For general discussion and debate. Possible talking point: the Gutless Gang of Eight!
They unanimously voted with their entire party against President Obama's stimulus bill in February, and did so again in April opposing the President's debt-laden 2010 budget. Yet these eight Republican House members broke ranks on Friday, awarding victory to the Democrats in narrowly passing the American Clean Energy and Security Act (ACES)...The best thing for Republicans in Obama-supporting districts would be to break the President's string of legislative victories and start saddling him with highly-publicized losses. With healthcare reform apparently losing moderate Democratic support thanks to the price tag, an ACES defeat Friday could have given Republicans some much-needed momentum heading into this next crucial legislative battle.
Thoughts?



















Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Politics and policy
July 1, 2009 - 09:05 ET by KC MulvilleSaddling Obama with "losses" may make sense, in the pure politics of it. But I don't want to stamp down a policy merely for the politics of it. If Obama came out tomorrow with a good policy, I wouldn't want to lose the policy simply as part of the political "game." The problem with voting for this ACES bill is that it's a lousy policy to start with. It imposes enormous cost for little or no benefit.
KC
July 1, 2009 - 09:18 ET by Noel SheppardKC,
I think you missed the point. I wasn't suggesting the Gang should have voted against this bill just to give Obama a loss. Clearly, you don't believe these Eight actually thought this was a good bill. Instead, it appears they voted for it for their own political reasons.
With that in mind, they could have made strictly political votes with stimulus and/or the budget and voted for policy reasons on this one. They and their advisors, in my view, played this political game very poorly -- ESPECIALLY as it pertains to policy. Make sense? ns
A very astute point given
July 1, 2009 - 10:23 ET by dscottA very astute point given Obama's Chicago culture of corruption view of the world. What were the 8 promised in exchange for their vote? Is it as reported earlier if they cooperate will not have the full weight of the DNC campaigning against them?
Just as importantly what were Snow and Collins (both senators from Maine) offered in exchange for their votes on the stimulus bill? Both with low ACU scores.
As I noted on Bizzyblog, all of the 8 had fairly low ACU scores, most on level with Arlen Spector with one being on level with McCain around 74.
The second point is given their RINOness is a factor of their local constituency (remember this is a Republic where the pol represents the voter of their district) it seems to me our tact is not simply to paint them as self serving pols but tar and feather them as being part of the group who sold out America to hurt their constituency when everything crashes and burns. Why? They need to be burned to a crisp experiencing the policies of
liberalism before seeing the impracticality of their emotionalism. Some
people can see the danger before it comes to learn of it’s mistake,
some people can only learn from experiencing the mistake. However, once
learned they won’t make that mistake again.
Hence the GOP MUST immediately come up with Contract With America 2.0 Here is a framework to start that discussion. The success or failure of the GOP to capitalize on the public's unease will be determined by their ability to clearly articulate the direction they believe the country should be headed, that's called leadership and so far it is sorely lacking. Reacting to liberal assaults like ObamaCare is not leadership, proacting to the public's common sense by reflecting their values is the self governance they want. The GOP lack the leadership of skills of Eisenhower and it is high time they reach down to the core and get them!
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, starving the poor one gallon of ethanol at a time. Fill your tank with E85 and cull a village.
Rhinos
July 1, 2009 - 10:29 ET by JDWThese people justified themselves by comparing America to other nations around the world which are racing to reduce emissions. They want the US on equal footing. The Rhinos do not realize and/or do not care is that China is growing nuke and coal plants; Green is the last objective on their minds.
JDW
DAILY WAVE
When people fear their government there is tyranny.
When government fears the people there is liberty.
Understood
July 1, 2009 - 10:44 ET by KC MulvilleWell, therein lies the tale, Noel.
Look at what happened here. Here we have an issue in which we've been assured that "science has spoken," and that WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING! In the public mind, Obama's trying to do something. The media says that we can address global warming, but the Republicans are blocking our noble Barack.
When it comes to the stimulus and budget, the public doesn't want them anyway, so they don't care about GOP blocking them. But if polls are right, the public does want something done about global warming. The details don't matter to the public. They want something done! Politically, then, the Eight may be right about how the public feels.
A principled conservative would argue that the details do matter, and that you can't just put out expensive and broad legislation just because you have an urge.
We Have To Do Something
July 1, 2009 - 12:05 ET by JDWWhy do we have to do anything?
'the public does want something done about global warming'
1-How many people can define cap-and-trade?
2-What percentage of the public is willing to pay to more taxes for cleaner energy?
3-How do people feel about the cost of energy v. greener energy?
JDW
DAILY WAVE
When people fear their government there is tyranny.
When government fears the people there is liberty.
I agree
July 1, 2009 - 12:33 ET by KC MulvilleI don't agree with the majority, but unfortunately, I think that's how the majority feels ... it's a hazy "do something!"
It's funny -- I just picked up and started reading Michael Crichton's State of Fear. Great story so far, and the disputed evidence about global warming is a key plot point. That's probably what's driving my interest on this topic (along with the passage of any bill that no one reads).
When Has Obama Agreed With The Majority?
