I guess I am taking kind of a chance here. I am taking one of the more popular members of this site to the woodshed and there might be some backlash. I am referring to futbolisgreat.
I was on the discussion with the Bill Maher thread yesterday. I really don't want to make this about religion, but rather about something he said about covering things up.
It was kind of shocking when he implied that even if he knew a family member or I guess a very close church friend that he considerers family was a pediphile and was taking advantage of little kids, he would not turn them in. What is more, he is accusing me of having a lousy family, because I said I would do otherwise.
In futbolisgreats world, he would not even turn the familiy member in, if that person was one of the people that flew the plane into the world trade center. Yes I know that is an extreme comparision, but I feel pedophilia is about as extreme as you can get.
So NBers is blood thinker than water no matter what?
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
is it okay to turn in a family member?
April 15, 2008 - 09:43 ET by shawn228I am not talking about Jay walking, drugs stealing, cheating or a DUI. I am talking about taking advantage of kids or mass murder. Is it okay to turn in a family member if you knew they have done something horrible that effects other peoples families?
I agree with you, Shawn.
April 17, 2008 - 18:08 ET by Roger the ShrubberI agree with you, Shawn. Pedophilia, especially.
We all know what happened in "Striking Distance".
thx Roger
April 17, 2008 - 23:11 ET by shawn228I also am liking how the Pope is addressing this situation by comforting some of the victims.
I do not understand the reference to Striking Distance. That was the movie with a very cute young Sarah Jessica Parker right? At least you didn't bring up Hudson Hawk:-)
Right. Dennis Farina was
April 18, 2008 - 15:19 ET by Roger the ShrubberRight.
Dennis Farina was covering for Robert Pastorelli's murders because he was his son. Plus, Bruce Willis still had some hair.
I would certainly advise
April 15, 2008 - 18:49 ET by AvatarI would certainly advise them to turn themselves in first, barring that, yes, i WOULD turn in a family member for pedophilia or murder. It is my obligation to society and to my Lord to protect the innocent potential victims of my deranged family member.
The Avatar
twisting futbalisgreats words?
April 15, 2008 - 21:08 ET by shawn228I just want to make sure I don't get accused of twisting futbals words. I'm pretty sure he is referring to the brotherhood of the Catholic Church as his family. Lets take a look at what he said.
"Kind of sad to have a sense of family and honor? Only you.
YOu don't know what I would do to him, punishment stays within the
family. So don't assume. I think the punishment would start by me
finding out he/she is a pedophile.
If the police caught him/her, I would do everything legally and
morally within my power to help them and defend them. Does it mean
that I believe he/her did right, that I agree with the horrific action,
of course not.
but it is NOT my place to denounce publicly (key word there, publicly) any family member of mine.
I would never turn a family member into the police or admit pubicly any of the sins of a family member.
I think the sad one is you. That you fail to understand this, speaks tons of who you are."
Am I misinterpreting something or is he saying, the Church was right to keep this under wraps and anyone whistle blower is bad person?
Circling the wagons i
April 16, 2008 - 14:53 ET by AvatarCircling the wagons i believe is the term i would ascribe to that. My father's a pastor, and was the circuit pastor when one of the other local pastors was engaged in questionable activity. There was no circling the wagons here, the pastors from that circuit immediately advised the offending pastor to step down, which he did.
There are ways to clean your own house out, like the above example. The church is NOT a club, or a brotherhood of priests or pastors to protect 'club honor' by feigning ignorance when the guilt is clear. Pastors and priests are to lead by example, and it says far more about a synod that adequately cleans their own house and admits it's mistakes and tries to rectify them, rather than the synod that tries to hide and cover up the misdeeds of it's clergy.
The Avatar
Not turning in pediphiles
April 17, 2008 - 09:29 ET by shawn228Circling the wagons is a good term. Would you say the poster in question is implying whisleblowers have no honor, or am I misreading it?
