To CNN's "Lou Dobbs Tonight" host, we live in a world of absolutes - because the potential of a government bailout of two publicly traded government-sponsored enterprises condemns the entire concept of free market capitalism.
On the July 22 broadcast of Dobbs' show, he attacked proponents of free-market capitalism because of the potential trouble of the two government-sponsored enterprises (GSEs) Fannie Mae (NYSE:FNM) and Freddie Mac (NYSE:FRE).
"Well the - it's a, it's quite a mess, quite a mess indeed," Dobbs said. "And I love the idea that all these free traders, free marketeers now got to have the government to, to bail them out. If I hear one of these ignorant, hypocritical, sanctimonious free traders ever talk about free markets again, they should be pilloried. I mean they are absolutely - this is an administration of jerks and cowards and fools. I mean it's unbelievable."
Dobbs would have proponents of free markets and fair trade shackled in stocks for public humiliation.
Dobbs blamed the Bush administration for the struggles of the housing market, insisting the administration could have in some way acted to cool off a housing market that allowed people to borrow more than they could afford.
"We've been reporting for months on this broadcast about the Bush administration's failure to address adequately the housing crisis," Dobbs said. "As millions of middle class Americans have been hurt by foreclosures the White House has consistently denied the problem. As [CNN correspondent] Kitty Pilgrim reports, this month alone, the administration has contradicted itself many times about the state and health of our economy."
Pilgrim added her own comment about the legislative process concerning President George W. Bush and a housing bill that recently made it through Congress.
"It is inconceivable that it has taken this long to get this legislation together," Pilgrim added.
Comments Policy
I agree with Dobbs on the Bailouts
July 23, 2008 - 14:44 ET by PopularTechGovernment bailouts are simply corporate welfare. These businesses are in trouble because of bad decisions and it is not the responsibility of the government to float them, let alone with my tax dollars.
At the same time Bush has nothing to do with the housing market, that is poor financial planning by the people in trouble. It is no one's fault but their own for borrowing too much money. These people are clueless they mortgage a house they can barely afford, finance or lease cars out of their pay scale and run debt out their ass on multiple credit cards, then they take double mortgages to keep spending like there is no tomorrow pushing them farther into bankrupcy, please, what bunch of morons.
The Anti 'Man-Made' Global Warming Resource
right with an addition
July 23, 2008 - 14:57 ET by mbuelThese two corps are both PUBLIC and PRIVATE.. That means they get all the benefits of a both.... and all the negatives as well!
like no oversight, when they give ridiculous organizations, hundreds of thousands of dollars... or when they continue to make bad decisions!
And the mortgage mess was mainly caused by the following:
1) the 1977 CRA.
2) the Clinton era refinement of that, (that RiNO let through...)
3) An out of control Federal Reserve that believes inflation is better than stopping out of control spending.
The problem really begins and ends with central banking... and once again proves the failures of trying to manage an economy!!!
Thanks for trying though dobbs...
EDIT:
and corporate welfare is no better IMO than personal welfare. People should have to pay for being stupid. INCLUDING corporations!!!
Oxymorons
July 23, 2008 - 15:58 ET by zeestephenUsing the words "Fannie Mae" and "Freddie Mac" in the same sentence with "free traders" and "free marketers" is comical.
Fannie and Freddie are "Government Sponsored Entities."
They are not public corporations, they are exempt from many of the laws that govern publicly owned businesses, and all major decisions are reviewed, or imposed, by government agencies and elected officials.
The "bail out" is also 24 carat baloney.
The stock price of both Fannie and Freddie had collapsed by 90% before the Fed and Treasury even began to talk about a rescue.
Even after the rescue talk began, the two stocks were still down 80%.
Shamefully absent from press reports is that Fannie and Freddie stock have been touted for decades to older and more conservative Americans as being ultra-safe investments.
These folks thought they were buying a steady dividend and moderate stock price growth.
Thanks to the US government, 80% of their hard earned money has vanished into thin air.
well..
July 23, 2008 - 17:10 ET by mbuelThey have the ability to act like a private corporation when it's convenient, and get bailed out like it's public corporation when it's conveninet. here in washington state we have another ridiculous arrangement, with "sound transit authority". When it's convenient they are a private organization, but when it comes time to tax the hell out of us for more non-functioning mass transit projects, they are a "public" organization.
The whole arrangement is ridiculous. The fact that Fannie and Freddie perform the same function is just another example of government inefficiency as well!
mbuell - Sound Transit Authority
July 23, 2008 - 21:26 ET by zeestephenmbuell,
I thought I was the only Conservative in King County!
Off the top of my head, I recall that several years ago the "real" cost of a Sounder Train ticket was $110 per passenger.
And remember the Monorail fiasco?
On the same freaking ballot, voters decided to reject the expansion of the Monorail, but voted to KEEP the tax that was going to pay for it!
hence the reason,
July 24, 2008 - 12:09 ET by mbuelI live in Pierce county. The voters in King County (especially Seattle) drive me nuts. Remember it was 168 of those nuts that put Gregoire in. GAH!!!
