Open Thread: Ohio and Mississippi's Election Results
Yesterday's election saw three especially controversial ballot measures, two in Ohio and one in Mississippi. Ohio voters voted on a measure to restrict collective bargaining rights, similar to the Wisconsin law passed by Gov. Scott Walker earlier this year, and on a measure to opt out the national health care mandate imposed by Obamacare. Mississippi voters voted on a ballot initiative to declare that life begins at conception, seeking to ban abortion altogether. However, the only measure to pass was the health care mandate opt out in Ohio.
What are your thoughts on the three ballot initiatives? Are you surprised by the outcomes? Let us know your thoughts in the comments.
Ohio's collective bargaining restrictions were not expected to pass according to polls, but state Republicans argued they were essential to close Ohio's deficit. According to Fox News:
Senate Bill 5 would have banned Ohio's public employees from bargaining over health care and pension benefits. It would also have required them to pay at least 15 percent of their health care costs.
[Gov. John] Kasich and other Republicans had argued that the restrictions were necessary to close the state's $8 billion deficit and help local governments balance their budgets, while avoiding service cuts or tax increases.
Ohio's other ballot measure did pass, creating a state constitutional amendment to prevent the government from forcing Ohio residents to buy health insurance.
Voters in Ohio have approved a ballot measure intended to keep government from requiring Ohioans to participate in any health care system.
The constitutional amendment passed is largely symbolic, coming in response to the 2009 federal health care overhaul, a provision of which mandates that most Americans purchase health care.
Supporters hope it will prompt a challenge of the overhaul before the U.S. Supreme Court.
Finally, in Mississippi, a personhood amendment to define life as beginning at conception also failed, perhaps because of its ambiguity in terms of birth control and in vitro fertilization.
The so-called "personhood" initiative was rejected by more than 55 percent of voters, falling far short of the threshold needed for it to be enacted. If it had passed, it was virtually assured of drawing legal challenges because it conflicts with the Supreme Court's 1973 Roe v. Wade decision that established a legal right to abortion.
Supporters of the initiative wanted to provoke a lawsuit to challenge the landmark ruling. The measure divided the medical and religious communities and caused some of the most ardent abortion opponents, including Republican Gov. Haley Barbour, to waver with their support. [...]
"Some very strongly pro-life people have raised questions about the ambiguity and about the actual consequences -- whether there are unforeseen, unintended consequences. And I'll have to say that I have heard those concerns and they give me some pause," Barbour said last week.
What do you think of the results in Ohio and Mississippi? Were they what you were expecting?
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Comments
Ohio's Issue 2 failed because
Submitted by inquiringmind on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:01pm.
Ohio's Issue 2 failed because the unions out spent Govonor Kasich 10 to 1 if the yards signs and commercials are any indication.
Speaking just in central Ohio where I live, I was floored by the lack of pro Issue 2 advertising.
Kasich, where the HECK were you?!?
Inquiringmind,
Submitted by 26CX on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 2:11pm.
You're right about the enormous imbalance in spending between the pro/con Issue 2 forces. Where I live in Ohio the ads against were much more numerous and pushed the idea that if Issue 2 passed we weren't going to have any police or fire protection and schools were going to go into the toilet. The ads FOR Issue 2 seemed pretty low key and didn't make a real effort to dramatize the impact of continuing as we are.
In addition, there were two instances of advocates against Issue 2 coming to my door to try to convince me to vote no. In one case the gentleman stressed how it was going to adversely impact veterans because they wouldn't automatically get 5 points on the civil service exams (my neighbor told him I am a veteran) and in the second instance the woman canvasser told me that the bill was going to take away all collective bargaining rights for public employees- which was not true.
The folks on the right have got to start doing a much better job of promoting what we believe is key to the survival of this country or we're going to go down in flames. As it stands, the left is running circles around us.
"As it stands, the left is
Submitted by richflanj on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 3:51pm.
"As it stands, the left is running circles around us."
That is because they are VERY experienced liars.
Ohio can vote all it wants to
Submitted by jkwtrading on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:10pm.