July 1, 2009 - 12:49 ET by JDWWhat hapens to the world economy if big oil is shut down?
Read this and this.
JDW
DAILY WAVE
When people fear their government there is tyranny.
When government fears the people there is liberty.
Screw the politics. ACES
July 1, 2009 - 09:18 ET by HockeyKidScrew the politics. ACES is just plain stupid, along with the 8 that crossed over to support it.
Ironically, 8s and ACES are known as the Dead Man's Hand in poker. Perhaps a harbinger of the mid-term elections next year.
"Beauty is only skin deep, but liberal's to the bone." - me
Dead Man's Hand
July 1, 2009 - 14:59 ET by stratmanHow apropos.
Nice pickup, HockeyKid.
Careful, or the Dems will call you for hooking.
RINOs are idiots who keep
July 1, 2009 - 09:19 ET by mattmRINOs are idiots who keep hitting themselves in the head with a hammer and then wonder where their headache came from.
Albert Einstein Quote (obviously he had met some RINOs)
July 1, 2009 - 09:31 ET by GothampcInsanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.
the gang of eight
July 1, 2009 - 09:25 ET by larry on LIwere probable promised set asides in the bill for their votes.well the good part is that they singled themselves out for voters and any challengers in the 2010 election.i am sure mike pence will deal with them.
Michael Steele
July 1, 2009 - 09:29 ET by GothampcI saw Michael Steele on Hannity last night. He's not convincing me that he's the right man to lead the GOP. He's way too laid back. He seems to just shrug his shoulders and say "Oh well." The GOP needs someone who is a fighter. Who can get up there and pound away at the party message. Is there any fight left in the party?
I think the problem with
July 1, 2009 - 09:34 ET by DontFeedTheTrollsI think the problem with the RNC is that they want to appeal to democrats, and are acting just like democrats to do so. Look at Colin Powell. So what Republican (Conservative) wants to vote for a democrat? None! The RNC is on a losing path.
D
Write Congress and say vote NO on cap and trade!
Keep the ILLEGALS out, join NumbersUSA to send free faxes to your reps.
Wholeheartedly agree with you...
July 1, 2009 - 09:52 ET by OBIE1DAKOMYI too saw Steele on Hannity. I haven't been impressed with him at all. He is the wrong kind of leader for the party. What's a leader... It ain't him. He doesn't inspire confidence. He doesn't evoke in me the eloquence and fierceness we need in someone that will put the opinions and the positions of this party on the table, outline the role the party will have in restore order in our land, specially during this crucial time. If the appeal of him was having a Republican Barry O then forget it. The strategy isn't working. Race and color should never have a place in politics and definitely should not decide who your leaders should be. Americans will soon learn not to vote for someone on the basis of the color of their skin.
I'm not convinced either
July 1, 2009 - 10:55 ET by Tom in NCMichael Steele is not much of a fighter for Conservatives, he is much to willing to be bipartisan with the democrats and I say that type of attitude is exactly why we are where we are. We need someone with a back bone of iron not jelly, someone who is going to fight the democrats tooth and nail, someone who doesn't mind getting bloodied in a scrap and still winds up kicking some liberal ass.
Senator Kirk?
July 1, 2009 - 09:35 ET by CaringwhiteguyMark Kirk really wants to be Senator from Illinois. We'll just have to see if this stunt helps or hurts him. It's pretty obvious that it didn't help any other American.
The Cap and Trade bill has nothing do with the downfall or our
July 1, 2009 - 09:37 ET by shawn228The cap and trade bill has nothing to with the downfall of our country, neither is the stimulus. Our country is going down simply because of same sex marriage, porn and other forms of debauchery. "sarc" According to Rep. Sally Kern
He had my vote
shawn
July 1, 2009 - 10:31 ET by larry on LIyou left out the most important problem plaguing our country,liberalism.
It is mostly right and all a
July 1, 2009 - 11:23 ET by Dan The Man 2It is mostly right and all a symptoms of sin in ones life. What we have here is a failure to communicate. Common sense has failed these people as it fails you most times.
Hi Dan The Man 2
July 1, 2009 - 20:06 ET by shawn228What are we failing to communicate here? Common sense has failed who?
Hey Common sense fails me the time, but can you explain your reasoning so my liberal mind can comprehend it? :-)
He had my vote
Shawn,
July 1, 2009 - 16:08 ET by R D HelmLOL-I hate to tell Sally Kern, but what 3-5% of the population is doing behind closed doors isn't what is pushing us to the edge of the cliff.
Now, blowing $12 trillion out the door that we don't even have is a whole different story.
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
LMAO Dave
July 1, 2009 - 20:03 ET by shawn228My thoughts exactly what is more important? A reckless administration that blows 12 trillon, or who is blowing who? ;-)
He had my vote
This collection of RINOS is particularly odious.
July 1, 2009 - 09:39 ET by CTThey are all Pelosi Pussy-Whipped.
Today is quite the day when
July 1, 2009 - 09:43 ET by Roger the ShrubberToday is quite the day when it comes to tremendous losses of life on history-changing battlefields...
1861 – The 26th North Carolina enters a sleepy little Pennsylvania town looking for shoes. Little did they know history was about to be written.