Well we all know it was actually Acorns not nuts but anyways....
PT... Well you said about
July 23, 2008 - 15:01 ET by bigtimerPT...
Well you said about what I was going to say and how I feel about it...only much better.
As an aside...I cannot stand Pilgrim...Dobbs about a third of the time.
I am getting real sick and tired of him blaming the administration and Pres. Bush for everything.
Where oh where it he personal responsibility...I am past disgusted with all of this..it is unbelievable to me.
We are tax-payers are going to have to pay for all of this BS again....
As to Fannie and Freddie...Franklin Raines should of been behind bars long ago...what he (and others) did was ten times worse than Enron as far as I am concerned.
Then we have Dodd and others and their sweet deals with Countrywide...
Schumer with Indymac...
I give up...as long it is a democrat all is okay, personal responsibility is not a requirement....Govt. laws and regulations plus institutions like Freddie and Fannie should go under as far as I am concerned...I know, I'm not an economist and others have completely different thoughts...
Oh well...it is what it is.
"America isn't the problem...America is the solution." ~ Rush Limbaugh
That guy is just annoying.
July 23, 2008 - 14:51 ET by ApacheThat guy is just annoying. Who is proud to call themselves a "populist"? Feeding people what they want to hear as if mob rule is the same as doing the right thing? And "advocacy Journalist". What is that? You can't pretend to be both. I still love the time Aaron Brown took a swipe at him on the air back when he Dobbs did the business report and first started pretending he was an anchor. Aaron said, "And that’s the news, here is Lou Dobbs to repeat it all over again". Camera went to Dobbs who was obviously irked. I busted out laughing.
What?
July 23, 2008 - 14:58 ET by Chasvs"It is inconceivable that it has taken this long to get this legislation together," Pilgrim added.
So it's inconceivable for the DEMOCRATS who have been running the COngrees for TWO years to take this long to get something done? Where has this B!tch been?
Let's get a reality check! BUSH didn't make anybody buy a house they couldn't afford! But the DEMOCRATS FORCED lenders to make loans to people that they otherwise wouldn't have dealt with before!
DEMOCRATS you are EVIL and the ones to blame here!
precisely
July 23, 2008 - 17:11 ET by mbuel"But the DEMOCRATS FORCED lenders to make loans to people that they otherwise wouldn't have dealt with before!"
yep. And coupled with the out of control low interest rates, the banks saw an opportunity to make money with high risk loans. And for a while it worked....
So...
July 23, 2008 - 15:14 ET by ontheright...the Clinton Administration and the Congress at the time had nothing to do with the housing bubble fallout we are seeing today?? That is a very, very interesting take on history Mr. Dobbs.
Your ignorance of contemporary history is amusing at best and quite sad at worst. It seems there are many, many official government documents that clearly refute your "it's Bush's fault" mantra.
I'm no scholar, but I can read and use what little God given deductive reasoning that I was blessed with to know that your contention that GWB et. al. are responsible for the housing problem, is pure hogwash.
http://clinton2.nara.gov/OMB/legislative/sap/105-1/HR2-h.html
https://www.policyarchive.org/bitstream/handle/10207/355/97-169_19980521.pdf?sequence=1
And just for good measure I added some more bathroom reading for you Mr. Dobbs. More Clinton Era housing "hand-out" programs, laws, regulations, etc. etc. etc. ENJOY!
http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2004/pdf/04-25986.pdf
Pop
July 23, 2008 - 15:12 ET by expatriotYou agree with Dobbs on the bail out? Yet you don't want to use your tax dollars. That is what Dobbs is proposing, using your tax dollars to bail out those who went over their heads and bought houses that they could not afford. Dobbs wants the Bush administration to get involved instead of letting the market take care of itself.
Personally, if you went further than you could afford to go that is your problem. If you are being forclosed on, work it out by yourself and leave the rest of us out of your problem. I am not directing this at you, Pop, but rather at those who made bad decisions. Life is full of them and it is up to each individual to take care of him/herself.
Dobbs is wrong on all counts.
Did you read what I said?
July 23, 2008 - 19:27 ET by PopularTechI said I agree with Dobbs on the "bailouts" (his position) as in he is against the government bailing out businesses. And I am obviously against bailing out home owners. I think you need to read what I said and not just the title.
The Anti 'Man-Made' Global Warming Resource
read it a couple of times
July 24, 2008 - 06:57 ET by expatriotI think you need to edit the title. Relisten to Dobbs. He wants government to fix the problem. He is not against bailouts. He calls the market conservatives a disgusting bunch, to paraphrase, and then crows about the dhimms passing legislation to bail out those who made a bad decision. Listen to him again.
Free market
July 23, 2008 - 15:13 ET by PurdueMattNo one said the free market NEVER fails. Failure is in fact an important part of the free market system. Kudlow was hammering home that point last week.
In fact, some of us
July 23, 2008 - 15:20 ET by sarcasmoWould never have called either Fannie or Freddie anything like "free market" at any time during their entire respective histories... In fact, that's not how I describe the Bush administration, either. Bailouts are what happens under socialism, not free markets.
