Open Thread: U.S. to Display Military Force for North Korea Sunday

By NB Staff | November 26, 2010 | 10:36

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For general discussion and debate.

Possible talking point - U.S. will send a message to North Korea Sunday that includes nuclear aircraft carrier the U.S.S. George Washington:

What do you make of this exercise? Is it a strong enough response to North Korea's attack Tuesday? What else should America do? Is this heading to full-scale war, or just a show of strength by Kim Jong Il?

North Korea

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Does all this smell like the Gulf of Tonkin...?

Submitted by wizardjr on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 10:47am.

Do we need a sunken warship to make Sir Golfsalot look Presidential? I trust him about as much as I trusted LBJ.

wizardjr,

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 10:58am.

It smells like something, all right.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

Gulf of Tompkin

Submitted by libBuster on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:11am.

No naval officer wants to lose a US Warship much less a carrier. Obama is not the decision maker for a carrier task force threatened by an enemy.

oooosha

Submitted by hoosherdaddy137 on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 8:01pm.

bet your backside, get a hard nosed naval officer, and in 13 minutes F-18s will be raining fire on everything the Tomahawks dont vaporise. We are not at peace with North korea, we are at a ceasefire, they have provoked the world enough, even China has to see this. they have to much invested in Obama to let kimmy il show off for his son before he takes the reins. so I dont think fire filled "cupcheck" on north korea would be out of the question, should they try to flex on American warships, or American soldiers in the ROK.

The Lion didn't become King of the jungle by courting the favor, or earning the admiration of lesser mammals.

You Bet

Submitted by Jimbo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 9:05pm.

You bet he's not the decision maker. The US Military is sailing into a hostile environment off the Korean peninsula with the potential for very serious escalation. Obama's priority is shooting hoops. I'm sick to death of it.

If you spent $1 million a day since Jesus was born, you would have not yet spent the entire stimulus package.

Relax. We always wanted an Carrier in the mix.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:07am.

Carrier status unclear for S. Korea exercises

By Gidget Fuentes - Staff writer
Posted : Wednesday Nov 3, 2010 8:06:19 EDT

The third in the series of U.S.-South Korea naval training exercises designed to deter North Korean aggression will take place in the waters west of the Korean Peninsula, but officials have not yet announced whether an aircraft carrier will join the drills.

The North Korean Oligarchs

Submitted by Free Stinker on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 10:54am.

The North Korean Oligarchs know that Obama is weak. Sending a carrier there might make them calm down, but I have my doubts.

/// Sarah Palin Fan since July 11, 2007 /// خال

I agree that they sense his

Submitted by motherbelt on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:01am.

I agree that they sense his weakness, but I pray that he summons the strength needed to deal with this. Much as most of us dislike him, we should all be praying for him right now.

Indeed. We all should be

Submitted by Free Stinker on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:39am.

Indeed. We *all* should be praying for. (and we've been Commanded to do so)

/// Sarah Palin Fan since July 11, 2007 /// خال

It is just another weak play from a failed state.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:16am.

There is some talks coming up. Time to make some noise and squeeze some more goodies out of the 6 ways suckers, er, talks.

You are correct. Winter is

Submitted by BD on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 6:00pm.

You are correct. Winter is coming on and they need fuel and food to prevent yet another 50,000 nK citizens from starving to death. The morons from the UN et al will pay them foodstuffs and limted fuel to keep them under what they conceive of as control. (fools...)

And the North can still use the "See, we are under attack, look inward juche" bull.......

He is best who is trained in the severest school." -Thucydides, "History of the Peloponnesian War" (431-404 B.C.)

Spot on, Vet...

Submitted by Jer on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:28pm.

It follows a familiar pattern of the North Koreans whose only diplomatic leverage is rattling their oversized but comparatively weak [vis a vis the US] sabres.

And the idea that China would join with NK to intimidate us via direct confrontation makes no sense from either a miltary, economic, or geopolitical perspective.

Jer

Shhhhh

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 9:22pm.

What are you doing? It is kick the Vet day. Apparently believing the Chinese would not travel 5000 miles to shoot off a missile in our waters in addtition to stating the U.S. Navy is unmatched on the planet will get a foot up your butt from 2 long time whiners.

Don't try to keep it real. Let's run around like a coupla chickens minus their tops and scream THE CHINESE ARE COMING THE CHINESE ARE COMING.

You are gonna get yourself outcast people find out you are agreeing with me. You didn't hear? I called a diesel-electric boat a diesel boat. Un-friggin-believable. You betcha by golly wow.

Those wild and crazy N. Koreans ....

Submitted by bgirardo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:04pm.

And what if they attack the carrier? Then what?

China will probably say we provoked them and side with the N. Koreans. Russia will also side with the North leaving us with little to no backing (Germany, France or the EU? Ha ha ha!!!!)

I do not think that overt action like this is a good thing. What we should have done instead is:

A. Determine which N. Korean sub sank the S. Korean destroyer and then
B. Sunk it quietly (claiming an accident or whatever)
C. Repeat as necessary (for instance, we should have a missle accident where a cruise missle accidently goes off and hits the artillary that just shelled the island).

All of this follows the advise from a guy who once said

"Talk softly, but carry a big stick"

The U.S. does too much talking.

Sorry Sir.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:14pm.

North Korea has nothing remotely possible of getting with in 200 miles of an United States Carrier.

Sorry sir part duex

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:19pm.

But the Chinese do.

-Jon

We beg to differ.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:01pm.

They might be modernising. But they ain't there yet.

They ain't there yet, but

Submitted by Newsbubba on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 2:11pm.

the problem with the Chinese is they don't have to get all the way there before they act. They are more than willing to sacrifice a few million people to "the cause" if that's what it takes. Besides, they ain't one bit intimidated by our rat bastard Fascist SOB. Sometimes I've almost convinced that they talk on a regular basis to plan this crap.

Don't forget to count their nuke sub force, either. I'm betting that they are at least equal to us in numbers if not greater. I'm also convinced that the "jet contrail" 35 miles off the west coast was a little communique for Boy Blunder to shut up and sit down when he got to the summit.

And why do they call that crap "summit" when the bottom of the barrel is taking part in it?

Comrade Bubba

They aren't there yet? That would be news to the Pentagon

Submitted by ckc1227 on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 4:13pm.

They were there 3 years ago.

Seriously?

Submitted by The Vet on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 12:32am.

...160ft Song Class diesel-electric attack submarine...

A diesel? It was a fluke. Someone dropped the ball. The exception now proves the rule?

Not a navy guy, but an old

Submitted by BD on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 6:02pm.

Not a navy guy, but an old diesel boat running on batteries is pretty quiet from what I have heard.

He is best who is trained in the severest school." -Thucydides, "History of the Peloponnesian War" (431-404 B.C.)

They still need to have air

Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 5:51am.

They still need to have air and the batts run out quickly. Basically all they need to do is place themselves in a spot and be quiet. I cant imagine our navy letting them that close though.

Nuke em til they glow; then shoot em in the dark

I doubt it is too old.

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 11:33am.

So they have prolly made some progress on the quietness front. How old are the diesels you are talking about?

We went nuclear for submarines 50 years ago for a good reason. You only have to surface for food for the crew. Our submarines can stay under for months. A diesel still has to recharge on the surface every what 1 or 2 days?

And it was called an attack submarine, not a suicide submarine. Surfacing in the middle of a Carrier Battle Group is suicide.

It was a fluke. We call a it lesson learned. I would link to the number of articles about our Navy and the Chinese submarines since but it is early and I need some more coffee. In 3 years, we have figured out the mistake we made in letting the boat get close and won't repeat it.

Hey, anyone know what day it is? The mlitary excercise begins today!

George Washington Strike Group Begins Exercise with Republic of Korea

Anyone fell warry or duck and runny? Let's let the children back into the room. Some people just like to scare them I guess.

Suicide?

Submitted by ckc1227 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 6:39pm.

"And it was called an attack submarine, not a suicide submarine. Surfacing in the middle of a Carrier Battle Group is suicide."

Apparently not, unless I missed something. Did this sub get blown out of the water?

Will you remove your foot from my butt?

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 7:11pm.

You are the one acting like this was some kind of a big brouhaha. That the Chinese can now take out our entire Navy with one attack submarine popping up in a battlegroup.

Now what? You don't like that statement either? Frell. What the hell is wrong with my statement.

I say the Chinese are not near us in size or technology. YOU SAY THEY ARE BASED ON ONE INCIDENT 3 YEARS AGO. I say an Attack Submarine, IT WAS AN ATTACK SUBMARINE popping up in the middle of a battlegroup to fire off a torpedo is commiting suicide. As a tactic, IT AIN'T WISE.

Dude, get off of my back. Now. I ain't enjoying your little game.

I say relax we ain't at war. You say it counts.

I say it counts as a tactic but suicidal. YOU SAY RELAX WE AIN'T AT WAR.

The exception now proves the rule?

Submitted by ckc1227 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 6:36pm.

The "exception" proves you were wrong. And if you read the article, there's more to it than just dropping the ball.

"A diesel?"

Umm, no. Reading is fundamental: A diesal-electric.

"Its 13 Song Class submarines are extremely quiet and difficult to detect when running on electric motors."

"It was a fluke. Someone dropped the ball."

That's right, it was just a fluke. Everyone aboard the 12 or more ships responsible for protecting this carrier from submarines all dropped the ball. If true, that's even worse than China having subs capable of getting close to one of our carriers.

"The lone Chinese vessel slipped past at least a dozen other American warships which were supposed to protect the carrier from hostile aircraft or submarines And the rest of the costly defensive screen, which usually includes at least two U.S. submarines, was also apparently unable to detect it."

Let's hope the pentagon and the military aren't as naive as you seem to be.

Sorry. Did not know I was picking a fight.

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 7:03pm.

Also did not know we were at war with the Chinese. When I say diesel, when anyone says diesel, it is kinda understood that it is a diesel-electric. Kinda hard to run a fuel burning motor underwater when the air supply is kinda tight.

I don't get it. We have a superiority in the salt water navy department of something like us being bigger than the next 13 navies COMBINED. And if I say it was a fluke, now I am being chastised as some kind of a loon?

Yes. It was a fluke. We are not at war. And we prolly had a big meeting where someone said, how do we make sure this don't happen again. If we were at war, we would probably be all active sonar all the time, dropping sonar buoys like they were candy, with those asw helicopters 24/7. So kindly remove your foot from my butt.

Yes. Fluke. A Russian submarine surfaced directly under on of our carriers in the 80's.

19. 21 March 1984: The U.S. aircraft carrier USS Kitty Hawk (CV-63) collided with a Soviet nuclear-powered Victor class (Project 671) attack submarine in the Sea of Japan. At the time of the collision, the USS Kitty Hawk is estimated to have carried several dozen nuclear weapons, and the submarine probably carried two nuclear torpedoes.

Now. Again. Kindly remove your foot from my butt so I can move on with my life.

Remember the Tom Hanks movie. Poo happens. We learned a lesson. We ain't at war. Relax. Sheesh. Hurry up, I wanna sit down. Treating me like I am an idiot because I said Diesel. Sheesh.

I thought about it and guess what? I am ticked off.

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 7:02pm.

20 years in the Navy, I got to have this guy stick his foot up my butt because I said Diesel.

Admiral: Diesel Subs OK for Others, Not U.S. InsideDefense.com NewsStand | Christopher J. Castelli | April 24, 2006

Diesel submarines have near-shore and stealth capabilities that may make them suitable for other countries but they do not meet U.S. requirements to project and sustain forces far beyond coastal waters, according to the Navy's submarine director, Rear Adm. William Hilarides.

The Navy has long opposed acquiring diesel subs, arguing nuclear-powered subs are superior. The subject came up again when Hilarides briefed reporters about submarines at the Washington Navy Yard April 17.

“If we were defending our coast from high-end ships, then a diesel submarine might make sense for that, but we project our submarines out to the far corners of the world and need them to stay there for long periods of time,” Hilarides said.

YES FRELLING DIESEL. NOW GET YOUR FRELLING FOOT OUT OF MY FRELLING BUTT.

Defense Focus: Diesel sub wonder weapons

Aug 31, 2007 ... Washington (UPI) Aug 31, 2007 - The diesel submarine may be the leading Cinderella weapon of the 21st century.
www.spacewar.com/.../Defense_Focus_Diesel_sub_wonder_weapons_999. html - Cached - Similar

The Stupid Shall Be Punished: Diesel Sub Sets Record Apr 27, 2006 ... "The admiral said that diesel subs would cost $1 billion for the hull and for installing modern U.S. equipment on the vessel. ...
bubbleheads.blogspot.com/2006/.../diesel-sub-sets-record.html - Cached - Similar

Taiwan To Build Own Diesel Subs - Defense News Apr 13, 2009 ... Taipei - Taiwan appears to have given up on a 2001 U.S. offer of eight diesel submarines and instead will develop an indigenous vessel, ... Submarines -Diesel Submarines, Fast Attack Nuclear Submarines ... This site is about Diesel Submarines, Fast Attack Nuclear Submarines, Fleet Ballistic Missile Submarines, and submarines in general.

Two things to consider

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:11pm.

FS, based on previous instances, I would expect the Chairman to order our ships not to do anything. Here's why for a couple of reasons:

1) while he was on his 10-day failed asian trip, the Chinese sent off a rocket 35 miles off our shore near LA. This was not an accident. This was a warning to the US by the Chinese. There's simply no other way to look at it.

2) There was a warning that an attack will happen on South Korea and it was feared it would happen during the g20 summit. It didn't, and the reason why, it was to wait till the leaders left before attacking, that was also a message. And the Norks are backed by the Chinese. They won't tell the Norks to stand down.

The US is in a very vulnerable position right now both within and without.

I don't see any other outcome except that our carrier group will be forced to turn back without any sort of action taken. In the meantime, the UN is going to send more "aid" to North Korea. Those soldiers in NK have to be fed after all, right?

-Jon

Let me walk out on a limb here.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:24pm.

No one in the history of mankind has gone to war because someone held a military exercise.

No one in the history of mankind has tested a modern weapon in the sovereign waters of another nation.

Notch it down a bit contrailman.

contrailman??

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:40pm.

You know, I don't make it a habit to call anyone here names unless they got it coming(and there are a few that do).

-Jon

Sorry.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:45pm.

But I am not in the habit of scaring the women and children with talk of conspiracy theories and going to war because we held a joint exercise that was scheduled 6 months ago. A 3 part PUBLISHED exercise mind you.

I was making a point. I will note that you get deeply offended by such nastiness as being called contrailman. It shall not happen again.

deeply offended? Hardly

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 2:01pm.

I was just saying I don't generally stoop to the level of calling people certain names especially those associated with conspiracies(which I knew you were referring to and it's utterly ridiculous).

As for scaring women and children, I don't have to do that, the TSA is already doing that.

And yes, I know war doesn't happen because of joint exercises, but an attack by a despot who is replacing a despot is a whole new ballgame, can you honestly say you know what's going to happen? There are a lot of variables in play that the conventional answers don't seem to fit the scenario.

-Jon

Now I am offended. I am lying now?

Submitted by The Vet on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 1:16am.

...those associated with conspiracies(which I knew you were referring to and it's utterly ridiculous). -- What? YOU brought forward a conspiracy theory. Remember this? --- I've been sleeping like a rock ever since that Chinese missile got launched off our shores. --- Or this? --- ...the Chinese sent off a rocket 35 miles off our shore near LA. ---You going to deny it now? You going to tell us all the Chinese sent a submarine, a technology that has been in use since World War I, 5000 miles, into our sovereign waters, AN ACT OF WAR, to fire off a missile, a technolgy availiable since World War II, to prove what? That a missile can be launched underwater from a boomer submarine, a technology that has been around for over 50 years? YOU DON'T WANT INSULTS, DON'T TREAT ME LIKE A CHILD. Surprise. We didn't even believe it. So the whole thing was a waste of precious resources, huh?

Not once. Not twice. But three times you pop on a CONSPIRACY THEORY.

Pentagon Says 'Mystery Missile' Was a Plane

"Mystery Missile" Was a Plane, Pentagon Says - CBS News

Experts: Mystery Contrail Was Plane, Not Missile

Jet contrails from some angles look like missile trails

Mystery Vapor Trail Over California Was Left By Plane Not Missile ...

TWA FLIGHT 800 Downed by Missile: TERRORISM 1996 --- Oops. Was that the Chinese too?

Contrail from plane not missile: US army

Experts: Mystery Contrail Was Plane, Not Missile

Los Angeles Missile Contrail Explained in Pictures

AccuWeather.com - Weather News | Not a Missile Over California ...

Did I spend 3 and half years here shooting down every conspiracy theory and lie about George W. Bush because I was a partisan or because I was interested in the truth? I am not about to start buying into lies just because I happen not to like the man in the White House.

..the TSA is already doing that. A red herring. Were we talking about that?

...can you honestly say you know what's going to happen? --- Oh you mean like you? --- ...our carrier group will be forced to turn back...

Overstatement

Submitted by Jimbo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 9:15pm.

"No one in the history of mankind has gone to war because someone held a military exercise".

The history of mankind spans an awfully long period of time. Are you sure about that? Even if it is true, it doesn't mean it won't happen now. Although I think the Socialist in Chief will do anything in his power to avoid conflict, it will come at the cost of showing significant US weakness to NOK, China, and every other gun slinging nutjob in a position of power around the world. That in and of itself is a very serious issue. Once again, Obama's World Appology Tour has come back to bite us in the ass.

If you spent $1 million a day since Jesus was born, you would have not yet spent the entire stimulus package.

Which, basically, means nothing

Submitted by ckc1227 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 6:45pm.

"No one in the history of mankind has gone to war because someone held a military exercise. No one in the history of mankind has tested a modern weapon in the sovereign waters of another nation."

No one in the history of mankind had deliberately destroyed two skyscrapers with hijacked planes before either....until they actually did.

Have we met?

Submitted by The Vet on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 7:46pm.

What is with you and the constant non sequitors?

IF MY STATEMENT IS WRONG. PROVE IT.

I don't need you and your damn red herrings crawling up my ass.

Great, the Norks are getting uppidy, and our "CiC" is a former..

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:00am.

...community pisser-offer, who I am not at all certain knows which end of the gun the bullet comes out of.

Yeah, I'm sleeping like a rock these days.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

Ditto

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:17pm.

I've been sleeping like a rock ever since that Chinese missile got launched off our shores.

I wonder how many people bought that story that it was a plane?

God, what a nightmare we're in.

-Jon

Relax a little there.

Submitted by The Vet on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:05pm.

We ain't going to war with China over a simple little joint exercise.

Nightmare now? Sheesh.

jon, At any given time there is a 1,000 tons of aircraft in the

Submitted by upcountrywater on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 2:39pm.

sky at any given time over the LA area. One would think that the folks that live there would know what an aircraft would look like, flying in any direction at day or night < cough> or sunset?

The best video was from a helicopter crew, clearly a rocket engine(s)...

NKorea is very big on their Artillery and they have lots of them...

No countermeasures for Artillery in the 50's, now there is..

The high-mobility artillery rocket system (HIMARS) is the newest member of the multiple-launch rocket system (MLRS) family. HIMARS is a highly-mobile artillery rocket system offering the firepower of MLRS on a wheeled chassis. HIMARS was developed by Lockheed Martin Missiles and Fire Control under an advanced concept technology demonstration (ACTD) programme, placed in 1996.

This system worked wonders against Husseins state of the art artillery....This system is one of many reasons we did'nt loose 30,000 men in the first few minutes of the Iraq war.

And or do what Reagan did... yea right!

Los Angeles Times - 15 April 1986 100 DEAD ESTIMATED IN TRIPOLI; KADAFI'S DAUGHTER KILLED; SOVIETS CANCEL U.S. TALKS; 2 SONS OF LIBYA CHIEF WOUNDED TRIPOLI, Libya--As dusk fell over this U.S.-bombed capital today, diplomats estimated that about 100 people were killed in the pre-dawn attack, and doctors said the dead included Libyan leader Col. Moammar Kadafi's baby daughter. Dr. Mohammad Muafa, director of pediatrics at Tripoli's Fatah University Hospital, said he was summoned to the Kadafi family compound about an hour after the 2 a.m. raid and found the family, including Kadafi's wife, "in very bad terror."

Oh well looks like, we will send in some cash, AKA Clinton N' Carter....Ok for NKorea and Pakeestan to have nuks, USA, Japan and South Korea... not so much...

Irrelevance of START

You Didn't Build That.

jon, I imagine many bought the line that was a plane

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 4:43pm.

That was clearly a missile - and a submarine launched one, at that.

What I want to know is, assuming it was the Chicoms (the only other possibility is the Russkies) and assuming the sub that launched it was not detected (and we may never know whether it was or wasn't) just exactly how in the Hell did they manage to sneak it that close to our shores without us knowing about it?

If they could do it off the west coast, they could just as easily do it off the east, as well as the Gulf.

Boomers are the most formidable weapons in existence, more so than even carriers, and the fact that the Chicoms (or the Russians) can apparently prowl our shores with them with impunity is not a little disconcerting.

It's scary as Hell, actually.

That missile could have easily had multiple nuclear warheads and could just has easily been launched toward the east.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

Dave, Subs are still very hard to impossible to track.

Submitted by upcountrywater on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 6:03pm.

I'm sure you remember the Chi com sub popping up in the middle of some training exercise...

Scroll down for photos...

If the Task Group is on a particular heading, then the enemy sub can simply lay in wait on the bottom until the group passes over it. Then pop up in the middle of the group as in this case. Few ways to combat against this sort of thing beyond frequent course changes and a better attack sub defensive zone net.

The vain Hussein effected the normal patrols of some 34 ships, when he traveled to the East.

Save the whales over a smoking crater that was once LA harbor.

No sonar no tracking.

It's all good!! So far the Chi coms think a TRILLION bucks is worth not launching a missile to the east.

You Didn't Build That.

Unsettling

Submitted by Jimbo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 9:23pm.

I think the possibility of that having been a missile is not only plausible, but likely.

In addition to a forign sub getting that close to the coast, I'm also realatively certain that the Pentagon didn't know about it's launch immediatly upon it happening. Had they, I would have expected some sort of measurable response by someone. The whole episode coupled with what is going on in Korea is very unsettling.

If you spent $1 million a day since Jesus was born, you would have not yet spent the entire stimulus package.

While the sheeple slumber, Big Sis marches on, unencumbered

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 11:20am.

Why the American people sit idly by while federal, state and local governments continue to turn us into a surveillance state is beyond me.

How long will it be before we see them putting flush meters on our toilets, monitors on our thermostats, GPS trackers and cameras in our cars?

Orwell got it right, it was just his timing that was off.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

Here's an idea, Dave.

Submitted by Newsbubba on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:17pm.

We send Big Sis over to North Korea and let her grope the little bastards into submission. It pretty much got the majority of Americans to surrender without much of a whimper.

Comrade Bubba

Nb,

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 4:26pm.

That it did.

Sad what has become of our country.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

Dave, Be green, no need to change gloves, that will do it.

Submitted by upcountrywater on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 2:48pm.

Free Junk.

You Didn't Build That.

Monitors on our thermostats?

Submitted by Radical1979 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:13pm.

Monitors on our thermostats? That's what the smart grid they keep pushing is all about. OnStar? Tells GM where you've been.

We're there, but as long as people can get Netflix on demand or play Warcraft, what's the big deal?

Of course we can't use those cameras on the border to send someone after illegals sneaking in, that would be against their civil rights.

Proud member of the 53%!

I tend to look to the comments from...

Submitted by bkeyser on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:17pm.

former Ambassador to the UN, John Bolton in these situations; he's a hawkish diplomat, so he seems to embody the one really good thing Teddy Roosevelt said. I saw him on FNC and he suggests this is typical behavior by the NorKs and nothing to get overly alarmed about at this point. Saber-rattling.

The way I see it, the issue will be just how much Obama wants to avoid diplomatic confrontation (he surely won't fire a shot) -either through diplomatic or (worse) economic pressure put forth from China (who really doesn't want this headache either), or by holding on to his silly preference for the world to like us better. If he capitulates and offers greater economic aide or reduced inspections on their nuke program, they win. If he delays the 6-party talks, we win.

Doubtful

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:30pm.

Not to doubt anything Bolton might say, he's a sharp guy, but that's the old North Korea, this is the new one with the son(of a b!tch) who is succeeding the ill Kim Jong Il. I wouldn't call an artillery attack saber rattling especially since it was an attack on civilians and some of the military were killed. I thought such things were an act of war from one country to another, especially since it's supposed to be an ally of the US.(and we know how the Chairman treats our allies)

That's why I made the prediction that he won't take any act and we may end up being like a dog tucking tail.

-Jon

Jon

Submitted by bkeyser on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:45pm.

In May, the NorK's sunk a South Korean Naval vessel and killed 46 sailors. Yeah, the use of arty (my personal favorite) is new and different for the NorK's, but the result was a lot of damage and 4 deaths -assuming that number holds. There's no question the NorK leadership is delusional but they're probably right in thinking we'll blink- we (or the South Koreans) aren't likely to return meaningful fire unless the mainland (or worse, a US Base) is deliberately targeted. We didn't take action against Russia when they invaded Georgia, and when the Naval exercise is complete, we'll move that carrier back out of the Sea of China into the Indian Ocean- or wherever it's scheduled to go next.

Barry will probably offer more economic aide to settle them down. What he should do is call their bluff and call off the coming 6-party talks; call it a scheduling conflict or something really petty like that to piss them off. Unfortunately, that cowboy hat he wore on the campaign trail was clearly just a prop.

We ought to pull any, and defund the UN too

Submitted by Blonde on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:26pm.

No more carrots. Time to take away the carrots. Not sure it's stick time, but the Nork's are into symbolism.

Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)

Grow a pair.

Submitted by Jimbo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 9:27pm.

In my opinion, it is stick time. What would a US lead strike on the artillery base that launched those munitions result in? A pissed off China? A pissed off Russia? Who the hell cares??? Does anyone think China or Russia would retailiate in kind against a US target or US protected target? Come on. Let's grow a pair for a change.

If you spent $1 million a day since Jesus was born, you would have not yet spent the entire stimulus package.

China wouldn't have to attack

Submitted by Radical1979 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:08pm.

China wouldn't have to attack us, just use our financial position to get us. The plus on that is that it would force the government to stop spending. Maybe we could even start (gasp) drilling again to make some money!

Proud member of the 53%!

One of the big risks a

Submitted by MidAmerica on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:30pm.

One of the big risks a military commander has (i.e. CIC) is to be perceived as weak because then an over-reaction is necessary to be taken seriously.

Carter was not taken as a serious threat but when Reagan was inaugurated the Iranians let the hostages go.

Don't get all worked up

Submitted by Barack_must_go..... on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 12:36pm.

Don't get all worked up thinking the Ass Clown actually did something for, not against the sovereignty / safety of America and her people.

This supposedly was a routine joint exercise between the U S and South Korea scheduled long ago. It just happens to coincide with the lastest " act of war " perpetrated by North Korea while Obama gives them a stern tongue lashing ( usually reserved for those evil Republicans, Tea Party folks and any other real American who dares to disagree with his socialist agenda ), although this time doing so from under his bed is a rather queer new strategy.

The jury is still out on this one.

Barack_Must_Go.....

Catty posting of the day...and a barf-bag alert!

Submitted by motherbelt on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 1:39pm.

Big Surprise: Michelle Obama makes Vogue's Best-Dressed List.

What Gina Miller has to say about it is pretty good. No, it's great. She says what the fashion industry is too besotted to see.

Here's why the barf-bag alert:

“Style is not an afterthought to this wife and mother committed to national service; whether she is frolicking on the White House lawn in Converse or at an awards dinner in Michael Kors scarlet chiffon, she always looks elegant and appropriate to the occasion and to our modern times.”

[Mrs.] Obama, Tally says, “has made an interest in and love of fashion – having fun with it, the way it can make one feel good about oneself – accessible to all. But beyond her wardrobe, it is her confidence, sense of purpose and grace she wears best of all.”

Follow the link to Politico for some examples of her "style," and make sure you link from there to the Vogue article to see the "flowing blue and white dress" that so caught Vogue's attention (#3).

motherbelt, I'll second

Submitted by Chris Norman on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 12:39am.

motherbelt,

I'll second your "meow" and go one further. If Michelle Obama, for some reason, squeezed into a cardboard tube, the media "fashionistas" would praise her for it's "bold form-fitting simplicity".

Let's make the 2012 campaign: "The War on Error"

If Laura Bush wore the work-out gear that . . .

Submitted by Galvanic on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 4:35pm.

. . . Michelle Obama wears, her fashion-sense would be ridiculed by the same fashioneers who praise Obama's.

I fear that this is much more than it seems

Submitted by c5then on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 2:40pm.

I suspect that this is China behind the scenes setting us up. This has all the subtle appearance of a chess match.

Here is what I think may be transpiring... China gets N. Korea to go all bully on S. Korea and then says virtually nothing. We of course, move to show our strong support for our Ally and send a carrier strike group over for "pre-arranged exercises". China loudly and forcefully protest our "meddling" in their backyard. N. Korea does something increadibly stupid (like actually firing on our warships) and China jumps in and puts an immediate stop to N. Korea's antics, showing that it is they who control that area of the world. They then ask that we leave the region to them under threat of deteriorating relations (and their holding so much of our debt). Obama is more than willing to turn tail and leave showing our allies that we are weak and untrustworthy.

This could be all a prelude to China taking back Taiwan in a few years after the US is successfully removed from the Western Pacific.

I hope I am wrong.

Madison and Jefferson and Franklin built a Republic - Roberts killed it!

With Obama in command now

Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 7:03pm.

With Obama in command now would be the optimum chance with the PIC.

Nuke em til they glow; then shoot em in the dark

Smacked at basketball

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 4:01pm.

Looks like the Chairman got smacked playing basketball.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010/11/26/obama-needs-stitches-hurt-bas...

12 stitches on his lip, that must have been a helluva hit or whatever it was.

I can say only one thing about this: Karma can be a b!tch. And they say that's an elbow strike, fine, but I like to call it a b!tch-slap by Karma.

-Jon

Oops, I almost forgot: ROLL TIDE!

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 4:15pm.

And they are currently rolling over Auburn in the Iron Bowl 14-0.

:-)

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

The basketball smackdown

Submitted by bkeyser on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 7:04pm.

As Jon referenced above, Barry needs to stick to golf. Not sure if elbow'er -Rey Decerega of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute- was upset about the failure of the DREAM Act, or if he's just MS-13. Regardless, the symbolism isn't lost on this photoshopper.

Wow....again.

Submitted by jon_torlin on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 8:11pm.

Once again, yet another masterpiece.

And you know, you might have hit it right on, he may end up looking like that even though it looks like he got it on the side or the lower lip.

I linked from Drudge where the yahoo article mentions that guy, there's a picture of the Chairman looking out the window with an ice pack. If I didn't know better, he looks angry in that picture.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101126/ap_on_go_pr_wh/us_obama

Heh, the article states he's an "avid golfer" but doesn't say anything about his skill(lack of) with it.

I still like to think of this as Karma b!tch-slapping him one and Karma works in mysterious ways, even through people.

-Jon

Jon

Submitted by bkeyser on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 8:21pm.

I initially had the stitches on the lower lip, and I swelled his eye up, but then I saw an update that said the stitches are in the upper lip. The article you link indicates that also (I saw it on HotAir) even though the pictures look like he's holding his lower lip. I even had it up on Flickr but took it down when I saw the update. Then when I moved the stitches, I decided the eye swelling didn't look realistic enough, so I just went with the slight discoloration.

Oh Nooooooooooooooooos! Bama loses to Auburn by one!

Submitted by Dave. on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 7:14pm.