1898 – The Battle of San Juan Hill occurs, as 15,000 US troops overpower 800 Cubans.
1916 – The bloodiest day in British history begins as the meat grinder of war along the River Somme begins to churn out 20,000 dead and 40,000 wounded in one day.
1942 – After a 250 day siege, the Ukrainian port of Sevastopol falls to the Nazis. The siege cost the lives of over 200,000 soldiers and civilians.
Most horrific of all? Fred Schneider turns 58!
Priceline
July 1, 2009 - 10:33 ET by JDWI prefer them for trip plans.
As such, for your next vacation no doubt CA would love to have you. Explore the state and choose a location. You might enjoy it so much that you could move there!
JDW
DAILY WAVE
When people fear their government there is tyranny.
When government fears the people there is liberty.
Rounding up democratics
July 1, 2009 - 10:01 ET by slickwillie2001Pelosi uses torture to round up votes among the democratics:
"One of Pelosi’s first targets was Rep. Rush Holt (D-N.J.), a key fence-sitter who wanted more money generated from the carbon trading to be directed to the research and development of green technology. Pelosi talked to him again and again, but he wouldn’t budge. Her message to him was the same as it was to others: It wasn’t worth voting against the bill because of what wasn’t in it.
According to witnesses, Pelosi perched herself on the arm of Holt’s chair and went nose to nose with him for a half-hour warning him that his no vote could scuttle the entire climate change effort — and that liberals would have another chance to make their case once the bill came back from the Senate.
Around 2 o’clock, he became a 'yes.' "
Could anyone withstand that kind of abuse?
Ref: Chaos, Arm-Twisting Gave Pelosi Win: http://essenceofpolitics.blogspot.com
Anyone really expect anything different?
July 1, 2009 - 10:14 ET by AnkharanThis is politics as usual. Nothing has changed except who gets the bribe money.
Face it America, your republic is corrupt and you better do something about it before it is too late. 2012.. way too late.
Obama might be the orchastra leader but without the orchastra playing the music he is a leader without a song.
You think Obama is the cause of all of this? No.. it is your Congress. But it looks like the voters are too stupid or are purposefully destroying the republic with their callousness of who they elect. C'mon, we demand more out of our pets than we demand from the elected body these days. WTF!
Honduras sticks its thumb right in Obama's eye
July 1, 2009 - 10:25 ET by R D Helmhttp://hotair.com/ar...
Good for them.
Obama is on the wrong side, once again.
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
Looks like "The One" is
July 1, 2009 - 11:18 ET by motherbeltLooks like "The One" is going to have to "recalibrate" another "inartfully worded" statement.
I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson
motherbelt,
July 1, 2009 - 12:42 ET by R D HelmLOL.
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
If these eight hadn't voted for it....
July 1, 2009 - 10:48 ET by Prester John.....I have no doubt that Pelosi had a list of 8 Dems that would've. They may not have liked it but she would twisted their arms enough to get them to cry "uncle" so it still would've passed
The funny thing is that these RINOs obviously thought they could attract so called moderates to vote for them in 2010 by voting for this monstrosity, when in fact all they've done is to drive away a greater number of conservatives so the net effect is a minus.
What a bunch of maroons.
"The Truth is Treason in the Empire of Lies"
www.campaignforliberty.com
If only four of those
July 1, 2009 - 11:04 ET by fitzfongIf only four of those morons voted correctly, the bill would have been defeated. And it would have been preferable for these 8 to do the right thing and force Stretch to twist the necessary Democrat arms to shove this bill down our throats. That way they wouldn't have the cover of claiming it was somehow a bipartisan failure. But these 8 scumbags, like the 3 in the Senate who voted for the bailout, need to be targeted and defeated. The Party needs to fund their primary challengers and withhold finances for their general campaign should they survive the primaries. Take that money and spend it to boost Conservative Republicans in their challenges to the "Blue Dogs" who got bullied by Pelosi into voting for this crap...oh, and if Kirk gets the Republican nomination for BHO's seat, withhold funds from him and put them into the campaign to defeat Harry Reid. But knowing that clown Cornyn, he'll insist on subsidizing Crist, because he'd rather keep the Florida seat in "The Party" (even though that would be replacing one RINO scumbag with an even worse RINO scumbag) and concede to the vulnerable Reid than to try to take Reid down and risk "losing" the Florida seat. I'll bet most Republicans would take their chances "losing" Florida (a Democrat defeating Crist and replacing Martinez would be no great loss) to get a shot at ousting and humiliating Reid. Cornyn needs get his act together or get out.
"I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered." -George Best
The Democrats who voted no
July 1, 2009 - 11:26 ET by motherbeltThe Democrats who voted no were "allowed" to vote that way, in order to save face with their constituents.
Had they not the required number of votes without them, they would not have been allowed to dissent.
Period.
I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson
I am just glad that I
July 1, 2009 - 10:40 ET by Ruths husband BenI am just glad that I live in a state without any of these bozos. I may come up with other reasons to vote against the Republicans running here, but at least they are not disqualified (from my vote) from the get-go.
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read. - Groucho
Did you notice that three
July 1, 2009 - 11:36 ET by motherbeltDid you notice that three of them are from NJ?