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Lou Dobbs
July 23, 2008 - 15:17 ET by timrfrench61I am more concerned that MSM continues to be filled by talking heads flinging loose threats and extended insults, even when they are commentators and not reporters. Name calling simplifies the discussion and builds up single elements above all the elements of the whole discussion.
Is the whole problem a free market? Without the free market we would all be living in shacks. People love that housing is 2,3, 4, 5 times what it was 20 years ago. The society wanted a free market on housing because everyone wants to make big bucks on turning primary residence real estate (traditional real estate money is based on leverage).
Is the whole problem our president and his administration? I personally think the market has been heading for trouble for 10 years and any moves 10 years ago would have been seen as against 99% of constituancy interests; 5 years ago: be the same; 3 years ago: too late.
Limits to borrowing practices are limits to demand. Limits too demand lower selling prices. How big is the real estate market? Everybody who owns a piece would be resistant to their property values going down. And "Everybody" is the constitiency, and some of them actually give to political campaigns.
But we should be very careful about bailouts. Better to accept deflation quickly.
And MSM professionals like Dobbs needs to think before they talk.
Right you are
July 23, 2008 - 15:26 ET by expatriotWithout the free market we would be like the Peoples Republic of China, Cuba, Venezuela, Russia or any other country where the government controls the majority of business.
Dobbs has an idea of what really makes our country run but he needs to connect with the nutroots who are dumb enough to watch his program. People with brains and the ability to use them don't watch loo dibbs.
Other questions answered----
July 23, 2008 - 19:15 ET by misterbillI had long been a very active blogger here. I was in agreement with most posters and enjoyed the discourses. We saw our resident pro-illegal immigrant shoot himself in the foot and be gone. After that, I noticed this site waged and staged some severe ad hominem attacks on Ron Paul. While RP was not my choice, I was at a loss for the vitriol against him considering that we agreed with MOST of what he stood for, (the constitution for one). Then the issue of of the SPP/NAU arose. It was attacked with the same vitriol as RP had been. I, personally, had become a prey of Unsane after I expressed my views on how our free trade was not working as a free trade. The subject of illegal immigration has become a weak and forgotten memory on this site. What a shame. Now I find I have no brains or the ability to use them because I watch Lou Dobbs. Well sir you can stay in your free mrket competing with 36 cents an hour employees in China, an overabundance of H1B, etc., plans. There are approximately 8 million people unemployed in this country, the number is growing daily. There are two parties to blame for the mortgage crisis, greedy bankers, (etal), and a huge number of people who did not take the time to understand that an escalating payment clause would escalate. Add to thet, that many of those who are losing their homes are illegals in America. I do not want to bail them , the mortgage companies or the home owner out. And if you are paying attention and look at the bailout bill, the Democrats have included, as integral, grants of money to La Raza and ACORN. Guess who told me that?? The populist that's who! Between free trade, illegal immigration and the number of "legal" visas granted for immigrants, I find that Lou Dobbs, in spite of his heated rhetoric is one of the very few in this country who speaks out for the middle class.
And as one of the nutroots who is dumb enough to watch his show let me thank you for the second insult. Yoyu and Unsane will fix the country. A true pedant (Unsane) and an ad hominem debater.
You!
Great!!!!! Just great!!!!!!
Expect to see even less of me on this Free Market, (which necessitates Open Borders the way it is being implemented), Deriders of Constitutionalists, anti 3rd party, vote for McCain or Obama wll be elected people.
Breaking up is hard to do!!!!!!!!!
PS My ad hominem is I suspect you have only scrtached the surface of any economic suffering and you think everyone who got caught in the mortgage deal is stupid, so you scorn them. You may be 100% right, but that fixes nothing either.
Here's what you should be worrying about instead of nutroots like me and Lou Dobbs.
" Nancy Pelosi wants a Windfall Tax on Retirement Income. In other words tax what you have made by investing toward your retirement. This woman is a nut case! You aren't going to believe this.
Madam speaker Nancy Pelosi wants to put a Windfall Tax on all stock market profits (including Retirement fund, 401K and Mutual Funds! Alas , it is true - all to help the 20 Million Illegal Immigrants and other unemployed Minorities!
This woman is frightening.
She quotes...' We need to work toward the goal of equalizing income, (didn't Marx say something like this), in our country and at the same time limiting the amount the rich can invest.' ( I am not rich, are you)
When asked how these new tax dollars would be spent, she replied:
'We need to raise the standard of living of our poor, unemployed and minorities. For example, we have an estimated 12 million illegal immigrants in our country who need our help along with millions of unemployed minorities. Stock market windfall profits taxes could go a long way to guarantee these people the standard of living they would like to have as 'Americans'.' (Read that quote again and again and let it sink in. 'Lower your retirement, give it to others who have not worked as you have for it'.
timrfrench
July 23, 2008 - 20:24 ET by misterbillA much better thought out piece than some others I have read. My initial reaction to the mortgage problem was- "Why in the world should I, among others , who planned their finaces closer that some today, who did not fall for the 1% mortgage scheme, who have the ability to reason that a 1% mrotgage is , monthly, one sixth of a 6% mortgage, why should I pay for the stupidity of those folks. (Esp. when I found a goodly number of them were illegals. A bartender from Brazil in Fraingham MA, earning $60k bought a $300K + house and then lost it. ) I have been a real estate salesman and a business broker. (Only dabbled in retirement.)
