother was a widow. I once lived on a farm that had no indoor toilet.
MCFADDEN: You certainly didn't grow up wealthy, but you've become a wealthy man.
CLINTON: I have, yes. And one of the most amusing things of all is everybody saying, "Well, how can Hillary possibly relate to the terms of middle class America because now we have money?" I mean, it's laughable. It's okay if you inherit your money, apparently, then you can help people. I'm grateful for our success. But let me remind you, when we moved into the White House, we had the lowest net worth of any family since Harry Truman.
MCFADDEN: When you left, you had $14 million in legal bills.
CLINTON: Or more. That's okay, we paid them. And we've been very fortunate.
MCFADDEN: Over the years he's made a lot of money giving speeches. While his wife was secretary of state, he gave eleven of them which paid him $500,000 or more.
CLINTON: I give 10% of my revenue off the top every year to the foundation. And Hillary, in the year she was there, gave 17%. Over the last fifteen years, I've taken almost no capital gains.
MCFADDEN: But why do it, Mr. President?
CLINTON: To pay my bills and because in the – why?
MCFADDEN: Regular working Americans look and say $500,000 for a speech?
CLINTON: But why shouldn't every – it's the most independence I can get. It's – I don't – if I had a business relationship with somebody, they would have a target on their back from the day they did business with me until the end. Any kind of disclosure is a target. But it looks bad. There's no facts, of course, but it looks bad. People – I work hard on this. I spend a couple hours a day just doing the research, people like to hear me speak. And I have turned down a lot of them. If I think there's something wrong with it, I don't take it. And I do disclose who gave them to me. So people can make up their own minds.
MCFADDEN: So she's now running for president, will you continue to give speeches?
CLINTON: Oh, yeah. I gotta pay our bills.
MCFADDEN: If your wife is elected president, will you step down from the foundation?
CLINTON: Well, I'll decide. If it's the right thing to do, I will.
MCFADDEN: Why might you step down if she were elected president?
CLINTON: Well, I might if I were asked to do something in the public interest that I had an obligation to do. Or I might take less of an executive role. I mean, I really, I work at this and I'm involved in this, as you can see. So I might do that. But we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.
MCFADDEN: Until then, there are many more people to help and lots more money to raise.
Bill Clinton says he trusts the American people to see the good work the foundation has done for fifteen years and to realize that criticism is political. He's off to Liberia today to meet with Ebola survivors and to see the work of the foundation there. Matt.
LAUER: Alright, Cynthia McFadden, thank you. A very candid interview with former President Bill Clinton. She'll have more of that interview with President Clinton tonight on NBC Nightly News.
