One candidate for Biggest Biden Spinner on Thursday night was John F. Harris, the editor-in-chief of Politico.com and a former political reporter for The Washington Post. In Jim Lehrer’s half-hour of post-debate analysis on PBS, Harris declared that "just as a neutral observer," it was obvious: on "whose answers were more substantive, who was more detailed, who responded to the question that was asked, there’s really no reason to assert a false equivalence -- Senator Biden won this debate." Historian Michael Beschloss agreed they weren’t equals, and insisted Biden "was a lot more human."
Harris also insisted that the reporters around him found Biden won: "I don’t think there’s any question that Senator Biden had the more substantive night, the crisper, at least to my ear more spontaneous night – because so many of Governor Palin’s answers were clearly points she was going to make irrespective of whatever good questions Gwen asked....If seemed to me and a number of us coming out of the filing center here that an awful lot of those questions, she got through the evening, but was hanging on for dear life."
David Brooks, the NewsHour analyst and New York Times columnist, led off the evaluations of Biden and Palin by insisting Palin was "every bit his equal," which rankled historian Michael Beschloss as well as Harris. After the team of Brooks and Mark Shields evaluated the debate, and the historian panel of Beschloss, Richard Norton Smith, and Ellen Fitzpatrick, PBS anchor Judy Woodruff interviewed Harris alongside New York Times reporter Kate Zernike on the scene in St. Louis.
Woodruff was asking for the official reactions of the campaigns, and Zernike tried to relay what the McCain-Palin campaign was telling her about any Biden misstatements they found. But when Woodruff asked Harris what he was hearing from the Obama campaign, he quickly jumped off that question of relaying information to offering his own opinions as a "neutral observer." (This is mildly funny for someone who would slam Palin for not answering moderator Gwen Ifill’s questions.) He said the Obama campaign loved Biden, and then added his "neutral" agreement:
"Well, they think clearly it was a far superior performance for Senator Biden, and I have to say, just as a neutral observer, if you’re measuring this, judging this the way you would typically with a debate – whose answers were more substantive, who was more detailed, who responded to the question that was asked, there’s really no reason to assert a false equivalence -- Senator Biden won this debate – if you’re judging by those, through that prism.
"The prism that a lot of us were viewing this, coming into the debate, would Governor Palin really have a poor answer, the way she faltered badly in the interview with some of her questions to Katie Couric on CBS. I didn’t see any of those moments here, she never really had a belly-flop moment. But I don’t know if that’s how typical viewers are viewing this. They’re going to look at these as two candidates to be vice president, or potentially president. I didn’t think there’s any question that Senator Biden had the more substantive night, the crisper, at least to my ear more spontaneous night – because so many of Governor Palin’s answers were clearly points she was going to make irrespective of whatever good questions Gwen asked."
Woodruff asked if Harris was saying Palin didn’t answer the questions, and he replied on behalf of the media in general: "It seemed to me and a number of us coming out of the filing center here that an awful lot of those questions, she got through the evening, but was hanging on for dear life."
Earlier, historian Michael Beschloss offered several anti-Palin comments. "I think she almost went over the line when she said Biden and Obama, if elected, would wave the white flag of surrender. I thought that was really not of the stature of a potential vice president."
He disagreed with Brooks claiming Biden and Palin looked like equals:
"But I don’t think they look equal tonight. I think she got through without saying something that would damage her the way some of these interviews with Katie Couric and others have done in the last week. I think Bdien gave the sense of someone who was a lot more human, more willing to confess human error. He was sort of ‘here I am, warts and all.’ I think that’s appealing in a public figure."
On the Charlie Rose show that came on after Lehrer, there were no real outrageous pro-Biden or anti-Palin comments (although there were repeated comparisons of Palin to her Tina Fey caricature on Saturday Night Live). There was also no one to represent a Republican or conservtive viewpoint. The guest list included the liberal media (Cokie Roberts of ABC, Al Hunt of Bloomberg News, Mark Halperin of Time, Katty Kay of BBC) and just plain liberals (historian Doris Kearns Goodwin and Cleveland columnist Connie Schultz, the wife of liberal Sen. Sherrod Brown). After the first presidential debate on Friday, Rose interviewed David Brooks and Byron York of National Review, but there was no real debate after the veep debate.
—Tim Graham is Director of Media Analysis at the Media Research Center.




















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As many of us predicted
October 3, 2008 - 07:55 ET by ThisnThatAs many of us predicted during yesterday's open thread, it didn't make any difference to the MSM -- their reports were already written and filed. Politico.com could have written this last week, its spin is simply disgusting. But, it won't work -- the debate was broadcast on live TV and viewed by many, many more people than pay attention to these liberal mouth outlets these days. Watch the polls over the next few days -- even illegal sampling won't hide the results.
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If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
Spin, John, spin. Biden's
October 3, 2008 - 07:56 ET by HockeyKidSpin, John, spin. Biden's going to wake up this morning and say, "What the heck just happened?"