The old rule was (FHA/VA) that a monthly mortgage , principal Interest, Taxes and insurance could not exceed 28% of your monthly gross. With car payment. etc 36% was the magic number
$5000 X .28 = $1400
My thinking changed after a discussion with my son who is in the real estate/finance business. He feels the lending companies should assume the full responsibilty. He is more cynical about the reasoning power and responsibility of the homeowner than I am. I espect his knowledge and intelligence and I accepted that, partially. To me both parties are to blame.
Next, I agree with you that this mess has been building before GW took the White House. I agree with Dobbs that he has done little or nothing to change it. Our economy has built falsely by the immigration of some 20+ million illegal immigrants. The banking/RE people saw a lot of "get rich" quick scheme. An economy built on a growth encouraged by developers, manufacturers, that would increase sales and profits with little regard for the long-term unintended (I do not believe that for a minute) consequences. I believe it was "I don't give a damn, I just want mine" consequences.
My problem is I have seen this site turn into a defend GW at all costs. There is not a single doubt in my mind he is a globalist and an open borders advocate and that will destroy the American middle calss. On the other hand, he is far from the person responsible for the state we are in today. I also still believe were it not for his actions there would have been many more attacks here in our homeland. So do not think I am a hater.
capitalism is dead
July 23, 2008 - 15:22 ET by FAQsIs Lou Dobbs a communist? I don't watch his show. Is this somehow proof that we should abolish non-government ownership? Should the government take over CNN too? What are you talking about Lou?
Jerks and cowards and fools,
July 23, 2008 - 15:27 ET by SickofLibsJerks and cowards and fools, huh?
The douchebags are going to be mighty upset they were left out.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong but
July 23, 2008 - 15:41 ET by ur-conDidn't the existence of these government sponsored entities contribute to the problem? Don't they provide a way for primary lenders to unload risky loans? And why do we have these entities? Was it not to provide a way for those with less than good credit ratings to purchase a home they probably wouldn't normally be able to get? If so, then we (the government) brought this on ourselves.
lets see... The dollar is
July 23, 2008 - 15:43 ET by sajc05lets see...
The dollar is crashing,
the banks are failing
our government keeps printing out money to pay for things it cannot afford
bush's keeps pushing for a north american union destroying this country for good.
Americans are encouraged by our president to keep growing in debt spending beyond their means.
....no, these people in charge are sooo smart i hope we have more leadership like this in the future
stop crying democrats this democrats that, when both parties are corrupt and have only rich special interest in mind not the american people
and you attack people for calling out the incompetence of the federal gov't simply because a republican is in power?Open your eyes, this government whether it be a democrat or a republican has sold us down the river years ago while we get updates on britney spears' baby or natalie holloway by the MSM.
some on this board would rather more britney coverage rather than reporting that keeps the GOVERNMENT ACCOUNTABLE despite the party.
WAKE UP
The point is...
July 23, 2008 - 16:03 ET by ontheright...give credit where credit is due.
Regardless of what the BDS whackos believe, not everything happening in the country today is Bush's fault. That is the point.
And you are absolutely correct, the mantra should NOT be Dimocrat this and Dimocrat that...it should correctly be chanted as liberal this and liberal that.
Not that we don't despise the over-bloated, do nothing for "We the People", power hungry charlatans in DC.
That should be a given to ANYONE who pays attention.
Hey bud
July 23, 2008 - 16:09 ET by expatriotRead what was written and then think. No one in this thread is promoting the Bush administration. What you fail to see is that Louie is off the wall and was called on it. He is espousing the increase in gov't involvement and the throwing overboard of market economics.
No one is supporting a bail out and most are supporting responsibility. If you get in over your head, start dog paddling. Don't count on the gov't to save you. If you drown you drown. I think Darwin would support that point of view. Survival of the fittest isn't it?
Here we go again, sajc!!!
July 24, 2008 - 05:36 ET by Unsanesajc, every time you post here you show yourself to be an even bigger embarrassment and a Conspiro than the LAST time.
Let's go one by one.
The dollar is crashing, So why isn't the British Pound the world's reserve currency then, huh, Currency Fetishist?
the banks are failing Really? My banks are doing GREAT. A number of banks fail every year. Don't look for me to join a bank run anytime soon.
our government keeps printing out money to pay for things it cannot afford Actually, they keep borrowing (and not from China, so save it, one-third of the debt is foreign owned, mostly by Europe and Japan) for that purpose. Better.
bush's keeps pushing for a north american union destroying this country for good. Whoever believes this only proves to me that they have zero understanding of the HISTORY and CULTURE of three nations. Study your freaking HISTORY and know your CULTURE and get back to me.