I would agree with that
April 17, 2008 - 16:14 ET by AvatarI would agree with that assessment.
The Avatar
Without a doubt!
April 15, 2008 - 19:00 ET by SyriusNo justification to harbor a criminal. I'd try to be the first to hand them over to the authorities and if there was a reward I'd hand it over to the victim or their family.
Syrius
"...the dire consequences to society when people begin to believe that by
renaming someone to erase their humanity opens the door to the
devaluation of everyone's life..."-dscott
That would be the right thing to do Syrius
April 15, 2008 - 21:01 ET by shawn228I appreciate your common sense and logic
"Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered. . ."
April 15, 2008 - 21:27 ET by tracheostomySo I'm opting out of this thread completely.
I abhor kicking a man when he's down. The thread in question was sickening enough. You wanna dig it up just to have another go at it.
-PJ
"Trake: Your lofty convictions are another blemish on the rump of congregational sectarianism." -Tumbler 5/15/07
kicking futbol when he is down?
April 15, 2008 - 21:46 ET by shawn228I hardly believe I am kicking futbol when he is down, he sure seemed like he was making no apologies for his stance.
I truly want to know if he meant what he said about the Church is right for keeping this stuff under wraps or just trying to get attention.
Also most NB members identify with Futbols beliefs much more than mine and he is pretty well liked as well. I just want to have some honest answers about how many people agree with his logic in the case of coverups, when it involves your family/church family
I am also curious if members will defend him because he is a popular member or agree that his thinking is on the wrong end of the moral spectrum
Shawn... I didn't even
May 27, 2008 - 23:02 ET by futbolisgreat1Shawn...
I didn't even know you had given me the honor to create a whole forum about me.
Shawn, thank you, thank you, thank you. I never realize that words over a computer would have such a great impact on weak minded people like you....but to throw some goodies to the mindless like you, let me reply.......
let's clarify a couple of points that you clearly, clearly twisted...
1) Members of the Roman Catholic Church are not my blood relatives. I find a priest molesting a child I would IMMEDIATLY call the godfather of my son, who is a cop. Nice try there buddy.
2) You assume that the local, city, state, federal authority are moral and good. While there are many honorable cops, agents, lawyers, etc....our judicial system is filled with individuals that do as bad or worst than pedophile. Why would I turn in a blood relative to a system filled with individuals that are as guilty or more so than your example of a blood relative.
3) You do not understand honor. You must have one disfunctional family. Furthermore, you do not know our judicial system from the cop arresting you, to the prosecutor to the judge. Here in America people regard law enforcers as incorruptable gods. Believe me, they are FAR from it.
4) What you also failed to say is that I would much rather take justice into my own hands than allow a corrupt, destroyed, demolished, ridiculous, justice sysem do it. While I whole heartly believe in the American Constitution and what it stands for, too many corrupt individuals have molded it to mean what they want it to mean.
The State, individuals like you are not interested in justice, they are interested in the law. Do you even know the difference? I bet not.
The State, individuals like you are not interested in justice, they are interesterested in making an example of criminals. Not in just punishment.
Our judicial system is ran by a bunch of wacked out Liberal fools.
If we had a court of justice and an uncorrupted system rats like OJ Simpson would at least be spending their life on Earth behind bars. President Clinton would be in jail right now.
You scream about my stance to not turn in IMMEDIATE BLOOD relatives into the law even if I know for a FACT that they did something bad, yet you turn a blind eye to LIBERAL judges, prosecutors, etc giving weak sentence to real pedophiles, to child murderers. Where is your Woodshed forum talking about how Democrats through out the country have stood against laws like "Jessica's Law".
No thank you, pedophile is a horrific, evil, satanic act, but I much rather my immediate blood relative leave in shame, leave through justice delivered by me, than the "justice" delivered by a corrupt judicial system.
Nice try Shawn, but you fail miserably.
