'Nightline' Excludes Christian Scholars from Debate on the Devil

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ABC explored the existence of Satan during the March 26 "Nightline" but stacked the deck in favor of those who do not believe the devil exists.

Harris invited internationally known, and in some circles, renowned, New Age guru Deepak Chopra to argue that Satan does not exist. Bishop Carlton Pearson, hailed as a "former fundamentalist preacher who says he used to cast demons out his followers," joined Chopra.

Mark Driscoll, labeled a "hip yet hard-line preacher," and Annie Lobert, a former prostitute and leader of the "Hookers for Jesus" outreach program in Las Vegas, represented the view that the devil does exist. Lobert herself noted her lack of intellectual credentials, "I don't have a theologian background, but I have 16 years of experience of walking with the Devil so I know he's real for sure."

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"Nightline" gave audiences a balanced look at the issue. Chopra argued it's the unhealthy people in the world who need Satan: "Healthy people do not have any need for Satan. Healthy people need to confront their own issues and that all the trouble in the world today is between religious ideologies. So I would say be done with Satan, and confront your own issues."

Lobert testified about her own experience with what she believed was the devil:

I am a former escort/prostitute/stripper, what have you. And a night came in my life where I faced death. I O.D.'d on cocaine because I hated myself. And I kept hearing voices to tell me to kill myself. There was no reason to go on. And I know that wasn't coming from inside of me. There was a diabolical force speaking to me. And I truly believe it was the devil and his demons.

Driscoll argued that the world can't have goodness without evil as a counterpoint. He stated, "I think [God] created angels and people and he gave us the capacity to have free will for there to be virtue, there must be the possibility of vice ... I think if you don't allow choice, the theologians will say you don't have love. And so the argument is made that if God were not allowing choice, then you wouldn't have evil, but you also would not have love."

"It's awkward for me to be here tonight because I'm from four generations of Demon caster-outers and I think that the best way to get people free is to get them to stop believing so much in this hairy, horny, freaky, scary, omnipresent entity and it will not manifest the way we have believed it to," stated Pearson.

So yes, each was allowed to present their argument for or against the existence of the devil, but the fact remains the most notable authority in the debate was a non-Christian scholar who called those that believe in the devil and God, "primitive." Chopra responded to Driscoll's argument with:

It's actually a little difficult for me to respond because everything he says is in contradiction to what we know about the physical universe, that began about 13.8 billion years ago, in something called the Big Bang. I have been hearing all the terminology. How come you're all so convinced that God is a he or Satan is a he when she be a black woman, you know? The point is, and how come we have the ideas that are so primitive. Why don't we understand that so far evil is a part of ourselves?

Harris appeared on the March 26 "O'Reilly Factor" to promote his "Nightline segment and told host Bill O'Reilly, "I've been covering evangelicals for years now." With experience like that, Harris should have been able to find a Christian theologian to defend the idea that Satan exists. Dr. Albert Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary most likely could have effectively argued the position that the devil is real.

While Harris appeared relatively neutral as moderator of this debate, his heavy promotion of Pearson's arguments in this exchange with "O'Reilly" appearance indicated that he gave more weight to the argument that Satan does not exist:

O'REILLY: But here's what's interesting about the scientific part of it. I did about 15 years ago an investigation of exorcisms out of Rome. OK? And the Vatican to this day has kept it very quiet, because it can be exploited in hysteria. They have priests that go in and -- to people who have unexplained maladies, much like the movie. And a priest played for me a woman in Sicily's testimony where she was speaking in Etruscan, the language Etruscan. And they had it on tape. And the woman was a peasant and didn't know anything, could not have known Etruscan. And that -- those were the kinds of things that really, I went, whoa, unexplained, this, that, and the other thing. Did you get into any of that stuff?

 HARRIS: You know, one of the guys on the panel is this guy. His name is Bishop Carlton Pierson. And he is a former fundamentalist preacher. He used to cast demons out of people for a living. He had a change of heart. He now believes that Satan does not exist.

 O'REILLY: Did he refund the money of the other people that he cast them out?

 HARRIS: Unclear, but he's clearly apologetic.

 O'REILLY: Apologetic.

 HARRIS: And he is now saying that he made a big mistake. And his theology was wrong. He was leading people in the wrong direction and that...

 O'REILLY: And what does he say? The devil made him do it?

 HARRIS: He doesn't go quite that far. But...

 O'REILLY: You have got to get him on that.

HARRIS: He does say that it's a dangerous myth, that if you externalize all of our evil tendencies, as opposed to looking inside for what may be wrong about us, you can set up a straw man.

O'REILLY: Well, you can. I mean, you can make an excuse, "It's not my fault. I was possessed by a demon on Tuesday and that's why I did X, Y, and Z."