To wit:
From The Economist, 14 July 2007:
“Some Canadians see Mr Harper’s trip as part of his general desire to be in step with George Bush. The prime minister has made smooth relations with the United States a priority. Afghanistan has become the top recipient of Canadian aid. Mr Harper’s government has given outspoken support to Israel; its relations with China have been strained. Nevertheless, this week Mr Harper announced plans to purchase up to eight patrol ships for light icebreaking duties to assert Canadian sovereignty over Arctic seaways, which is contested by the United States.”
So, if Canada is going to take part in this magic happy merger, can you explain the final sentence of the above passage?
Or, from James Dunnigan and Austin Bay, A Quick and Dirty Guide to War:
“Is Soviet-style political devolution (of Mexico) possible? Mexico may be seen as three separate nations: the “Panista” north, the traditional Mexico of Mexico City and the central states, and the Indian south. Let’s say the PRD takes control of several southern states and the northern states become dominated by the PAN. What keeps Mexico together if the southern states discover they have more in common with the rest of Central America?” (p.599) Hmmm. Looks like they have enough problems keeping united themselves...
Yes, we COULD have a "North American Union". BUT it requires a certain ingredient...something none of you Conspiros want to ever dare admit to. It is the same ingredient it took for the European Union to form. And it is quite unpleasant. Care to guess what that ingredient is?
Americans are encouraged by our president to keep growing in debt spending beyond their means. The President is not sticking a gun at 300 million heads, forcing them to go into debt. Get a grip. People go into debt of their own freewill. Stop blaming other people for the lack of personal responsibility of others. Here you sound like a whacked out Leftist.
stop crying democrats this democrats that, when both parties are corrupt and have only rich special interest in mind not the american people sajc, I am confused. Are you now a Socialist who wishes to punish and destroy successful people and corporations?
and you attack people for calling out the incompetence of the federal gov't simply because a republican is in power?Open your eyes, this government whether it be a democrat or a republican has sold us down the river years ago while we get updates on britney spears' baby or natalie holloway by the MSM. The government sold us down the river? Not me, as I vote and keep the pressure up on my representatives. The people who whine this deserve all the crap they can handle from the government.
Now wake the hell up and quit your whining and conspiracy spinning.
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
UNSANE just keep your head
July 24, 2008 - 13:15 ET by sajc05UNSANE
just keep your head and the sand and the let the media brain wash you.
yes the dollar is strong, there is no banking crises. the gov't doesn't print out money backed by nothing. sure. no inflation either right? do you even know that gov't changed the barometer for inflation. (a fact that you'll probably whine is a "evil conspiracy theory")
shhh... keep your ears and eys covered.
"The President is not sticking a gun at 300 million heads, forcing them to go into debt. " i'm sorry did he not use the state of the union to tell americans to SHOP! what a leader.
its shallow people like you that dismiss people who don't agree with bush as crazy leftists, or conspiracy theorists.
you're part of the problem, if you vote for a democrat there is something wrong for you and if you vote for a republican you're a hero: well at least i'm not whore to a political party.
and i'm happy you're doing fine, but others aren't. Oil prices are a result of the weak dollar tthe dollar you say is fine just because bush or limbaugh says so.
i grow weary of people who think the democrats are great or the republicans are great, they are both crooks. and i'm sorry big gov't big spending republicans are not conservatives no matter how much you wish they were.
you make some good points
July 24, 2008 - 15:09 ET by mbuelBut the democrats are still crooks and marxists.
I'm sorry I'd rather have a big government conservative like Bush, than ANY marxist democrat, including Obama.
Do you really think any of the dems running would be a good idea?
Consider the following:
1) Dems would tax us all into the ground (not including the ridiculous global warming crap). Simply by allowing Bush's tax cuts to expire would increase ALL of our taxes back to Clinton levels. And that doesn't include all of the increases Obama and Hillary are talking about, AND the MASSIVE increases in government the two are talking about. McCain wants to keep the Bush tax cuts, AND cut spending levels Bush has increased!
2) Pull back militarily like Clinton and Carter. Remember we had THREE terrorist attacks on American soil and property and one attempted. (the millenium bomber) yeah we could say Bush wasn't vigilant enough, but the difference is clear. If Gore had been elected there would've been NO response militarily to Al Qaeda and we would've been attacked again. While Obama is playing the rogue militarist now, it is just that... a PLAY. an ACT. As soon as he's elected he'll be the same, OR WORSE than Carter and Clinton in National defense regards.
3) The dollar falling is NOT Bush's fault. He does NOT control the federal reserve. And an interesting side effect of higher oil prices and lower dollar value is an increase in American production. Walmart is starting to re-open shops they closed down because it's to costly to ship stuff from China. European shops are opening up over here because of the low dollar, and LOWER REGULATION. (which the dems ALWAYS want to increase.)