NEXT please!
defending your pediphile relatives
May 27, 2008 - 23:11 ET by shawn228" You assume that the local, city, state, federal authority are moral
and good. While there are many honorable cops, agents, lawyers,
etc....our judicial system is filled with individuals that do as bad or
worst than pedophile. Why would I turn in a blood relative to a system
filled with individuals that are as guilty or more so than your example
of a blood relative. "
Wow, futbol. I did not realize that you were such a fan of Tom Clancy novels.
So exactly what would you be afraid of turning your pediphile brother/uncle /cousin to the authorities? And how exactly would you take matters into your own hands, If you did not even know where he was?
I'm not weak minded, I love all my family members, but If I knew they were planning mass murder at a University or were planning on killing thousands of innocent people, even though it would hurt, It would still be the right thing to do.
Shawn, Fan of Tom Clancy
May 27, 2008 - 23:20 ET by futbolisgreat1Shawn,
Fan of Tom Clancy novels? don't get the connection.
1) I would rather kill my blood relative and I end up in jail than turn them into this incredibly corrupt system which cares NOTHING about justice. We live under a judicial system that is blinded by its laws. Once again, you don't seem to get this.
Let me give you an extreme example....
If you took our current judicial system and your way of thinking to the times of Slavery, according to you, it would be bad, really bad that a blood relative didn't turn in another blood relative that harbored run away slaves.
Another example of our upside down judicial system. It is the choice of a woman to murder her unborn child because it is her body, right? But it is illegal not to wear seat belts, even though it is also her body? eh? care to explain the contradiction?
Extreme examples, but I hope they make the point.
and let me just make it clear, I know, and understand that pedophile is evil, as evil as a an act can get. I would personally kill anyone that dare touched my son or daughter in a sexual manner. I would turn in in a heart bit a stranger, a priest, a teacher, etc, etc that I knew committed pedophile because I know how evil our judicial system is.....but I cannot do the same to an immediate blood relative.
I much rather take justice into my own hands than let the hands of this evil, corrupt, vile judicial system impose its revenge on an immediate blood relative.
As I said, you leave in a very naive world, you truly do.
see futbol :-)
May 27, 2008 - 23:25 ET by shawn228A post does not always have to consist of you insulting people. You just defended youself in a very reasonable manner.
However I still disagee with you. Let just say Mohammed Atta was your brother. You knew hours before he was to board the plane what he would do. You are in another State, you cannot get to him. Would you have been more worried about what then AG John Ashcroft would have done to him, or the thousands that would be killed that day?
Shawn, Well, you keep on
May 27, 2008 - 23:34 ET by futbolisgreat1Shawn,
Well, you keep on using these extreme examples. To be honest, if I knew that one of my two older brothers was planning a horrible attack on innocent civilians, I would more likely than not call my best friend, who is a cop and like a brother to me and tell him about it.
I would make every effort to let him know that instead of arresting them, that they go in a blaze of fire.
Shawn, I do not believe in our justice system, I truly don't.
To me, our judicial system is no different than the criminals you keep on giving as examples.
Our judicial system does arrest innocent people, why? Because cops must meet a quota of arrests a month. Innocents are given speeding tickets or other moving violations that they never committed, why? because cops must meet quotas.
Prosecutores must like, cheat, etc to convict innocent people, why? because they must meet a quota.
I can go on and on and on about this.....and let me just give you a hint...I am not talking from the criminal point of view....I have been on the side of the "law" and it aint pretty my friend.
I whole heartly understand your gun-ho attitude, "turn in all evil people, friend, family or foes..." Spend a week inside our judicial system, and your jaw will drop at how corrupt our system has become. And honestly, I blame Liberals....not Democrats, but Liberals, a great difference.
by the way, you never explained your Tom Clancy analogy.
Futbol,
May 27, 2008 - 23:41 ET by RESTLESS 1"I would make every effort to let him know that instead of arresting them, that they go in a blaze of fire."