You don't measure the winner of a debate by the crispness
October 3, 2008 - 07:59 ET by c5thenYou measure the winner by how many opinions of the undecided were changed, and which way.
Personnaly I think they are all hoping to get an autographed first edition of Ifill's book by trying to help Obama win. Cause if Obama looses, the book will be worthless and could potentially not even be released.
Biden...
October 3, 2008 - 07:59 ET by ForbusYeah, ole' Joe was "crisper" all right! As in TOASTED.
The more I see
October 3, 2008 - 08:04 ET by ghost of Mary Jo Kopechneof Sarah Palin the more I wish she was the presidential nominee. I love Sarah Palin.
Support Our Troops. God bless the military.
http://adoptaplatoon.org/new/index.htm
Palin was incredible last
October 3, 2008 - 08:08 ET by sewcattyPalin was incredible last night. In fact, I wish she could stand in for McCain next week. She has a real ability to connect with the every day American. She is real, she is down-to-earth, she is intelligent and confident.
Biden was blind-sided by her.
Tom Brokaw actually said (paraphrase) - I am sure the democrats are glad that there is only one VP debate.
This was after he had some really positive comments about Palin's performance.
Peggy Noonan "Sarah killed"
The .95 mach view
October 3, 2008 - 08:15 ET by BuffNBoneProbably the longest thing I'll ever post, but here goes.
In a recent interview, Palin’s father said Americans had yet to meet the real Sarah. Many had that pleasure last night and the polls (not the pols or pundits) are going to show the like her big time. What they saw was the unvarnished version devoid of the spin applied by interviewers and editors.
People who approached the debate with an open mind will have to question those who were trying to influence them about Palin being a lightweight. If they can’t trust pundits to accurately predict her performance, what else can’t they get right? The only question should be, were they wrong by mistake or do they do it on purpose?
We’re already startin to hear how she talks funny and her doin it was a façade. Doin it for 90 minutes on that stage tells me it rings true and she’s the real deal. For those of us who appreciate the Jimmy Stewart and Frank Capra genre of “It’s a Wonderful Life” and “Mr. Smith goes to Washington” we got a real life version of it. Fat cats in Washington and on Wall Street should be very afraid she's got you in her sights.
I especially appreciated Palin’s connection with teachers and teaching. First off, her words honored them, something they too rarely hear said with any modicum of sincerity. The NEA and AFT spout promises but in the end take teachers for granted. In reality about 25% of them share values with Palin but they don’t voice their opinions out loud. A good plan since they are in hostile territory. Another portion ride the middle and can be influenced. This should be a segment to connect with—especially in the battleground states. The remainder seem to be in the bag of the dem party and push a liberal agenda out of touch with what our country stands for. I think all groups initially go into the profession for something other than big bucks. They want to change lives. I salute the ones who want to teach their charges how to think and I loathe the ones who tell students what to think.
The question about VP roles in their boss’ administration turned out to be an EASY one (Energy, Accountability in Govt, Special needs advocate, You the American people). Plus McCain seeks and values diversity of opinions from his team. That’s what true leaders insist on. Biden on the other hand sounded like he was going out for a position as a bobblehead.
Senators live in a “revise and edit” world. They can say one thing but before it get printed in the Congressional Record they have the opportunity to revise and edit their remarks. As a result, they can become sloppy, careless and forgetful. Knowing he was playing under a different set of rules, the 35 year orator was tied to his notes more while she used them but was quite comfortable facing the camera.
Mission (not the war) accomplished! This B-52 and B-1B pilot scores it a Shack and is expecting secondaries any time now.
"Fighters are fun but bombers make policy"
Good post
October 3, 2008 - 08:34 ET by KC MulvilleDon't apologize. I don't come onto this site to avoid reading --that's why I come here in the first place!
"She chose to answer her own
October 3, 2008 - 08:27 ET by billb"She chose to answer her own questions"...I knew she was a quick study. She's already learned the first rule of politics! SPIN! Now if someone can shake McCain by the shoulders and get him to hold up his end! He needs to come out and name names and make them famous. But, he needs to do it now, not after the election. UNLESS he is resigned to losing and wants to maintain his friendships in the senate.
If not answering the
October 3, 2008 - 10:03 ET by BuffNBoneIf not answering the questions asked is the NEW standard, then let it be applied evenly and at all times.
Try next Tuesday evening for starters or a retrospective on the first Presidential debate last Friday.
"Fighters are fun but bombers make policy"
Fossils
October 3, 2008 - 08:31 ET by KC MulvilleIf you happened to see a coffee cup hanging in mid-air, you'd rub your eyes and wouldn't make sense of it. That's because you take gravity for granted. Gravity is so "taken for granted" that we're no longer conscious of it. We just assume it.