Does that mean something?? LOL
I didn't think it was physically possible, but this both sucks and blows. -Bart Simpson
It's Aliiiiivvveee!!!
July 1, 2009 - 10:42 ET by slickwillie2001A sign of life from Hillary: Clinton Urged Obama to Talk Tough on Iran: http://www.washingtontimes.com
I expect more of this, now that some kind of honeymoon is over and Hillary has to lay some tracks of independence to guarantee her future. As the Bamster screws up, she has to have something to point back to as evidence that she didn't agree with him and simply had to follow orders. Watch for the leaks from foggy bottom.
Yes indeedy. It is going
July 1, 2009 - 10:53 ET by Ruths husband BenYes indeedy. It is going to be sweet as Obama's appeasement policy (which apparently applies even to his own staff picks) bites him in the behind. Maybe a learning opportunity for the Great and Mighty O. Many more to follow, I hope.
Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read. - Groucho
After Call From Senator's Office, Small Hawaii Bank Got U.S. Aid
July 1, 2009 - 10:50 ET by Prester JohnThis was actually on the front page of the Washington Post!!
Sen. Daniel K. Inouye's staff contacted federal regulators last fall to ask about the bailout application of an ailing Hawaii bank that he had helped to establish and where he has invested the bulk of his personal wealth.
The bank, Central Pacific Financial, was an unlikely candidate for a program designed by the Treasury Department to bolster healthy banks. The firm's losses were depleting its capital reserves. Its primary regulator, the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp., already had decided that it didn't meet the criteria for receiving a favorable recommendation and had forwarded the application to a council that reviewed marginal cases, according to agency documents.
Two weeks after the inquiry from Inouye's office, Central Pacific announced that the Treasury would inject $135 million.
Many lawmakers have worked to help home-state banks get federal money since the Treasury announced in October that it would invest up to $250 billion in healthy financial firms. But the Inouye inquiry stands apart because of the senator's ties to Central Pacific. While at least 33 senators own shares in banks that got federal aid, a review of financial disclosures and records obtained from regulatory agencies shows no other instance of the office of a senator intervening on behalf of a bank in which he owned shares.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/06/30/AR2009063004229.html?hpid=topnews
While not immediately noting that Inouye is a Dem, they do mention in para 5.
"The Truth is Treason in the Empire of Lies"
www.campaignforliber...
Obama's leadership problem. His loss could be a gain.
July 1, 2009 - 10:48 ET by acaiguanaI've been watching Obama's foreign policy stands this year.
1. He has no clear policy on the Middle East, using Israel as a whipping boy and making banal statements about 'peace' in the region is no formula for peace and certainly doesn't represent his current commitment in Iraq or Afghanistan.
2. Oh, yeah, Iraq and Afghanistan are countries with large Muslim populations that incidentally have US troops fighting radical Muslims there. In all of his comments about Iraq troop realignments he has never mentioned what a Victory has been achieved so far and he has never addressed when his 'surge' in Afghanistan will be successful.
3. He has approached these two wars as if they were off-hand issues to him and he has relegated the US sacrifice in those countries to a footnote.
4. He has not articulated any American foreign policy framework. He appears to be making it up as he goes along. His touted speeches over in Turkey and Cairo resulted in zilch with respect to terrorist activity in Lebanon, Gaza or Iraq.
5. He is being held up as a blabbermouth by politicians in Europe who can't shut up and has no substance behind what he is doing. He can't get a message together from the White House to save his grin. Hillary and Obama don't seem to agree on much and North Korea and Honduras is bringing that out clearly.
6. Honduras has announced that if the exiled ex-Presidente comes back, he'll be put in jail. Why? Because he was violating the very Constitution of the country to turn it into a life-time dictatorship, sorta like Hugo Chavez in Venezuela.
7. He shot from the hip over Honduras, which put him in the same camp as Cuba, Nicaruaga and Venezuela. This is certainly the group of thugs I want America to be associated with on Latin American policy issues.
8. He has said nothing about Venezuela's threat to invade Honduras.
9. He has said nothing about Iranian capture of the British Diplomats.
But, man is he cool. He sure does present a pretty face to the world.
I think he is way over his head and has to rely on bad advisors who appear to be as poorly informed about the world as he is showing in his so-called Policies.
Hot Dog diplomacy may work on the American people in an election - pity the state of that - but it ain't going to produce much good on the Foreign Policy front. In fact, he is assuring the world that another attack on the US in America will probably be met with more of the same appeasement.
ACA
...
Quoted from: 'Acaiguana notes from the Underground' (Soon to be at theaters near you)
As you head east on I-10,
July 1, 2009 - 10:48 ET by fitzfongAs you head east on I-10, making your way towards Palm Springs, you're treated to the reason Mary Bono voted for that phony "Global Warming" bill (well, beside the fact that the Palm Springs area is becoming increasingly liberal as the theatre-types keep rolling in because they can have a wealthy and somewhat captive audience of bored retirees come to watch them perform)...that massive wind farm in the hills alongside the highway. Though it can get quite windy out there, the wind farm is useless. The lion's share of the fans don't even operate. Mary Bono is a joke, she must be electorally punished for this. If this means a Democrat replaces her, fine. Of what use is a Republican in that seat if that Republican is going to vote with Nancy Pelosi on something this important?