How does the above statement make you, or your cop friend, if he went along, any better than the system you are railing against?
Shawn...
May 27, 2008 - 23:56 ET by futbolisgreat1because we wouldn't be doing it for political gain, revenge, etc, etc, etc.....we would be seeking justice for justices sake.
I am unsure how handing my blood relative to a system that is as evil as my brother makes me a good person.
by the way, you never explained your Tom Clancy analogy.
May 27, 2008 - 23:44 ET by shawn228Lol, to be honest I only read "Hunt for Red October" From what I understand Tom Clancy's novels are about conspiricy theorys.
I can see where you are coming from. I am not sure if you are a immigrant to the United States or natural born, but you mentioned you have dual citizenship and Venesuela is your other country.
I'm sure there is corruption here in the USA, but i'm sure not as rampant as a country run by Hugo Chavez.
Many police officers died for us on 911 and many of them put their lives on the line for us every day. To imply that you cannot trust the majority of the people in law enforcement is a slap in their face
Shawn, You know, for a long,
May 27, 2008 - 23:53 ET by futbolisgreat1Shawn, You know, for a long, long, long time I also believed and thought that countries like Venezuela had much, much more corruption than the United States. I hate to inform you. that's not the case. I think as BT said it down below....individuals like Nifong are a dime a dozen now a days. Shawn, you tell me....how would you feel if say your brother was amongst the group of Drake U. students that Nifon prosecuted. Say that the lady that claimed she was raped ran into you and told you this horrible story about your brother, that she had been raped by him.....and you believed her and you called the cops. Nifong gets invovled.....and BOOM!!!!!!! quitea few months later we all find out that it was all a lie and that the prosecutor, cop, etc, etc used this situation to get ahead in their career and political life.....how would you feel?
futbol
May 28, 2008 - 00:04 ET by shawn228I would feel terrible and would have felt cheated by the judicial system. I would feel the same way If I was Nicole Simpsons family.
The thing is it looks like Nifong is getting what is coming to him and OJ as well.
I don't agree with many of laws either. I personally think it is awful to spend tens of million dollars a year incarcerating people for drug possesion.
The thing is, if it came down to it. If a family member was abusing a child, they are taking away that childs innocence and will caus emotional scars for the rest of that childs life. Family member or not, they need to be punished.
I am going to bed now futbol. This in no way is an insult. I see no remnants of the raving lunatic I was debating more than 2 months ago. Maybe you had a few drinks that day.
Have a good night ;-)
shawn
May 28, 2008 - 00:26 ET by futbolisgreat1you have a good night also....
I do remember that it was very late, much later than today...so maybe that was it. :)
It's not just quota's...the
May 27, 2008 - 23:46 ET by bigtimerIt's not just quota's...the political ladder some of them strive for becomes first and foremost...no matter the person or persons they get a conviction for...Nifong ring a bell with anyone?
I worked around people like this man, for years.....it starts at the bottom and woks it's way all the way up....
Btw..before I quit for the night, there are good people that work in the same system, they just aren't the majority nor do they have the power.
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Hi BT,
May 28, 2008 - 00:00 ET by RESTLESS 1I agree with a lot of what you have said. How do we fix it? It seems that the justice system is run like a business, in that promotions go to those who get results, and managing a budget, but there isn't the same ways to gauge productivity, other than arrest rates and convictions. It's sort of a blurry landscape at that end of the system. In business, you can see profitablity, revenue, market share, etc... but in the justice system, you only see wins and losses.
R1... I am literally
May 28, 2008 - 00:06 ET by bigtimerR1...
I am literally standing up getting ready to hit the sack...how do we fix this, there have been lots of suggestions ect...all I know is the meantime a lot of innocent people go behind bars...trust me.
I really want to write a lot more, I just have to get out of here...
"Never murder your opponent when he is committing suicide." ~ W. Churchill
Good night BT.
May 28, 2008 - 00:09 ET by RESTLESS 1Good night BT.