4) Whilst McCain has talked about "saving the environment from climate change", you can bet your ass that you'll be taxed for breathing under Obama. I think McCain is just talk in this regard and for whatever reason is trying to attract more democrats to vote for him. (Probably because he sees the disparity that still exists in the party.) I don't think it's a smart move, and as long as we keep real conservatives in the house and senate it shouldn't be TOO big of a problem. That's the key. (as Limbaugh has stated numerous times.)
5) Do you think that we would've gotten the gun rights we have today if Gore or Kerry were elected? They would've pushed through a leftist supreme court judge, and that 5-4 decision would've gone the other way! Not to mention that we need to fight for more seats to prevent more relativistic crap like not being allowed to put child rapists to death..... (or some other 5-4 that will likely come up again... Imagine if we can get another conservative judge on the court?)
Oil prices are due to future percieved shortages AND the value of the dollar slipping.. most of it is due to that fact that if no more supply comes online by 2012 (just guessing on the date here) we could be short by ~10 million bbpd. That's a problem that our no-drill dems refuse to accept. Why? because of the "problem" of Global Warming.
So continue to be a relativist and say there are no differences between the parties. You're only hurting yourself.
Growing weary of sajc
July 24, 2008 - 16:45 ET by Unsanejust keep your head and the sand and the let the media brain wash you How utterly creative. I can't think of the last time I tuned into the American media except through here. Just keep your head in the hippie lettuce...
yes the dollar is strong, there is no banking crises. the gov't doesn't print out money backed by nothing. So? You must be one of those gold bugs that wants to waste a perfectly good element on money. I like using gold for other things, like conducting sound for starters. sure. no inflation either right? do you even know that gov't changed the barometer for inflation. (a fact that you'll probably whine is a "evil conspiracy theory") Actually, I am going to say something entirely different. You need to grow up, face 6000 years of human civilization, and accept the nasty fact that money fluctuates in value and always has and always will. Money is NOT a store of value, it is ONLY a medium of exchange.
"The President is not sticking a gun at 300 million heads, forcing them to go into debt. " i'm sorry did he not use the state of the union to tell americans to SHOP! what a leader. What a brain-dead poster. What an absolutely brain-dead poster. Yeah, hundreds of millions of people plunged themselves into debt because they have absolutely no freewill and are mere automatons that will do everything the freewill-depriving Bush tells them without question.
GROW UP. If people wish to plunge themselves into debt, that isn't the President's fault; it is on THEM. Nor is it my fault.
its shallow people like you that dismiss people who don't agree with bush as crazy leftists, or conspiracy theorists. It's shallow people like you who think that I 1000% agree with everything Bush says. I agree with some of what he says and does. If I wanted the perfect President, I would run myself.
you're part of the problem, if you vote for a democrat there is something wrong for you and if you vote for a republican you're a hero: well at least i'm not whore to a political party. And you are better than everyone on this board I am sure. You think I am a card carrying Republican? You had BETTER think again. You know what they say about "assuming". Or am I a Republican in your mind because I don't have your same foolish beliefs?
and i'm happy you're doing fine, but others aren't. Oil prices are a result of the weak dollar tthe dollar you say is fine just because bush or limbaugh says so. Oil prices are IN PART a result of a weaker dollar but owe more to two things you seem blithely ignorant of among countless other things: supply and demand.
i grow weary of people who think the democrats are great or the republicans are great, they are both crooks. and i'm sorry big gov't big spending republicans are not conservatives no matter how much you wish they were Um, sweetie, you need to find for me where I have ever said such. For that matter I can't think of party wonks here. In any event, it doesn't matter too much, as you think of yourself as the only "true conservative" on the board. (Yes, my memory is quite long on that score.)
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
MBUEL don't take my
July 24, 2008 - 19:30 ET by sajc05MBUEL
don't take my disdain for bush as love for obama, I too know that he would be very bad for this country right now. the last thing we need is even bigger gov't and even more taxes.
I myself will probably end up writing in newt.
UNSANE
points taken, however, I do not consider myself the only conservative here. I do speak for many disenfranchised conservatives who thought they had a home in the republican party but it turned into the democratic party only different lobbyists. no lobbyists for the american people anymore and its sad. dobbs points that out but since here dared to say something bad about the president he gets targeted by the big government conservatives. and there is a difference between free trade and fair trade
Shrieking populist demagogue
July 25, 2008 - 03:35 ET by Unsaneand there is a difference between free trade and fair trade The main difference being that whenever I see the word "fair" thrown about in political discourse (like "fair trade"), I instantaneously see more red flags than a May Day parade at Red Square, or is that Кразний Пложедь? Fair is relative. What is "fair" to you may be wildly "unfair" to someone else. Hence I run the hell away from the word "fair".
I do speak for many disenfranchised conservatives who thought they had a home in the republican party Well, I hope you learned your lesson. The great thing is that the Republcan party CAN be taken back by conservatives again if the Rightists so wish. Regardless, I am not now nor have I even been a party guy.
dobbs points that out but since here dared to say something bad about the president he gets targeted by the big government conservatives. I don't think you read NB that much. I and others have been plenty critical of Bush in different arenas. The problem is that Mr. Dobbs only has it right on one issue: illegal immigration. Beyond that, he is nothing more than a shrieking populist demagogue. I don't like shrieking populist demagogues.