"I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered." -George Best
Speaking of windfarms, I
July 1, 2009 - 14:05 ET by ckc1227Speaking of windfarms, I was watching a movie the other night, and one scene, somewhere in Oregon I believe, showed a windfarm full of windmills. I'm guessing there were at least 100 of them....and not one of them was turning, lol.
It was a sunny day though, so maybe they should put some solar panels on the windmills to supply enough power to make them turn. :)
Idle windmills
July 1, 2009 - 14:14 ET by nkviking75Here in North Central Iowa we're surrounded by windfarms. In fact, they are going up so fast that a special rail terminal nearby was built to receive windmill parts for truck transport to various sites. Anyway, I never see a cluster of windmills without seeing a few that are idle. I'm not sure why. Maybe they break down a lot.
When you put the clowns in charge, don't be surprised when a circus breaks out.
The Dems have learned
July 1, 2009 - 14:14 ET by dscottThe Dems have learned nothing from the Danish, German and British experience with wind generators. Nothing what so ever... Do you consider 4% of installed KW as a reliable capacity number when connected to an electric grid? The more wind generators you connect to a grid, the LESS reliable their output, kind of flies in the face of the sales pitch of alternative power.
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, starving the poor one gallon of ethanol at a time. Fill your tank with E85 and cull a village.
Bamster on how to lie
July 1, 2009 - 11:05 ET by slickwillie2001Instructions from the Bamster have gone out to the states on how they are to lie about employment statistics: Obama Asking States to Lie When Counting Jobs Saved or Created: http://www.americanthinker.com
How to lie about facts, thanks for the link slickwillie2001.
July 1, 2009 - 11:54 ET by acaiguanaI copied this from the link above to the Americanthinker.com. This is great.
"Meanwhile, some state officials worried about how they were supposed to count jobs credited to the stimulus. Now, the White House Office of Management and Budget has given states guidance calming these concerns."
Well, thank gosh for the Federal Government and the White House. All those guys working for the State (fill in your state) who track jobs, employment, unemployment, etc can just kick back now and fill in the form. Will they keep copies of the form from week to week so as to not look too silly? Who knows?
"All we're asking them to do is a simple headcount; tell us how many people you hired," said Rob Nabors, the deputy director of the office, in an interview."
The key word in this 'guidance' is simple. Exactly what the White House likes. If they got complicated, the poor starving masses of unemployed and under-employed would not understand what we were saying about them.
"Recipients won't be asked to grapple with complicated estimates, he added. Instead, they may use their best guess whether a job would have been created or saved in the absence of a recovery plan, and to not count it if they are uncertain.
Best guess - is that like Joe Biden's comment, 'Everyone guessed wrong," or am I on another thread there.
"Philip Mattera, research director for the economic development research group Good Jobs First, said the method appeared to be "a bit impressionistic" and presented pitfalls. "One is the risk of unreasonable reporting; the other risk is how the whole system is perceived because of the possibility of unreasonable reporting," he said."
There seem to be two pitfalls.
1. ...unreasonable reporting.
2. See number one above (Loop).
What's next? Ctl + Alt + Delete?
"Craig Jennings, a senior policy analyst at the nonpartisan OMB Watch, also said the new guidance could allow state officials to use their own definition for the number of hours in a "full-time equivalent" job, thus making it possible to credit stimulus projects for more employment."
Here we get into the mucky-muck. A full-time equivalent job is whatever they want to say it is without any relevance to reality. I suppose 9 million fifteen hour a week jobs would be 7 million full-time equilivants.
Leave it to Liberals to equivocate anything (or is that conflate?) to prove a point that is both useless and unproved. Quite a feat of number crunching if you will allow me to crunch my teeth for a moment.
ACA
...
Quoted from: 'Acaiguana notes from the Underground' (Soon to be at theaters near you)
Waxman
July 1, 2009 - 12:29 ET by JDWWaxman hospitalized
JDW
DAILY WAVE
When people fear their government there is tyranny.
When government fears the people there is liberty.
How to bypass the 8
July 1, 2009 - 12:37 ET by east tennessee johnAre the Republicans completely devoid of stategists? With the Dems having an overwhelming majority in the House and now a 60 vote filibuster proof Senate, why sit there and get wacked? They, the state run media barely runs your objections now. Why not skip votes? What will change? Argue your points during the already limited debate, then go back to you local offices, with local news coverage, and point out what's wrong with what the Dems are doing, each time pointing out this is the byproduct of 1 party government. On certain issues, the "blue dogs" might vote against Nancy, but those 25 or so votes will stick out like a sore thumb. It will solidify in the public's mind who owns what's being done while keeping the arguments against alive and kicking rather than being buried under the majority's iron rule.
They lack the proper
July 1, 2009 - 12:50 ET by dscottThey lack the proper strategists. RINOs have been running the party for decades under the guise of being moderates. They have always been a minority in the Party, they are an elite group who like Dems believe they are entitled to run the show based on their perceived authority and education. They distain people like us who are from the base. This is why Palin was so alienated from the RINOs, she wasn't one of them like the former Alaskan GOP senator Ted Stevens. McCain picked Palin because he knew Palin would energize the base who are conservatives, not moderates like himself.
Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, starving the poor one gallon of ethanol at a time. Fill your tank with E85 and cull a village.
I hope they don't sit out
July 1, 2009 - 14:18 ET by ckc1227I hope they don't sit out the cap and trade vote in the senate. They have a pretty good shot at stopping it there.
Helen Thomas vs. Robert Goebbels Gibbs
July 1, 2009 - 15:06 ET by R D HelmLOL-I could almost kiss her. Almost:
http://hotair.com/ar...
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
Yea R D Helm, How many years has Helen been there?
July 1, 2009 - 16:14 ET by upcountrywaterAnd she is shocked WOW.. At least a hug..
We are soo screwed..
Reagan VS Liberalism
ucw,
July 1, 2009 - 16:24 ET by R D HelmLOL-I'm not sure, but I would say at least since The Flood.
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
If my history is
July 1, 2009 - 19:11 ET by ricklailIf my history is correct she ask the first question at Sherman's press conference after the burning of Atlanta. This was held somewhere on I-20 near Conyers.
Semper suprene nitens
rick,
July 1, 2009 - 20:40 ET by R D HelmLOL. Yeah, that was probably it.
-Dave
"Obama's health care 'reform' plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof." - Herman Cain
RD...Me too!
July 1, 2009 - 16:31 ET by PrairieSkyAlmost...I couldn't believe my eyes and ears...Helen seemed really miffed about this, and she and Chip Reid were all over Gibby (who as usual stumbled all over himself). It was good to see and fun to watch...
"The problem is not that people are taxed too little...the problem is that government spends too much." ~President Ronald Reagan
Dave
July 1, 2009 - 16:39 ET by ricklailKiss Helen Thomas? I rather kiss Cynthia McKinney or Cynthia Tucker's behind. Probably looks and smells better too.
Semper suprene nitens
Memo to Newsbuster's
July 1, 2009 - 18:12 ET by Roger the ShrubberMemo to Newsbuster's liberal readers: even Helen Thomas is smelling the bullshit. Is your sense of smell worse than an 87-year-old woman?
Just posted this below
July 1, 2009 - 18:24 ET by general companyOnly 3 hr after you: [ , I heard it on Levin
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
Karl Malden has passed away. Will anyone notice?
July 1, 2009 - 15:21 ET by R D Helmhttp://www.nbclosang...
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
I ordered "On the
July 1, 2009 - 15:48 ET by fitzfongI ordered "On the Waterfront" just yesterday and was wondering if he was still alive.
"I spent a lot of money on booze, birds and fast cars. The rest I just squandered." -George Best
"George will you just shut
July 1, 2009 - 19:07 ET by ricklail"George will you just shut up and listen for once." Karl Malden as Gen. Omar Bradley in PATTON.
Semper suprene nitens
Karl Malden...Fox just reported this...
July 1, 2009 - 16:38 ET by PrairieSkyon their newsbreak...He was 97! What a wonderful actor he was, and I always really enjoyed his work.
"The problem is not that people are taxed too little...the problem is that government spends too much." ~President Ronald Reagan
Cruel Joke
July 1, 2009 - 16:36 ET by ricklailThis maybe more appropriate for the Kos Kids:
Farrah Fawcett gets ready to enter the perly gates when St. Peter what he can do for her. She tells him that she ask that he look after the children on earth. Poof guess who dies.
Semper suprene nitens
Hey Rick how about this one
July 1, 2009 - 17:33 ET by general companyJackson was made of so much plastic, they were going to melt him down and make Lego's out of him, and then little boys could play with him.
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
GC
July 1, 2009 - 18:55 ET by ricklailMy daughter told me that one just a minute ago. That is a good one
Semper suprene nitens
Holy cow, real Hope?
July 1, 2009 - 18:18 ET by general companyAnyone else seen this . Who woke up Helen?
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
holy cow, indeed!
July 1, 2009 - 18:37 ET by katainkentI just got done watching it. I am floored. But of course, Gibbs has his tap shoes on! Furious circles he's making there.
I'd like to see this get some momentum before its too late. We're about 2 weeks away from passing the two most crap-tastic bills in history.
___________________________________________
Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past - George Orwell - 1984
Response from Mary Bono
July 1, 2009 - 18:34 ET by ex buff e-dubNormal
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I live in Mary
Bono's district, and after her vote, I sent an email to her expressing my
dissatisfaction with her vote, and that I would actively work to assure she
would not be re-elected. I just received this response from her
office. I apologize for the length. I have edited out my personal information for privacy.
July 1, 2009
Dear Mr:
Thank you for writing regarding the
American Clean Energy and Security Act, H.R. 2454. This legislation passed
the U.S. House of Representatives on June 26, 2009, and now awaits action in
the U. S. Senate.
I voted in support of this legislation
to move the process forward and help our region realize the benefits of
advancing clean energy technology, while at the same time recognizing that
areas for improvement still exist. I appreciate your taking the time to
express your specific views, as it will help guide our debate and facilitate
important changes to H.R. 2454 as it moves to the Senate.