Ahem,
May 27, 2008 - 23:37 ET by RESTLESS 1I will try to be succinct here. Futbol, you are trying to turn this into a debate and indictment of the justice system. The fact remains, if someone has, or is going to, commit horrific crimes, then they should be turned in, family or not. Do dichotomies exist regarding results? Yes. Are there corrupt members in the justice system? Yes. That does not mean we set criminals free. You guarantee that your justice would be worse than what a family member would receive via the justice system. You sell your own argument down the river with such a statement.
In addition, these are crimes against the community, and the community deserves to have justice, not just you. I respect many of your comments, but I do not, and will not agree with you here.
Restless 1, 1) If you know
May 27, 2008 - 23:48 ET by futbolisgreat1Restless 1, 1) If you know anything about me. I do not go on this forum to agree with anyone. I speak my mind and what I believe.
2) Why am I selling my argument short when I claim that my justice would be worst than anything our corrupt justice would hand out? More likely than not, my blood relative (example given my Shawn) that committed the unspeakable crime would end up free, or with some light sentence. Probably the ACLU would defend them and the city afraid of going bankrupt would back off. I mean if your sense of justice is abortions are legals...no thanks, keep your justice system. If your sense of justice is an underage child can't drink an aspirin without a parents permission, but she can have an abortion without the parents permission, no thanks, keep your justice system. If your justice is a cop arresting you to meet his/her quota for the month to keep his/her job, no thank you, keep your justice system. If your justice is letting OJ Simpson free do to corrupt prosecutors, you can keep your justice system. I can give you countless examples of how our justice system is a joke, a pathetic, laughable joke. As I said, Slavery was once the law....would you say then that if you lived during Slavery and since it was the law, you would have turned in a brother, father, mother, friend who harbored a slave?
As for the community seeking justice...unfortunately what you find today is the community seeking revenge, not justice. How different does that make the community from criminal?
I truly believe that none of us know what we would do if we found out that a brother, sister, etc was about to commit a horrible crime, this is all hypothetical and I am telling you what I believe is the right thing to do from personal experience, being in the business of justice myself for a while.
Futbol,
May 28, 2008 - 00:07 ET by RESTLESS 1Okay, are you saying that you don't trust the system to be hard enough on a relative, or too hard?
From your post above:
"To me, our judicial system is no different than the criminals you keep on giving as examples.
Our judicial system does arrest innocent people, why? Because cops
must meet a quota of arrests a month. Innocents are given speeding
tickets or other moving violations that they never committed, why?
because cops must meet quotas.
Prosecutores must like, cheat, etc to convict innocent people, why? because they must meet a quota. "
From your response to me:
"More likely than not, my blood relative (example given my Shawn) that
committed the unspeakable crime would end up free, or with some light
sentence. Probably the ACLU would defend them and the city afraid of
going bankrupt would back off."
So which is it, they would get away with it, or be prosecuted, jailed, or face the death penalty unfairly? Just trying to get where you are coming from.
Restless 1, It is
May 28, 2008 - 00:39 ET by futbolisgreat1Restless 1,
It is both....don't you get it?! There is ZERO justice...the criminals go free and the innocents are punished. I know this is not always the case....but it happens more often thatn it should.
The innocent will get the speeding ticket, will be arrested so the cop meets his quota and don't let anyone here tell me this is NOT A FACT......
The criminal will be defended by corrupt lawyers, or prosecuted by corrupt lawyers and end up free.
The system is too soft on criminals and to hard on the innocent.
Once again Restless 1, it is hard to convince me other wise when I have lived these examples on a daily basis for years.
Let me give you an example....
In the city where I live, Chicago, the City of Chicago set up a sting operation to grab solicistors of prostitutes, right? You know, your typical prostitute sting operation.
Undercover woman cop is the prostitute, she is walking by a light, when cars stop at the light she walks up to the cars and tries to get them to offer her money for sex.
