I don't know the structure of the adminstration and moderation of this site. And I've been told that those who are responsible for this structure prefer that the site not be overly moderated. But I think it's time someone took a look at how much space is wasted arguing and/or defending a decision to suspend or ban a member.
I have two suggestions in this regard:
1. Admins and/or mods should be identified on the Home page. Members should be informed as to who to contact if they see something that may be inappropriate.
2. Discussions regarding the suspending or banning of a member should take place among admins and mods and not become a part of the public discourse. IMO, these discussions add nothing to promoting the purposes of N.B. Warnings and final decisions regarding the suspension or banning of a member should take place via pm or e-mail. If these means of communication are somehow not feasible, a brief warning in public from an admin or mod should be sufficient. If there are questions regarding the absence of any member, these could be dealt with in this Forum topic and it should be policy to refer any questions in this regard that might be posted anywhere else on the site to this Forum as well.
JMO - Q.M.



















Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Queen Mum
May 7, 2009 - 16:50 ET by bigtimerHey just got to checking out the Forum threads to see the latest this afternoon...pretty good suggestions QM...not bad at all.
Thanks.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
I would add a third
May 7, 2009 - 19:07 ET by motherbeltI would add a third suggestion:
That mods and admin folks who are online jump in when they see a whole thread getting derailed in this manner, suggest that those involved move to the forum (or even the woodshed) and take the initiative if the suggestion is ignored. I, for one, think the the forum is way underused for matters of this kind.
They might say "Wow, that sucks!" But at least they'll say "Wow!" -Duff Goldman, the Ace of Cakes
Queenmum
May 7, 2009 - 19:19 ET by botgthe masthead is listed on every page:
Executive Editor
Matthew Sheffield
Editor at Large
Brent Baker
Senior Editors
Tim Graham
Rich Noyes
Managing Editor
Ken Shepherd
Associate Editors
Noel Sheppard
Deborah Corey
Contributing Editors
Tom Blumer
Geoffrey Dickens
Dan Gainor
David Limbaugh
April Mickelson
Seton Motley
Mithridate Ombud
Clay Waters
“The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.” -- Chief Justice John Roberts
Cute, botg. I'm talking
May 7, 2009 - 19:39 ET by QueenMumCute, botg. I'm talking about mods and admins who participate under usernames other than their own. Most of the people in the above list are too busy to respond to every day problems and concerns. On other sites I've visited, there's a place on the Home Page where mods and admins who are responsible for watching the site at any particular point in time are plainly identified. Some of us who are here a lot know who some of these people are. But not everyone does. Problems are more easily solved when someone who's paying particular attention can be contacted quickly. As I said, I don't know the moderating structure. This may not be possible according to current policies and procedures. It's just a suggestion.
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
queenmum
May 7, 2009 - 19:47 ET by botgwell that's what we have for now, or PM the writer of the thread, they surely can either deal with the situation or refer it to someone who can.
Who knows Matt may take your ideas into consideration.
“The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.” -- Chief Justice John Roberts
wow
May 7, 2009 - 19:36 ET by candanceJust wow.
All I had to say.
Carry on.
Wow..just
May 7, 2009 - 19:38 ET by bigtimerWow..just wow.
Interesting.
Doubling down on stupid is not a particularly good idea. ~Andrew Breitbart
I donno
May 7, 2009 - 20:20 ET by general companyWhile I am sometimes also frustrate about derailed threads, you cant help what some folks say. And some times you cant just leave it their either, this is part of NB charm. To confront false claims. Maybe some of it should be continued in the woodshed. Maybe those who feel it belongs their might like to remind the offending parties, I would certainly consider it.The forums can get fun also.
I think prudence should be considered before tampering with success. My 2.
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
QM
May 9, 2009 - 08:24 ET by shawn228The reason why a Open thread is called a Open thread means that most topics are open for discussion.
He had my vote
shawn: Of course, you are
May 9, 2009 - 11:31 ET by QueenMumshawn: Of course, you are correct. But this isn't about Open Threads and whether any topic should be disallowed. What this is about is the public stoning of "suspicious" members. And whether or not such suspicions are valid or not is not the issue either. If I come here for the first time, I'm going to be a bit put off by the sort of things that often take place in the Open Thread. Most respectable websites conduct their discussions about trolls and other such suspicious persons among admins and mods. Sure, go ahead and call someone out. But if there is serious concern about someone, admins and mods should be contacting these people via e-mail or pm to issue warnings if necessary and taking swift action once it has been determined that an account should be suspended or closed. It appears there are no specific standards. And without specific direction as to who to contact at any given time re: inappropriate content, plenty of such trash is left to rot in plain view for hours at a time.
