Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt Like Christian Conservatives in U.S.?
The Daily Beast contributor who once insisted that there's "no such thing as sharia law" is at it again, dismissing the threat of radical Islam presented by the political instability in Egypt.
In a January 30 post at Washington Post/Newsweek's "On Faith" feature yesterday, Reza Aslan dismissed fears that the Muslim Brotherhood is a radical group that could take Egypt in a theocratic direction should strongman Hosni Mubarak be forcibly ousted from power, even though members of the Brotherhood have expressed admiration for Osama bin Laden.
Aslan, a creative writing professor at the University of California Riverside, particularly singled out two socially conservative Republicans who are rumored 2012 presidential contenders, former Arkansas Gov. Mike Huckabee and former Sen. Rick Santorum (Pa.):
GOP presidential hopeful Rick Santorum is already drawing parallels between the young protesters calling for an end to the brutal and repressive Mubarak regime, and the popular protests that, three decades ago, brought down another despicable dictator and former American ally, the Shah of Iran. "We abandoned [the Shah] and what we got in exchange was... a radical Islamist regime," Santorum said. Mike Huckabee, another GOP presidential hopeful, joined in the hysteria, warning Americans that, "if in fact the Muslim Brotherhood is underneath much of the unrest [in Egypt] every person who breathes ought to be concerned."
[...]
[H]owever the current uprising in Egypt turns out, there can be no doubt that the Muslim Brotherhood will have a significant role to play in post-Mubarak Egypt. And that is good thing.
Despite the wide array of political and religious views on display on the streets of Cairo, Giza, Alexandria, and Suez, the one thing about which the overwhelming majority of Egyptians agree - 95 percent according to a 2010 Pew Research Center poll - is that Islam should play a role in the country's politics. At the same time, a similar Pew poll taken in 2006 found that while the majority of the Western public thought democracy was "a Western way of doing things that would not work in most Muslim countries," pluralities or majorities in every single Muslim-majority country surveyed flatly rejected that argument and called for democracy to be immediately established, without conditions, in their own societies.
For Huckabee and Santorum, as well as for a large segment of the American public, these two polls present a contradiction. How could Egyptians want both a democracy and a role for religion in their government? After all, in the United States it is axiomatic that Islam is inherently opposed to democracy and that Muslims are incapable of reconciling democratic and Islamic values. Never mind that the same people who scoff at the notion that religion could play no role in the emerging democracies in the Middle East are the same people who demand that religion must play a role in America's democracy. Ironically, one of the most vocal proponent of religious activism in politics is Mike Huckabee himself, who has repeatedly called Americans to "take this nation back for Christ" and who, while running for president, proudly declared that "what we need to do is to amend the Constitution so it's in God's standards."
In fact, when it comes to the role of religion in society, Americans and Egyptians are pretty well in agreement. An August 2010 Pew poll found that 43 percent of Americans believe that churches should express political views and play an active role in politics, while 61 percent agreed that "it is important that members of Congress have strong religious beliefs."
There is no doubt that giving religiously inclined organizations and politicians a seat at the political table poses risks. And certainly, problems can arise when religion becomes entangled with the state, as those who recall the Bush administration's evangelistic foreign policy can attest. Nevertheless, since a state can be considered democratic only insofar as it reflects its society, if the society is founded upon a particular set of values, then must not its government be also?
Of course, as Andrew McCarthy noted over at National Review (emphasis mine):
[T]he Brotherhood even continues to lionize Osama bin Laden. In 2008, for example, “Supreme Guide” Muhammad Mahdi Akef lauded al-Qaeda’s emir, saying that bin Laden is not a terrorist at all but a “mujahid,” a term of honor for a jihad warrior. The Supreme Guide had “no doubt” about bin Laden’s “sincerity in resisting the occupation,” a point on which he proclaimed bin Laden “close to Allah on high.” Yes, Akef said, the Brotherhood opposed the killing of “civilians” — and note that, in Brotherhood ideology, one who assists “occupiers” or is deemed to oppose Islam is not a civilian. But Akef affirmed the Brotherhood’s support for al-Qaeda’s “activities against the occupiers.”
What's more, McCarthy added:
To this day, the Brotherhood’s motto remains, “Allah is our objective, the Prophet is our leader, the Koran is our law, Jihad is our way, and dying in the way of Allah is our highest hope. Allahu akbar!” Still, our see-no-Islamic-evil foreign-policy establishment blathers on about the Brotherhood’s purported renunciation of violence — and never you mind that, with or without violence, its commitment is, as Qaradawi puts it, to “conquer America” and “conquer Europe.” It is necessary to whitewash the Ikhwan’s brutal legacy and its tyrannical designs in order to fit it into the experts’ paradigm: history for simpletons.
I highly doubt Aslan could point to anything remotely analogous in the political rhetoric of Messrs. Huckabee and Santorum or any other social conservative representative of the religious right.
- Ken Shepherd's blog
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Comments
Mars attacks
Submitted by jon_torlin on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 4:42pm.
I read this and I remember the movie Mars Attacks where the martians were running around with devices saying "we come in peace" while killing people.
-Jon
If only Slim Whitman
Submitted by Uncle John on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 4:50pm.
could save us from the Brotherhood.
→ Una Paloma Blanca ahhhh ahhhh
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 4:54pm.
K-TEL records presents . . .
Just for you Jon
Submitted by Denny Crane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:06am.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMdC45S79uQWe Are The 53%
Hay Denny, I think Jon is referring to this clip...
Submitted by upcountrywater on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:37am.
Mars Attacks! [Don't run, we are your friends]@11 seconds..
You Didn't Build That.
Thanks UCW
Submitted by Denny Crane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:56am.
This is my favorite from the movie
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VepS-IyKOLE&feature=related
We Are The 53%
→ That's it
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 4:44pm.
The Muslim Brotherhood is just like Christians.
Got it!
Is Aslan a script writer for Sicko Michael Moore?
Submitted by needle on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:50pm.
Europeans have had a chance in the past decade or so to learn a few things about Muslims.
If Reza Aslan tried out on a European his idiotic notion that “Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt [is] like Christian Conservatives in U.S., “ the European would conclude that Aslan is cracked.
- Looking forward to the self-annihilation of the Manipulated Stories Machine.
i declare a gee-hod!!
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:05pm.
i declare a gee-hod!!
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
The threat of "radical Islam"
Submitted by Ashrak on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:02pm.
The threat of "radical Islam" already exists in Egypt. It already exists where ever Islam exits because it is part of Islam itself. What is happening in Egypt didn't start out as a radical movement, it wasn't even a Muslim movement. To be sure, though, the Muslim Brothrhood is trying to benefit from it as do all parasitic entities do from unwilling hosts.
The only danger here, that doesn't already exist, is the face of those Islamic Zealots coming out from the shadows and showing themselves. This is something many fear, but not those some might think. The ones scared of this kind of happening are the ones who have been denying it all along, the ones who have been apologists all along, the ones who have demonized anyone who dares speak the truth about the fact that terrorism, the targeting and killing, brutal killing, of inoocent people, is sanctioned within the Koran itself.
The "Religion of Peace" garbage is exactly that. It is the Religion of Submission. Nothing would serve this world better than to get the truth out on the table for all to see. The Muslim Brotherhood is no friend to peace, it is no friend to anything but Islamic domination of the entire planet by any means necessary. Go ahead MB, make a play in Egypt, make the same mistake Bin Laden did. Go for it.
This is a lose-lose situation in Egypt for them. (Kinda like Iran getting the bomb) If that organization gains power, it shows it cards. So too does it if it does not. Is danger coming to pass? Yup. It has been there all along- the only difference is that now deniability goes from hard to impossible.
Only by facing this "Radical Islam" head on can resolution be found.
Aslan overlooks a major distinction
Submitted by Galvanic on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:04pm.
The Muslim Bortherhood has taken credit for the massacres of Western tourists in Egypt.
To my knowledge, the "conservative Christian" Americans he cites have no such record here.
i'm pretty sure i massacred
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:07pm.
i'm pretty sure i massacred some tourists somewhere
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
Truthie
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:13pm.
PARTNER WITH ISLAM!
cool you funny man -
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:23pm.
cool you funny man - heehee
i see you have come on board!
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
→ No chance Truthie
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:34pm.
I don't know of any Christians offering physical death as the only alternative to conversion.
Do you?
i could give you the names of
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:17pm.
i could give you the names of some retired old nuns:)
sure the church used to burn people at the stake for lack of conversion but that has been extinguished (no pun intended) over the years by higher minds like yours and mine
so once again i say that if we were to partner with islam in likewise fashion we could substantially help to shut down the aforementioned islmaic barbarism whilst simultaneously winning over millions of new islamic allies in the WOT
this will also pave the way for eventual conversion of wavering Muslims to Christianity - thus fulfilling the prophecy that God always wins and resistence is futile
united we stand divided we fall, bud
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
Thanks Truthie
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:23pm.
Throwing in the "they're not as evolved as us" argument?
And these are the people you want to partner with?
if we don't help them who
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:27pm.
if we don't help them who will - osama bin laden is who
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
Which reminds me:
Submitted by troglodyt on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 4:31am.
What is the difference between tourists and terrorists? The latter have sympathizers.
This shouldn't surprise anyone
Submitted by Blogball on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:18pm.
Remember these quotes?
Travis Smiley Show
Ali:Okay, I think first and foremost what we have to acknowledge is we're not going to get a monster with horns, blue in the face, looking like a dragon called jihad coming in and terrorizing us. The people who are engaged in terrorist activities look like you and me. They look like everybody else here. Major Nidal Hasan, the military guy who in November shot 13 of his colleagues and injured 32, he's going to be on trial pretty soon, I think this week, the young man, Faisal Shahzad, in Times Square who tried to blow innocent people that he doesn't know up, these guys are acting on conviction. Somehow, the idea got into their minds that to kill other people is a great thing to do and that they would be rewarded in the hereafter.
Tavis:But Christians do that every single day in this country.
Ali:Do they blow people up (unintelligible)?
Tavis:Yes. Oh, Christians, every day, people walk into post offices, they walk into schools, that's what Columbine is -- I could do this all day long. There are so many more examples of Christians -- and I happen to be a Christian. That's back to this notion of your idealizing Christianity in my mind, to my read. There are so many more examples, Ayaan, of Christians who do that than you could ever give me examples of Muslims who have done that inside this country, where you live and work
And this one
"Radical" Christians in America are just as much of a threat as the followers of radical Islam who piloted hijacked jetliners into New York's Twin Towers and the Pentagon on Sept. 11, 2001."
Rosie O'Donnell
I'm sooo glad we have
Submitted by rbosque on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:32pm.
I'm sooo glad we have left-bent journalists who are infinitely more intelligent than the rest of us who can set the record straight on who's dangerous!
Funny how Stratfor and other intelligence groups say the opposite of what this hack tells us.
Christians are sooo mean*
Submitted by cajun2 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:41pm.
http://tribune.com.pk/story/105019/infanticide-on-the-rise-in-pakistan-statistics/
http://brainz.org/13-most-brutal-and-inhumane-judicial-punishments-still-used-today/
http://weaselzippers.us/2011/01/30/iran-sentences-two-to-death-for-running-porn-websites/
oh yeah? well take
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:09pm.
oh yeah? well take this...
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBkQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kystandard.com%2Fcontent%2Ffirst-christian-annual-indoor-yard-bake-sale&ei=_S9ITcuuKIu_gQee0Y2SBg&usg=AFQjCNHtRoUQpufy1s_HWGMocnvyas7xcA
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
Rush Limbaugh - Obama Had An Egypt Moment
Submitted by im41 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 5:45pm.
"The Savior Of The Muslim World Barack Hussein Pharaoh Obama."
Now I'm Confused
Submitted by Kingfish17 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 8:18pm.
I just watched an eight minute segment on MSNBC where they had nothing but praise for the Muslim Brotherhood. And now this liberal is saying that the Muslim Brotherhood is just like conservative Christians? I've never heard a good word about conservative Christians on MSNBC? This stuff is confusing!
"You can’t go take a trip to Las Vegas...on the taxpayer’s dime." Barack Obama
Another proxy for Leftist hatred
Submitted by needle on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:13am.
While the Left hates America, it is just not quite socially acceptable to let it all hang out; so what they do is lavish praise on Castro or Hugo Chavez, who express their hatred of the US for the Left.
The same sort of process is going on here. Al Qaida really hates America (in a fundamentalist sort of way that appeals to the Left) but again it is socially dodgy to gush praise for Al Qaida, so the Left praises the Muslim Brotherhood, the ideological parent of Al Qaida.
(Notice also that Left is still trying to tie the 9/11 atrocities to Dick Cheney so as to exonerate Al Qaida.)
"Hate is not a family value"; it's a Liberal Value.
- Looking forward to the self-annihilation of the Manipulated Stories Machine.
Christians Impose Freedom
Submitted by upcountrywater on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 8:25pm.
Just like all them 'college" folk...
Now, here are the precedents for the latter situation: Remember the Iranian revolution when all sorts of people poured out into the streets to demand freedom? Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is now president.
Remember the Beirut spring when people poured out into the streets to demand freedom? Hizbullah is now running Lebanon.
Remember the democracy among the Palestinians and free elections? Hamas is now running the Gaza Strip.
Remember democracy in Algeria? Tens of thousands of people were killed in the ensuing civil war.
Yup all then Christians, all right.
You Didn't Build That.
Egypt and the Muslim Brotherhood
Submitted by BrianBarkley on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:11pm.
If we are to be true to our beliefs we must allow them to freely decide. Islam must be treated like a religion. Right now the whole of Islam is facing this debate. If we can convince them that the wants and needs of a government are similar but not the same as a religion we will find good trading partners and neighbors. A public official that must act only with the approval of the Mosque will be less effective than if he were free to act as his job required and an Imam that must act only with the approval of the State will also be deminished. Public officials can do their jobs and still be faithful as well as the Mosque can serve Allah faithfully and still be patriotic. New technology is making dictatorships to difficult a task and all that control crushes growth and development. Freedom is hazardous. We accept the risk and until they do they won't be free. I hope they are ready.
→ The fall of Egypt
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:20pm.
I'm remembering the Taliban setting off charges to eliminate several huge carvings in Afghanistan .
If these Muslims really worship Allah, they will eliminate every religious image, past or present, from the face of Egypt. Think on that, Egypt, before you decide to surrender your souls and your daughters to the Muslim Brotherhood.
eliminating history
Submitted by jon_torlin on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:27pm.
I honestly don't know the answer to this, but who was it that was attacking the Egyptian museums and destroying various artifacts, including ripping the heads off at least two mummies of pharoahs? It got so bad they had to post soldiers to guard the rest of the ones that were still in one piece and the ones that got damaged to prevent further damage.
Was it the brotherhood? Was it hte people of Egypt? They say they roped in from the ceiling.
The damage was devestating.
Oh and according to an article that Rush talked about, this brotherhood the the population that was demonstrating/protesting/vandalizing/terrorizing(with machetes and looting) accounted for .3 percent of the total population of Egypt. If that's the case, they need to be eliminated before causing any more damage.....starting with the former IAEA doofus.
Yes, I do mean it, they are making their beds now they have to lie in them. That kind of margin should NEVER dictate the direction of the rest of the Egyptian population.
-Jon
Jon
Submitted by Radical1979 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:33pm.
What scares the life out of me, is that if Egypt, which is surely not politically correct, allows .3 percent of the population to take control, what will happen here? Liberals and the MSM will be cheering the muslims on until they are stoned at an NFL stadium where beheadings and stonings replace football games.
Should be interesting
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:38pm.
And without those great monuments to their Pharaoh gods, who gives a lesser crap about their tourism?
But of course, if these Muslims really do believe, they know what they have to do. That is, if they really do believe.
Personally I've never been
Submitted by Radical1979 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:42pm.
Personally I've never been interested in visiting countries in which the populace believes cutting someone's head off is acceptable behavior for something like being a reporter, or being Jewish.
visiting those countries
Submitted by jon_torlin on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:55pm.
I mentioned elsewhere that my parents had visited Egypt a few years ago. On the same trip, they had visited Turkey. There was a LOT of rich history behind both countries, of course like any historical place, there was a lot of violence and etc, but there were also a lot of treasures to appreciate and I don't mean the gold silver kind, but different artifacts and so on. Basically like a museum for some places as well as various locations with interesting things there. And people were welcomed with open arms in some of these places.(Again, the same trip, my parents also went to Greece....it was a LONG trip, but they enjoyed it. What's there now, they wouldn't recognize it)
It's not so much of tourism that's going to be lost as much as the IDENTITY of what made this countries rich in their history and culture. This is what makes Islam an abomination because they destroy what was there and replace it with something that has no honest place in it. This is what makes Islam a cancer, it eats away the original and replaces it with something evil.
This is what happened with Iran, which used to be called Persia many decades ago.
Given the various movies that go to these exotic locations like the Giza Pyramids and so forth, there was a time that I would have loved to taken a trip to see these places and their place in history. But because of Islam's cancerous desire, that may not be the case.
Now Turkey is lost, Lebanon is lost, Egypt may be lost......That it could happen so easily is the real tragedy even though that's not the word I would use against that cancerous cult that is Islam and commit these heinous acts.
-Jon
So there are predominantly
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:18am.
So there are predominantly Islamic countries or nations with Islamic governments which do not engage in the wanton destruction of historical treasures. Doesn't that contradict the claim you posted earlier?
Jer
Okay
Submitted by jon_torlin on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:41am.
Dude, don't twist my words. When I mentioned those countries, they weren't pre-dominately radical Islam.
They are now.
-Jon
I didn't twist your words, dude...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:49am.
You said "Islam", dude. Not "radical Islam". Just "Islam". Dude.
Jer
Up thine!
Submitted by jon_torlin on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:10am.
Islam as it is might as well be one and the same, even if there are people that aren't into it as much as the radicals are.
-Jon
Thy should unwind....
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:27am.
the pretzelized mind
of thine.
Jer
dude - you will find much of
Submitted by TruthMonger on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:36pm.
dude - you will find much of that here when it comes to islam, but truly i say unto thee - their hearts are in the right place - its just that the heads need only to catch up
TM 1:16
Congratulations Jimmy Carter!
Oh, and one more thing, dude...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:52am.
You might find this article interesting.
Jer
It's my understanding it was
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:20am.
It's my understanding it was the Muslim Brotherhood which acted to secure and protect the property from destruction and looting.
Jer
Great PR isn't it? What
Submitted by dscott on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:00am.
Great PR isn't it? What better way to whitewash the stains of blood on their hands from all the people they have killed over the years. It was the Muslim Brotherhood who engaged in a MURDER campaign against tourists visiting Egypt in order to collapse their economy. Bombing buses and shooting people. Whom better prepared to scare off potential looters, wouldn't you say?
Jer, the bloodlust of the Muslim Brotherhood is no less than that of al Qaeda for they give hearty approval to Osama bin Ladin. It is only the Egyptian security forces that kept them in check. Behaving for a week by going low profile does not absolve them of the bloodshed they perpetrated. This is no different than Hamas having free medical clinics in Gaza, it's PR, a recruiting tool.
dscott...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:23am.
Please don't mistake me for a booster of the Muslim Brotherhood. But it may be that as this plays out the organization will emerge as the governing entity best equipped to fill the power vacuum. It may not be the result we would prefer, but there is not that much we can do at this point to dictate a more strategically palatable outcome without risking a catastrophic explosion of violence and a complete evaporation of influence throughout the region.
There have been some encouraging moderating trends evident within the Muslim Brotherhood. Perhaps it's a ruse. We'll see.
Jer
Jer, I do know better than to
Submitted by dscott on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:52am.
Jer, I do know better than to think you would boost the Muslim Brotherhood that's not in your character. You're a liberal but not an insane loony.
My intention on highlighting their bloody history is to make sure in no uncertain terms that the readers of this blog should not be ignorant of what these people are capable of doing. I hope you are correct that elements of this group are moderate if they should take power. However, given what we have seen in Iran, moderate means essentially those not in the top tear of power like Mosavi. Their ideology is pretty much the same like the nuance of executing you with a sword versus lethal injection, the point is your dead just the means are debated.
Any iteration of the Muslim Brotherhood in power running the show in Egypt ultimately means a Sunni theocratic state as their stated intentions have said as much. Given the aggressive nature of Iran's Shiite theocratic state and their aim of dominance of the Muslim world, these two countries are on a collision course of violent bloody Jihad against each other with Israel in the middle. A theocratic Egypt must by its doctrine oppose all heresy and Shiite Islam is considered heresy by Sunnis and visa versa. This is why they have literally slaughtered each other over the past 1000 years until this very day. Obama doesn't realize in opening the door to the Muslim Brotherhood will set the stage for this bloody conflict. Just as Carter in opening the door to a theocratic Iran didn't realize their doctrinal imperitive to convert all Sunnis to the Shiite belief system of Islam. We have two Islams and both have a proven history of violent aggression against each other. One only needs to look at what happened in Iraq when al Qaeda, the Sunni terrorist group engaged in a murderous rampage killing thousandss by bombing people in the market place and funerals and religious processions of Shiites.
BTW - The Saudi ruling family while the custodians of Mecca and Medina, are NOT a religious ruling body, they are a monarchy. Religion is subjucated to the State/Monarchy and while religious clerics do have great influence on the Saudi Family, they do not call the shots and that's why Saudi Arabia as a State has been certainly more benign than Iran. This is not to say members of the ruling family haven't used their financial resources to fund Madrases to preach their version of Sunni Islam making trouble for the West.
dscott....
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 3:01am.
Thanks for the kind words and your very informative commentary. I have to call it a night. I'll be back tomorrow evening.
Jer
They have sworn to destroy the West.
Submitted by Army Brat on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 7:03am.
How does one moderate that?
King Tut
Submitted by Radical1979 on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:29pm.
CA my sister was just saying how happy she was to have seen the King Tut exhibit several years ago, as it's very possible those relics will be destroyed if the Muslim Brotherhood of msyoginistic beheading violent terroristic 4th century animals gets in power in Egypt.
I think the risk to
Submitted by Jer on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:44pm.
I think the risk to Israeli-Egyptian relations is far greater than the threat of destruction posed to archeological treasures, historical artifacts, and cultural antiquities. There appears to be more of a nationalistic strain within the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood not found in Taliban style theocratic extremism.
Jer
Wrong style
Submitted by jon_torlin on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:46pm.
It's not "Taliban style," it's Islam style. They claim to be non-violent in their methods when their actions prove otherwise. just like Islam. Their actions would be approved by the clerics whereas if they did those same actions in this country, we call it murder.(the so-called honor killings)
-Jon
Part of the value of
Submitted by Radical1979 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:02am.
Part of the value of archeological treasures, historical artifacts, and cultural antiquities; is that they give voice to history. Destroying these items can allow history to be rewritten and increase the power of the current government, which in this case, will almost surely be destructive on a global scale.
Islam style, jon?.
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:12am.
Excuse me...
But isn't Mubarak Islamic?
Jer
You're excused, Jer
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:57am.
But didn't Mubarak jail many members of the Muslim Brotherhood? Appears 34 high ranking members were sprung from the hoosgow during this uprising.
But let's not jump to any conclusions.
I'm sure you're content that Al Baredai was completely thorough in his IAEA dealings with Iraq.
→ Oh yeah, Jer
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:54pm.
I remember those "college students" demonstrating in the streets of Iran too.
Worked out good for poor old hapless Jimmy Carter.
Haven't we seen this movie before?
You're maybe expecting a different result this time?
Bookmark this post, Jer. I'll do the same.
I'm not clairvoyant, Cool...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:28am.
And I don't know what to expect. If it were in my power, the upheaval would be resolved peaceably, democratically, and hopefully without the ascendancy of the Muslim Brotherhood.
The GOP Congressional leaders--to their credit--have commended the administration's handling of the crisis thus far. I realize though that such a measured response is beyond your capacity.
Bookmark away.
Jer
Now there's a liberal take on the situation---
Submitted by matthewdean on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:52am.
"The GOP Congressional leaders--to their credit--have commended the administration's handling of the crisis thus far". At this point, NOBODY knows if what the Dems are doing reference Egypt is good, bad, or indifferent. But, of course, if the GOP were hammering Obama and his minions because they believed Obama's policies were inept, then they would be accused of hoping he fails.Nobody, Matthew...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:06am.
can predict the outcome. But the Republican leaders, Boehner and McConnell, have both indicated their support for the administration's approach thus far.
The "hope he fails" crowd is ensconced primarily in Limbaugh Nation. But, admittedly, it's a pretty big crowd.
Jer
→ Not so fast, Jer
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:13am.
You're still hoping for "Islam Lite". Mubarak was "Islam Lite".
Again, would you be willing to give up 99% of your law proceeds if Obama decreed it? It's a slam-dunk you're willing to force people to buy stuff they don't want.
Cool..
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 1:27am.
Why ask silly questions that have absolutely no basis in reality? Would you agree to strap yourself to the nose cone of an anti-missile missile and be blasted into space if Dutch Reagan decreed it?
But, for the record, no. I would not be willing to give up 99% of my law proceeds if Obama decreed it.
Jer
For the record, Jer---
Submitted by matthewdean on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:02am.
Cool wins.
He may have asked, but you answered, what you called a "silly question that had no basis in reality". :o)
I guess I could give you points for not saying that such a scenario would be impossible under Obama.
MD
It depends on how you define
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:07am.
It depends on how you define winning. Cool has already asked the question twice. If my answering will prevent any further badgering, it will have been worth it.
Jer
Winning is defined as---
Submitted by matthewdean on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:15am.
being a conservative when crazy libs like Pelosi and Reid screw up the federal government with no help from the Republicans.
MD
You won't get much argument
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:27am.
You won't get much argument from me there.
Jer
Jer , I'll play..Obama can make me proud.
Submitted by upcountrywater on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:22am.
Egypt is Allied with America and Israel.
Obama is CiC, He has a choice. He can do that ol familiar Carter's Iran dance for 444 dazzes.
OR
CiC Berry could send in Marines and aircraft, sell/give away all sorts of weapon systems to Israel.
Give Israel the ability to do what Israel is good at.
Critical mass...Lookie what Ally Egypt has.pdf, and will Lose to islamopods.
Just a bunch of 1979 college students.yt
We know what happens when America fails to act.
The good news, it couldn't be as bad as blackhawk down.
You Didn't Build That.
I disagree, ucw. If either
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:54am.
I disagree, ucw. If either we or Israel acted precipitously and militarily, the consequences could be Blackhawk Down multiplied by a factor of 50 or worse. Depending on the direction of political developments, it might be a viable, desirable and necessary option at some future time, but not now. It would be absolutely disastrous to prematurely play that card.
Jer
Yea I also heard that 30,000 Americans would die invading Iraq
Submitted by upcountrywater on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 3:24am.
Blackhawk Down, was funded by GHW Bush, defunded by Carter, opps Clinton.
Better go in now before they dig in; Defend the wounded ally, before he's bled out.
Not to worry tho, Obama won't make me proud, after all he's overdue for some vacation/ food/ light bulb issues.
You Didn't Build That.
Bush, with the best of
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 8:59am.
Bush, with the best of intentions, got us into the Somali mess. Les Aspin erred in not authorizing heavier armored support. Clinton resisted the clamor of leading Republicans to turn tail and run immediately after the Blackhawk tragedy.
And fortunately the current GOP leaders are behaving like statesmen and realize a military strike in Egypt at this juncture would be sheer insanity.
Jer
→ Jer
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 10:06am.
Are you claiming a decision to withdraw from Somalia was NOT made?
Are you sure somebody didn't eventually bow to "the clamor"?
Are you willing to tell us who that somebody was?
Hope he fails Jer?
Submitted by Denny Crane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:22am.
The Limbaugh nation doesn't blindly hope he fails at everything he does. (at least not most of them)
We hope he fails at everything that is destructive to America.
As long as his approach is the right one, he will have support.
We Are The 53%
Denny...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:39am.
Correct me if I'm wrong, Denny...
because I'm basing this response largely on a pattern of past behavior since I'm not thoroughly acquainted with every word uttered by Limbaugh since Obama assumed office, but my guess is that Rush has never offered a scintilla of praise for one single thing Obama has said or done during his presidency, even with respect to policies in general accord with those of the previous administration.
Jer
Jer, here is a LARGE scintilla..
Submitted by upcountrywater on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 3:09am.
Rush Limbaugh CPAC 2009 start @ 6:16...
You Didn't Build That.
Well, ucw...
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 9:05am.
I'll give you and Rush a half point--and that's being generous. I actually had watched the entirety of that CPAC address...twice.
If you listen to the rest of Rush's remarks immediately following his "praise", you will note that he merely used it as a pretext to further hammer Obama. It's a classic example of the back-handed compliment.
Jer
→ Jer
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 9:51am.
Given you might know something more than I about Constitutional law, do you still hope he succeeds in forcing people to buy something they don't want?
I don't know how you can insist the President must succeed in everything he endeavors.
You're the one who has couched this argument into an "all or nothing clause". It's a pure case of Jer demanding "It's Obama's way or the highway"
Yes Jer, you're wrong.
Submitted by Denny Crane on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 5:09am.
Rush has said the president has done the right thing
Sorry it took so long I had some work to do.
But it only took me a minute to find this.
RUSH: I want to single out today, Jonah Goldberg at National Review Online for being the first that I saw to have the proper reaction to the rescue of Captain Phillips from the merchant marine organizers, and that was to congratulate President Obama for a job well done. And I think we all must agree, folks, that when Obama does something right, we gotta go out there and we've got to acknowledge it. We gotta say he did a great job, and we've gotta be open-minded to the fact that Obama's going to do some good things, and so Jonah Goldberg leading the way here in showing us how this is done. There have been others to jump on this bandwagon. I would like to not only jump on the bandwagon of praising President Obama for a brilliant rescue, not only a plan but its execution, I don't think the Navy had that much to do with it. Were Obama not in the White House, who knows, this might still be going on, we might have had some unfortunate American deaths. But we are blessed with President Obama and his administration, their cool hand. In fact, let's go back to this program last Friday. This is what I predicted on this program.
We Are The 53%
You're putting me on, right Denny?....
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 8:49am.
Because what you quote is from one of Rush's oh-so-clever parodies which was in fact a typical cheap Limbaugh smear of Obama.
Here...read the full transcript.
Jer
Jer joins Limbaugh
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 9:40am.
So finally, Jer admits that if the law affected him, Jer would hope Obama fails.
Suddenly it wouldn't be hateful to call for the failure of the President.
But in the real world, the President is ONCE AGAIN going back on his word and forcing a mandate which he has already CONDEMNED during the Presidential campaign.
Jer, I know it is in your educational nature to find a reason to support even the most repugnant of ideas, but I would hope that at some point you could put that aside and form a more principled mindset.
Quit believing the cutest dodge is the most noble.
Cool...time to throw in the towel, partner
Submitted by Jer on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:23pm.
I've told you before that you're wasting your time setting these little rhetorical traps desperately hoping to finally ensnare me. Not...gonna...happen.
You might just as well have added the last 1% to your bait and made it "Obama decreeing that 100% of my law proceeds be confiscated" Acknowledging absurdities proves nothing. And your preposterous extrapolations are insulting and beneath you.
Jer.
→ That's funny
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:41pm.
You've had all night to stew over your answer and it must've done some serious gnawing at your gut.
Sorry, Jer, but your wish for Obama to fail, at some level uncomfortable to you, stands.
Where do you think I pulled the quote from, Jer?
Submitted by Denny Crane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 12:20am.
are you saying he didn't say "We gotta say he did a great job, and we've gotta be open-minded to the fact that Obama's going to do some good things,"
We Are The 53%
Where do I think you pulled the quote from, Denny?
Submitted by Jer on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 12:37am.
Because I like you, I'll resist posting the obvious answer. But it's awfully tempting. ;-)
I don't deny Rush said it. But I also know he had his fingers tightly crossed, his tongue firmly planted in cheek, and whichever half of his brain was in use in full "hammer Obama" mode.
And you know it too.
Jer
Smells like roses?
Submitted by Denny Crane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 1:20am.
Just listened to it, He turns it into a parody, but in the beginning he was serious when he said "We gotta say he did a great job, and we've gotta be open-minded to the fact that Obama's going to do some good things,"
:-)
We Are The 53%
Nice try, but...
Submitted by Jer on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 2:02am.
no, Denny. I know Rush. Rush was not being serious.
Jer
Nice try, indeed, Jer---
Submitted by matthewdean on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 2:11am.
as I'll bet you know Rush so much better than any other liberal who bad mouths him.Well, by all means, allow me to defer
Submitted by Jer on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 2:43am.
to NB's "Mister Conservative": the esteemed Matthew Dean.
So, Mr. Dean, do you believe Rush's effusive praise of Obama was sincere?
Please answer yes or no. And then feel free to launch into one of your grand flights of fancy rhetoric.
Jer
Ok, Jer---
Submitted by matthewdean on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 3:38am.
While I appreciate the "Mister" appellation, and the "esteemed' gambit was just too "too", I shall answer, exactly as instructed by the barrister: yes or no. Howzat?Well done, Matthew...
Submitted by Jer on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 3:43am.
Jer
MD
Submitted by Denny Crane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 6:28am.
Where is the fancy rhetoric after?
and it should have been..
yes or no.
We Are The 53%
Good eye, Denny---
Submitted by matthewdean on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 9:22am.
My reply to Jer with the yes or no answer was of necessity done without benefit of italics because the formatting choice seems to have a mind of it's own, and I have no control over it.
Kinda like my ex-wife.
The grand flight of fancy rhetoric took off before I could get on board.
Here I am in So. Cal, and my luggage is in Amarillo.
Jeez.
MD
Close minded librul!
Submitted by Denny Crane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 3:13am.
Jer, can you get me his autograph?
We Are The 53%
I'm afraid Rush and I are no longer on speaking terms, Denny...
Submitted by Jer on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 3:31am.
but I would be pleased to send you a signed and framed 8 x 10 photo of Jer, which I am sure would make a lovely addition to your den.
Jer
Well it is pretty cold here.
Submitted by Denny Crane on Wed, 02/02/2011 - 6:27am.
I could use some more firewood!
;-)
We Are The 53%
I am so-o-o-o-o tired....
Submitted by wizardjr on Mon, 01/31/2011 - 11:14pm.
I am worn out with ignorant children at colleges and universities parading for USSR in American while ignorant and/or stupid people are paid outrageous salaries to spew inside out, upside down nonsense on the public media.
I understand now why old men get crabby. There is a limit to how long one can put up with large doses of stupid in ones life.
He is among the worst...
Submitted by Army Brat on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:08am.
of the muslim apologists.
He is a joke and nothing more...
Typical Airhead Liberal
Submitted by DaMama on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:33am.
This guy doesn't have a clue. I don't see Christian conservatives screaming in people's faces, strapping bombs to their bodies or flying planes into buildings.
I don't see Christian conservatives pushing around the elderly because they dont' agree with their opinions on homosexuality. I don't see Christian conservatives demanding the death of people who don't agree with their beliefs.
This guy is an ignorant fool.
→ DaMama
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:21pm.
What's important is how he feels. And he feels Christians are as hateful as Muslims.
We need to get out of the habit of expecting that urinalists back up their claims with facts.
I get
Submitted by amyshulk on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 2:49am.
That as a nation, we welcome freedom of religion. What I don't get is why the left attacks Christianity for the horrors perpetuated by Muslims yet embracre Islam as the "good" religion???
I'm not anything, so I have no dog in this hunt, but this has always confused me. Is it because it's safer? A way to telegraph dissaproval without fear of getting their heads lopped off, and the less critical thinkers/America haters take it a green light to embrace Islam?
This is a serious question, I really don't understand this, thanks.
Ronald Reagan
Aslan swings and misses by a mile
Submitted by HockeyKid on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 10:55am.
How blissful his life must be, to be able to simply lump together as "religion" two worldviews which say:
"Each person is free to choose for himself."
vs.
"Convert or we kill you."
No wonder leftists have a hard time with politics. They just throw "democratic republic" and "totalitarian dictatorship" in the "political philosophy" bucket--no time for details, apparently.
That, dear friends, is why liberal creative writing professors shouldn't be let out of the library except on visiting days with family members present.
"Beauty is only skin deep, but liberal's to the bone." - me
Very blissful, Hockey
Submitted by Cool Arrow on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 11:12am.
Aslan might want to talk to FOX contributor, Steve Centani who was released by Palestinian Muslims only after converting to Islam.
But gosh, since Aslan has proof that both sides do it, maybe he can provide it.
I wonder if I should be hoping Aslan gets the opportunity to prove his belief. Wouldn't want him to continue under a cloud of suspicion he peddles falsehood, would we?
This guy might be smart but
Submitted by Hologram5 on Tue, 02/01/2011 - 12:13pm.
This guy might be smart but he has the common sense of a frozen gnat. Zilch.