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
newt
July 25, 2008 - 09:54 ET by mbuelA vote for newt may as well be a vote for Obama.
I agree with the reply to your post about free trade. There is no such thing as "fair trade". Someone is always going to feel like they got shorted.
And BUSH did not cause the mortgage crisis. (clinton/carter/fed)
BUSH did not cause the dollar to fall. (fed)
Bush did not cause you to lose your job.(dems and unions)
The republicans are STILL fighting to drill, where as democrats use the logic of increasing our supply from our emergency reserve, but... Drilling will not fix the problem of supply.
MBUEL I do not think bush
July 25, 2008 - 12:28 ET by sajc05MBUEL
I do not think bush alone caused the mortgage crises however, the increasing deregulation or the taking away of any oversight of the fed and wall street absolutely played a role in this crises. With oversight the bankers and others would not have been able to bundle people's life savings into risky loans for people with no credit to buy homes
the democrats plan to lower the speed limit to 55 is dumb and short term fix
the republican plan to drill for more oil to "to get us off our oil addiction" is very backwards.
our government, if they wanted and were not controlled by oil companies, could actually fund an apollo type program that and private companies could create alternative ways to power an automobile in a few years...bush saying that by 2025 (or whenever he projected this last time) we'll be off oil is disingenuous.
UNSANE
when I say fair trade all I mean is that it is kind of unfair for an american worker who has some standard of living and the right to a some what decent wage to have to compete for a job with some one who has no standards of living and will work for pennies a day.
however I cede that in the case of some US auto makers it is not cost effective to hire americans because of the sad state of affairs with our unions who bleed employers dry, and like ford simply make no profit because, so why should they hire unionized american workers.
Various comments
July 26, 2008 - 05:08 ET by Unsanewhen I say fair trade all I mean is that it is kind of unfair for an american worker who has some standard of living and the right to a some what decent wage to have to compete for a job with some one who has no standards of living and will work for pennies a day. The economy of the United States is not static as you so wish it to be. If it were, we wouldn't have the Internet, computers...NB. We'd still be stuck making Seletrics and otherwise living in the 1950s.
Those "pennies a day" often are a FORTUNE in that particular country. What seems like pennies to us can be big-time cash for someone in certain countries; a point that is all to often missed.
I am one of those people, since my job and way of life are not guaranteed and promised to me, thinks that no one should have a job guaranteed and promised. France does that for its people; for some reason its unemployment rate hasn't been lower than 8% for 25 years and has ranged into double digits. So much for coddling workers getting people someplace.
Indeed, the auto industry is doing just fine in the United States, depending on where you look. Nissans, Hondas, Toyotas, evben Hyundais and BMWs are built here all over the southern U.S., employing many thousands of Americans at hefty wages. Most, if not all, of those facilities are non-union shops; the south does not have a union tradition the way places like MI do. All unions are really good for is pricing the labor out of the market.
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
Lou has lost all sense of
July 23, 2008 - 16:07 ET by general companyLou has lost all sense of reality, wonder how he would respond to a name calling tirade directed at him? Why is it we can no longer get any reporting that has examples and facts used as there bases, why must it always be OPINION that rules the news. Hey Lou, liars hate facts, how about using a few in your next story.
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
You have to laugh
July 23, 2008 - 16:10 ET by BluegillLou is always so angry you would think he is going to grind his teeth down to nubs. So predictable you have to laugh. (Note to Lou: Fannie and Freddie run by high profile Dems including Obama's economic advisor, check that O thru him under the bus too)
Government Intervention is to Blame
July 23, 2008 - 16:21 ET by liberal_bug_zapperDobbs has no clue what he's talking about and it is the misinformation peddlers like Dobbs who need to be pilloried.
The free market does just fine unless it is interfered with by the government at any level. Telling lenders to make loans they had no business making, just so some people who had no business buying homes could buy homes was the fault of government. Backing those loans with government guarantees also further erodes any kind of free market that might really exist.
We who support a true free market understand the more the government interferes, the worse problems get... and then, this sophistry and bile spewing from the likes of Dobbs about how those who support Free Markets are to blame and are ignorant or hypocritical is dangerous and worthy of being jailed or worse. It's like yelling fire in a crowded theater. Or worse, it's just like insider trading or short selling a stock when it's your words that influence what happens to that stock.... this is criminal on Dobbs part and he should be locked up.
____________________________________________________
"A society that puts equality...ahead of freedom will end up with neither equality nor freedom." ~ Milton Friedman
Liberal Bug Zapper, I
July 23, 2008 - 19:02 ET by Trix RabbitLiberal Bug Zapper,
I couldn't agree with you more. However, I would add that free market capitalism, without the virtues of honesty and the freedom to succeed and/or fail is everything that Dobbs and all the other liberal nitwits say that it is - a failure. And that is what we are witnessing in the way of government bailouts for the irresponsible actions of others.