There are several reasons why we must
take the issue of regulating greenhouse gases very seriously, and why we should
grapple with this issue within Congress as opposed to leaving this to the whims
of bureaucrats in Washington.
While some have debated the causes and
even the validity of global climate change, few debate the need for our nation
to reduce its dependence on foreign oil and other traditional carbon-based
energy sources, and also develop more American alternative energy production so
that our nation may become more energy independent. This is not just a matter
of economic and energy security but truly a matter of our future national
security as well.
If Congress does not take action to
address regulating greenhouse gases, it is clear that the United States
Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is already taking steps to implement new
regulations on all domestic industries with little input from Congress or
affected residents.
On April 2, 2007, the United States
Supreme Court ruled that greenhouse gases are a pollutant, creating the
authority for the EPA to directly regulate these emissions. This decision
instructed the EPA to look at these gases and determine if, as pollutants, they
do in fact cause harm to humans and contribute to global climate change.
Shortly after President Obama was
elected, it became clear his Administration would further examine this issue,
as the guidance from the Supreme Court was clear in stating that if climate
change threatens human health, they must consider actions to cut the gases they
find to be explicitly harmful. Following this ruling, the EPA announced on
April 17, 2009, that six greenhouse gases, including carbon dioxide, are
pollutants and are subject to regulation under the Clean Air Act of 1990, which
was signed into law by President George H. W. Bush. This decision is
commonly called the "Endangerment Finding," and is the first signal
that, in my estimation, the EPA was very serious about taking action to
regulate our domestic businesses emitting greenhouse gases, even without
Congressional input.
It is crucial, especially for our
agriculture communities, that we do not stand idly by while a mechanism that
results in the EPA regulating everything from major industries to
small businesses, and even taking the right to regulate methane from livestock
can occur. It is very important to note that H.R. 2454 actually removes
the ability of the EPA to regulate emissions unilaterally under the Clean Air
Act. This is vital, as our domestic businesses cannot and should not be
forced to operate under the fear of the uncertainty that can come from the
bureaucratic red tape created when EPA mandates aggressive and stringent
regulations. Ensuring the EPA is not allowed to regulate these substances under
the Clean Air Act, as they are currently empowered to do, is one of the primary
reasons why this legislation was necessary. Without Congressional direction,
new burdensome regulations will leave small businesses vulnerable to new
emissions controls from the EPA that will go too far.
President Obama, in my opinion, sought
the wrong approach to addressing this issue, an approach that was truly a
"cap and tax" regime. Earlier this year, the President pressed for an
auction of 100% of the emissions credits that the government would create and
force domestic companies to purchase if they had emissions that exceeded
certain levels. These payments would then revert back to the Federal
Government's General Fund at the Treasury Department to pay for a series of
other items including a government-run health care regime and expansion of
other federal government programs.
H.R. 2454 does not use this
approach, which would have significantly increased the price of energy for
consumers. This
approach was included in the President's Fiscal Year 2010 Budget proposal and
is a component with which I strongly disagree. In fact, I opposed the Budget
when it came to the Floor of the House on April 29, 2009. This Budget included
tax increases of over $1.5 trillion that would hurt workers, families, and
small businesses.
The proper legislative approach was
never to raise federal revenues, but instead provide incentives directly to the
companies that are interested in taking on the challenges of cleaning up their
current emissions levels or implementing new technologies to make themselves
more efficient - in effect reducing costs and improving their output.
Further compounding the complexity of
this issue, the State of California enacted Assembly
Bill 32 in 2006, which directed the California Air Resources Board (CARB) to
establish a greenhouse gases cap regulation to lower emissions to 1990 levels
by 2020.
The emissions targets in H.R. 2454 are
actually less stringent than those within California's A.B.
32. It is even more important to note that the more reasonable approach in
H.R. 2454 pre-empts the California State law on the cap and trade portion so
that, if properly addressed, the entire U.S. can more efficiently work to clean
up our greenhouse gas emissions nation-wide over the next few years.
The fact is, California already utilizes generally cleaner
energy resource inputs for its electricity production. In recognition of
the current economic challenges we face, the House bill does not
take effect until 2012. This legislation ensures that California is rewarded for taking those early
actions, as we should not be penalized for our role as an innovator in new
technologies, especially in alternative energy industries with the potential to
create jobs.
It is that forward-thinking approach to
our nation's energy future that brought major U.S.- based companies like Johnson
& Johnson, DuPont, and Conoco Phillips to support legislation like this
over the years. Such legislation provides the certainty that companies
need to invest in new clean energy solutions and bring us closer to realizing
the benefits, including job creation, from these new technologies. These
are the companies that will help provide new jobs in our own region as we begin
to push to revive our economy. Investors and entrepreneurs will clearly see the
opportunities for leading the world in new energy technology manufacturing and
ideas that can be exported around the globe.
Our region is in a unique position: we
have vast potential for more wind, solar, and geothermal energy production
facilities to be built in Riverside County. Due to the state of the
economy, it is crucial that those who are seeking new employment opportunities
have options that include jobs created from more green energy production in the
area.