I know that the powers-that-be see things differently. I'm just trying to present the perspective of someone who might be a new member and/or someone who would like to present opposing views. But maybe I'm just a bit too "conservative". :)
Edited to add: On second thought, since shawn brought up the topic of the Open Thread per se:
I posted my topic mostly in response to the banning of PopTech and the attendant gossip session that ensued. I accept the reasoning, although I feel the standards aren't applied fairly. Not to mention the taunting that amounts to nothing more than bullying. I feel the Open Thread should be just that. Open for discussion. But who can get a serious point in edgewise when the thread is cluttered up with chatter, troll bashing, and lengthy expose's and manifestos. If I came to the site for the first time, I certainly wouldn't spend much time reading the Open Thread before I came to the conclusion that my opinions would be lost in the debris. Lengthy posts and frivolous banter should be directed to the Forum. I don't mind a few one-liners and jokes here and there. But when the Open Thread becomes nothing more than someone's personal blog, the "discussion" should be directed elsewhere. This could also be applied to discussions deemed worthy to be sent to the Woodshed. Other sites use the capability for an admin or moderator to physically move topics and comments to somewhere else on the site. This is usually done with a note posted in the original post that the topic has been moved. So it's not a matter of just censoring or deleting someone's posts. Heck, I didn't even pay any attention the Forum until I'd been here for about 2 years. Posting links to the Forum from threads that need to be moved would be a way to let others know about it.
These are just suggestions that I hope the management would take into consideration.
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
Pop Tech's
May 9, 2009 - 12:46 ET by shawn228banning IMO was deserved. That is up for debate and I find nothing wrong with doing so. I believe things should be discussed here on NB. The thing I believe should be looked at is "stalking" When people try to post or create forums, and people chase people thread to thread and try to make things uncomfortable for them.
This is what PT did, he stalked marijuana and Palin threads and spammed them to death. Many folks tried to ignore it, but it is not easy when someone calls you a moron for supporting Palin.
He had my vote
the thing is
May 9, 2009 - 16:16 ET by katainkentI actually agreed with PT on most issues but after SIX months of spamming ... I can understand the managment had had enough. There was just no way to have an intelligent conversation in the blogs anymore regarding hot button issues he opposed - especially Palin. Low hanging fruit everywhere meant people who wanted to have real discussions or had real questions got summarily ignored.
I personally would have never requested it. I have never asked that anyone be banned. I did however draw attention to one poster (which I wont name) to the management, but did so privately.
All the management here are very pleasant to speak with. I trust them to make good decisions but I also recognize this is a large board and that they are busy people.
Hold on ‘cause the world will turn if you're ready or not ~ KT Tunstall
kata & shawn: Although I
May 9, 2009 - 18:43 ET by QueenMumkata & shawn: Although I agreed with PT re: the knee-jerk response from some whenever Palin was criticized, I also agree that PT got out of hand. In fact, he was a prime example of littering up threads with lengthy and repetitive posts. I just didn't approve of the (edit) public stoning and post mortem. Thank you for your comments.
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
well
May 9, 2009 - 18:55 ET by katainkentthat is the nature of message boards. Sometimes you read things people don't approve of. Sometimes you write em.
Hold on ‘cause the world will turn if you're ready or not ~ KT Tunstall
kata: With all due respect,
May 10, 2009 - 10:39 ET by QueenMumkata: With all due respect, the N.B. Home Page is not a message board. It's a blogsite. There's a difference. Which is why IMO ongoing personal discussions and matters of internal affairs should take place under a Forum topic. And new members should be directed and encouraged to consider the Forum as the place where they're free to engage in off-topic discussions outside the realm of politics and media bias. IMO, the Open Thread should reflect the same tone as the topics presented by N.B.'s contributing editors. It doesn't have to be purely professional or overly serious. But it should at least try to present the idea that the Open Thread is a place where regular members can have the opportunity to be taken seriously without the sort of distractions that add little to the overall dialogue.
Edited to add: The exception would be Open Threads specifically presented by staff to discuss sports, music, etc.
But as I said, this is my personal opinion. I clearly understand that those who run this website know the direction they want to take. I certainly won't be disappointed or deterred from participating if my suggestions aren't taken seriously.
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
queenmum
May 10, 2009 - 10:43 ET by botgIIRC from past postings; Matt's concern is that mods being more active will limit the free dialogue this site is known for. It's something he has weighed. I can only say what i figure to be correct, i may be wrong.
“The way to stop discrimination on the basis of race is to stop discriminating on the basis of race.” -- Chief Justice John Roberts
Thanks for filling me in. I
May 10, 2009 - 12:11 ET by QueenMumThanks for filling me in. I was gone for about a year and evidently missed some of the changes.
How about this? Just change the name of the Forum to Community Forum or Members Forum. As I suggested, when someone comes here for the first time, the Home Page is where they end up. The mods could be focusing their energies on the main page and leave the Forum more free-wheeling, as it pretty much already is. The thing is, with N.B. being more and more well-known (thanks to the FNN), I see more reason to protect the brand from looking like the Huffington Post or DailyKos. (I know this is a far reach at this point in time. Just looking at it from the general public point of view. Journalists, pundits, and media types have their own way of looking at things. I also realize that competition is always a consideration.)
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
perhaps I should have said
May 10, 2009 - 15:23 ET by katainkentthat is the nature of human beings.
That said - I have run a message board that was attached to a medium sized website. I've also been part owner in one and modded two others. None of which were on topics that even remotely touched on such a hot-button as politics and yet still managed to erupt into the occasional flame war. I can appreciate the desire to have has limited meddling in people's personal expression.