Well guess what...do you think that she followed the law, that the arresting cops followed the law? NO!
Why, because the city fo chicago put pressure on the cops to make a certain amount of arrests under this new iniciatives so rats like Mayor Daley could get re-elected by showing how tought they were on crime!
I personally know couples who marriage ended because of the lies told by cops on this stings.
I personally know individuals that recorded the conversation between the under cover cop and the "client" and it was shown that the "client" said no at all times, no, no, no....and still the person was arrested. I personally know how a brother and sister were arrested because supposedly they were seeking a threesome....etc, etc, etc.....shall I continue? I personally know a Seargent of a different police district that was arrested under this sting while he had his baby in the car! None of these stuck in court, thank goodness!! but in the mean time guess what....marriages were rocked, marriages ended, and the city of Chicago made millions throught the impounding fees, arresting innocent individuals who for months suffered through sting operations like this one which were ment to keep corrupt rats in political posts rather than clean the streets of Chicago.
Is this your sense of justice? is this the type of justice you want? Anyone and everyone that went after the city...guess what happened, lost! why because all the lawyers were bought by the rat Mayor Daley......
get it yet? do not tell me our justice system, our law enforcement officers are great individuals that deserve all types of praise. While many are great, many are equally bad....sadly, today there are more bad than good.
Re: Vigilante Justice
June 2, 2008 - 11:08 ET by packmanRestless1,
I think you have cut to the chase on this issue. So many people are willing to complain about injustices in our various elements of government and law enforcement, but few are actually willing to step up to the plate and do something about it. Gee, that would actually take a commitment instead of perpetually whining.
I remember years ago as a manager in the Federal Gov't, people would regularly appear at my desk to complain about something or to suggest we take on a particular course of action. Over time I discovered a unique solution -- I quickly offered to put that person in charge of making the changes, perhaps heading up a committee...gee how quickly they lost interest! Many complain and criticize, but few are willing to effect change.
May 28, 2008 - 00:20 ET futbolisgreat1 wrote:
"I would rather kill my blood relative and I end up in jail than
turn them into this incredibly corrupt system which cares NOTHING about
justice. We live under a judicial system that is blinded by its laws."
futbolisgreat1 -- what you seem to be advocating is nothing more than a form of vigilante justice, a posse mentality that takes the law into its own hands and renders judgment according to its own standards.
What you seem to be overlooking here is those who are the victims of such crimes. What Restless1 said is quite true - these are crimes against the community, and the community deserves to have justice. Whether you like it or not, we are a nation of laws, and if you choose to operate outside of that system, you become, in effect, "lawless."
For the record, I would not harbor or hide a known sexual predator regardless of their status. Those kinds of crimes are against humanity itself.
Packman, Don't be so
June 5, 2008 - 12:26 ET by futbolisgreat1Packman,
Don't be so quick to assume that I am not doing my part to change things. In fact, that is the reason why I went into law enforcement right out of college. It was through this experience that I found out the incredible corruption and criminals that are running the "Justice" system in Chicago and surrounding cities. I was naive like you once, I know better now and I am a lot more mature.
The only way to change things in Chicago is by getting rid of the establishment. I am deeply invovled in politics and I constantly vote against the establishment. Does it change? NO!
don't be so quick to assume that all of us like to complain and do nothing about it.
Currently, I am also part of a group that helps kids stay out of the streets. We teach them sports, give them math, english, history and character building classes.
I also attend community meetings between the police and the community. Having been in law enforcement, I constantly call out the lies of the police and of the community when I hear them and see them.
I would urge you to look in the case in Chicago in which our SOS was disbanded because thie elite group of cops who were undercover were ran by the Chicago Police Department as a vigilante group. They did whatever it took to get criminals, and I mean whatever it took.
Here in Chicago cops don't testify, as they say, they testlie. Everyone knows it and no one cares about it.
Prosecutors will do whatever it takes to get enough convictions, regardless of real innocence or not. Why? because convictions shows, according to the State Attorneys Office, that you are a good lawyer.
I rather be a vigilante, in a vigilante town than the dupe that hands in criminals to a criminal system.
We are no longer a nation of laws. Laws are used and abused by those heading the system. It is sad, but true.
I find it amusing that any one of you would hand over criminals to criminals, pedophiles to pedophiles, vigilantes to vigilantes.
There are good people in the system, but they are ketp down and not allowed to move ahead. In Chicago those that play within the system move up, those that kiss Mayor Daley's behind and his buddies behinds are the ones that move up.
Please, don't be so naive.
There is a great number of cops who are as corrupt and who are as much of a criminal as those that they arrest.
A JUST community, seeking JUSTICE deserves justice and more than the community, the victim, the person(s) affected do need justice and even more than them, God demands justice.
If you truly believe that our communities today seek justice instead of revenge, you are very naive.
If you truly believe that our justice system seeks justice instead of revenge, you are naive.
Where was the justice against OJ Simpson?
Where is the justice to the millions uponn millions of babiess that have been mercyless murdered since 1973 thanks to the "justice" of our system?
Justice? a joke in Chicago, a pathetic sad joke.
it is more, dog eat dog. The State Attorney's Office and the Chicago police department are not different than the criminals they go after. the State Attorney's office and the Chicago police are but a bunch of gangs, no different than the Latin Kings, etc, etc.
See what happens to a cop that dares speak out against the Chicago Police Department, you'll find him "suicided".
Please....what great naivity.
I am sure that Scooter Libby loves the "justice" that was handed down to him, right?
I am also sure that Richard Armitage loves, literally, the justice that was never delivered to him.
Open up your eyes. really now.
RE: don't be so quick...
June 6, 2008 - 07:23 ET by packmanfutbolisgreat1 - your extended rhetoric doesn't change the fact that what you are advocating is anarchy..
Packman, And what you
June 6, 2008 - 09:06 ET by futbolisgreat1Packman,
And what you advocate is handing over people to a system that is already in anarchy.
Have you ever ridden with the Police?
June 6, 2008 - 14:20 ET by SyriusFutbol,
Not to spark any fires, I've been on a few "ride alongs" with my local police department as a way to get a better appreciation of their work.
Are your personal experiences molding you into a more paranoid and bitter person towards people who are trying to maintain the peace and order of civil society? Wouldn't it be better for you to become more in tune with them by creating a more positive relationship?
Syrius
This is a new low of ingorance even for you Syrius
June 6, 2008 - 14:28 ET by Dee BunkFutbol didn't just ride along he was in law enforcement and has had all kinds of involvement with it.
Your post is just absolutely stunning in it's ignorance. Chicago police, like the whole Democratic Machine in Chicago are completely corrupt. You know nothing about it and yet you spout your mouth.
Syrius...again...open
June 6, 2008 - 14:37 ET by bassndudeSyrius...again...open mouth, insert fut....
Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!
Right Bass - everyone else makes some good points
June 6, 2008 - 14:44 ET by Dee Bunkbut Syrius has complete nonsense as usual
It's a complicated problem and I think the people on both sides of this argument have points. I would imagine that Restless and pack don't live in a big city like Fut. There is a big difference.
Many of the big Cities like Chicago are run by Dems and run like crime families. Suburban and small town police are a lot different. That doesn't mean that there are not some courageous well meaning brave police in Chicago and other big cities but they often become corrupt because of the politicians that encourage it.
Mayor Daly in Chicago was the D.A. and party of the largest police brutality cover up and got off basically for statute of limitations. Chicago politics and police are very corrupt.
Thats right Dee. And I have
June 6, 2008 - 14:52 ET by bassndudeThats right Dee. And I have noticed that Syrius is not responding:-) OOPS, spoke to soon. Seems he went back and read a little bit.
Save a SeAL, club a liberal!!
My apologies!!! Rant away!!!