I fully appreciate that H.R. 2454 needs
continued improvements. That is why during the debate on the American
Clean Energy and Security Act, I voted in favor of the Rep. Forbes (R-VA)
substitute amendment, based on the text of the New Manhattan Project
for Energy Independence, H.R. 513. The Manhattan bill set a goal of reducing our
dependence on foreign oil by 50% in 10 years and 100% in 20 years. The bill
pushes incentives for renewable energy, clean coal, and other low emissions
energy sources. It enhances research, especially in fusion, bio-fuels,
carbon-capture systems and efficiency upgrades. Unfortunately, this bill was
defeated by a vote of 172 to 256.
There is no reason why we cannot advance
our domestic energy production and incorporate them into this legislation, from
streamlining energy industry permitting processes, opening up drilling for oil
in ANWR, aggressively pursuing clean coal, and removing government red tape
that prevents us from using more oil resources like the oil shale reserves
throughout the western United
States.
Nuclear energy also plays a crucial role
in our domestic energy future, as it is highly-efficient and emissions
free. H.R. 2454 recognizes this by creating the Clean Energy Deployment
Administration, which will provide loans and loan guarantees for large nuclear
power development projects. The nuclear energy industry will see serious growth
in a model where we seek to reduce carbon emissions in the electric sector.
Studies have shown this legislation's goals will require 30-40 additional
nuclear plants by 2030, and an additional 86 new plants by 2040. This is vital,
as the last new reactor to come on-line was in 1996, and we actually have fewer
generating units in our country today then were operating in 1994.
As someone who chose not to cosponsor
this bill, I look forward to further debate in the Senate, as there is clearly
more work ahead to refine and improve this legislation. That is why I so
deeply value your continued input. California is recognized as
a world leader in technological advancements and must continue to be a leader
on this front, as we have an obligation to make a cleaner energy economy a
reality in the decades ahead.
Again, thank you for taking the time to
write. For your convenience, you can sign up to receive regular email updates
from me on issues important to the 45th District at www.bonomack.house.gov/emailsignup. Please feel free to
contact me on other matters of mutual concern.
Sincerely,
MARY BONO MACK
Member of Congress
M
MBM/jb
Sincerely,
MARY BONO
Member of Congress
***PLEASE NOTE - DO NOT REPLY TO
THIS EMAIL DIRECTLY, AS IT WAS SENT FROM AN UNATTENDED MAIL BOX. IF YOU
HAVE ADDITIONAL COMMENTS, PLEASE ACCESS MY WEB SITE AT
http://www.bono.hous.... THANK YOU.
All 8 GOP "canned" responses
July 1, 2009 - 18:41 ET by katainkenton the first day all sounded alike to me. They sounded like Dem talking points. (I think that's what Mark Levin said too). This letter just shows how rediculously stupid they're all still being. Someone needs to take these people aside and explain economics to these goofballs.
___________________________________________
Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past - George Orwell - 1984
No. I walked in this stuff
July 1, 2009 - 18:57 ET by ricklailNo. I walked in this stuff as a kid on the farm. It is called BS.
Semper suprene nitens
They need to be kicked out of the party
July 1, 2009 - 20:12 ET by general companyHow come the other Repubs dont just shun them, most of the crap in the bill is against everything the Repubs claim they are. Their has to be a line in the sand here when it comes to gov involvment.
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
Re Honduras
July 1, 2009 - 18:37 ET by slickwillie2001Anti-Zelaya and anti-Obama, pro-constitutional law protests in Honduras. Will the US liberal media dare cover the protests and offend the Bamster?
Obama Should Not Succomb to Chavez: http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com
I see no evidence that the liberal media is willing to tell the truth about what happened in Honduras. They persist in calling it some kind of military coup which is ridiculous.
Jacko fans committing post-natal abortions on selves
July 1, 2009 - 20:11 ET by R D Helmhttp://news.sky.com/...
At first, I was going to step up and condemn this, but then I gave it a little more thought.
I mean, just think of it as a long overdue cleansing of the gene pool.
(h/t: boortz.com)
-Dave
"Obama's health care "reform" plan is to blow up the building in order to fix a leak in the roof" -Herman Cain
RDH...
July 1, 2009 - 20:15 ET by JAB...cold adult beverage every where except where it should be, damn (GMTA)! I thought the same thing when I read that article, however, then I remembered "The Annual Darwin Awards" and got over it with no life long scars :-)
"Too bad Ignorance isn't painful..."
I dont know Dave
July 1, 2009 - 20:30 ET by general companyLeast we could do is offer Obama care,,,,,,,well never mind, probably more humane the other way.
Lord forgive me for that right there.
My Gov. thinks I am dangerous, so be careful
"Television is a freak show" Bernie Goldberg
30 pieces of gold
July 2, 2009 - 14:21 ET by teeaa01To the Cap and Traitors. How much does it cost to buy a vote nowadays? Is there a conversion chart for pieces of gold to votes? What will you be doing when you retire? Will you be working for GE or maybe Al Gore? A nice seat on the Carbo trading commission? Just asking.
"The inherent vice of capitalism is the uneqaul sharing of the blessings. The inherent blessing of socialism is the equal sharing of misery" Winston Churchill