Good for ABC for including all viewpoints in this debate. But CMI suggests next time reporters should look for scholarly authorities from both sides of the aisle

—Colleen Raezler is a research assistant at the Culture and Media Institute


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.....

I thought Driscoll held his own well.  Chopra looked over emotional and irritated and 'snobbish' and that made Driscol look calm and collected while he stated his counter arguements.

Driscoll says: "I think

Driscoll says:

"I think [God] created angels and people and he gave us the capacity to
have free will for there to be virtue, there must be the possibility of
vice ... I think if you don't allow choice, the theologians will say
you don't have love. And so the argument is made that if God were not
allowing choice, then you wouldn't have evil, but you also would not
have love."

HUH???????

God created evil  as a balance for good, so that he could give us free will????

What is this man's background in theology and what qualifies him to be a "preacher?"

 

I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson

I disagree. How can you

I disagree. How can you judge a man as good when he has had no opportunity to be otherwise? That's the statist way of thinking. We will create the perfect man or perfect society by creating the environment where there are no other options. Good is a choice that we must make continually every moment of every day of our lives.

The story of Eden gifted man with the knowledge of good and evil. In other words a conscience. Evil is to know something is wrong and to choose to do it anyway. This is even recognized in our systems of justice. We do not hold those who are incapable of telling the difference between right and wrong accountable for their actions in the same way as we do others. Evil does not take place in the world. It takes place in the hearts and souls of men.

God created evil  as a

God created evil  as a balance for good, so that he could give us free will????

Yeah dude, that is EXACTLY why God created evil. See Isaiah 45:7 Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version)

 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

  This all so silly.  We

  This all so silly.  We know where the devil is....

So Nightline, this is

So Nightline, this is news???

~How's that old saying go?

"The biggest trick Satan ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist". Apt.

 

 

That high-pitched scream you hear is the troll under my heel. 

Great quote choselife. 

Great quote choselife.  That reminds me of Verbal from the movie "The Usual Suspects", as he used that quote.

 

Militant, virulent,

Militant, virulent, boilerplate, fundamentalist leftist political activist Dan Harris asserts:  "I've been covering evangelicals for years now."

Yes, another sworn enemy of evangelicals like Dan Harris who claims to be "covering evangelicals" (i.e., continually producing and featuring attack ads against evangelicals).

I await Dan Harris, ABC and their identically like-minded leftist political activists and political advocacy groups in the Washington/New York press corps to begin to "cover" the pagan left, the atheist left, the feminist left, the earth worshipping left, the race baiting left, the socialist left and the fundamentalist homosexualist left.  Don't hold your breath waiting for that to happen ....

  A debate as to whether we

  A debate as to whether we believe the devil exists or not is really only a debate about our own personal frame of worldly reference.  The existence or non-existence of the devil is beyond rational proof.   It's the same as the argument as to the existence of God.  If you say God does not exist then that tells me information about you but none about God.

Driscoll did well

I think Driscoll did an outstanding job. I know very little about the guy but I was impressed. The host tried to barrage him early and he parried every swipe, remaining strong for the duration. The bishop even went over when they were done and ethusiastically complimented him, he may have preacher passion in him yet.

Annie seemed a bit out of place when the discussion became a Hebrew translation freestyle battle. Her initial story was very powerful in my opinion, but they quickly moved to dismiss her claims as just a product of being in a horrible environment, an invented excuse (example of Satan in itself?). That she was still in mega makeup and a rather stylish outfit likely contributed to people judging her harshly, something I'm sure an agenda-driven production staff wouldn't mind one bit.

The classic "we have data, you merely have emotion and blind faith" aura of intellectual superiority was thick in the air. Chopra's evolution rant at the beginning was only one example, another big one was the take-ball-and-go-home attitude level of enlightenment zing which Driscoll later used against him twice I think. Faith is ultimately vulnerable to the "you have no scientific proof" line of attack, but that's its definition. The bishop seemed genuine, so his "go on and keep believing that supreme lie little one" condescension didn't bother me very much.

Driscoll articulated a key point about pride, an area of discussion I think that is vital to the meaning of life. God gives us so much and allows man to reach quite far, but at the end of the day we need to tip our hat to him and bow down. I fear for those who refuse to even entertain such humility and revere man alone for the duration of their lives. Driscoll also gave a solid counter to the argument that Christians are unkind and arrogant for claiming they know the only way to heaven. Jesus said it, not the red-staters.

Lastly, I watched the show on the net (painfully via their POS resetting streaming player), but I heard that the live broadcast was edited down quite a bit. I noticed though that they did play the aggressively female questioner's entire bit on TV, which is par for the course. Emotional Christian getting uppity?  Play in full. Chopra getting owned? Edit.

When, oh, please, when, are we going to grasp that . . .

. . .the advocacy/adversary media DOES NOT CARE to know the truth?