Ohio can vote all it wants to spend...but they better have the cash. Last I saw is cash does not grow on trees. the sun does not rise in the west and set in the east.
Choice?
Submitted by Fredy on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:18pm.
Was this simply a situation in Ohio where the people voted for choice? Choice in healthcare and choice in labor unions?
by no means a union supporter
Submitted by jgarcia on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:30pm.
Kasich wasted an opportunity to be above the political "norm"
Kasich include police (FOP), firemen and nurses into SB5 and rammed it down everyone's throats like Obamacare by refusing to meet with anyone affected by this or listen to anyone explaining to him that this will fail due to way its handled and the tiny fine print! I feel asleep 10 times trying to read the bill.
Issue 1 failed (raise Judge’s ages to 75) and Issue 3 passed (we won't be forced into Obamacare)......most of the school levy’s all failed (no new taxes), meaning we are still a purple state. But the thug’s of certain unions will over shadow this and this is all Kasich fault.
EAS test today
Submitted by jon_torlin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:55pm.
I guess we'll find out in an hour what will happen.
One thing's for sure, we can never rely on the federal government to protect us.
-Jon
It came and it went
Submitted by jon_torlin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 3:03pm.
Well, that was anti-climatic, wasn't even what they said it was. Lasted about 55 seconds, black screen with old style analog lettering.
Anyone else see that?
-Jon
Don't be afraid, It's only a test.
Submitted by upcountrywater on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 1:57pm.
Don't panic! TV and radio to shut down across America at 2pm EST today as national alert system is tested..
You Didn't Build That.
inquiringmind & 26CX, I saw
Submitted by irishguy on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 2:21pm.
inquiringmind & 26CX, I saw the same situation here in southwestern Ohio. As I mentioned in another post, I even saw firefighters wearing "No on Issue 2" tees over their gear at my polling place.
Most of these bills were worded confusingly
Submitted by NJRightWinger12 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 2:49pm.
And made me ponder how to vote for it, and if Im confused, imagine how most of the sheeple are going to react?
The top of the hour radio news programs were cut,for 45 seconds
Submitted by upcountrywater on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 3:16pm.
It really was an Outer Limits program with all the blaring 60's style sirens.
Up next a 3 hour "Emergency" National Alert program from the WH?
You Didn't Build That.
Good news: Virginia appeared to have taken a sharp right turn
Submitted by vrwc13 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 3:34pm.
The GOP seemed to have picked up two seats in the Senate, which would evenly divide the 40-member chamber among Republicans and Democrats. Any tie votes would be broken by Lt. Gov. Bill Bolling (R).
Republicans will have complete control of state government for only the second time since the Civil War and, some say, a new mandate to push forward a strongly conservative agenda.
On the campaign trail, Republicans generally focused their pitches on boosting jobs, curbing spending and streamlining government. In many parts of the state, GOP candidates encountered no or token opposition from Democrats. - The Washington Post
...a good trend, let's see it roll on through 2012.
v
Perry / PalinGingrich 2012
The burden of life is from ourselves, its lightness from the grace of Christ and the love of God. - William Bernard Ullanthorne
The last thing I heard last
Submitted by ricklail on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 4:11pm.
The last thing I heard last night it looked like it might go 21-19 in favor of Republicans. Can the minority party filibuster in VA?
Poor Ohio. Ironically the
Submitted by picofaradpjf on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 3:38pm.
Poor Ohio. Ironically the scare ads will come true because Issue 2 was voted down. Without the money savings of Issue 2 the state will have no choice but to lay a lot of workers off.
Good thing WI got our reforms through. Here the sweetheart deals between the Unions and the Democrats were so bad that the State was under contract to buy health insurance from a company owned by the Unions. Who just happened to greatly over charge for it. That little scam probably cost the state billions of wasted dollars over the last 30 years.
A lot of local schools and governments managed to balance their budgets just by buying their health insurance from someone else or forcing the union company to drop their rates to normal market prices. The only localities struggling still are the places where union bought politicians extended the sweetheart contracts before the reforms took effect.
Wanna have some anonymous fun with a real Occutard?
Submitted by SickofLibs on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 4:10pm.
Post over here. He'll take the posts down eventually, but they sometimes stay up for a day or so.
I like 'shallow grave' comment, <wink wink>
SoL - I POSTED!!!
Submitted by MrShy on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 4:50pm.
Hey, go there now :)
We should bombard this doofus. Immature and not at all productive, I know, but I'm at my wits end with this (which they want -- these commies want civil unrest and war so O can completely take over.)
I'm "Occupy Violence", btw.
- shy on vinyl
Join Mr. Shy and The 1* Percent
I'd be willing to bet my next
Submitted by ricklail on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 4:55pm.
I'd be willing to bet my next grandchild they don't pick up any roadside trash on their march.
ROFL
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 6:29pm.
A guy in Bel Air MD offers to help in any way possible. When a guy says there are about a dozen of us can you put us up, indoors or out, guy number one says, I'll find a park for you to stay in.
They love one another so much!
No Fast and Furious reporting
Submitted by ricklail on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 4:53pm.
Nor have there been any reporting on Obama trashing Bebe. He is getting a pass on both issues from the MSM. That doesn't really surprise me. Joe Pa is getting more coverage than the previous 2 stories.
Congratulations GM
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 6:09pm.
Your stock tanked 11% today.
That cant be Cool
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:31pm.
One of these debate moderators just told us we were wrong about bailing them out?
Ohio Issues
Submitted by stratman on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 8:15pm.
Ohio voted on 3 Issues.
I'm glad Issue 1 failed and Issue 3 passed. Neither of those Issues were publicized or discussed much. The enormous disconnect (or manipulative bias) of the Media was in full display today on an NPR radio show broadcasted on PBS television - All Sides with Ann Fisher - over these issues (like Rush televising his radio show). Notably about Issue 3, guest Joe Vardon (Public Affairs Reporter, The Columbus Dispatch) made a comment that people misunderstood thinking Issue 3 was about ObamCare. Not a single media/journalist took exception to this egregious comment. Contemporaneously, there is nothing else Issue 3 would refer to but ObamCare.
I believe Issue 2 was a failure because Kasich and supporters failed to clearly and succinctly educate the Public why it was vital to Ohio's future and fair for all Ohio tax-paying citizens. Media is to blame for this as well. While true that pro-Union, anti-Issue 2 groups received more money than those pro-Issue 2, the glaring lack of cohesive arguments from pro- Issue 2 supporters combined with the emotional pleas of anti-Issue 2 detractors were the winning combination for the Left. A side note about the contributions to the opposing groups failed to mention where the money came from for the anti-Issue 2 group all the while making sure to let the public know how unpopular Issue 2 was based on contributions against it. I think it is a good bet that multi-millions came from outside Ohio, probably Union and Democrat Party in origination.
Also of note is how Media is already walking back the once alledged importance of Ohio's Issue 3 on the national debate and potential SCOTUS review of ObamaCare. These Media activists are despicable reprobates.
Funniest Thing Said On Election Day
Submitted by stratman on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 8:29pm.
In my county, we use optical scanning machines to scan our ballots which are filled out with a pen by filling in a bubble corresponding to our vote. In the past, we would hand our ballots, stored inside a folder, to the election official who would then file the ballot in the predetermined fashion. This year, election officials were not to touch our ballots at all. We were expected to tear off the stub and place it inside an envelope and then feed our ballots one page at a time into the optical scanner. When I asked the lady at the official's table why the change, her answer was succinct but spoke volumes:
I think I found an honest election official. :-)
Where is the debate chat?
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:29pm.
Eh
Boudin
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:33pm.
Don't you love that the audience had NO interest in hearing about the accusations about Cain?
Yep,
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:37pm.
I think I would fit right in : ]
I wish Cain would had thanked Mitt for not piling on, when the moderator tried to provoke it. Newt has been awesome, what he said about the cretins in the park was fabulous
I realy dislike the moderators
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:39pm.
But the candidates, all of them are doing very well with them. Been fun to watch. But I am going to miss the next 30 min or so. Neighbors need a hand.
Anyone watching the Debate...(you, NS?)