On the other hand, I'm sure that Dobbs and all his plutocrat buddies would feel very comfortable under a socialist or fascist regime.
Liberal: a power worshipper without power. George Orwell
I just don't understand why
July 23, 2008 - 19:12 ET by sajc05I just don't understand why everybody has to go after the ONLY man in the MSM who calls out BS in both parties he's not a left wing hack like olberman and he's not a "if you don't like this war you hate freedom" blowhard like hannity, he truly looks out for the american worker.
I'm not for bailouts either, if you took out a loan you couldn't pay then my tax dollars (or money printed from absolutely no where, right mr president?) shouldn't be given to help
however if we leave wall street to no oversight then crap like this happens. No oversight or regulation for a bunch of people who only see dollar signs and you think everything will run smoothly?
Dobbs the shrieking populist
July 24, 2008 - 05:43 ET by UnsaneWhat, sajc? Are you the only taxpayer in America now???
Hate to break your heart...well, not really, it is fun...but beyond Lou Dobbs reporting on illegal immigration, he is an idiot. He constantly whines and moans endlessly about outsourcing jobs, but completely ignores (it must be convenient for him to do) the jobs that get outsourced TO the United States. BMWs are just as apt, if not more so, to be made in SC as in Bayern, for just ONE example. But does Dobbs point this out? Hell no.
Mr. Dobbs seems to think (as do you) that all we need to do is to hermetically seal off the United States completely and totally from the world and all will be fine. For some reason that I can't quite put my finger on, this almost never works historically.
This shrieking populist, IMHO, is best 100% ignored.
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
Dobbs the shrieking populist
July 24, 2008 - 05:43 ET by UnsaneWhat, sajc? Are you the only taxpayer in America now???
Hate to break your heart...well, not really, it is fun...but beyond Lou Dobbs reporting on illegal immigration, he is an idiot. He constantly whines and moans endlessly about outsourcing jobs, but completely ignores (it must be convenient for him to do) the jobs that get outsourced TO the United States. BMWs are just as apt, if not more so, to be made in SC as in Bayern, for just ONE example. But does Dobbs point this out? Hell no.
Mr. Dobbs seems to think (as do you) that all we need to do is to hermetically seal off the United States completely and totally from the world and all will be fine. For some reason that I can't quite put my finger on, this almost never works historically.
This shrieking populist, IMHO, is best 100% ignored.
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
wow. you took my comment to
July 24, 2008 - 13:20 ET by sajc05wow. you took my comment to mean that I think i'm the only taxpayer in america?
you're... you're not terribly clear on a lot of things are you?
Worry about YOUR clarity not mine
July 24, 2008 - 16:49 ET by UnsaneI do that to anyone who whines "MY tax dollars".
You're not clear at ALL on ANYTHING are you?
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.
I only like Dobbs in regards
July 23, 2008 - 17:35 ET by mostlymoderateI only like Dobbs in regards to immigration. His highlighting of the illegal-occupation of Mexican invaders is fantastic. Other than that, he is quite the turd-in-the-punchbowl.
It is about time for Lou to
July 23, 2008 - 19:27 ET by d1carterIt is about time for Lou to retire again...
Is there no beginning to
July 24, 2008 - 01:04 ET by fitzfongIs there no beginning to the intelligence of CNN personalities? It's the fault of the Bush Administration because some people borrowed more money than they could afford to pay back and because some lenders loaned money to risky borrowers? If anyone is ignorant, hypocritical and sanctimonious it's that bloated economic illiterate Lou Dobbs.
"Government's view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it." -Ronald Reagan
fitzfong.blogspot.com
Gotta go with Dobb's on this one
July 24, 2008 - 11:19 ET by edweirdnessI must say, that Lou Dobb's has definitly hit the baby on the soft spot with his analysis of the Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac bailout. Government's policy (at least during the Bush administration) has been that it's alright for citizens to crash and burn economically, particularly now that their rewrite of the bankruptcy code ensures that banks issueing credit cards get their blood money before the ashes cool.
Policies that allow, or in this case, gloss over bad corporate governance and decision making at major financial institutions, cannot be considered sound economic or social policy. Leaving tax payers hanging out for the debts that "empty suits" accumulated in their lust for incentives is definitley not in anyone's interests. As for investors, what part of "risk" are they having trouble understanding?
Joe Sixpack would love to be guaranteed that "bad decisions" he makes won't come back to bite him in the posterior, but what are the chances of that happening?
Besides, in a world without absolutes, we have no basis for analyzing anything, and ya gotta start somewhere!
Free markets
July 24, 2008 - 13:48 ET by edweirdnessFree markets in the absence of prudent oversight are little more than sanctioned criminality. Obviously everyone who benefits from things the way they are will resist any attempt at change!
Failure is allways an option!
Marxist comment
July 26, 2008 - 05:10 ET by UnsaneFree markets in the absence of prudent oversight are little more than sanctioned criminality. Marxist, much?
Whoever casts a vote for Barack Obama is nothing more than a common thief. Whoever fails to vote against him is nothing more than a moral coward.