They'll ALWAYS stack the deck against the truth.

And, spiritually speaking, if you appear to work for Satan, as the advocacy/adversary media does, would it make sense to give a fair hearing to whether or not your lord, the prince of darkness who is also your motivator, exists?

C'mon.

And Chopra as some expert? Please. The guy's a joke, a manufacture of the advocacy/adversary media and, irritatingly, of Hannity, who keeps having this New Age clown appear now and then.

I agree....Chopra is a 

I agree....Chopra is a  New-Age Spiritualist who has no connection to any real faith; his philosophy is all about the self. 

He knows as much about God and Satan as I do about acupuncture: that is, I've heard of it, and I know that some people believe in it, but that's about all.

I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson

CKA... Totally agree

CKA...

Totally agree about Chopra...bad enough he is a darling of CNN...but when Hannity keeps having him on I click it.

Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart

The show may not have proven

The show may not have proven the existence of the devil but it did prove the existence of morons on TV.

Satan is in the Bible, for crying out loud!

What's going on?! How can any Christian seriously doubt Satan's existence? It's stated in the Bible how good and evil came into this world. Man's fall from grace instigated by Satan! What's there to discuss? If you believe in God, then you cannot not believe in Satan! But wait, the msm and all these pseudo "anything goes" Christians believe in themselves and their own judgments and not in God's word. Thus, they don't believe in hell or celibacy nor in gayness being a sin. They just think that God didn't "really" condemn homosexuality or promiscuity. Nor do they believe in Adam and Eve but evolution and Adam and Steve. Those pseudo-Christians and heretics think they are so much smarter than God! And of course Satan exists. The Bible calls him "the God of this world" and just look at the msm and you can clearly see his evil spirit all over the place. Look at how Christians and conservatives are ridiculed and how depravity is celebrated on MTV. Look at Obama the infanticist and pathological liar. He is the president this depraved world ruled by Satan deserves.

You're on target: "How can any Christian seriously doubt..."

Chrisitans don't doubt there is Satan.

Pretend-Christians, be they New-Agey types such as Obama or others of whatever stripe, do.

It's an inconvenience for them.

That's because that challenges their notion of God as Santa Claus, the Big Sugar Daddy and Chief Dumbo.

It's also because they're deceived by the very Satan and his associates of whom they refuse to acknowledge.

Maybe, too, it's because they haven't dusted off a copy of the Bible and actually read it.

Whatever.

Well said, matey!

Well said, matey!

Douchebag Chopra

Chopra argued it's the unhealthy people in the world who need Satan: "Healthy people do not have any need for Satan. Healthy people need to confront their own issues and that all the trouble in the world today is between religious ideologies.

Oh really?

Hitler was a religious ideology?

North Korea is a religious ideology? 

Anything out of the Soviet Union was a religious ideology?

Khmer Rouge (Pol Pot) was a religious ideology? 

And Mao was all about the religious ideology?

The most murderous thugs of all history banished religion and yet managed to kill more people than anyone else in history.

Let's also not forget that it is people who use religion to motivate others to war in order to amass land, natural resources and riches.

Since when did Western Christians get together and decide to purposefully make war in the Middle East because the folks were another religion?

Clue - We don't care that they are Muslims.

What's needed is to excise or marginalize the people that inflame and incite anger and violence using religion.  Let's start with Dan Harris and Chopra.

Well said, Stratman!

Well said, Stratman!

What this debate called into

What this debate called into mind is the NECESSITY OF purging the Christian Church of FALSE DOCTRINE. I realize that this is my "hobby horse" but DANG. A religious debate where the ONLY PERSON who didn't at one time say something COMPLETELY STUPID was the Ex Prostitute, oughtta TELL YOU SOMETHING.!

 

A remarkable young woman who has obviously been through a lot, came through as perhaps the ONLY one who had actually had an experience with Jesus Christ! That is because not one single thing she said can be biblically questioned. She was smart intelligent and she stuck to the weight of her personal experience which was compelling.  Many of you on this blog call me an extremist because my posts are generally about the exposure of false doctrine. I'm 'Harsh", "Judgmental" and  a whole lot of other stuff I won't repeat. Maybe looking at the MISH MASH of JUNK that came out of the mouths of those who were SUPPOSEDLY versed in the bible will make you re-think that. 

 

I urge Christians to return to the truth of Scripture, NOT tradition or "this is the way my momma did it"!  Allow me to expose this filth fest for what it was. Carlton Pearson is a false teacher who was ALWAYS A FALSE PREACHER. While he spoke about "speaking in tongues", which he is now somehow dismissing, he NEVER baptized people properly in Jesus' NAME. That's how satan got in! The devil can speak in tongues too! That's why we don't as a rule speak in tongues around those who have not yet received the Holy Ghost because they might have a "mocking" spirit attached to them! But when they are baptized in JESUS NAME a satanic spirit cannot survive the process. This is how satan got a foothold in the Catholic Church, because they don't baptize properly and DON'T clothe themselves in the "garment" (Holy Ghost) that Christ provided for not only our salvation but also our PROTECTION! 