June 6, 2008 - 14:51 ET by SyriusDee, bass, Fut,
After rereading his comments...
You're so right. I'll back up and let him rant & rave. Not my problem, I'll just apologize for my naiveté...good luck with your city. It sounds like the end of days in Chicago! Have you thought about moving? Don't look back or you'll turn to salt...
Syrius
Syrius, Hmmm....yeah, I
June 6, 2008 - 15:14 ET by futbolisgreat1Syrius,
Hmmm....yeah, I have been to much more than a ride along...I have given them! :-)
I think Dee and Bass made a good point, big city police department are very corrupt. Not that small town cops are not, but there is less temptation, less crime, so much less of chance that the corruption happens.
Let me give you an example that never made it to the news or more like it was ignored by the media.
About 4 years ago all City of Chicago police department, police use only computers were password protected. many asked why (within the department) and then we found out it was because internal affairs did an investigation and ALL police districts in Chicago had within their computer searches and views of child ponography! WOW!!! don't you think? oh but wait, it is more important for the media to attack the Church and the few nut job priests than go after the City of Chicago and Mayor Daley and his mobsters.
Syrius, if you want to believe I am ranting, go right ahead. But come one down to Chicago, run a red light or commite a small infraction, get caught by the police and see how these guys treat you.
The City of Chicago is completly corrupted, sad to say. Adn I have seen with my own two eyes go good, honest individuals have been corrupted because they had to support a family.
Packman claims that I am promoting anarchy, what he fails to see is that many big cities are already in anarchy.
Like the example of the SOS especial department that the City of Chicago had created. From the top to the bottom, they were encouraged to do whatever it took to get criminals off the street. You speak of me being a vigilante, look at the city of Chicago police department, they are the vigilantes.
Call it rhetoric, call it rant, it is what it is. Why people want to cover their eyes, ears and mouth about it, is beyond me.
and then there are those, like packman, who assume that individuals like me just complain and do nothing about it. Seriously.
There are many incredibly heroic individuals in the police department, every single New York cop that perished on 9/11 is a hero! but there is a much greater number that is corrupt, corrupt and more corrupt. And the corruption is from the top down.
I appreciate your personal perspective.
June 6, 2008 - 15:25 ET by SyriusFutbol,
I commend you and anyone who tries to improve their city, town, and community in which they live. We need more people like you to interact and find solutions to the problems. You have every right to criticize the corruption since you are working towards a solution. Keep up the great work. Good luck and don't run the red light! No need to see Chicago (I hear it's pretty corrupt-sarc on)...I've got DC and the surrounding suburbs to keep me entertained!
Syrius
Syrius, I lived in
June 6, 2008 - 16:17 ET by futbolisgreat1Syrius,
I lived in Washington DC for a while, or more like Maryland. Bethesda and Chevy Chase neighborhoods.
It was during the alte 1990s. It always amazed me how President Clinton literally lived a few blocks away from the hood.
but I did fell in love with that area. I love how much green exists in MD and being a history and political buff, I loved having The Mall just a few miles away from me. Not to mention all the Civil War history around that area.
Potomac...for me.
June 6, 2008 - 16:40 ET by SyriusFutbol,
The traffic is awful! Wouldn't want to live anywhere else, though.
Syrius
Not buying it.
January 15, 2009 - 19:16 ET by sentry_99I read the entire thread and I'm not buying any of that crap. It's great futbol was a cop in Chicago and apparently Chicago is a crap hole but for him to speak for law enforcement as a whole is total arrogance. I've been a cop for years in California. We never had quotas, we don't get things done vigilante style and we are not a cog in the corrupt liberal political machine. Futbol's stance is not unlike the gang bangers who constantly flip flop from victim to suspect with no end because of their warped world view. They don't come forward as witnesses because of the "corrupt system".
If you KNOW your family member is a criminal and you do nothing, regardless of your reasons, then YOU are a criminal.