In Alabama, that means the Tide has had a losing season. It doesn't matter if they beat everybody else they play, if they lose to Auburn, the season is a wash.

Sure hope Saban doesn't take a brick through a window tonight.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

New photo of Barry, back on

Submitted by bkeyser on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 9:25pm.

New photo of Barry, back on the basketball court. From now on, he'll be protected.

How would the Chinese act?

Submitted by bgirardo on Fri, 11/26/2010 - 10:20pm.

Overtly?

Hardly. Trash our currency? Much more likely.

Interesting other news lately ... Russia and the Chi-Coms have agreed to stop using the $$$ for their bi-lateral trade. Now we just need the Saudi's to move off the $$$ and we're somewhere where the Weimar Republic was in '28.

All I can hope for is that "cooler" head's pervail and we don't stage ourselves for failure again.

Show of force

Submitted by Galvanic on Sat, 11/27/2010 - 4:41pm.

Sending elements of the US Seventh Fleet into the incident area is SOP for the US. When tensions between the PRC and Taiwan rise, we send a carrier strike group through the Taiwan Strait.

I expect that the ROK-US exercise will go on; the North Koreans will continue to posture with outrageous statements; things will wind down, and everything will return to normal.

The North Koreans will claim victory, and we'll take credit for restoring the status quo.

BURN BABY BURN

Submitted by MrShy on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 7:50pm.

We need to do this to every mosque that is found to have been the safe-haven and death-influencer of a terrorist killer that attacks, or tries to attack, us.

And I'm being kind, because as someone more militant (and yeah, we should all be more militant, as we, the people, are the final military that can reject the creeping of Islam into our peaceful world) commented somewhere:

"Bulldoze all mosques in the US. They are the crack houses of the soul."

Spot-on.

And fudge the blowback from muslim-loving libs and the media, and the hideous muslims themselves who make out like the victims. We have already been at war with them for some time, so might as well open this wound all the way and cut out the cancer.

- Shy Shuffle

EDIT: It's also at Fox .... but it's interesting, MSDNC has turned off commenting. And so far, nada from CNN on this. I'm sure they are shaking in their boots having to report this.

Join Mr. Shy and The 1* Percent

Well, what about the Wikileaks thing?

Submitted by Blonde on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:07pm.

Just read an interesting snippet at the UK Daily Mail, re: HRC directing spying on foreign dips:

Requests for IT related information – such as details of passwords, personal encryption keys and network upgrades - could also raise suspicions that the US was preparing to mount a hacking operation.

It is set to lead to international calls for Mrs Clinton to resign.

This makes me go HMMM. Apparently the Guardian has had access to alot of this info for a while. No wonder the press here isn't covering it....but apparently the you know what is going to hit the fan, soon.

Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)

Its not any revelation, all

Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 11:10pm.

Its not any revelation, all countries spy on one another to gain an advantage. And the UN and its diplomats are used extensively to do so.

Nuke em til they glow; then shoot em in the dark

Yep. Boring.

Submitted by The Vet on Mon, 11/29/2010 - 12:55am.

Sorry. Your country does things you would prolly not want to know about just to protect you. But yeah, that whole security thing usually protects you from knowing so hey, looks like some jerk thought being a jerk and letting you know about the dirty secrets took precidence over us protecting you with the things you would rather not know. Ahh, whatever, lunch? Who is in the mood for Mexican today?

It is despicable that some

Submitted by Dan The Man 2 on Mon, 11/29/2010 - 2:06am.

It is despicable that some jerk did this and he or she should get the maximum. I wonder if it is because the Boy Blunder is in charge this is now out there. The timing of all this is suspect, almost if the Boy Blunder did it himself.

Nuke em til they glow; then shoot em in the dark

J,

Submitted by Dave. on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:25pm.

I can't believe that site is even still up.

A real president with some stones would have had it taken down by now, and further had that limp-wristed goober-cheese that runs it hunted down.

And I would just love to know who coughed up the classified info they keep posting.

My gut is telling me it's somebody in the White House.

-Dave

Vote for the American in November

D, it was an American soldier

Submitted by Blonde on Sun, 11/28/2010 - 8:45pm.

....an unhappy gay soldier....seeking revenge, no doubt.

Here's the link on the UK Daily Mail. I like to see their take on things, which is usually a hundred and eighty degrees opposed to the usual media stuff we see here.

Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)

Blonde, I love this

Submitted by Radical1979 on Mon, 11/29/2010 - 12:52am.

Blonde, I love this quote,

The U.S. branded France's President Nicola Sarkozy an 'emperor with no clothes' with a 'thin-skinned and authoritarian personal style',
This administration projecting much?

Proud member of the 53%!