 

So now Carlton Pearson DISMISSES the entire bible as not being inspired by God when the bible says that it is! So how does he still get called "Bishop"? Because no one is willing to say the truth, that he is an apostate loser who no longer, deserves the title! AND he is ACTIVELY teaching AGAINST the truth of scripture! He says that demons are only in our minds and there is no devil. Well, then what he is REALLY saying is that JESUS WAS CRAZY! Because JESUS certainly cast DEMONS, not figments of imagination, out of people! Jesus certainly spoke about satan and called him by name. Jesus is the one who said, "And I saw satan fall like lightning from heaven!"

 

We are so LUKE WARM as a nation that we cannot even read the bible for ourselves and decide who is or is not teaching it correctly! Pearson's nonsense was ably countered by Mark Driscoll, who himself, while a bit more serious than Pearson, is ALSO a teacher of false doctrine. I first became interested in Driscoll about a year ago. He started getting a lot of press about his alleged "fundamentalism"  and was heralded as a fundamentalist "hippster", so I checked him out.  Here are some of the areas in which his "doctrine" is false. 

 

He believes that a Christian once saved is "eternally saved". This is nonsense. While the scriptures do say in reference to us being taken away from Christ by the beguiling of another that , "No man can pluck them from my hand", we are certainly capable of WALKING AWAY. The doctrine of eternal salvation regardless of what the individual does is hogwash, is JUDAS SAVED? Will Judas be in heaven with the other Apostles?Since the names of the twelve apostles are listed on the gates of the heavenly city and Judas is not among them, I would say no! So would the Apostles. After Judas' death, the apostles thought they would select between two candidates to replace him. In doing so they said this about Judas....

 

Acts 1:24-26 (King James Version)

 24And they prayed, and said, Thou, Lord, which knowest the hearts of all men, shew whether of these two thou hast chosen,

 25That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.

 26And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

Not only do they say that Judas FELL and went to his own place they also no longer numbered him with the others. Driscolls website is replete with false doctrine. He implys that the gifts of the Spirit have absolutely NO PURPOSE whatsoever since in his words they are "neither essential, nor prove the presence of the Holy Spirit, nor are an indication of deep spiritual experience", causing one to wonder just what the heck they might be for. (http://www.marshillc...) Anyway, I could spend all day dissecting Driscolls multiple false statements concerning Christ on his website, but one thing he said live during the debate stood out. He said that GOD DID NOT CREATE EVIL. He said that when God created Lucifer he was an angel and therefore "good" but after he fell he turned bad and all of the evil in the world came from satan and had NO ORIGIN in God. You would think that a PASTOR of a church would AT LEAST know where the evil he is fighting comes from!

Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version)

 7I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

NOTHING that was created was NOT created by God! How sad. Now those of you who wanna call me names might look at this and wonder how a pastor could say this when it is so clearly printed in the Word. The answer is because he is a teacher of FALSE DOCTRINE who DISPARAGES the Gifts of the Holy Spirit, he OBVIOUSLY doesn't HAVE ANY OF THEM! That would be why he cannot remember or even conceive of the breadth and depth of the word when he's just musing. 

That said, he's a decent earnest sort of guy who I liked immensely, I respect his stand for Christ in the face of haters, apostates preachers and godless media. I prayed for him to know the Lord in "spirit and in truth" one day. 

Deepak Chopra's junk was predictably junk but one interesting thing was the anger which he was trying so desperately to hide. 

But my heart went to Annie, the ex-prostitute who told her story in such a heartfelt manner, I pray the Lord bless and keep her also in Spirit and in Truth. 

Looking at this display is the exact reason that I continually exhort you and others to SEARCH THE SCRIPTURES and COMPARE THEM with what your churches might be teaching. Things like baptism and reception of the Holy Spirit are not SMALL THINGS. They are the whole shebang! 

 

 

Clarification

To be clear, the "evil" in that passage, "I make peace, and create evil" refers to the evils of afflictions and punishments, but not the evil of sin.  (The original hebrew word can refer to either, but the full context of the passage makes it clear what is meant.)   The evil of sin is of course a result of the choice of the created beings who have intellect and free will.

 

the devil is dead

Carlton Pierson is a polished and articulate spokesman but as Elaine said "he's playing for the other team". I commend him for being true to himself but that unfortunately is the essence of heresy. I caught his comments at the end saying of Lobert "she is young in the Lord and she is a prostitute" as a kind of postscript to naivety. I thought gee Carlton, I'll forgive your views, you're a negro. Driscoll did a real good job...  not smart to try and push him off the road.