While gravity is a pretty safe bet, the political assumptions inside the Beltway are not. The political class have been working on partisan assumptions so ingrained that now they can't grasp how dysfunctional they are. Now that things are so screwed up, even Harry Reid had to admit that they don't know what to do. Their assumptions make no sense anymore. People are angry at them, and they can't imagine why.
Assumptions are necessary. Life moves too fast to allow you to re-think everything from scratch, at every encounter. You need a headstart on most topics. But the risk is having those assumptions locked in.
We see the Beltway fossilizing before our very eyes.
KC
October 3, 2008 - 09:42 ET by well99Excellant post.
My Tax Money
October 3, 2008 - 11:31 ET by MexNobamaI know something about arts fundraising. I have written and received money for a number of grants due to my activities in Classical Music.
Grants whether they come from the state or private sources are given because a clear mission statement is offered by the petitioner and in most cases conditions are put upon that grant so that the money is not mispent.
In the rare case of an "unconditional" grant, the foundation has so much trust in the entity to whom they are giving the money that they expect the money to be put to proper use.
Now PBS operates in part on our tax money, and in part on viewer sponsorships. If liberal viewers want to give their money to PBS so that they can continue to present material with a liberal slant then fine. This is a free country, let them do it.
My taxes however, and yours, should not be part of the PBS budget.
Once upon a time PBS also presented arts events such as opera, symphonic concerts and ballet on a regular enough basis that the liberal slant of the programming was not the meat of what they had to offer.
Those days are long gone. You can't even watch a children's show on PBS without being served a heaping teaspoon of liberal slant.
In addition, with all do repsect to doo wop groups, rock bands from the 1960's and so forth, why is there so much material that falls under the category of commerical entertainment being presented as though it is high art and deserves support from the NEA? I enjoy John Fogerty, but he is a commercial act, not a 501c3 arts organization. He doesn't need my tax money.
I say cut all federal tax support from PBS and NPR. Let them make it on private donations alone. Perhaps if they are no longer working for big government they would consider presenting more political balance in order to get support from conservative groups.
At very least however we the people should be able to put conditions upon the tax money. If a "fariness doctrine" needs to be put in place at all it should start with PBS because it is sponsored by all the people, via the NEA, not just liberal people.
That would serve as a virtual "condition" upon our grants.
WHAT????
October 3, 2008 - 12:38 ET by ArtisteAre these folks living in some parallel universe? It takes a lot of spin to put Biden on top of this debate. Most of the time he looked like a deer caught in the headlights. The only ones "holding on for dear life" are the Dems after Palin's amazing presentation.
Reuters article stated
October 3, 2008 - 19:35 ET by CassandrinaReuters article stated Palin made 2 errors one the name of the commander in Iraq and the second calling Joe Biden "O'Biden".
I believe this was deliberate and not a mistake.
I then read an answering article to Reuters on the factual mistakes Biden made - I quote:
Biden was a gaffe fiesta. He was wrong on the Constitution and the VP (see Article I [the Article that defines the legislature], Sec 3, where the only role of the VP is specified as a contingent legislative role; and Article II, Sec 1, where the VP is spoken of with no role in the executive branch (read the first line), until the president cannot serve; and Amend 25, where the VP can, with other exec officers, declare the president incapable).He was wrong on Iraq and Afghanistan spending. Current monthly spending in Iraq: ~$12 billion. Total spending in Afghanistan to date: $173 billion. And he said “I’ll say it again,” and restated the same falsehood.He was wrong on Palestinian elections: Obama had been in office less than a week when they happened, and said nothing about them.The US did not kick Hezbollah, or even Syria, out of Lebanon.He was wrong on the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty. All but one Republican voted against ratification, not just McCain. And for good reasons.He was wrong about a restaurant in his home town; it’s been closed for over two decades. How often does he really mix with the people? Better check that Home Depot too.That’s just skimming the surface, and not even getting into his misrepresentations of regulation of the secondary mortgage market, supposed deregulations that he blames the credit crisis on but which did not happen, falsehoods about the McCain health insurance plan, the Bridge to Nowhere (which he voted for every time he got the chance, as did Obama), and on and on.
The only thing uncharacteristic about Biden’s gaffomania this time is that none of them was funny.
But any two of them, had they been stated by Palin, would have the media clucking over her ignorance, incompetence, inexperience, and confusion. Biden didn’t make two gaffes. He’s over 20. Good god. And this man is supposed to be competent to be vice president? It’s laughable.
NUFF SAID I THINK.
Biden is Assasination Insurance against BHO
October 4, 2008 - 16:28 ET by JayTeeAs Ann Coulter says . . .
Hell, I wouldn't vote for any POTUS who was dumb enought to pick Biden for VP.
PBS is RIGHT, and 69,000,000 Americans are WRONG
October 4, 2008 - 16:24 ET by JayTeeThis Lying Elite SOB helps, he really helps, with the future exodous of MSM.
You can't buy a better Advertisement against the Lying MSM. Why pay for something that advertises itself ?
PBS will be "Shocked" over the Election Results come November.
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised