Today's starter: Right now I am sitting on a panel at the Talkers Magazine yearly convention where the fur is flying at combined panel featuring talk hosts Jim Bohanon, Monica Crowley, Thom Hartmann, Lars Larson, Lionel, Steve Malzberg, Mancow, Alan Stock, and Tom Sullivan.
Lots of topics were covered but a couple of things stood out: the first is that everyone thought that John McCain will be the winner of the 2008 presidential race with the one exception of Hartmann.
The fairness doctrine also came up and an excellent point was made by Lars Larson that the best way to kill any left-wing support of the idea is to make it apply to news programs too.
My thanks also to Steve Malzberg for the plug for NewsBusters as an "excellent source of evidence about the media's overwhelming liberal bias" during the panel.
Editor at Large
Comments Policy
Legend passes
June 7, 2008 - 11:39 ET by nkviking75Legendary ABC sportscaster Jim McKay has passed away.
When you put the clowns in charge, don't be surprised when a circus breaks out.
I miss WWS
June 7, 2008 - 11:44 ET by kch50428"...The thrill of victory...and the agony of defeat."
RIP.
A Class Act
June 7, 2008 - 20:14 ET by ChaitealoverWhen I heard of his death this morning, the first thing that came to mind was his voice saying: "They're all gone" at the '72 Olympics. At that time, most of us couldn't imagine such a thing would happen, but his ability to convey the story with honesty and clarity, and without purple prose was outstanding.
ESPN had an hour long retrospective of his career, with comments from many of his sportscasting colleagues, this afternoon. Unfortunately, it was on opposite all the pre-Belmont stakes programming on ABC, so I don't imagine many people got to see it. Hopefully, they will repeat it.
Chai
“A liberal is a man who will give away everything he doesn’t own.” —Frank Dane
To me, Jim McKay's voice
June 7, 2008 - 20:18 ET by balboaTo me, Jim McKay's voice represented two things: the Olympics and ABC's Wide World of Sports. To me, it was never the Olympics without McKay, just like college football really isn't the same without Keith Jackson.
Bal,
June 7, 2008 - 20:29 ET by R D HelmI agree. McKay was the Olympics for me. His coverage of the '72 Munich Olympics, which I remember even though I was only eight years of age, will always stand out in my mind as one of his truly great broadcasts.
He was a class act without peer.
So-long, Jim.
Jim McKay
June 8, 2008 - 01:38 ET by UnsaneI arrived in a borrowed RV (still in transition to my permanent home!) to see the opening sequence to Wide World of Sports. I remember that vividly; it was one of my first memories growing up. We always saw that in my family every Saturday afternoon.
My first thought was "Cool! What's the occasion?"
Then I heard that Jim McKay had died.
I for one won't forget him, and that immortal phrase "the thrill of victory and the agony of defeat" which encapsulates sports so well.
Thanks for the memories, Jim! You will be missed.
P.S. Only now that he's gone do I find out the man was a Naval officer on minesweepers during WWII...
Res tantum valet quantum vendi potest.
Is there still any leftwing support for the "Fairness" doctrine?
June 7, 2008 - 11:43 ET by sarcasmoI thought they'd lost that debate and I'll admit I hoped they'd given up. While applying it to news is an excellent idea to make it unpalatable, it would be a nightmare in practice. I'd do my best to make sure of it.
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Fairness Doctrine
June 7, 2008 - 12:05 ET by ThisnThatWatch out what you wish for. The MSM will determine "What's fair". For example, they will bring in Keith Obermann to present the "moderate/right-wing" view -- and none of us will be able to counter that.
Don't believe me? Look at the current state of affairs, and all the comments made by the MSM on who the "moderates" really are. They will re-lable Republicans as "Radical right"; and they will designate some group as "Radical left" -- and then declare that neither the Radical Right or Left gets to play in the fairness game. This will give them a lock on the discussion, and since they are in control of the communications racket, they will get their way on this.
_________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
Exactly Sarc - and that's why it would never pass if it applied
June 7, 2008 - 12:06 ET by Dee Bunkto television and news programs either. It would be a nightmare for radio and that's why they want to do it, to shut down political programs on radio.
Conservatives too often get caught up in principle because we don't agree with it and have never tried to get a "fairness doctrine" on T.V. despite the obvious bias against us.
It's not dead by any means, they only gave up, because they knew they needed a veto proof majority. When Obama gets in it will fly through easily with both a Dem Senate and House.
Conservatives will need to be very loud to stop it and they will need to filibuster in the Senate. They need to insist that it apply to television also because the ignorant public won't get their principled debate. If they convince the public that it should be there for both, the Dems would never in a million years pass it. They are not going to give up the huge advantage that they have. So the best way to fight against it is to fight for it to apply everywhere.
Even if the worst were to happen, and it was applied everywhere (which I can't imagine happening in a million years) then at least it would be truly "fair". Not for anyone outside the two parties granted, but at least two positions to every issue would be covered. It's better than just one no matter what party you are in.
And the way I'd make guaranteed trouble
June 7, 2008 - 12:12 ET by sarcasmoIs to demand "fairness" for Libertarians & Greens, too, even (if not especially) in cases where it looks stupid. May as well go whole-hog if they're dumb enough to say they want "fairness."
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Sarc - you could make all the trouble you want,
June 7, 2008 - 12:30 ET by Dee Bunkbut it wouldn't make a difference because there aren't enough Libertarians and Greens to influence it being put in the bill. It's the very reason why "fairness" is completely unobtainable through government laws. The best chance still exists with the free market and that will never be fair either.
If the free speech haters are to argue for two voices on radio then it's an easy argument to demand two voices on T.V. which will kill it. It should be killed, but two sides to every issue on BOTH radio AND T.V. would at least give some sort of representation to all of us. I don't think there is anyone here who agrees with either party platform on everything. We only identify ourselves as one or the other because they are the only two that can get elected. It stinks but that is the way it is.
I don't think it would need to be in their law
June 7, 2008 - 12:50 ET by sarcasmoVarious Libertarians, Greens, and probably others who'd make the LP & Greens look downright "normal" would get involved and start questioning every decision in court or administrative hearings. We'd add to the nightmare this proposal would already make by assuming just 2 parties or 2 possible points of view, IOW.
I'd want this mess to cost as much money as possible, with maximum rancor & minimum civility early on, so even the strongest proponents are sure it's a failure. This is one of those proposals like McCain Feingold, IMO. Compromise is impossible. The ONLY acceptable resolution, whether it ultimately passes or not, is a tail between the legs retreat by the other side.
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Sarc - that is exactly what the left hopes for
June 7, 2008 - 17:18 ET by Dee Bunkand then radio won't put on any political shows because they don't want to fight lawsuits. It effectively would shut down radio political talk. That's why the only way to fight it is with T.V. because it's the same concept and the Dem's will never give up their huge advantage there.
Holding firm that the regulation is just no good won't stop it from passing. Only drawing attention to it by making the insistence that it apply to T.V. would kill it. Even a really stupid public is going to say - hey why won't they include T.V., what's the difference?.
McCain Fiengold was wrong and it passed and went through the Supreme Court (granted a liberal court but it will be at least as liberal after one Obama pick). No One has made any effective "noise" against that.
The "noise" needs to be made before the bill passes, once it passes any "noise" only supports it more by shutting down political discussion on radio stations that don't want to deal with legal bills. There are more libertarians on radio then there are on T.V.
But let's go BEYOND TV!
June 7, 2008 - 17:24 ET by sarcasmoWhy shouldn't it apply to newspapers and the internet? All speech should be controlled, not just radio or TV speech! ;)
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Good point sarc - they should bring up Newspapers too
June 7, 2008 - 17:36 ET by Dee Bunkand Documentaries and films and everything.
TV (it feels so naked that way! ) would probably be enough to stop the liberals in their tracks. They'd never go for giving up even one of the three mediums where they have an extreme advantage. Make that four, we could add Universities too.
Radio is probably about equal (conservative slant) to film (liberal slant) and I don't think they'd even give up film. TV is seen/heard by more than both the others combined and also more than Newspapers so it would be big enough to stop it.
Again the goal is not passing it, but stopping it. They will be able to pass it if TV isn't in the bill.
Dee Bunk
June 7, 2008 - 12:50 ET by MrShyWow, "T.V." with periods? Trying to think when the last time was I saw TV as T.V. -- but, of course, it's traditionally correct (tele - vision) :)
Sorry, just butting in here with nonsense, as this IS the open thread.
And I side with liberals on this issue: We all need to be fair. You know, give liberals their fair 98% of the voice in all media.
/sarc
* * * SOCKS THE CAT '08 * * *
For REAL Change
Mr. Shy See - I just did it with your name too. Period crazy
June 7, 2008 - 17:26 ET by Dee BunkI guess. Maybe that's why I'm such a B. I don't know why or how I started doing that but it's a reflex. I'm not thinking about it. I'll try to stop. ; )
It does illustrate the
June 7, 2008 - 12:34 ET by Matthew SheffieldIt does illustrate the absurdity of it all that way.
Backyard Critters
June 7, 2008 - 11:50 ET by Tinian...where the fur is flying...
I almost got eaten by a bear this morning.
Call In Exxon/Mobile They Kill Bears, ya know ?
June 7, 2008 - 11:55 ET by JayTeeEvidently the Green people think Exxon is Out in Alaska with Elephant Guns Killing Bears and all sorts of Wildlife.
Have 'em drill in your backyard, and the Bear problem will be solved...according to the Green Revolutionary Guard.
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
The stock market is making
June 7, 2008 - 12:34 ET by Ruths husband BenThe stock market is making bears bolder these days.
When you go out, you should spray yourself down with bear repellent, carry pepper spray and sew little bells to your clothes to alert the bears. Black bears run away when they have advance notice. Of course you should learn the difference between the types of bears so you can identify the type you have. Black bear feces, for example smell like wild berries and have nuts and twigs in them, whereas Grizzly bear feces smell like peppery bear repellent and have little bells in them.
"Whatever Michelle Says Is The Message." –
Senator Barack Obama October 1, 2007, Chicago HQ
Hey Big Ben...Obama's doesn't smell at all..according to MSM
June 7, 2008 - 12:39 ET by JayTeeWhile you're covering the discoveries along the Forest Trails...the Political Trail has discovered that the stuff Obama drops...doesn't Stink .
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
It Must be the Market Meltdown
June 7, 2008 - 12:45 ET by TinianIt must be the market meltdown that's driving them into my backyard. Anyway, I'm going to play the radio from now on when I sit outside to read. And thanks for reminding me about the pepper spray. I almost bought a can of the super strong stuff for bears a few years ago after my fellow workers simply watched as a huge dog circled in on me for the kill. Time to visit amazon.com.
"Grizzly bear feces smell
June 7, 2008 - 15:15 ET by Indiana Joe"Grizzly bear feces smell like peppery bear repellent and have little bells in them."
ROTFLMFAO!!!
Good Morning M.S.
June 7, 2008 - 11:59 ET by JayTeeNB provides an Easy Reference for Web based searches into the MSM Follies. Sometime the MSM's own Websites provide the Evidence of less than Honest Reporting.
The SIN of omission of News is also defined within the NB Site. Right now, we see the Obamarama MSM push going full steam with TOTAL dis-regard for IRAQ War news.
McCain can only get coverage if he Screws up, or says something to Piss off the Republican Base....that gets front page MSM coverage...but ONLY after the Obama "Lead Story" is out of the Way.
If Americans are somehow getting closer to Electing a Liberal President, then we have to Observe/acknowledge the Obvious.
There IS currently in place, In Print and MSM, a very Biased Liberal Media continuously pushing for their Candidate. Now the MSM Candidate has been Defined...It's a much more Clear path to Give Obamarama a Full measure of 80% of the TV Air Time available for Democrats...
NO MORE SHARING with Hillary. The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
Congratulations Matthew
June 7, 2008 - 11:59 ET by jefflebowskiNewsbusters is the best site on the web for exposing the dishonesty and bias in the MSM. This site allows diverse opinions on a variety of topics and has the ability to find some of the most unusual news items from across the news spectrum.
I am honored to have posting rights at Newsbusters!
Jeff Lebowski
Coming in July
June 7, 2008 - 11:55 ET by sarcasmoHackers will be, as usual, painted as "evil" by the news media for telling the truth & exposing security flaws. That's nothing new, but this time, vulnerabilities in physical locks rather than computer security. 95% of 'em. "The vulnerable high security locks are currently in wide use by branches of the U.S. military, federal agencies, and at many private facilities to protect critical infrastructure." The media bias level, if past experience is any indicator, will be huge against the hackers, because hackers habitually commit the sin of telling the unvarnished truth about security (which is why I happen to enjoy them). Watch for it.
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Where is list of latest posts?
June 7, 2008 - 12:00 ET by ThisnThatI see the most popular list; and the Editors' Picks; and the Poll; and Recent Comments. But -- what happened to the Latest Posts? It's a pain to always have to go back to the NB Home Page to get to the most current posts.
___________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
And on that subject...
June 7, 2008 - 12:07 ET by sarcasmoWhere did "active Forum topics" go? I often find the NB forum has more interesting posts than I see from the NB masthead (not just Bilderburger news, but because of timing, that subject conveniently applies).
JMR
The tax & spend drug war looks racist in the real world.
Regarding your starter
June 7, 2008 - 12:24 ET by Ruths husband BenI'll go a step further and say that the Republican Party should collect all the data available showing the unfair and biased coverage between the two parties and file a lawsuit against the networks (including CNN) as illegal campaign contributions to the Democrats. The lawsuit would not win, of course, but if they pushed it all the way to the Supreme Court it would bring the issue before the American people and would make a difference in the election. There is plenty of evidence that it is occuring. This would be a good way to spur a national debate on the issue of media bias.
"Whatever Michelle Says Is The Message." –
Senator Barack Obama October 1, 2007, Chicago HQ
The Energy Chief Speaks...but he's a Republican, so it's a Lie
June 7, 2008 - 12:35 ET by JayTee"Samuel Bodman, attending two days of meetings in northern Japan among energy chiefs from Group of Eight industrialized countries and other top economies, said the surge in world oil prices was largely a simple problem of supply and demand."
Too bad he's a Republican...now Pelosi and Reid will Try and Discredit Him and His "Simple Problem"....
WE now have "Oil Derangement Syndrome" in Congress....also known as STUPIDITY, Ignorance, and now ODS.
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
No Sports Thread Today
June 7, 2008 - 13:42 ET by BlondeI've been watching the Belmont pre-show. Perhaps Big Brown will today become only the twelfth horse to capture the Triple Crown. I sincerely hope his hoof holds up, that quarter crack looks very nasty to me.
It was thirty five years ago that the absolute supreme horse race in the universe occurred. Secretariat winning the Belmont by 31 lengths. Seeing that video is still a thrill.
David Gregory, do you know which damn network you lie for? ~ Uncle Jimbo, @Blackfive
Just another funny from the people bringing the news.
June 7, 2008 - 15:29 ET by jaywlOn Fox a few minutes ago I watched a report about a box of M-16s dropping off an Air Force Humvee. The reporter, Ereatha Bonds, gave an average, competent report. However, she tired down the stretch saying this: "No ammunition was in the case, but whoever has the guns could potentially find a way to fire the weapons." Right , like they could potentially find a bullet (maybe at a bullet store?) that fits the rifle and then could potentially pull the trigger!
I don't know how much more radical television news would be without the restraining influence Fox brings, but they too can have the funnies from time to time.
I did not see the story. In
June 7, 2008 - 17:11 ET by BDI did not see the story. In the old days of ten years ago we used to ship the bolt carrier sepearted from the rest of the rifle and wrapped ten per green cotten wrap. Is this what she was refering to perhaps? Just a thought.
Caution - violent video warning - graphic
June 7, 2008 - 15:37 ET by acumenNew anti-marine beheading (and scaling) propaganda video surfaces in Iraq.
Yes, the Dem leadership, Hollywierdos and the demedia was right. The Iraqi people hate us.
Sorry vacuous man..1 video does not lose a War
June 7, 2008 - 16:58 ET by JayTeePeddle your Wares at Kos
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
Jay Tee
June 7, 2008 - 20:00 ET by acumenYou do understand the video is a parody mocking terrorists performed by pro-American Iraqi soldiers....don't you?
We'll tackle the term sarcasm another day. Don't want to overload.
Tough crowd.
AccuMan thanks for the Video Description..the first warning was
June 7, 2008 - 21:13 ET by JayTeeThe First warning you published...was enough for me to Avoid the Video. Sight unseen, I assumed.....it was KOS material...My Bad.
I saw some of your other comments, and I realized it was probably not as I Assumed/interpreted.... Us G.O.E. guys are sensitive to Certain subjects.....sort of.
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
Jay Tee, don't feel bad. I
June 7, 2008 - 21:26 ET by ThisnThatJay Tee, don't feel bad. I made the same assumption and avoided the video too. But I didn't comment.
__________________________________
If you can read this, thank a teacher. If it is in English, thank a Soldier. - My barber
Thatnthis I wasn't perturbed
June 7, 2008 - 21:48 ET by JayTeeI was just gonna send him (if he was what I thought) to a site that would appreciate his Video....(as described).
Leon he is not.....what ever happened to Leonitski ?
What ever happeded to Lame Cherry, the Conspiracy Theorist ?
The Republican Revolution will not be Televised
Laura Ingraham named talk
June 7, 2008 - 17:16 ET by QueenMumLaura Ingraham named talk radio "Woman of the Year".
Congratulations to one of my personal heros and a worthy role model for any young woman.
Laura has been missing from
June 7, 2008 - 22:16 ET by ckc1227Laura has been missing from her show lately, with no public explanation. Word is it's a contract dispute. Some speculate that she might bolt for television.
Years ago,
June 7, 2008 - 22:20 ET by DEVILDOCMOMwhen I still watched cbs occasionally I remember Laura on their weekend broadcasts...she was the only reason to watch. When she left I was disappointed, but now, not surprised. I listen to her radio program and love it. You are right, congratulations to Laura.
Do you really think this panel believes McCain will win?
June 7, 2008 - 17:41 ET by Dee BunkOr were they just trying to be positive? I hope they are right, but I just can't see it. Obama seems to have a huge advantage in Money, enthusiastic supporters, Media who are in the tank for him, and charm and personality. Something drastic would have to happen for it to change and since McCain isn't willing to define Obama as he is (a far left wing radical), I can't see what drastic thing could change the equation.
Now, now DB,
June 7, 2008 - 17:57 ET by FastEdyou just can't go calling Barry a far left wing radical - it's not nice, and besides, he's a Marxist, with a left leaning way of thinking, not too radical for a demolib.
There is no sense in being stupid, if you can't prove it! - my dad V
Fasted - sadly that is true
June 7, 2008 - 18:25 ET by Dee BunkAll the moderates have been forced out of the party so anyone who runs is pretty far left now. Did anyone ever think in a million years we would be able to think of Hillary as the moderate Dem candidate? It's crazy. There are no more Gephardt's. Now we have a choice of far left or very far left.
Mark Steyn
June 7, 2008 - 19:53 ET by KC MulvilleI nominate Mark Steyn's column today as my favorite of the year. Funny, accurate, and absolutely on target.
Remember Obama's self-revealing irony: he asked us all to "come together to remake this great nation!!!!" or in other words ... this is the greatest country on earth, so let's CHANGE it!
Thanks for link
June 7, 2008 - 22:29 ET by DEVILDOCMOMMark Steyn's column is thoughtful and brilliant as usual. On one had I see it as funny, on the other as very scary if the American electorate falls for the thought that only if we elect bho all will be wonderful and all problems solved. Cannot these people see the greatness of America?
Great link, thanks.
June 8, 2008 - 09:45 ET by BlondeI liked this bit from Steyn about B. Hussein Obama's desire to "remake" a great nation:
Speaking personally, I don’t want to remake America. I’m an immigrant and one reason I came here is because most of the rest of the western world remade itself along the lines Sen. Obama has in mind. This is pretty much the end of the line for me. If he remakes America, there’s nowhere for me to go — although presumably once he’s lowered sea levels around the planet there should be a few new atolls popping up here and there.
David Gregory, do you know which damn network you lie for? ~ Uncle Jimbo, @Blackfive
Lost Divers Fight off Dragon to Survive
June 7, 2008 - 21:07 ET by BritcomSource: The Times (UK)
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Communist vs. Statist '08
Q. Is Panamanian born John McCain a "Natural Born Citizen"
If you thought Obama being
June 7, 2008 - 23:17 ET by GregEIf you thought Obama being one "first" had the media drooling enough, read on, the "firsts" are numerous. Even the first from this or that college, as if that's of any significance whatsoever. Oh and let's not forget to list all the "near firsts" too. All I can do is shake my head in disbelief of the nonsense.
http://news.yahoo.co...
Pure Hype or wishful thinking
June 8, 2008 - 02:36 ET by easygoerBig Brown was exposed as a sprinter. How anybody thought he would pass the "Test of the Champion" is beyond me. Fell for the hype, I suppose. There was no way on God's green earth this horse was going to last the 1 1/2 miles required to win the Belmont Stakes. Big Brown finished in last place. Now they're gonna have to come up with an excuse to justify the ridiculous price they paid for him. The true shame is Casino Drive, who bruised his foot and had to be scratched. He would have won this race,easily. I feel bad for his Japanese connections. Casino Drive will live to fight another day. As for Big Brown, as a racehorse, he is what he has always been; a fast horse with a whole lotta quit in him.
UPS sponsored Big Brown. I'm no newspaper man, but I can just see this headline: BIG BROWN FAILS TO DELIVER. Somewhere in Memphis, Fed/Ex executives are happy.
Hype=Obama
June 8, 2008 - 09:37 ET by TjexciteThe hype is very similar to Obama. The whole left will pay big when he wins and then fails. They will still blame bush when McCain could have won if, BDS was not as chronic.
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June 8, 2008 - 15:57 ET by dahliatraversWas Belmont a longer race than prior races Big Brown ran in?
Length
June 8, 2008 - 21:38 ET by ChaitealoverI don't know about his first three races, but the Belmont is 1 1/2 miles long, while the other 2 Triple Crown races are 1 1/4 miles.
Chai
“A liberal is a man who will give away everything he doesn’t own.” —Frank Dane
Triple Crown distances
June 10, 2008 - 13:42 ET by easygoerThe Kentucky Derby is 1 1/4 miles. The Preakness is 1 3/16 miles, 110
yards shorter than the Derby. When Big Brown was eased up at the top of
the Belmont stretch he had just run 1 1/4 miles. He could not get that
last 1/4 mile. His jock knew it and threw in the towel. I didn't bet
the horse, but if I had I would be fuming that the jock did not keep him
to his task. There was no way he was gonna threaten the winner, but
who's to say that he couldn't have held on for 2nd, 3rd or even 4th.
In addition to the millions of dollars bet on him to win, there were
millions more bet on him in the exacta, triple and superfecta pools.
Shutting him down in the lane really gypped the bettors who had him
keyed in all sort of exotic wagers. As it was, since he ran out of the
money, the payouts on a $2 exotic bet were huge:
Win Place Show
1st 6 DA' TARA- $79.00- $28.00- $14.80
2nd 4 DENIS OF CORK- $5.40- $4.10
3rd 8 ANAK NAKAL- $7.60
3rd 9 READY'S ECHO- $6.20
Exotic Payouts
$2 EXACTA (6/4) paid $659.00
$2 TRIPLE (6/4/8) paid $3,703.00
$2 TRIPLE (6/4/9) paid $3,954.00
$2 SUPERFECTA (6/4/8/9) paid $48,637.00
$2 SUPERFECTA (6/4/9/8) paid $47,309.00
Of course, I didn't have any of them!