I am happy to read that that is indeed the management's consensus for this board and that is why I continue to come here.
Hopefully they'll be able to come up with a compromise palatable to all.
Happy Mother's Day QM.
Hold on ‘cause the world will turn if you're ready or not ~ KT Tunstall
Thank you,
May 10, 2009 - 15:44 ET by QueenMumThank you, kata.
Edited to add: You can clearly see the difference between a message board and the N.B. Home Page. And why I think it's useful to consider somehow directing participants to what would amount to a "message board" in a separate part of the website. As you said, the message boards you moderated were an adjunct to a website.
You've stated that flame wars erupted on the message boards. That's pretty much expected on such forums. But the Home Page of N.B. is not the same thing. The blogs on the Home Page are written by people who, for the most part I would think, want to be taken seriously. Arguments and disagreements based on a difference of opinion re: the topic at hand are not the same thing as some of what has often been posted in the Open Thread, which is also a part of the Home Page.
I'll confess to being a bit verbose on the topic. I think I've pretty much said all I have to say at this point. Thanks again.
Civilization is the progress toward a society of privacy. The savage's whole existence is public, ruled by the laws of the tribe. Civilization is the process of setting man free from men. - Ayn Rand
→ Banning members
May 10, 2009 - 17:07 ET by Cool ArrowI'm not aware of any posters who weren't aware, beforehand, of the thin ice on which they stood.
I had a field day with the pity party that ensued pi314's banishment. It just seemed silly to carry on so much over him.
What the heck, I miss having tracheostomy around sometimes, but it's hard to argue he didn't have a thing for turning threads into religious discussions.
Another poster who recently left was so consumed with his hatred of Sarah Palin that his dismissal seemed to me, well overdue.
I can go out on the Net and fill a post full of links to prove my point, and I can save them in a file to bash home my point every time the subject comes up, but beyond a certain point it's monotonous, predictable, and infuriating.
LYDSEXICS UNTIE!
Housekeeping
May 12, 2009 - 15:38 ET by QueenMumAs is often the case, I have one more thing to say. The Forum needs to be tidied up at bit. There are topics on the Internal Affairs Forum for instance that really don't belong there. This is another example of where the capability to physically move topics and content would be helpful. JMO
GO CAVS!!!!!
I am a little confused Queenmum
May 13, 2009 - 08:46 ET by JWFThe internal affairs forum is for troll sighting.
Internal Affairs
The place to discuss technical issues, suggestions, and the latest troll sightings. Do not post discussions about any other topic in this forum.
So this is the space to pipe up if you think a troll is lurking.
Also the mods don't read every post. No one can. It is too much. As per the terms of use:
While NewsBusters ® may monitor interactive content, it will not read each and every posting.
That is why it is up to us in the community to inform them when people get out of line.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
JWF: 1.There are numerous
May 13, 2009 - 09:28 ET by QueenMumJWF:
1.There are numerous topics in the Internal Affairs Forum that have nothing to do with Internal Affairs as you've defined them.
2. You made my point re: troll sightings. They belong in the Internal Affairs Forum - not in the Open and other Home Page topics.
3. If it is up to the community to inform N.B. when people get out of line, it needs to be clear who should be contacted. Those who are frequent flyers eventually get to know who's who. For newer or more casual members this isn't clear. In the early days of the site, it was easy to communicate with the editors because neither they nor the site were as busy as it is today.
As someone who's been around since almost the beginning of the site, I see that the dynamic has changed and I think the management of content needs to be updated as well. However, I realize that this takes time and technological investment and/or that the management is taking N.B. in a new direction and has already considered these issues.
Thank you for your comment and for continuing the dialogue.
GO CAVS!!!!!
I am still a little confused.
May 13, 2009 - 09:52 ET by JWFAs to point 2 -
2. You made my point re: troll sightings. They belong in the Internal Affairs Forum - not in the Open and other Home Page topics.
It seems to me choselife3x rightly brought a troll sighting properly to the Internal affairs forum and you jumped all over her for it.
As to point 3. Yes, there should be a special subject in the contact form to point out violaters of the terms of service.
Sincerely,
a Veteran of a 1000 psychic wars.
Yes. You are correct, JWF.
May 13, 2009 - 13:53 ET by QueenMumYes. You are correct, JWF. But the topic was also posted in an Open Thread and required scrolling down at least 4-5 screens in order to get past it. A link to the Forum Topic would have sufficed. And in my personal opinion, it wasn't necessary to cut and paste the minutiae of the "investigation" in order to make the case. All the details could have been forwarded to the administrator/s and a brief synopsis posted in order to explain the booting of pelicanmarsh. JMO But as has been pointed out, the Forums are for the purpose of allowing people to have their say. All the people.
Edited to add: There are many topic subjects in the Internal Affairs Forum that don't belong there. cl3's is not one of them. There are also a number of topics in the Forum overall that have been up for a good long time without any new responses. It might help to retrieve some bandwidth if someone could go through these and start deleting old, inactive topics.
GO CAVS!!!!!