Submitted by Blonde on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:56pm.
Huntsman on the banks.
Que'lle idiot!
We must require these big banks to pay into a fund to reinsure the risk.
HELLLLLOOOO Jon! Can you say AIG? I knew you could, you idiot.
Handy Reference Guide to Obama's Gaffes and Goofs ~ Currently Numbering 200 (and Counting)
Princess Nancy
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 9:56pm.
Ah, I love that one.
moderators
Submitted by 26CX on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 10:00pm.
The moderators are really getting roughed up by the candidates - especially Newt. It's fun to watch.
Yep,
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 10:20pm.
Great to have them on the offensive for a change
Indoor windstorm?
Submitted by mom_rox on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 10:29pm.
Romney has about 5 strands of hair across his forehead. Yes, this is a petty comment, but it looks contrived.
Kramer has no credibility
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 10:47pm.
For him to sit there and talk about people getting ripped off by the markets is ironic. He's a failed fund manager who's a better actor than financial guru.
Kramer
Submitted by 26CX on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:14pm.
Kramer came across as a total ass. It was funny when Cain tried to calm him down and said I feel your pain.
JoePa
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:16pm.
is out.
What a shame
Submitted by Boudin on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:22pm.
I thought the world of JoPa. What the heck was he and others thinking?
IMHO
Submitted by Radical1979 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:42pm.
I think Paterno thought he was PSU football, and anything that would harm the program, would harm him. Honestly, I thought for a long time that he should have retired. Let someone else have a chance, the world wouldn't end without Paterno a the helm. Now he goes out with the shame of having allowed the destruction of young boys because he did nothing to stop a pedophile.
Penn State*
Submitted by cajun2 on Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:52pm.
How sad that Joe Paterno must leave under a cloud. His accomplishments deserve better than this. Not having all of the information, still it is clear that all those in positions of responsibility had to go. I also heard today that several years ago, a player walked into the shower and saw Sandusky molesting a 10 year old boy. The player left the area and promptly called his father to ask what to do. His dad told him to leave the building. How sad that this strong young athlete did not have the courage or knowledge to grab the kid and kick the coach's butt. That story says something about the world our kids must live in today where there are efforts to "normalize" this kind of behavior. Not blaming the player, blaming the society that put him in a difficult position and unable to make a decision concerning anything but his own best interests...
Yep,
Submitted by Boudin on Thu, 11/10/2011 - 12:26am.
I feel the same way. Why was this allowed to linger?
take a cue from Sarah
Submitted by mom_rox on Thu, 11/10/2011 - 12:36am.
Gov. Perry - next time write on your palm. (of all things to forget, energy ???)
Now, I'm sure the media will be as forgiving with Perry as they were with Biden's gaffes. right?
Good intentions, BAD Law
Submitted by Russian55 on Thu, 11/10/2011 - 3:34am.
Mississippi dodged a bullet: This would have made even use of some contraceptives cause for a MURDER investigation, since many do not prevent fertilization, but implantation. It was poorly devised. Can you imagine having a miscarriage and facing a murder investigation?
You need more than fertilization of an egg to create a person. How would the law have applied to frozen embryos that were attained from in vitro methods?
It would have been a legal quagmire.
---
Those who beat their swords into plowshares will end up plowing for those who kept their swords in the first place!
Way way off topic
Submitted by Prisondog1776 on Thu, 11/10/2011 - 4:19am.
but have a question because this is an 'Open Thread'. The History Channel has a program that aired "Vietnam in HD"...was not even alive during that time(born in 1974) but i saw in this program some really hypocrites. First i saw (from the program) History Channel aired was that protesters wanted the war to end. Signs and posters said bring the troops home. The next scene these 'protesters' that wanted the troops out of Vietnam , spat at and ridiculed the troops that arrived home. My father served in the Navy during that time and to this day he is confused as well about the protests. I my self served in the Army history here of serving and cant see what those protests were about. They WANT all troops to be at home. They want to demonize all troops?..................... Sadly this reminds me of a group who calls themselves OWS. ........No actual goal. .......................... sorry to deviate from the substance of the thread.